"Help Me Rank" IM 2023

[whoknows2012]

Hey everyone! Thanks for sharing the thread, my goal is Hem/Onc fellowship, and would appreciate some advice on my list:

1. Dartmouth
2. Tufts
3. Jefferson
4. Georgetown
5. Utah
6. Cedars-Sinai
7. Rutgers RWJ
8. Temple

Utah, Dartmouth, Georgetown and Jeff are slightly above the rest (for me with a big ?? On cedars as I do not know where to fit that in with the east coast programs).

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[obiwan]

Utah, Dartmouth, Georgetown and Jeff are slightly above the rest (for me with a big ?? On cedars as I do not know where to fit that in with the east coast programs).

For a second, I thought there is a Cedars hospital in the northeast that I wasn't aware of given the regional bias of this list. Only reason I would move it up the list is if the OP is deadset on doing fellowship in California

 

[The Minister]

Hey everyone! Appreciate the help in advance. My goals are cardiology fellowship, with high emphasis on urban environment. I've currently got my list broken into three tiers and have listed relevant pros/cons within tiers.

1/2 UChicago/NYU (Family is in chicago, would be significantly cheaper and have many perks being close to fam. Conversely, love NYC and would love to live there for a couple years)
3/4 Rush/UTSW (pros of chicago as above, cons for UTSW include less desirable and rough call schedule, wondering if it would be a huge mistake to rank rush over utsw though given difference in pedigree and strong cards program at utsw)
5/6/7 Baylor/UVA/Georgetown (tough to distinguish here, in terms of city its DC>Houston>charlottesville)

 

[obiwan]

Hey everyone! Appreciate the help in advance. My goals are cardiology fellowship, with high emphasis on urban environment. I've currently got my list broken into three tiers and have listed relevant pros/cons within tiers.

1/2 UChicago/NYU (Family is in chicago, would be significantly cheaper and have many perks being close to fam. Conversely, love NYC and would love to live there for a couple years)
3/4 Rush/UTSW (pros of chicago as above, cons for UTSW include less desirable and rough call schedule, wondering if it would be a huge mistake to rank rush over utsw though given difference in pedigree and strong cards program at utsw)
5/6/7 Baylor/UVA/Georgetown (tough to distinguish here, in terms of city its DC>Houston>charlottesville)

I guess my question to you is what your goals are as far as cardiology fellowship. If you have any inkling of wanting to train at one of those high powered programs like Duke/Brigham/Cleveland Clinic etc, then you should probably rank UTSW above Rush. Otherwise, if you're OK with having a likely ceiling as far as programs and valuing that support structure during these upcoming years that will most certainly be stressful, then do rank Rush above UTSW

 

[hlab27pair]

Hoping to do a cardiology fellowship in the future. I prefer the midwest, but I'm willing to go elsewhere if it makes a difference in my career. I've decided on my #1 and #2, but I am having a hard time with the rest. Really enjoyed the interview at Case and it looks like they match well. CCF seems awesome but I'm worried about the quality of the training. Would love to hear from others!

1. Michigan
2. Northwestern
3. Mayo
4. Case Western
5. UPenn
6. BIDMC
7. CCF
8. Cornell
9. OSU
10. Loyola

 

[chickennugget33]

any thoughts on yale? they are not in the top 20 on doximity (not that these rankings matter) but to me it seems like an absolutely amazing environment with a supportive culture. any insight on the quality of training?

 

[chickennugget33]

Hi there, any insight would be appreciated. I want to have a strong ambulatory skill set, eventually move into health systems science / non-profit admin. Technology + primary care integrations to improve healthcare access. I work a lot with people experiencing homelessness, so LA may be a good place to be. Vibe + food perks >> fellowship match.

1. UCLA - HPACT (VA) Primary Care
1. Johns Hopkins University/Bayview Medical Center Program - PC
3. Cedars-Sinai Medical Center Program - PC
4. Emory University School of Medicine Program - PC
5. UCLA-Olive View Primary Care - PC
5. UCSF/Kaiser Permanente Northern California (San Francisco) - IM/PM combined
6. Rush University Medical Center Program - PC
7. Cedars-Sinai Medical Center Program - Categorical
8. Santa Barbara Cottage Hospital Program - Categorical
9. Family Health Center NYU Langone - PC
10. Emory University School of Medicine Program - Categorical
11. Rush - Categorical 1127140C0
12. Montefiore Medical Center Albert Einstein College of Medicine (Moses and Weiler Campuses) Program - Primary/Social Int Med
13. University of Miami/Jackson - Categorical, Urban Health track 1104140C0
14. UMass Chan Medical School Program - PC
...

I think your #1 is spot on! have heard great things about it in regards to primary care training and the patient population would be wonderful to work with not as familiar with the rest, sorry about that. best of luck to you!

 

[obiwan]

Hoping to do a cardiology fellowship in the future. I prefer the midwest, but I'm willing to go elsewhere if it makes a difference in my career. I've decided on my #1 and #2, but I am having a hard time with the rest. Really enjoyed the interview at Case and it looks like they match well. CCF seems awesome but I'm worried about the quality of the training. Would love to hear from others!

1. Michigan
2. Northwestern
3. Mayo
4. Case Western
5. UPenn
6. BIDMC
7. CCF
8. Cornell
9. OSU
10. Loyola

The trajectory of your career and fellowship opportunities will not really be impacted by going to most of those places on your list. I would probably put Upenn/Beth Israel/Cornell in that order to round out my top 5 but that is personal preference and you're not going to severely handicap yourself if you don't and you preferred Mayo/CRWU over the others

 

[Hopeful9999]

Need help with getting this order right. What's most important to me is resident culture, scheduling, and QoL. Location is also important but much less....Also wanting to do a heme/onc fellowship + a fair amount of research but I know any of the top 4 programs can easily get me into heme/onc so very conflicted on how to order them especially. Right now I'm thinking:

1. Michigan
2. Vanderbilt
3. Duke
4. UTSW
5. Case western
6. UNC
7. Colorado
8. UAB

Appreciate any input

 

[Hopeful9999]

Impressive list of programs and really just splitting hairs trying to distinguish between them as these are all pretty big time programs. Would have a harder time not ranking WashU near the top or #1 but thats just me.

WashU
UCLA
Stanford
Beth Israel Deaconess
Northwestern
UChicago
Yale
Mayo

If you don't mine me asking, why WashU over UCLA, BIDMC, mayo etc?

 

[Deecee2DO]

Utah, Dartmouth, Georgetown and Jeff are slightly above the rest (for me with a big ?? On cedars as I do not know where to fit that in with the east coast programs).

Yeah cedars is nowhere near the rest of those programs there IM program is probably below avg. their fellowships on the other hand (specifically cards) is one of the best in the country

 

[Deecee2DO]

any thoughts on yale? they are not in the top 20 on doximity (not that these rankings matter) but to me it seems like an absolutely amazing environment with a supportive culture. any insight on the quality of training?

Yale is certainly top 20 for IM

 

[chickennugget33]

Need help with getting this order right. What's most important to me is resident culture, scheduling, and QoL. Location is also important but much less....Also wanting to do a heme/onc fellowship + a fair amount of research but I know any of the top 4 programs can easily get me into heme/onc so very conflicted on how to order them especially. Right now I'm thinking:

1. Michigan
2. Vanderbilt
3. Duke
4. UTSW
5. Case western
6. UNC
7. Colorado
8. UAB

Appreciate any input

Ive heard the schedules at vandy, duke, and utsw are worse than most. Michigan seems like it has a tough schedule too but probably no worse than other programs? I really liked the culture of Michigan myself!!!

 

[Deecee2DO]

Ive heard the schedules at vandy, duke, and utsw are worse than most. Michigan seems like it has a tough schedule too but probably no worse than other programs? I really liked the culture of Michigan myself!!!

100% agree-Vandy and Duke have brutal schedules. I interviewed at Vandy and one of the reasons I ranked it lower was because the intern year schedule is so tough. The good thing though is that PGY2 and 3 gets much better there based on what the residents there were saying last year on interview day

 

[obiwan]

If you don't mine me asking, why WashU over UCLA, BIDMC, mayo etc?

Just an inherent bias of mine. Clinical training/rigor carried the most weight for me when it came to ranking programs so preferred programs like WashU compared to perceived "cushier" peers (not saying that UCLA or Beth Israel are cushy by any means)

 

[Hopeful9999]

100% agree-Vandy and Duke have brutal schedules. I interviewed at Vandy and one of the reasons I ranked it lower was because the intern year schedule is so tough. The good thing though is that PGY2 and 3 gets much better there based on what the residents there were saying last year on interview day

Between Duke, UTSW, and Vandy, how would you rank the difficulty of scheduling/QoL/Culture? Or are they basically all equal?

 

[Hopeful9999]

Also, does anyone have any thoughts on UNC vs Case western vs UAB vs colorado? for heme/onc, culture, QoL

 

[gutonc]

Also, does anyone have any thoughts on UNC vs Case western vs UAB vs colorado? for heme/onc, culture, QoL

All I can say is that none of them will inhibit you in terms of getting a Heme/Onc spot, even compared to the others on your list.

 

[CatFactorial]

Also, does anyone have any thoughts on UNC vs Case western vs UAB vs colorado? for heme/onc, culture, QoL

All fantastic programs, can personally attest that UAB is all around great in terms IM training/culture/etc.

will get you what you need fellowship wise

 

[hlab27pair]

How would you all rank Case vs CCF vs OSU for cardiology?

 

[IdkLol2049]

Does anyone have any input on VCU vs. UMass in terms of prestige? Looking to match Cards or Heme/Onc

 

[Deecee2DO]

Does anyone have any input on VCU vs. UMass in terms of prestige? Looking to match Cards or Heme/Onc

in my opinion VCU>UMass much better match list and slightly better rep

 

[obiwan]

How would you all rank Case vs CCF vs OSU for cardiology?

If you're asking about cardiology fellowships, Cleveland Clinic is one of the top programs in the country

 

[Deecee2DO]

If you're asking about cardiology fellowships, Cleveland Clinic is one of the top programs in the country

Agree. CCF>Case and OSU for cards

 

[hlab27pair]

Agree. CCF>Case and OSU for cards

Does that hold true for their IM program as well? How do these residency programs compare for someone with an interest in cardiology?

 

[CatFactorial]

Does that hold true for their IM program as well? How do these residency programs compare for someone with an interest in cardiology?

It’s a good question to ask. Agree that CCF is one of if not the best fellowship programs because the fellows get a ton of training. Can the same be said for the residents? If you are looking for good clinical training, consider a place that allowed for robust resident autonomy

That said the big places are much more likely to get you good research opportunities

 

[expicept]

Ive heard the schedules at vandy, duke, and utsw are worse than most. Michigan seems like it has a tough schedule too but probably no worse than other programs? I really liked the culture of Michigan myself!!!

All four have similar intern year schedules. iirc, UM has intern patient caps of 8 but they're all inpatient heavy with most elective time being PGY2 & PGY3.

any thoughts on yale? they are not in the top 20 on doximity (not that these rankings matter) but to me it seems like an absolutely amazing environment with a supportive culture. any insight on the quality of training?

I was highly impressed by the program during interview day. My mentors talked me out ranking them too high, citing aging facilities and New Haven being New Haven... One of my classmates matched there and loves it. If you really like them, I wouldn't let doximity's ranking influence you. In the end all their graduates are ultimately Yale graduates.

Hoping to do a cardiology fellowship in the future. I prefer the midwest, but I'm willing to go elsewhere if it makes a difference in my career. I've decided on my #1 and #2, but I am having a hard time with the rest. Really enjoyed the interview at Case and it looks like they match well. CCF seems awesome but I'm worried about the quality of the training. Would love to hear from others!

1. Michigan
2. Northwestern
3. Mayo
4. Case Western
5. UPenn
6. BIDMC
7. CCF
8. Cornell
9. OSU
10. Loyola

If Cards is the goal I would definitely move Case down to six, and move Penn and BIDMC up one. The rest are all fine.

 

[Hopeful9999]

Hoping to do a cardiology fellowship in the future. I prefer the midwest, but I'm willing to go elsewhere if it makes a difference in my career. I've decided on my #1 and #2, but I am having a hard time with the rest. Really enjoyed the interview at Case and it looks like they match well. CCF seems awesome but I'm worried about the quality of the training. Would love to hear from others!

1. Michigan
2. Northwestern
3. Mayo
4. Case Western
5. UPenn
6. BIDMC
7. CCF
8. Cornell
9. OSU
10. Loyola

If you don't mind me asking, what made you decide on Michigan and Northwestern above the rest?

 

[Hopeful9999]

Hi there, any insight would be appreciated. I want to have a strong ambulatory skill set, eventually move into health systems science / non-profit admin. Technology + primary care integrations to improve healthcare access. I work a lot with people experiencing homelessness, so LA may be a good place to be. Vibe + food perks >> fellowship match.

1. UCLA - HPACT (VA) Primary Care
1. Johns Hopkins University/Bayview Medical Center Program - PC
3. Cedars-Sinai Medical Center Program - PC
4. Emory University School of Medicine Program - PC
5. UCLA-Olive View Primary Care - PC
5. UCSF/Kaiser Permanente Northern California (San Francisco) - IM/PM combined
6. Rush University Medical Center Program - PC
7. Cedars-Sinai Medical Center Program - Categorical
8. Santa Barbara Cottage Hospital Program - Categorical
9. Family Health Center NYU Langone - PC
10. Emory University School of Medicine Program - Categorical
11. Rush - Categorical 1127140C0
12. Montefiore Medical Center Albert Einstein College of Medicine (Moses and Weiler Campuses) Program - Primary/Social Int Med
13. University of Miami/Jackson - Categorical, Urban Health track 1104140C0
14. UMass Chan Medical School Program - PC
...

Move cedars from #3 imo. Although its in LA its very much not underserved focused so you may not get the experience you want there. Would also switch UCSF and UCLA-Oliveview unless you really want to be in LA, but SF has a sizeable homeless population and UCSF as a whole is more focused on the underserved so would really consider UCSF for ur goals. UCSF is one of the top places in academic medicine for service to the community.
Just my opinion but 1. UCLA HPACT, 2. Hopkins Bayview, 3. Emory = UCSF

 

[Deecee2DO]

Move cedars from #3 imo. Although its in LA its very much not underserved focused so you may not get the experience you want there. Would also switch UCSF and UCLA-Oliveview unless you really want to be in LA, but SF has a sizeable homeless population and UCSF as a whole is more focused on the underserved so would really consider UCSF for ur goals. UCSF is one of the top places in academic medicine for service to the community.
Just my opinion but 1. UCLA HPACT, 2. Hopkins Bayview, 3. Emory = UCSF

Idk why emory isnt number one here its rhe best program on this list

 

[hlab27pair]

If you don't mind me asking, what made you decide on Michigan and Northwestern above the rest?

Mostly location, but also culture and strength of training

 

[Green_Goose]

Between Duke, UTSW, and Vandy, how would you rank the difficulty of scheduling/QoL/Culture? Or are they basically all equal?

I can only speak for UTSW, but their schedule struck me as rather intense. They have quite a bit of overnight ward call, which I find kind of ridiculous considering that so many other programs of UTSW's caliber have transitioned to night float and some have even gotten rid of 28 hour calls entirely.

 

[Green_Goose]

It’s a good question to ask. Agree that CCF is one of if not the best fellowship programs because the fellows get a ton of training. Can the same be said for the residents? If you are looking for good clinical training, consider a place that allowed for robust resident autonomy

That said the big places are much more likely to get you good research opportunities

Do you think that the same issues regarding resident autonomy at CCF would also apply to Mayo's IM residency?

 

[Hopeful9999]

Idk why emory isnt number one here its rhe best program on this list

I mostly agree but OP wants to be in LA

 

[obiwan]

I can only speak for UTSW, but their schedule struck me as rather intense. They have quite a bit of overnight ward call, which I find kind of ridiculous considering that so many other programs of UTSW's caliber have transitioned to night float and some have even gotten rid of 28 hour calls entirely.

Training at Parkland is not for the faint of heart ........

 

[Green_Goose]

Training at Parkland is not for the faint of heart ........

Yeah I was definitely getting the impression that they don't play around down there, lol

 

[Hopeful9999]

All I can say is that none of them will inhibit you in terms of getting a Heme/Onc spot, even compared to the others on your list.

Thank you! So out of these 4, there isn't one that's definitely "ahead" of the rest? I like them all pretty equally (all 4 seemed to have great cultures) so its been pretty hard for me to decide

 

[gutonc]

Thank you! So out of these 4, there isn't one that's definitely "ahead" of the rest? I like them all pretty equally (all 4 seemed to have great cultures) so its been pretty hard for me to decide

Case is probably the "lowest ranked" of those 4, but not in any meaningful way.

If I were ranking them, I'd do it by location:
CU
UNC
UAB/Case (is Cleveland worse than the deep South for me? Hard to say.)

 

[IdkLol2049]

My final rank list. Let me know if I am crazy for ranking any of these higher than the others. I am looking to do Cardiology.

1.) University of Cincinnati Medical Center/College of Medicine (Cincinnati, OH)
2.) Virginia Commonwealth University Health System (Richmond, VA)
3.) University of Massachusetts Chan Medical School (Worcester, MA)
4.) University of Connecticut (Farmington, CT)
5.) University of Buffalo (Buffalo, NY)
6.) Albert Einstein Healthcare Network (Philadelphia, PA)
7.) Carilion Clinic-Virginia Tech Carilion School of Medicine (Roanoke, VA)
8.) Lehigh Valley Health Network/University of South Florida College of Medicine (Allentown, PA)
9.) The MetroHealth System/Case Western Reserve University (Cleveland, OH)
10.) Albert Einstein Healthcare Network/Einstein Medical Center Montgomery (East Norriton, PA)
11.) Summa Health System/NEOMED (Akron, OH)
12.) Akron General Medical Center/NEOMED (Akron, OH)
13.) Greenwich Hospital/Yale University (Greenwich, CT)
(I have 3 others that are at the very bottom that I am certain about).

Thank you all!

 

[Deecee2DO]

My final rank list. Let me know if I am crazy for ranking any of these higher than the others. I am looking to do Cardiology.

1.) University of Cincinnati Medical Center/College of Medicine (Cincinnati, OH)
2.) Virginia Commonwealth University Health System (Richmond, VA)
3.) University of Massachusetts Chan Medical School (Worcester, MA)
4.) University of Connecticut (Farmington, CT)
5.) University of Buffalo (Buffalo, NY)
6.) Albert Einstein Healthcare Network (Philadelphia, PA)
7.) Carilion Clinic-Virginia Tech Carilion School of Medicine (Roanoke, VA)
8.) Lehigh Valley Health Network/University of South Florida College of Medicine (Allentown, PA)
9.) The MetroHealth System/Case Western Reserve University (Cleveland, OH)
10.) Albert Einstein Healthcare Network/Einstein Medical Center Montgomery (East Norriton, PA)
11.) Summa Health System/NEOMED (Akron, OH)
12.) Akron General Medical Center/NEOMED (Akron, OH)
13.) Greenwich Hospital/Yale University (Greenwich, CT)
(I have 3 others that are at the very bottom that I am certain about).

Thank you all!

Looks good. VCU and Cinci are by far the best on your list with VCU being slightly better in terms of fellowship match IMO. Cinci matches a lot of in-house for fellowships especially cards

 

[EldenKing123]

Don’t know what to do. Decision overload. HELP.


Temple, Rutgers NJMS, USC, Brown, UT-Houston, University of Illinois at Chicago, UArizona Tucson, UWisconsin, MCW, UIowa Hospitals and Clinics, UMASS Chan(Worcester)ZuckerHofstra-at Lennox Hill, University of Chicago(North Shore), Icahn Mt Sinai at Beth Israel, University of Miami-HCH, UT-Austin.

 

[Deecee2DO]

Don’t know what to do. Decision overload. HELP.


Temple, Rutgers NJMS, USC, Brown, UT-Houston, University of Illinois at Chicago, UArizona Tucson, UWisconsin, MCW, UIowa Hospitals and Clinics, UMASS Chan(Worcester)ZuckerHofstra-at Lennox Hill, University of Chicago(North Shore), Icahn Mt Sinai at Beth Israel, University of Miami-HCH, UT-Austin.

What are your career goals/fellowship interests? What are your priorities? (prestige? quality of life? location?)

Tier/prestige wise the best program on your list is USC Keck then I would say
-Brown/Iowa
-Wisconsin/UIC/Temple
-The rest

 

[gutonc]

Don’t know what to do. Decision overload. HELP.


Temple, Rutgers NJMS, USC, Brown, UT-Houston, University of Illinois at Chicago, UArizona Tucson, UWisconsin, MCW, UIowa Hospitals and Clinics, UMASS Chan(Worcester)ZuckerHofstra-at Lennox Hill, University of Chicago(North Shore), Icahn Mt Sinai at Beth Israel, University of Miami-HCH, UT-Austin.

Wisco
Iowa/USC
Brown
NJMS/Temple/UTH/UIC/UMass
The rest

Wisco is far and away the strongest program on your list.

 

[EldenKing123]

Could you elaborate on wh

Wisco
Iowa/USC
Brown
NJMS/Temple/UTH/UIC/UMass
The rest

Wisco is far and away the strongest program on your list.

Thank you for the info. Could you elborate why Wisco? Ppl have mostly told me USC.

 

[gutonc]

Could you elaborate on wh

Thank you for the info. Could you elborate why Wisco? Ppl have mostly told me USC.

They are both good programs. Wisco has a better "atmosphere" and support, along with rigorous training that you want. It's also not in SoCal, which is a big plus for me.

 

[Deecee2DO]

Wisco
Iowa/USC
Brown
NJMS/Temple/UTH/UIC/UMass
The rest

Wisco is far and away the strongest program on your list.

What is your rationale behind why wisco so far and away best program on that list much more so than Iowa USC and Brown. Imo the latter are pretty similar tier wise and strength of training. USC tough culture but strongest program overall imo

 

[Deecee2DO]

Felllowship wise I'm undecided but I'm might go down the Cards or hemeonc route or less competitive endocrinology route. Maybe academic hospitalist who knows honestly thinking about that this year. Priorities-wise I am not tied to a certain location but wanna balance program prestige with QOL. For example, I know USC is the most prestigious but QOL seems bad given the salary(50-60K) in LA, while ZuckerLennox less prestige but I liked the QOL, NYC and salary was good for the city(70K range).UIC,Temple,UTHouston and UMass all gave me great vibes but I guess people have been scaring me a little with the crime crap about Philly and Chicago, but it's probably just about learning how to move in the city and being aware of your surroundings(I already live in a violent place).

QOL Brown has the best imo. Youll match strong in any of your desired specialties coming from any of the programs I highlighted with USC wisco iowa and brown giving you most options fellowship wise

 

[Green_Goose]

How bad is Hyde Park as far as safety goes? My parents see 'south side Chicago' and immediately freak out

 

[BalaV]

Need ROL advice

US-IMG looking for IM Categorical program. Plan to pursue Cardiology Fellowship. Looking for program that supports research, fellowship match and learning. ROL Choices are:

1. Medstar Washington Hospital, DC
2. Danbury Hospital, CT
3. University of Nevada, Las Vegas
4. Eisenhower Hospital, Rancho Mirage
5. Saint Vincent, Worcester, MA
6. Montefiore Wakefield, NYC

Please let me know.

Thanks.

-B

 

[Deecee2DO]

Need ROL advice

US-IMG looking for IM Categorical program. Plan to pursue Cardiology Fellowship. Looking for program that supports research, fellowship match and learning. ROL Choices are:

1. Medstar Washington Hospital, DC
2. Danbury Hospital, CT
3. University of Nevada, Las Vegas
4. Eisenhower Hospital, Rancho Mirage
5. Saint Vincent, Worcester, MA
6. Montefiore Wakefield, NYC

Please let me know.

Thanks.

-B

1. UNLV
rest