Religious incorporation... St. Louis U.

[millepora]

I hope this isn't offensive anyone, I am just trying to get some more information to make a final choice.

I recently found out St. Louis University (one of the school on my applying list), is fundamentally Jesuit Catholic. I looked on their undergraduate link to their site, and it pretty clear they are. When I look on the School of Medicine link though, I see it mentioned nowhere, except in the history, but I see it nowhere in the mission statement.

Does this school incorporate religion into its interviews or curriculum? Also do they give preference to people with strong religious backgrounds? I noticed they have some lower stats than most schools, and I am now wondering if it has anything to do with that.

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[KeyzerSoze]

"fundamentally Jesuit"?

Yes, they incorporate the catechism into Gross Anatomy.

 

[Rendar5]

AFAIK, Loma Linda is the only med school whose religious background is likely to affect your life. But I'm not even positive on that one.

 

[Octagonecology]

I heard at St. Louis they require their students to wear long brown monk robes and take a vow of silence for their first 2 years.

Barking at the moon and eating stew made from eye of newt is optional.

These are just rumors by the way.

 

[BigChubbyMD]

All procedures are taught with the correct accompanying prayer

 

[LizzyM]

The Jesuits are a group (order) of Catholic priests. IIRC, in the US they sponsor at 4 medical schools: Georgetown, Loyola, St. Louis University and Creighton.

The values of SLU med school pretty much reflect the religous sensibilities of the Jesuits (and are very much in keeping with Catholic sensibilites) :

A concern for the sanctity of human life.
A commitment to dignity and respect in the provision of medical care to all patients.
A devotion to social justice, particularly as regards inequities in availability of and access to health care.
Humility in awareness of medicine’s inherent limitations in the cure of illness.
An appreciation for all of the factors that affect a person’s state of health or illness.
A mature and well-balanced professional behavior that derives from comfortable relationships with members of the human family and one’s Creator.


I don't know much about the school but the lower stats could be reflective of their values with respect to admissions: they may look at the whole applicant rather than just the numbers. If you can embrace the school's values as your own, it may be a good fit. Otherwise, there are plenty of other schools to choose from.

 

[BlueElmo]

Other than Loma Linda, I haven't heard of any other school that is THAT religious.

 

[Appless]

loma linda is the only med school you will have to ever worry about this issue. Other then that you should have absolutely no issue with jesuit schools. The main thing about these jesuit schools is the commitment to community service and those underserved.

 

[lrkoehle]

The Jesuits are a group (order) of Catholic priests. IIRC, in the US they sponsor at 4 medical schools: Georgetown, Loyola, St. Louis University and Creighton.

The values of SLU med school pretty much reflect the religous sensibilities of the Jesuits (and are very much in keeping with Catholic sensibilites) :

A concern for the sanctity of human life.
A commitment to dignity and respect in the provision of medical care to all patients.
A devotion to social justice, particularly as regards inequities in availability of and access to health care.
Humility in awareness of medicine’s inherent limitations in the cure of illness.
An appreciation for all of the factors that affect a person’s state of health or illness.
A mature and well-balanced professional behavior that derives from comfortable relationships with members of the human family and one’s Creator.


I don't know much about the school but the lower stats could be reflective of their values with respect to admissions: they may look at the whole applicant rather than just the numbers. If you can embrace the school's values as your own, it may be a good fit. Otherwise, there are plenty of other schools to choose from.

👍 I think the point about the lower stats is probably very true from the people I know there. The students seem happy. High MCAT/GPA averages at schools don't necessarily make them better.

 

[bigbad]

So loma linda actually incorporates religion into the curriculum? Also, I know they give preference to a few schools but do they only look at the schools or do they want religious activities and such?

 

[smash]

So loma linda actually incorporates religion into the curriculum? Also, I know they give preference to a few schools but do they only look at the schools or do they want religious activities and such?

I'm also interested, would somebody (with some sort of concrete experience) elaborate on how religion is present at Loma Linda?

 

[LizzyM]

I'm also interested, would somebody (with some sort of concrete experience) elaborate on how religion is present at Loma Linda?

Mandatory chapel attendance. School is Seventh Day Adventist.

 

[NeuroChaos]

Can't be more catholic than my university. Of course, how many universities post a building size poster of the pope for all to see?

Ironically, half of the student body is orthodox jewish. There has been a huge pushing to build a synagoge at my university though. The curricula strains, strain, strains and strains even more bioethics the ultra conservative catholic way. You barf the stuff until you can't take it no more and discover that by the time you become an intern, you spent years learning a much of filler subjects that haven't prepared you to even draw blood properly. 😕 I had a few university mates a half an internship of experience above me rotating from a different hospital at my place that had never put a foley catheter before.

However, it's false that most doctors that graduated from my university are ultra conservative fundamentalists. Most of them simply went to that university for the same reason I did: closest med school from home. Luckily I have never been forced to get on my knees and pray for 40 hours. 🙄

Are you talking about SLU or another Jesuit institute? Or was 'my univeristy' used for purposes of annonymity?

 

[BigChubbyMD]

I'm also interested, would somebody (with some sort of concrete experience) elaborate on how religion is present at Loma Linda?

From their mission (http://www.llu.edu/medicine/mission.page?):

The mission of the School of Medicine is to continue the healing and teaching ministry of Jesus Christ, "To make man whole."

"So they set out and went from village to village, preaching the gospel and healing people everywhere." Luke 9:6.​

They are incredibly religious...which is why I didn't even bother applying here

 

[searun]

I was admitted to Georgetown, although I decided to attend a different med school on the east coast. In my Georgetown secondary, I did discuss my experiences as a student at a Catholic high school, and the values that were engendered by this experience, values that are shared by Georgetown. I think it helped my application.

 

[LizzyM]

Are you talking about SLU or another Jesuit institute? Or was 'my univeristy' used for purposes of annonymity?

Vasca reports location as Mexico City and I think that the experiences there would be reflective of the culture as much as the religious sponsorship of the school (whichever school it is).

 

[usermike8500]

I'm also interested, would somebody (with some sort of concrete experience) elaborate on how religion is present at Loma Linda?

My friend attended Loma Linda. He said LLU has the following rules:
1. Mandatory weekly chapel attendance
2. No caffeine, meat, or mustard on campus
3. Students must pledge to abstain from alcohol and premarital sexual
relations during the course of their enrollment at the university
4. Religion in the context of health professions is taught as part of the core
curriculum.
5. Campus-wide shutdown for the Sabbath (Friday evening/Saturday)

 

[Schemp]

My friend attended Loma Linda. He said LLU has the following rules:
1. Mandatory weekly chapel attendance
2. No caffeine, meat, or mustard on campus
3. Students must pledge to abstain from alcohol and premarital sexual
relations during the course of their enrollment at the university
4. Religion in the context of health professions is taught as part of the core
curriculum.
5. Campus-wide shutdown for the Sabbath (Friday evening/Saturday)

Worst. School. Ever.

 

[usermike8500]

Worst. School. Ever.

LLU isn't for everyone. But for many students, particularly Seventh-Day Adventists, it can be a terrific school. Isn't LLU a world-leader in radiation oncology and snakebite treatment?

 

[NeuroChaos]

Worst. School. Ever.

For some people.

 

[JonathanMD]

So loma linda actually incorporates religion into the curriculum? Also, I know they give preference to a few schools but do they only look at the schools or do they want religious activities and such?

Well, take their version of the Hippocratic Oath, for example:

The Loma Linda University Physician's Oath

Before God these things I do promise:


In the acceptance of my sacred calling,


I will dedicate my life to the furtherance of Jesus Christ's healing and teaching ministry.


I will give to my teachers the respect and gratitude which is their due. I will impart to those who follow me, the knowledge and experience that I have gained.


The wholeness of my patient will be my first consideration.


Acting as a good steward of the resources of society and of the talents granted me, I will endeavor to reflect God's mercy and compassion by caring for the lonely, the poor, the suffering, and those who are dying.
I will maintain the utmost respect for human life. I will not use my medical knowledge contrary to the laws of humanity. I will respect the rights and decision of my patients.


I will hold in confidence all secrets committed to my keeping in the practice of my calling.


I will lead my life and practice my art with purity, and honor; abstaining from immorality myself, I will not lead others into moral wrong doing.


May God's kingdom, His healing power and glory be experienced by those whom I serve, and may they be made known in my life, in proportion as I am faithful to this oath.

 

[Schemp]

For some people.

Haha yeah, I knew some people would call me out on that. I definitely wasn't trying to speak for other people. 😛

 

[millepora]

mustard...what is wrong with that?

 

[Concubine]

mustard...what is wrong with that?

No A-1 sauce either. Ketchup is ok because that can be put on potatoes.

 

[LizzyM]

mustard...what is wrong with that?

Fortunately, the Jesuit schools have no restrictions on coffee, beer, mustard, or pork chops.

 

[BlueElmo]

My friend attended Loma Linda. He said LLU has the following rules:
1. Mandatory weekly chapel attendance
2. No caffeine, meat, or mustard on campus
3. Students must pledge to abstain from alcohol and premarital sexual
relations during the course of their enrollment at the university
4. Religion in the context of health professions is taught as part of the core
curriculum.
5. Campus-wide shutdown for the Sabbath (Friday evening/Saturday)

I would go there only if every other MD school in the nation rejected me.

 

[TooMuchResearch]

Fortunately, the Jesuit schools have no restrictions on coffee, beer, mustard, or pork chops.

That's nice to hear. I wouldn't be comfortable at a place that didn't let me eat breakfast.

 

[BigChubbyMD]

👍 haha, good one

 

[Longshanks]

I hope this isn't offensive anyone, I am just trying to get some more information to make a final choice.

I recently found out St. Louis University (one of the school on my applying list), is fundamentally Jesuit Catholic. I looked on their undergraduate link to their site, and it pretty clear they are. When I look on the School of Medicine link though, I see it mentioned nowhere, except in the history, but I see it nowhere in the mission statement.

Does this school incorporate religion into its interviews or curriculum? Also do they give preference to people with strong religious backgrounds? I noticed they have some lower stats than most schools, and I am now wondering if it has anything to do with that.

You will learn to lay on hands and pray in the trauma room to save lives.


In all seriousness, are the Jesuit brothers more conservative than some other brotherhoods such as the Marist brothers? Yes. However, they run some of the finest institutions at all levels of education, and many successful people have come out of them and attributed their success to Jesuit education. There are many many Catholic colleges and universities throughout the country, run by different priesthoods, brotherhoods, sisterhoods, etc. In my experience from high school, and from what I've read about these colleges and universities, their goal is to provide excellence in education and train individuals to be leaders dedicated to service in their community. They are not pushing Catholic beliefs or teaching upon you, with the exception of humility and service to others (but is that such a bad thing?). They are not institutions for training clergy or Sunday school. I'm sure they probably have services available for those interested in learning more about the Catholic faith, but that is an aside. There will be people of all different faiths and backgrounds there, even those who have no religious affiliation. For what its worth, Catholic education tends to be more liberal, they are not the bent out of shape Evangelicals trying to convert or burn every individual in the world like the Jerry Falwell's out there.

There are many religious affiliated centers of learning, and what I'm trying to get it is, their affiliation, which they won't push on you, what decides if you'd go there rather than their academic quality? Would it have excluded you from going to Georgetown, Boston Collge, or Notre Dame for undergrad? Remember, Albert Einstein COM is at Yeshiva University, a Jewish affiliated school. Does that discredit it at all? Absolutely not, its a great medical school. Yeshiva actually presents probably the best comparison to the Catholic schools. Will there be some religious themes or their philosophy be based on religious values? Of course, but just how Judiasm doesn't prostelytize and attempt to convert, neither does the modern Catholic Church.