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Lurking Beloww: Sea Monsters Sign Ups and Game Thread
Started by katashark
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The Genny statement was in regards to people I'd have been willing to switch off of Coffee to. At the time it was Genny and SAR. Turns out I was 50% right. Sorry you don't like that I'm willing to move my vote if someone gives me a really strong reason. Guess I should just park my vote on you, plug my ears, and start yelling "la la la la la". Seriously, collateral info matters. I don't know why you're trying to say it shouldn't. That's just dumb.
And you're still just taking her on her word?
She was pretty heavy village but those statements have still been bugging me the entire game and keeping her in neutral/sketch zone. There were points when I was heavily considering her to be either wolf or third party. Especially when all the stuff with Snowy and DVMD came up, but she's still not been at the top of my list.
As I stated before, abilities are rarely enough on their own to sway me. Is this village list in order?
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@Crayola227 rather than trying to edit that down on my phone to respond to it...
- The kill targets aren't the only reason why I am voting for you, and yes obviously anyone playing could have made those choices, so I agree with you there.
- I would argue that you get more bummed out and absent when you are a busy wolf vs. a busy villager.
Where my likes at?
- I'm not recommending anyone let themselves be further swayed by my logic this game. You all can think for yourselves; I'd much prefer you make your own decisions.
- I did make a couple points against Bryndi earlier, because I am whittling down candidates.
But, that was before the reveal. I believe the role claim and I was fine with her target list for the most part -- it made sense to me.
My 2 small hesitations are:
- She says she tracked Snowy, and Snowy died earlier than I might have expected given that some people thought she was pretty sketch
- My strongest village lean seems to be less convinced of Bryndi's villageness than I am after her reveal.
- The kill targets aren't the only reason why I am voting for you, and yes obviously anyone playing could have made those choices, so I agree with you there.
- I would argue that you get more bummed out and absent when you are a busy wolf vs. a busy villager.
Where my likes at?
- I'm not recommending anyone let themselves be further swayed by my logic this game. You all can think for yourselves; I'd much prefer you make your own decisions.
- I did make a couple points against Bryndi earlier, because I am whittling down candidates.
But, that was before the reveal. I believe the role claim and I was fine with her target list for the most part -- it made sense to me.
My 2 small hesitations are:
- She says she tracked Snowy, and Snowy died earlier than I might have expected given that some people thought she was pretty sketch
- My strongest village lean seems to be less convinced of Bryndi's villageness than I am after her reveal.
I'm taking you and AM off the table based on weak VCA in your case, and stronger VCA in AM's case. I made it clear why I came off AM. In the POE I'm always weird and account for every player, in this case myself as well, leaving Stagg, BJ, and Skim.
The main reason to say this isn't my wolf play, is that I wouldn't have to be as whiny if I did have a wolf pack. I hate bussing because it makes it that much harder with lylo. I was converted late game by Kara in the Cheezit game (I think it was?) and was totally lost to wolf strategy despite reading the whole wolf pack thread, but I was able to just go with what Kara told me and we won.
I was pretty checked out in the game with SP and MJ, and SP basically just ran the pack and I ran with it. Depending on the pack this is totally my wolf meta - and you know this Pip. Didn't I literally run by you like a huge number of my on thread posts and how to "sound" on the thread? That hasn't changed all that much despite that being my first wolf game.
You could argue that with the loss of KC and SAR and being late to game, I'm "running" the pack now on my own, or that if there is another wolf and it's BJ or Stagg (no offense, newer players) I would feel more stressed. If it's Skim, I imagine I could be more laid back.
Still, I think I'm sticking out in a bad way, doing too much "if I were a wolf..." analysis you guys hate but I usually do anyway (but I don't know I would do as much at this point given everything), and mostly the SAR move was not at all in my meta. Down one wolf and I push the vote towards SAR, who we think was 1 of 2 or 3 wolves left? Based on what? Was she really irredeemable then? I don't know. I don't know that I would have late-voted in her direction like that. Even if it was certain she was going down, the timing of my vote on her wouldn't have looked as good in retrospect and I had a weak reason (couldn't the pack have helped me construct more?), so again, I think I would have just stayed off. All in all, besides maybe tone which you could argue, I don't think the SAR move, the NK pattern, or even my whininess, these are all the reasons I'm saying this isn't really wolfy for me.
It seems mostly that your disagreement saying you think this is my wolfy play is mostly based on tone. I don't know what to say, except look at the whole picture, because I hope that will get you off me and onto an actual wolf.
Yep.
But y.
I really, really do not think she is a wolf. Neither did dead-village WZ, who is excellent at reading AM.
this also reads like a list of who might be easiest to mislynch as a wolf, just saying
that doesn't make you wolf, but it's something for village to consider in any case
*Shrug*
I was asked for a list. That is my list.
And I think Stagg would be a bitch to lynch, actually.
What is VCA?
25% is usually on the higher side, which is often why it's used as a start point. I think for our games 20% is closer but I could be wrong. It's better to err on the side of more when looking for wolves at the start.
vote count analysis
Your "if I were a wolf" comments, really prickle my feels. Also, your comment this morning about how you wouldn't be around at lynch close (yet here you are) really screamed wolf to me.
Also... the bolded... SAR was the first wolf lynched, so... what are you trying with that?
Lynch cray
As promised, I gotta go. I really truly hope you guys switch off me, because it sounds like we lose the game if we don't. I'm a little less invested in this game for various reasons. (being late, being annoyed, being busy, feeling like the vote went straight to me for ridic reasons, etc etc).
As far as annoyance goes, we've seen this before when AM uses her 20Qs and even more, her Socratic method, on me and I have to defend against her. I love her as a player when we're getting along but when it comes my way I do just get annoyed. Not being caught up annoys me. Getting this far in game, finally participating, and then having it swing my way when I think it's just crap crap crap, annoys me.
You have more to go off on other players. Me being top suspect is silly given what little behavior you've seen and my wolf meta. I would not bus the (double kill wolf?) in the manner I voted. I would defend such a wolf and call *that* villagery in a WIFOM move rather than a crappy bus.
Personally I think in the POE Stagg, BJ, and Skim make more sense.
Why do I not see anyone saying more about Skim? That worries me for a number of reasons.
As far as annoyance goes, we've seen this before when AM uses her 20Qs and even more, her Socratic method, on me and I have to defend against her. I love her as a player when we're getting along but when it comes my way I do just get annoyed. Not being caught up annoys me. Getting this far in game, finally participating, and then having it swing my way when I think it's just crap crap crap, annoys me.
You have more to go off on other players. Me being top suspect is silly given what little behavior you've seen and my wolf meta. I would not bus the (double kill wolf?) in the manner I voted. I would defend such a wolf and call *that* villagery in a WIFOM move rather than a crappy bus.
Personally I think in the POE Stagg, BJ, and Skim make more sense.
Why do I not see anyone saying more about Skim? That worries me for a number of reasons.
I literally voted for SAR every day until she was lynched. You said you wouldn't bus the double kill wolf that hard, but you think I would? Plus, you just tied the vote between genny and SAR, I actually broke the tie towards SAR.
lol, again, clearly confused if I said it wrong
I always say I won't be on, and then get on, and then mess up my whole life and plans because of it
this is what I hate, as they say, "the more you defend the more they lynch" THAT IS WHAT ANNOYS ME about being me. Maybe "they" don't say it, I do because that's how I feel like it goes most games, except when I'm a wolf, actually, lol. Maybe it happens then but it less annoying since I deserve it then. Maybe this doesn't happen to me more than others. Doesn't matter. It's annoying, and I'm done.
Way to lose the game guys, it'll be fun to see which wolves steered my mislynch yet again. Take note for the future, please.
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And it would be great if we were all on the same page, but clearly we're not. If needed I will switch my vote to Cray, but I'd rather keep it on Pip because I feel like she's
But y.
Because of the timing with how everything went down with Snowy, her, and DVMD. It put DVMD and her on my radar, but then DVMD flipped village. So I've been weary of AM. Especially with the other issues about double NKs that I brought up earlier (KC casually mentioning it, you keep bringing it up, then KC flipping wolf). I've been side-eyeing everyone who keeps saying we have solid evidence of it when all we have is N1 and AM's word (which we don't even know if it's true because she doesn't want to share why she thinks it was a kill attempt).
I've gotten village feels from her most of the game and her gameplay definitely seems like village AM (although idk what wolfy AM is like, so can't be certain), but like I said certain things make me uncomfortable.
Here's the deal, cray.
I think there is at least a small chance you were kind of out of it when you found out you got added as a wolf, and you reflex lynched SAR because you either
1. Didn't realize you were a wolf yet
Or
2. You mistakenly thought she was already going down and felt you needed the cred
Or, her double kill was actually only that one time, AM didn't get kill-attacked twice, and you guys (you, KC, SAR) agreed to bus SAR because she'd already used the ability and had been on the table so much that it was an inevitable eventuality she would be lynched.
Regardless, I still like you as an option for woof #3.
Skimble is not getting talked about because she was on 2 wolf lynches and sounds very much like her village self these days.
Edited for formatting.
I think there is at least a small chance you were kind of out of it when you found out you got added as a wolf, and you reflex lynched SAR because you either
1. Didn't realize you were a wolf yet
Or
2. You mistakenly thought she was already going down and felt you needed the cred
Or, her double kill was actually only that one time, AM didn't get kill-attacked twice, and you guys (you, KC, SAR) agreed to bus SAR because she'd already used the ability and had been on the table so much that it was an inevitable eventuality she would be lynched.
Regardless, I still like you as an option for woof #3.
Skimble is not getting talked about because she was on 2 wolf lynches and sounds very much like her village self these days.
Edited for formatting.
Last edited:
OK, missed the memo. Guess that explains why you're name isn't on people's tongues.
No, I didn't say that I would bus the double kill wolf. The bolded had a question mark at the end, and was rhetorical. I posted an article many times on WIFOM. Everything is WIFOM, and basically you have to analyze any given behavior in the view of "are they wolf?" or "are they villager?" and see what fits best. My point is that the SAR move is just total malarky as HYPOTHETICAL wolf move in my case.
You all have cleared AM, Pippy, and now I see Skim, based on VCA. You get a pass. Tell me given the SAR move, why does VCA on me make me a better suspect than BJ or Stagg? Because it sounds like they've both got marks against them on that account.
If it seems like I'm trying desperately to get the vote off me and onto anyone else we can make a better case for, it's because I am.
Notice how neither Stagg or BJ are putting their hands into my lynch and mostly leaving it up to AM, Pip, and Skim. Read that for what you will. That smells wolfy to me, unless you're just that convinced you've got this right about me.
If AM is a wolf, then I will congratulate her for her win and move her into the Tier 1 Wolf category.
Because I was also on 2 wolf votes and after Genny flipped village I pushed for SAR until she was lynched?
Also, if things swung away from you towards anyone but Pip I would not hesitate to move my vote to you. I just think Pippy is more wolfy and don't need to move my vote at this point.
Edit: And considering you said that I seemed "very village" to you earlier in this convo, I'm actually considering moving my vote to you anyway for trying to shade me this hard at this point...
The turn towards me based on very little, of AM was my clue, and she's done it twice as a wolf in recent game. That's my #1 reason I still don't totally trust her, if I don't consider her move on SAR then she reads as pure wolf based on her behavior towards me.
This is crap. I always check my PM's before getting on thread. Period. I'm NOT a bonehead wolf and I think my record shows that.
I would not have mistakenly thought she was going down and bussed a wolf for cred without clearing it with the pack, period. You should know that I try to work with the pack rather closely.
I didn't need the cred, and looky-look, the tinfoil hat you all are wearing isn't getting me any. Like I said, in my view I would have been better off staying off that lynch as a wolf. If you really think KC would have urged me to bus her in that manner... because that's the only way that would have gone down.
Seriously Pip, your reasons here are just not good at all. I suggest you go for whoever you have as suspect #2.
I'm starting to get pissed because basically it sounds like your theory on me and SAR revolves around me being a total idiot and doing stuff I would never do because it's stupid, and it's frankly insulting. Let's just go with you have feels and leave it at that. This is insulting.
I'm not trying to shade you hard. I'm doing a POE, and noting that the 3 people *I* so far have reason to consider village based on suggested VCA to me, leaves you and BJ, who noticeably aren't trying to push my mislynch. When I'm a wolf and the villagers are mislynching who I want without help, I stay off, the better to not jinx it. As a wolf, just pushing a lynch can get the villagers to spook.
Now that you're making your point about yourself (which I was just following Pip's logic earlier about your voting, yes, I'm following logic this game pretty heavily), I feel even better about the BJ vote.
Oh god, my inner grammar nazi is currently stabbing all my insides. And I haven't even been drinking tonight...
I didn't say that at all.
You yourself have been waxing poetic about how you haven't been caught up on the thread and only read like 2 posts before making that lynch vote.
I'm saying you're busy and you got added late, I don't think it's completely impossible you made a mistake or something.
Plus, everyone is capable of making mistakes at some point -- let's reflect on how many times LIS threw down a lynch vote on a fellow wolf before realizing he was a wolf lol
Does that make him a bad player or a "total idiot"? Certainly not.
I'm not trying to insult you at all.
I'm not pushing your lynch because you're not my top choice. Do you want me to push your lynch and switch to you? Because I can, but I'd rather go with who I actually think is most likely to be a wolf though. Which is Pippy.
how is the quoted post suggesting that you should switch to me or that I think you are a wolf????
If you followed my logic, you would see that I'm merely putting people into piles based on *behavior* and from there analyzing. That analysis led me to BJ. So what exactly is the problem here?
The defensiveness here is wigging me out.
8 days at sea Lynch Tally: Unofficial
Cray (4) - AM, Pippy, BJ, Skim
Pippy (1) - Stagg
AM () -
bj (1) - Cray
(Am I doing this right?)
Cray (4) - AM, Pippy, BJ, Skim
Pippy (1) - Stagg
AM () -
bj (1) - Cray
(Am I doing this right?)
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If people are finished, it can be the end of today.
To be fair, yeah, I'm always making supreme bonehead mistakes. But I'm more careful as a wolf and everyone who has ever wolfed with me, hell even those who haven't, should know that I'm definitely more careful. If I'm late to the game, I'm definitely checking my PMs first, especially if I get added to wolf pack. That's the only way to avoid the LIS mistakes, and don't I know it? I've played enough with him to have learned that very lesson.
Also that I'm pretty big on trying not to mess up pack strategy, and the way to do that is to always check in with wolf pack chat before doing anything on thread. You know I'm a conservative player. If I didn't know what to do regarding an interaction with a fellow wolf, then I would just do something else and hope that is less damaging than a bad w/w interaction.
I get what you're saying here Pip, and you don't have to take my word on the very simple points that there are rules I live by in WW, one being, check PMs FIRST thing before getting on thread, and if in wolf chat, checking that almost before making every single post on thread. I read wolf chat before even reading the thread, to avoid even the temptation of responding before seeing what is shaking down in the pack, even if I don't follow what on thread my wolf homies are talking about because I read pack chat before the thread.
I mean, making it a point of practice to always check PMs isn't that hard, and I would think a player would be even more cognizant of that with a late add.
Is there a reason I'm lower than Stagg?
this plus the likes by you and Stagg on Kata's post, reads as you trying to get things to close, and I find that pretty annoying given that I'm actively trying to defend right now
all of this looks wolfy on you, and I'm going to really regret having moved my vote off you to BJ if I cleared you, even if it was a next-level wolf maneuver on your part with SAR
So this has nothing to do with lynch or closing. I was just asking a question.
Peace out, I really do have to get ready for this party. For those of you wondering why I didn't disappear as promised, it's because the party started at 8 PST and I aim for 9ish at the latest since I go with a bottom of mine. However, you should all be happy that because of this grrrr game I'm pushing back to 10. At least it goes to 2 am, but these things tend to thin out early as people move the party home. Anyway, this is how WW ruins my life and I hate you all 
I just wanted to make it clear why I wasn't "pushing your lynch", because you're not my top choice. However you're also sketch enough to me that I'd be okay with voting for you.
Maybe I'm coming across as defensive because I'm worried that this is potentially lylo and it sounds like you're trying to potentially swing the vote to me or Bryndy. I'm village and Bryndy is my heaviest village read, so I think a lynch there could potentially lose us the game.
Most of your questions aren't innocent, we all know that. I don't know that this was.
I thought BJ wasn't your village read? I thought you were the one earlier pointing out that she's not quite acting right? Does anyone remember who that was?
Wasn't trying to close lynch early, I just really want to see what the other team's creature was. Cuz ours is definitely better 😉
Ok in the middle of all this... I just went back and read the SAR lynch again and I think I would like to hear the PM convo between Stagg and bryndi from right after she unlynched SAR at the last second before lynch closed. Was there any discussion of that?
Here is the progression of interest:
Here is the progression of interest:
^this was to bryndi
Well if AM, Pip, and Skim are not planning on switching off me, and we can't agree on who is a wolf besides me and vote there as a team, then I suggest we do just close lynch.
I like to watch village cry when they mislynch me, and I'm dying to see which wolf engineered my downfall to win this game, and finding out before going to the party would just be cool.
So I'm hopping in the shower. Figure it out guys, I look forward to it.
I like to watch village cry when they mislynch me, and I'm dying to see which wolf engineered my downfall to win this game, and finding out before going to the party would just be cool.
So I'm hopping in the shower. Figure it out guys, I look forward to it.
I mean, we still have 15 minutes, but okay.
Nope, I've feel like a broken record saying Pippy is my wolf read. I've got Bryndy leaning village.
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I can pull this up. Will take a few minutes though. Any specific times (like the actual times) that you want?
Is there a reason you haven't revealed to her yet?
I think I'm landing on:
Either Cray is the last wolf, or Stagg & bryndi are a pair, with one of them as a convert since I don't think we'd have 4 originals.
If the latter, they also get mad props because it's bold to defend each other like they are doing.
Either Cray is the last wolf, or Stagg & bryndi are a pair, with one of them as a convert since I don't think we'd have 4 originals.
If the latter, they also get mad props because it's bold to defend each other like they are doing.
She hasn't asked me to. I've got no problems revealing at this point though. I'm vanillager.
Nah I'm just curious why you are leaning her so heavily village after that. I'd prefer you take as little time as possible to edit 🙂
