WildZenge Presents: Horizon Zero DaWWn

Started by WildZoo
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I have a feeling nobody but shorty opened my spoilered post so I'm going to lay it out ONE more time.

April has not been wolf hunting
D1 - she sat on an RVS vote all day and didn't push her vote, actively pocketed and used dina to save genny.
D2 - She spent all day hedging between genny and bob and pushed bob along with everyone else, but no push on genny. She was asking everyone else around how they read genny but no direct questions or interactions with genny. She was trying to see who she could pull off of the genny wagon. Once again not pushing me.
D3 onwards she's spent tunneling a villager who has her nailed to the wall.

If I hadn't started pressure on her D2, she would have switched to bob anyway after Cray's vote to save genny. She's using self-prez as a smokescreen.
 
I'm not spending today defending. I can't defend against people getting paranoid just because a pressured wolf starts making noise. Cray 180'd on me and Cubs 180'd on April right after April did her "ISO", so that tells me thats whats going on. Some of my PM partners from last night have my ability reveal, but as I've said before and we've seen multiple times this game abilities are NAI.

Let me know if you have other questions about other people.

I'm still for an April vote.
I would back a Lawpy vote. I don't like how he put TME into his POE yesterday. TME is pretty village to me based on genny interactions
I'd consider a Cubs vote, its possible I've been giving him too much village cred as an overcorrection to misreading him before. Especially if I read too much into our PM interaction.

Everyone else I would need significant convincing for




Vote April
 
I'm not spending today defending. I can't defend against people getting paranoid just because a pressured wolf starts making noise. Cray 180'd on me and Cubs 180'd on April right after April did her "ISO", so that tells me thats whats going on. Some of my PM partners from last night have my ability reveal, but as I've said before and we've seen multiple times this game abilities are NAI.

Let me know if you have other questions about other people.

I'm still for an April vote.
I would back a Lawpy vote. I don't like how he put TME into his POE yesterday. TME is pretty village to me based on genny interactions
I'd consider a Cubs vote, its possible I've been giving him too much village cred as an overcorrection to misreading him before. Especially if I read too much into our PM interaction.

Everyone else I would need significant convincing for




Vote April
What do you think about Lawpy being redirected when people said they were waiting on my read?
 
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I'm not spending today defending. I can't defend against people getting paranoid just because a pressured wolf starts making noise. Cray 180'd on me and Cubs 180'd on April right after April did her "ISO", so that tells me thats whats going on. Some of my PM partners from last night have my ability reveal, but as I've said before and we've seen multiple times this game abilities are NAI.

Let me know if you have other questions about other people.

I'm still for an April vote.
I would back a Lawpy vote. I don't like how he put TME into his POE yesterday. TME is pretty village to me based on genny interactions
Can you elaborate on this? Dina and I had pulled a bunch of her quotes about genny/the genny vote last night and they were part of what made me feel worse about her. Interested to see your reasoning.
 
Day 4 Keep Going, And Find Something Interesting Tally

Mel (3)
- April, cubs, cray
TME (1) - shorty
April (1) - Mel

5 / 8 votes

Leading: @Melchizedek
Missing: A few
Deadline: 10pm east on 10/4 (~33.5 hours)

tumblr_onhdvgArAi1s6elnxo2_500.gif
 
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Can you elaborate on this? Dina and I had pulled a bunch of her quotes about genny/the genny vote last night and they were part of what made me feel worse about her. Interested to see your reasoning.
I'm interested in flipping genny, but I was also interested in seeing other people's movement once I got on that vote. I know genny is going to do genny regardless of the people who vote for her so I'm not exactly looking for how she's going to react

is there a reason you felt your third vote on her would make something more exciting happen after my vote with pretty much the exact same reasoning?
If thats not a village reaction to April's hedgy AF reasoning for bussing genny, I will eat a hat.
 
April has not been wolf hunting
Come on. I don't care if you call me out for what I have/haven't been doing, but stop saying I haven't been wolf hunting. I've been here just as active and participating as anyone else and have been a lot more effectively hunting than you have been.
 
What do you think about Lawpy being redirected when people said they were waiting on my read?
MsLawpy redirected to Cubs
TME redirected to Cray
On the same night?

I'm interested in seeing if either of them got night results that genny seered them. I think that would help me understand if a wolf targeted one of them for redirection and a villager the other.

Possible a wolf got an upgrade and could do two redirections in one night after genny died, or this or that. There's too many mechanical explanations and I very clearly remember Dubz saying this game would be mechanics galore.
 
MsLawpy redirected to Cubs
TME redirected to Cray
On the same night?

I'm interested in seeing if either of them got night results that genny seered them. I think that would help me understand if a wolf targeted one of them for redirection and a villager the other.

Possible a wolf got an upgrade and could do two redirections in one night after genny died, or this or that. There's too many mechanical explanations and I very clearly remember Dubz saying this game would be mechanics galore.
No results.
 
MsLawpy redirected to Cubs
TME redirected to Cray
On the same night?

I'm interested in seeing if either of them got night results that genny seered them. I think that would help me understand if a wolf targeted one of them for redirection and a villager the other.

Possible a wolf got an upgrade and could do two redirections in one night after genny died, or this or that. There's too many mechanical explanations and I very clearly remember Dubz saying this game would be mechanics galore.
This would make Lawpy village either way though, wouldn't it?
 
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If you assume that the redirector knew Lawpy was a machine and would trigger cub's ability
Why waste the redirect on him regardless? Even if they didn't know Lawpy was a machine, why wouldn't he just target cubs on his own and the redirect be spent elsewhere?
 
Why waste the redirect on him regardless? Even if they didn't know Lawpy was a machine, why wouldn't he just target cubs on his own and the redirect be spent elsewhere?
Lawpy was still a ??? in some people's books, could have been a way to check if he was a machine wolf v.s. non-machine wolf.
 
Why waste the redirect on him regardless? Even if they didn't know Lawpy was a machine, why wouldn't he just target cubs on his own and the redirect be spent elsewhere?
I'm also not discounting the theory that there's no village redirector. Wolves actually only had one redirect, used it on TME and now Lawpy is claiming a wolf redirected him so that village will clear him.
 
I'm also not discounting the theory that there's no village redirector. Wolves actually only had one redirect, used it on TME and now Lawpy is claiming a wolf redirected him so that village will clear him.
Why bring attention to himself at all? This whole revelation started because Lawpy volunteered information. No one was asking for a reveal and cubs had no idea Lawpy acted on him.
Like who?



Say it AM
Like your mom.
 
Why bring attention to himself at all? This whole revelation started because Lawpy volunteered information. No one was asking for a reveal and cubs had no idea Lawpy acted on him.

Like your mom.
If it is a wolfy ploy, it could be because Cubs would know someone acted on him, and therefore an attempt to get ahead of that. I'm not sure what the wolfy motive would be for targeting cubs in the first place though
 
Why bring attention to himself at all? This whole revelation started because Lawpy volunteered information. No one was asking for a reveal and cubs had no idea Lawpy acted on him.

Like your mom.
because wolves do things when under pressure? Do I need to bring up Chaos and his missed kill night? I can't remember if that was intentional or on purpose, but wolves do sneaky things AM.
If there's an alpha like Cubs says the write-up suggests, and Lawpy is the alpha, why not make a loud scene about it especially since he might have been getting votes today from the POE anyway?

and idk why not target me. Hell, I expected the vig to have shot me by now if they had a x2.

The motivation of a Wolf!redirector is clear and obvious for Lawpy.

The village!redirector and Wolf!redirector reasoning is less clear for TME though.
TME was also in people's POE, so could have been villager checking TME, and seeing what info would come out on Cray.
Wolves would have known Cray would idle tonight from being vanillized so she would have been a good choice to redirect any ability to if they didn't know TME's ability.
 
If it is a wolfy ploy, it could be because Cubs would know someone acted on him, and therefore an attempt to get ahead of that. I'm not sure what the wolfy motive would be for targeting cubs in the first place though
Yeah, but that could be anyone. Was your first thought going to be "definitely only Lawpy could have acted on cubs; literally no one else makes sense"?
 
because wolves do things when under pressure? Do I need to bring up Chaos and his missed kill night? I can't remember if that was intentional or on purpose, but wolves do sneaky things AM.
If there's an alpha like Cubs says the write-up suggests, and Lawpy is the alpha, why not make a loud scene about it especially since he might have been getting votes today from the POE anyway?

and idk why not target me. Hell, I expected the vig to have shot me by now if they had a x2.

The motivation of a Wolf!redirector is clear and obvious for Lawpy.

The village!redirector and Wolf!redirector reasoning is less clear for TME though.
TME was also in people's POE, so could have been villager checking TME, and seeing what info would come out on Cray.
Wolves would have known Cray would idle tonight from being vanillized so she would have been a good choice to redirect any ability to if they didn't know TME's ability.
He wasn't under pressure like MsP was.

Chaos isn't Lawpy. I know what Chaos believes in.

Also, there's no evidence an alpha exist. That's a tinfoil. Unless you can prove one exists, I won't be humouring a tinfoil. I'm here to talk about concrete mechanics.

Don't like you talking about vigs though. You're saying it's only paranoia driving your yeet so why would you be shot?
 
Yeah, but that could be anyone. Was your first thought going to be "definitely only Lawpy could have acted on cubs; literally no one else makes sense"?
No, but I have no idea how Lawpy thinks so paranoia can do weird things

Mostly I'm just interested in why all this redirection happened involving both me and the person I targeted. my other concern was that Lawpy has the redirect ability himself, and wanted to get ahead of things in a way that would make me look even sketchier given that people were already suspicious of me.

I still think the double-redirector village scenario is very plausible, but I'm sorting through the options
 
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He wasn't under pressure like MsP was.

Chaos isn't Lawpy. I know what Chaos believes in.

Also, there's no evidence an alpha exist. That's a tinfoil. Unless you can prove one exists, I won't be humouring a tinfoil. I'm here to talk about concrete mechanics.

Don't like you talking about vigs though. You're saying it's only paranoia driving your yeet so why would you be shot?
Because paranoia is what gets me vig-shot to begin with like in SEGA, and EVERY other time i've been screwed over by a vig when I'm actually having a decent village game and people don't see the things I see 😆
 
because wolves do things when under pressure? Do I need to bring up Chaos and his missed kill night? I can't remember if that was intentional or on purpose, but wolves do sneaky things AM.
If there's an alpha like Cubs says the write-up suggests, and Lawpy is the alpha, why not make a loud scene about it especially since he might have been getting votes today from the POE anyway?

and idk why not target me. Hell, I expected the vig to have shot me by now if they had a x2.

The motivation of a Wolf!redirector is clear and obvious for Lawpy.

The village!redirector and Wolf!redirector reasoning is less clear for TME though.
TME was also in people's POE, so could have been villager checking TME, and seeing what info would come out on Cray.
Wolves would have known Cray would idle tonight from being vanillized so she would have been a good choice to redirect any ability to if they didn't know TME's ability.
Lawpy is barely under pressure, people specifically moved off the MsLawpy vote to give him more time to be read
 
Hmm. We had a different interpretation of that quote in the context of a bunch of other ones. I'll get it out of the PM in a sec.

There are so many that I'm going to spoiler them. I had pulled them because there was a weird inconsistency in them between wanting credit for voting genny on D1, but then hedging the hell out of it when I got on there and when April got on there - 2 people that TME had tried to sus.

This whole genny discussion has me uncomfy but I stand by why I voted there before (still very little actual content despite making appearances)

I'm interested to see what happens if I increase the pressure a bit, both for her and the people discussing her

yeet genny

I was already feeling wolfy on her but i also wanted to up the general pressure

like cubs, I don't love the result of that
Like, this was bizarre. She felt that genny was wolfy, wanted to up the pressure, and more people got on the vote ... and somehow, that made her uncomfortable. If you're really wolf reading someone, that should make you happy that you've convinced other people. If you're bussing a packmate and don't actually want the vote to take off, then it would make you uncomfortable.
I think he's implying that we're wrong about genny and you're taking advantage of that to join in on a misyeet, not necessarily that you're bussing genny

at least that's my concern

is there a reason you felt your third vote on her would make something more exciting happen after my vote with pretty much the exact same reasoning?
I'm not sure why me voting genny is suddenly surprising when I voted for her yesterday

she hasn't posted all that much since then
Then she picked this fight with April, which to me felt like she was trying to bait April into getting off genny's vote (particularly the bolded part).
yes, because no one suddenly sussing genny has said anything new for why they've decided that, and you yourself are somehow sus of me for being sus of genny with you? My two concerns are either

a) I'm right (yay!) and wolves are trying to distance themselves (worse for you) or
b) I'm wrong (yikes) and wolves are happy letting me be wrong (worse for april)

also i think we're in a three way tie right now so this is gonna be interesting
I had, but she completely ignored that.

I want to look more closely at the votes on her D1 and yesterday when I have time this afternoon.
cubs and I were on her D1. You started the votes for her D2, I followed you then April joined. I think Cubs was last on. Then April broke the 3-way tie (that included herself) towards bob at the same time I tried to break it towards april. Then i gave in and moved to bob at the last second. Don't remember the timing of the early votes but the tiebreaking movement was all in the last couple minutes before close.
This wasn't what I was talking about, and I felt like this was her trying to seem helpful so I wouldn't go look at the vote timing and actually analyze it. It's a lot easier to claim "well I was on the vote D1" and hope it'll just stop there. It wouldn't surprise me at all if there was a wolf on the genny vote D1, and of the 2, I think it's more likely to be TME than cubs based on the rest of their game play.

I guess I don't understand why shorty gets hard cleared for initiating the wagon when there were two of us on it the previous day already

Like she definitely gave it more momentum and stayed on with apparent intent, but as others have said genny is not afraid of being bussed when busy so i just can't give it a hard clear. Maybe another wolf was already pushing the bob wagon and they wanted to separate from each other. Maybe she had a reasonable expectation of April self-prezzing and breaking the tie towards Bob. I'm not saying any of these are likely, but they're possible
This felt off to me because it was trying so hard to get village cred for what was obviously a different situation because I started a wagon and rode it to the end with full intent to get genny yeeted. She got onto genny the night before with little conviction, remained with little conviction, and then got cold feet when the vote was actually taking off on D2.

I mentioned it multiple times, but I was still voting there until the last minute tie break
Then again, trying to get the cred because she'd voted her - because she wants that good VCA. Why did TME break the tie? In all likelihood, April was going to self prez. There was no reason for TME to move her vote too unless she wanted to guarantee that the genny wagon couldn't suddenly reappear with 3 minutes left.

I was also quite concerned about TME's vote holding yesterday and her reasoning behind it when I asked her.
 
No, but I have no idea how Lawpy thinks so paranoia can do weird things

Mostly I'm just interested in why all this redirection happened involving both me and the person I targeted. my other concern was that Lawpy has the redirect ability himself, and wanted to get ahead of things in a way that would make me look even sketchier given that people were already suspicious of me.

I still think the double-redirector village scenario is very plausible, but I'm sorting through the options
Double village redirection would be very powerful, but I suppose I can't rule that out.

I don't see the redirection as implicating you more than you already are especially given Cray is still alive.
 
Because paranoia is what gets me vig-shot to begin with like in SEGA, and EVERY other time i've been screwed over by a vig when I'm actually having a decent village game and people don't see the things I see 😆
Yeah, but after what you told me last night, that doesn't seem like something you'd bring that up.
 
Double village redirection would be very powerful, but I suppose I can't rule that out.

I don't see the redirection as implicating you more than you already are especially given Cray is still alive.
by double redirection i meant two redirectors, and lawpy is village

but i guess also a villager with extra strong redirection is on the table
 
He wasn't under pressure like MsP was.

Chaos isn't Lawpy. I know what Chaos believes in.

Also, there's no evidence an alpha exist. That's a tinfoil. Unless you can prove one exists, I won't be humouring a tinfoil. I'm here to talk about concrete mechanics.

Don't like you talking about vigs though. You're saying it's only paranoia driving your yeet so why would you be shot?

Lawpy is barely under pressure, people specifically moved off the MsLawpy vote to give him more time to be read
The slot was in POE for multiple people. Votes are not the only form of pressure. As long as people are questioning you, evaluating you, THAT is pressure.

Thats why RVS and Pressure votes are bunk. You can put your vote anywhere you want and move it anywhere you like until the deadline. Putting votes somewhere does not equal pressure.
 
The slot was in POE for multiple people. Votes are not the only form of pressure. As long as people are questioning you, evaluating you, THAT is pressure.

Thats why RVS and Pressure votes are bunk. You can put your vote anywhere you want and move it anywhere you like until the deadline. Putting votes somewhere does not equal pressure.
People said they were going to give him a cycle to climb out the hole. Redirection complicated things and interfered with my analysis.
 
because wolves do things when under pressure? Do I need to bring up Chaos and his missed kill night? I can't remember if that was intentional or on purpose, but wolves do sneaky things AM.
If there's an alpha like Cubs says the write-up suggests, and Lawpy is the alpha, why not make a loud scene about it especially since he might have been getting votes today from the POE anyway?

and idk why not target me. Hell, I expected the vig to have shot me by now if they had a x2.

The motivation of a Wolf!redirector is clear and obvious for Lawpy.

The village!redirector and Wolf!redirector reasoning is less clear for TME though.
TME was also in people's POE, so could have been villager checking TME, and seeing what info would come out on Cray.
Wolves would have known Cray would idle tonight from being vanillized so she would have been a good choice to redirect any ability to if they didn't know TME's ability.

To be clear, I wasnt suggesting that there has to be one, I was making a light hearted comment about the previous game and Dubz' role.
 
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