Magical WW Signups and Game Thread

[TheGirlWithTheFernTattoo]

Why didn't you out my wish possibilities? They were very chaotic in nature.

Also did I give you the most possibilities?

I actually pegged you as villager. Wasn't until later in the game I realized.

Also was thoroughly entertained that everyone was freaking out about PBC being a liability when both you AND MJ were trying to get yourselves converted



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[TheGirlWithTheFernTattoo]

I'd like to second this question...

I was kind of confused when he seemed to have an "ask-the-mods" role since that was my ability and it seemed like an odd ability to duplicate but honestly even here at the end of the game I don't have a clue what he could actually do.

One of STLs wishes was to ask game related questions to mods. I was a nice Genie.


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[TheGirlWithTheFernTattoo]

It was a genie thing

Twas not anything the genie was aware of


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[TheGirlWithTheFernTattoo]

Curious, what genie thing changed stl s win con and what was it at the end???

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Wasn't me unless mods screwed with my wish granting abilities.

Besides, STL had the lamp pretty early in the game.



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[TheGirlWithTheFernTattoo]

Also did I give you the most possibilities?

I had a few people give me 5

 

[TheGirlWithTheFernTattoo]

True, which was a complete derp on my part. But the seering snafu was a curious thing for me

I thought it was a test to see if I left you alone, and in turn you would leave me alone. That's why I was so slow to get on the lynch train

 

[Ceke2002]

Holy load of tl;dr.....

Less wordage next time.

Next game I shall be doge - few words, little post, much comprehend.

 

[WildZoo]

you AND MJ were trying to get yourselves converted

Bad MJ!

 

[SummerTheLynx]

I actually pegged you as villager. Wasn't until later in the game I realized.

Also was thoroughly entertained that everyone was freaking out about PBC being a liability when both you AND MJ were trying to get yourselves converted



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Hey now I wasn't trying to, I was already chaos . There was no real reason to ask for the extra chaos convert, except I didn't have anyone to talk to about the game, and hadn't started etching coins with messages yet (and didn't know about Dy yet)

 

[LadyOtheFarm]

My understanding was that Dy asked for someone she could trust.
I was converted by the genie and given a win condition of "chaos had to outnumber wolves and villagers."
I thought that meant that Dy had lied, but Dy was surprised and tried to clarify if her win condition had changed. She was told yes, but not if I was killed again. Then she could still win with the village.

(So basically I was killed/rendered unable to win by the Genie/Dy on conversion and that is how chaos' win condition changed, but also didn't.)

 

[LetItSnow]

Since balance and stuff has been brought up, I'll throw my grump on the pile.

(First, it was an enjoyable game up until the end-game, which is where my comments sorta lie....)

I think new mods get in way over their head when they play with chaos/neutral roles. People always underestimate how much those roles can throw a game off the rails. It is REALLY sucky when a chaos/neutral/whatever role can basically decide who gets to win at the end - that should never happen. In this game, not only did we have one non-wolf/villager role, but we had .... what .... 3? That's way too much.

Chaos/Neutral roles should be very *limited* in power - not given 2..3...4...5... abilities or one really powerful ability. They should never be convertible unless they are 100% converted. You turn these roles loose in the minds of creative players like pre-vet/vet students/vets and you're just begging for your game to come unhinged.

The way this game ended, though, took a really good game and basically made it a "well .... that was anticlimactic and sucky" ending. I'm not saying that because villagers lost; but because it really didn't matter WHAT the village did - the non-village players pretty much got to pick the outcome. By creating that situation, it robs people of incentive to play.

And, of course, we all know my rant about balancing. I've always argued village should win 75% of the time, but even anyone who disagrees with me ought to <at least> agree that village should win 50% of the time. How much has the village won in the last year in pre-vet? I dunno. I think in the last 10 games it's been 2-3 games. Something like that. Pretty sure @WildZoo or @hazelmoo looked it up recently.

There are a ton of reasons (meh gameplay by absentee players, etc.), but one of the big reasons is newer mods creating games that are more complex than they are ready to mod.

Look back at Dyachei's game. Simple mechanics - and most people agree it was still one of the most fun games we've had recently. Complex mechanics don't inherently make for a fun game. Don't fall into that trap as a mod.

I did like a lot of the discussion in this game. There was a lot of really useful poking back and forth, and evaluation of what people were saying. That was awesome.

</rant>

 

[WildZoo]

Since balance and stuff has been brought up, I'll throw my grump on the pile.

(First, it was an enjoyable game up until the end-game, which is where my comments sorta lie....)

I think new mods get in way over their head when they play with chaos/neutral roles. People always underestimate how much those roles can throw a game off the rails. It is REALLY sucky when a chaos/neutral/whatever role can basically decide who gets to win at the end - that should never happen. In this game, not only did we have one non-wolf/villager role, but we had .... what .... 3? That's way too much.

Chaos/Neutral roles should be very *limited* in power - not given 2..3...4...5... abilities or one really powerful ability. They should never be convertible unless they are 100% converted. You turn these roles loose in the minds of creative players like pre-vet/vet students/vets and you're just begging for your game to come unhinged.

The way this game ended, though, took a really good game and basically made it a "well .... that was anticlimactic and sucky" ending. I'm not saying that because villagers lost; but because it really didn't matter WHAT the village did - the non-village players pretty much got to pick the outcome. By creating that situation, it robs people of incentive to play.

And, of course, we all know my rant about balancing. I've always argued village should win 75% of the time, but even anyone who disagrees with me ought to <at least> agree that village should win 50% of the time. How much has the village won in the last year in pre-vet? I dunno. I think in the last 10 games it's been 2-3 games. Something like that. Pretty sure @WildZoo or @hazelmoo looked it up recently.

There are a ton of reasons (meh gameplay by absentee players, etc.), but one of the big reasons is newer mods creating games that are more complex than they are ready to mod.

Look back at Dyachei's game. Simple mechanics - and most people agree it was still one of the most fun games we've had recently. Complex mechanics don't inherently make for a fun game. Don't fall into that trap as a mod.

I did like a lot of the discussion in this game. There was a lot of really useful poking back and forth, and evaluation of what people were saying. That was awesome.

</rant>

At the time that dy's game was run (but not finished yet), wolves had won 7 out of the previous 10 games. It's now 10 of 14. That's only going back to February of this year, so not sure about the total numbers in the last year.

ETA: Or, 8 of the last 10, so the ratio is getting worse. It was a shared win with a chaos-ish faction in the Peter Pan game, but still, for villagers to have only won 2 of the last 10 games

 

[hazelmoo]

I think a lot of the balancing issues had to do with the genie. Chaos got the lamp the first 2 times we RNG'd an owner for it, and that was pure luck for them. I appreciate all the comments and constructive criticism, but again, we purposefully brought on a veteran mod for the sole purpose of helping make sure balance wasn't going to be a problem. And to be fair, the villagers would probably have won had they gotten rid of chaos early. But oh well!