The WWatering Hole Bar Grand Opening - Game Thread.

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************************************************
The Dead's Unofficial Lynch Tally

britzen (1) - Ceke
Ceke (6) - britzen, Crayola, LIS, WZ, Ski, Fern

7/7
lynch close in ~ 2.5 hours
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Ugh, so many feelings about the Ceke lynch.

Basically, I'm going to feel like an idiot no matter which way she flips, and still paranoid of LIS either way.

If she flips wolf, does that mean the game is won? If not, there's at least one more wolf, right?

So we could use this time to try to hunt for the next wolf.
 
If Ceke flips village, I will be looking pretty hard at Britzen, LIS, and WZ. Fern has pretty much cleared herself in my mind, and while skiotter is a prime conversion target, he's also not a prime conversion target for that reason, not to mention he's also the only one I have really good reason to put in the village pile to begin with, at least.

Which puts me back to my paranoia of the other 3.
 
Crayola227 said:
If Ceke flips village, I will be looking pretty hard at Britzen, LIS, and WZ. Fern has pretty much cleared herself in my mind, and while skiotter is a prime conversion target, he's also not a prime conversion target for that reason, not to mention he's also the only one I have really good reason to put in the village pile to begin with, at least.

Which puts me back to my paranoia of the other 3.
Click to expand...
My vote will likely go to the Ritz before it goes to LIS.

Though I don't remember if I have solid reason to believe you're village...
 
WildZoo said:
My vote will likely go to the Ritz before it goes to LIS.
Though I don't remember if I have solid reason to believe you're village...
Click to expand...

My villagey-ness. 😛 Mainly, we've never seen me wolf, odds are that I'm village, and no one buys for a second that I could be a wolf and actually hold it together.

The chances that both Ceke and I are trying to be regular sketch villagers and are wolf is pretty low, imo. If she flips village, I could see that increasing suspicion of me. Still, it gets WIFOM to wonder if I would have used a similar defense. "I'm playing too sketchy to be wolf."

Every game we've played, I've always been on the verge of being lynched, or at least heavy on the wolf-dar, and I've been village.

My normal play is so sketchy to people to begin with it seems (when I'm being 100% straight), that basically if I'm ever wolf and have to carry off deception, the wolf pack will be ****ed. I was Dead Chaos, and everyone actually had me pegged for Chaos even before I did, sincerely. I expect if I'm ever wolf the pack will just bus me hard for village cred.

I realized a while back, that the consistent village play I was cultivating, would leave me in a very bad place as a wolf. I had to decide if I wanted to be a DocE/STL style player (not nearly clever enough, I tried to pull a vanillager plot this time and it was a total fail), a silent mysterious player like AM, or.... well, me. I chose to do what comes naturally to me. it's easier to keep straight, and to do what I read WW online guides said about game theory and playing in the same group over and over. Consistent, honest village play, helps you as both village and wolf.

Only problem is, it's one thing when your village play almost gets you lynched every game when you're villager. That same play as a wolf.... Basically, unless I become a better player, which will involve a personality transplant and a shorter post word limit, which would then be a change in tone and a major red flag, I'm going to have to accept that while I might be able to fly by as sketch villager, as a wolf I'll be dead meat. That's OK, because statistically more games I'll be village. The trade off is losing the few times I'm wolf. I'm OK with that unless I improve over time.

Yes, it's all WIFOM. Maybe I'll get lynched over it. But as I said, I'm investing in my village rep as a regular player. That will mean getting lynched as a villager, and likely losing as a wolf. As I said, I'm OK with it. Evnetually I hope people will come to know and trust my village self.
 
PippyPony said:
********
You missed nothing but egregious modbandonment
********
Click to expand...
tumblr_mzre17n0ky1rh2vpvo2_500.gif
 
****************
Melchizedek said:
*delays lynch write-up even longer*
Click to expand...

Dude, no one is going to come back and play your games.

I'm kidding. These people are ww addicts. You could mod-kill them all day one and some of them would still probably come back.

****************
 
giphy.gif
After sucessfully lynching a wolf the village didn't know what to do with themselves today. "Does anyone have any leads?" "Meh I think ceke has been sketchy since day 1." "Sure why not?"
Everyone gathered around and booted @Ceke2002 out of the bar.

9. @Ceke2002 Herradura Tequila who could add a message to each night write-up which the mods would translate into gifs.
​
It is now Night 8. Night closes 0600 EST. (or if all night actions are in early)

_ _ __ ___ ____ ______ __________ ______ ____ ___ __ _ _​

​

Roster

(Lonely) Hearts
1. @LetItSnow

Spades
2. @TheGirlWithTheFernTattoo

Diamonds
14. @WildZoo

Clubs
22. @britzen
8. @SkiOtter
10. @Crayola227

19. @Animal Midwife - Southern Tier Pumking Beer
20. @tartesos - Malibu "Rum"
13. @genny - Jack Daniels Whiskey
16. @Jilary - Strongbow Cider
3. @SnowshoeDog143 - St. George Absinthe
11. @finnickthedog - Water
4. @rabbott1971 - Tanqueray Gin
12. @SummerTheLynx - Angel's Envy Whiskey
23. @PippyPony - Pabst Blue Ribbon Beer
17. @allieh8607 - Jose Cuervo Tequila
6. @Kam325 - Blue Moon Beer
15. @Cyndia - Josh Wine
21. @LadyOtheFarm - Raleigh Rum Company Rum
18. @raf2769 - Guinness Beer
5. @PrincessButterCup - Maker's Mark Whiskey
7. @DVMDream - Johnnie Walker Whiskey
24. @mmmdreamerz - Captain Morgan Rum
9. @Ceke2002 - Herradura Tequila
 
britzen said:
Well f*** me sideways with a spoon, all that sketchy nonsense ceke did every. single. day. was really just ceke being ceke??????
Click to expand...

Yep. That's what I've said the whole time. I've just gotten really tripped out about people who seem village, the paranoia has really gotten to me. She sounded like Ceke the whole way, I just wasn't entirely sure about the sincerity of a few moves she made.
 
Crayola227 said:
Yep. That's what I've said the whole time. I've just gotten really tripped out about people who seem village, the paranoia has really gotten to me. She sounded like Ceke the whole way, I just wasn't entirely sure about the sincerity of a few moves she made.
Click to expand...
That's some nice backpedaling you've got going on there cray
 
Remind me, why did we clear Fern? She was the one that handed us DVM? Cuz I couldn't keep all the PM and plot and ability stuff straight.

This is bringing me back to LIS & WZ. They are veterans that know how to pull off wolf in villager's clothing, and subtly manipulate the village into lynching who they want. They could be village, but I know they can make for cunning wolves.

I'd rather lose the game to noobs skiotter and britzen than have what happened last game happen: veteran wolves get noob villagers to turn on each other.

To me it's not even about lynching them, I just feel really distrustful and hesitate to lynch anyone they want me to lynch, and get burned again.

On the gamble that Fern, skiotter, and britzen aren't all wolves, I'd like to align myself with them, if they happen to have better leads on who to lynch than I do.
 
Crayola227 said:
Remind me, why did we clear Fern?
Click to expand...

Because of her ability as the little princess, or whatever it's called. Seems like a super unlikely ability for a wolf to have.

Noob question: are all roles assigned RNG? As in, is it possible for any ability to go to anyone, even if it seems weird? Or are some roles reserved specifically for village / wolf only? (Obviously extra kill power like DVM had can't go to a villager, for example.)
 
WildZoo said:
That's some nice backpedaling you've got going on there cray
Click to expand...

Nah, the whole time from day 1 I've defended Ceke, and I wrote a very long post in spoilers on exactly why I was going ahead with the lynch of her.

I ran out of better suspects, she did things that were sketchy to me like outing my vanillager plot, as opposed to many claiming she sounded sketchy, when she sounded like Ceke. Also, and it's come up form the start, I've become increasingly paranoid of people that come off as villager to me. I really did start to wonder if Villager Ceke was an artfully played role, and if perhaps I was colored by totally believing her tone as villager, if that was making me write her off. All of the above led to a lynch I said I didn't feel great about but the majority of us clearly felt had to happen anyway.

It's not called backpedaling when you've been saying the same thing the whole time, and from early on.
 
I've been saying LIS riding Ceke was sketchy since day 1.

I defended genny and was wrong. I was also Snowy and DVM's biggest critics. Doesn't make much sense for a wolf to NOT bus genny AND ride DVM - before anyone openly suspected DVM.

I've suspected LIS from early on, and said that I would take Ceke's lynch as the end of a distraction and a data point on LIS.

I also suspect you, WZ. Even more now that Ceke didn't flip wolf.

With Ceke's death, I suspect LIS and Britz more now. LIS might have used Ceke as a distraction this whole time, and to keep us from seeing any more meaningful things that might have shown us more about his true intentions. Ceke always suspected Britz - she may not have been right, but now we know it wasn't wolfy distraction from Ceke.

Ceke and I both suspected Britz for the same reasons from the start - best analysis of the game came from Britz. Really saying something when you're playing with DVM and LIS - except now we know we weren't getting DVM's villager-all. Is this true of LIS? Or is Britz the miracle woof noob?

Since I've narrowed down to Britz, WZ, and LIS, and have decided I would rather this was a noob-ran defeat than one to veteran wolves, my vote will likely be for WZ or LIS.

I am aware this stake in the sand might result in my death by lynch or night. I don't care. My usefulness as a villager, besides numbers, has come to an end. My words and suspicions will outlive me. I'd rather die going down against these guys than let them win.
 
Well, besides casting dispersions on others, I've given my defense for why I'm not a wolf.

Let's hear it from all the rest still alive. Seriously. A small paragraph from each of you on why you aren't a wolf and who you suspect is.
 
Crayola227 said:
best analysis of the game came from Britz.
Click to expand...

I like that from that same post early on I was both told I was putting out $hit analysis and somehow it is now also the best analysis. I really can't win. :shrug:

Unless you think LIS and I are both wolves, he reads me as pretty normal (I think - at least he did early on), and I've spent the most time arguing with him on this forum compared to anyone in this game. So he's probably got the best sense of my argumentative and reasoning style when it comes to posts.
 
Here's where I'm at with everybody who's left:

LIS: Pegged as village the whole time but openly Machiavellian, so don't necessarily trust my read there. Cray noted some possible under the radar interactions between LIS/DVM - maybe a subconscious thing they didn't even know they were doing. WIFOM-style but Kam got offed after she started casting suspicion on him. Somebody (Kam, again, I think) pointed out that a good wolf pack would have had a vote on genny D1/D2 and he is one of only two players left alive who voted for her.

BBC: Little princess in the game - a role that seems very unlikely for a wolf. I need to go back and look at her postings because I feel like she was under the radar for me most of the game, other than the dust up with M3 which seems to have mostly been the fault of a mod-error.

WZ: Used ability for kill cancel, which seems very village but there is a small potential it could swing wolf. The second player still alive who voted for genny on D1/D2 when no other wolves did. No pattern confirmed about roles, but two dead wolves were whisky, and one was tequila - WZ is also tequila so it could be 2 of each. Also one of the only people on thread who openly stated her role affiliation, which could possibly be fishing to get other people to say something out their roles after ceke brought it up (even though ceke's seems way sketchier in real-time...)

Ski: Innocent child ability. She could be a convert, but she wouldn't be an original wolf and based on Pippy's message where it seemed like there were 4-5 wolves in the game to start. If we lynch a wolf and the game is still going, I'd revisit here, but I don't think it's necessary for right now.

Cray: Defensive on D1 when no votes were really going her way. Weak reasoning on snowy vote, piled onto bad logic of the AM vote, and defended genny early on. Lots of crazy circular logic that doesn't really say anything and points fingers at all sorts of people simultaneously for contradictory reason (although this seems to be her normal game play), threw out a "I'm not a wolf, maybe YOU'RE THE WOLF" defense, used the phrase "If I was you villagers" at some point. After getting called out for being cray cray on D1, went much quieter and more subdued. This was noticed by both myself and LoTF; maybe her current level of game play is the Cray version of under the radar.


Looking at LIS, WZ, or Cray now, may add BBC on a re-read. So yeah, basically everybody still alive. This game is dumb.
 
Crayola227 said:
A small paragraph from each of you on why you aren't a wolf
Click to expand...

There are three things that have been brought up that I remember declaring my possibly sketchy (if there were others, remind me what they were and I will address them too):

1. Too smart for a noob
I addressed this two posts up too and earlier when Kam brought it up... My posts have been called both useless and brilliant, so I'm not really sure how to defend against this claim. The idea that a wolf pack was feeding my giant paragraphs of text D1 is asinine though. If anyone wants to go super meta and read some argumentative work of mine for future games, I'm happy to send you some works - my academic writing style is basically the same way I approach WW. (Do you like Medieval Middle Eastern social history and cultural geography? How about pastoral nomadic societies? Because if you do.... Man, oh, man, do I have a treat for you!)

2. Didn't get on board with the genny lynch
Lots of people didn't, and I stand by the fact that this was a Lynch-A-B**** Bandwagon. Did it work out? Sure did. But there were other good lynch candidates at the same time and 12 other people didn't vote for her either. I also didn't jump on board with other bandwagons (snowy, lotf) that I thought were dumb. The LotF vote in particular would have been an unremarkable vote that would have resulted in a dead villager, so I'm not sure why I would bother defending her if I were a wolf.

3. Disrupting communication networks with my ability
Unless someone openly said on thread they were knee deep in pms, I wouldn't have any way to know what I was breaking up or not. It's clear that some players are more pm-heavy than others, and I got a pretty good sense this game of who those people were for future reference. If you go back and look you'll see I never broke up any 2 person groups to try to minimize isolating anybody and I never moved cyndia/STL/WZ again when it was clear that the move really f*cked up their communication.

The pairings I made are also clearly match ups of people I said seemed more likely to be village vs. questionable on thread. Overall, the pairings I made seem like a really stupid way to use my ability if I were a wolf. Instead, I could have been purposefully trying to be more disruptive by isolating players or trying to push wolfy intel fishing. And using my power in an innocent way the whole game, just so I could say that's what I did on N8, would be a hell of a long con and very WIFOM.
 
britzen said:
There are three things that have been brought up that I remember declaring my possibly sketchy (if there were others, remind me what they were and I will address them too):

1. Too smart for a noob
I addressed this two posts up too and earlier when Kam brought it up... My posts have been called both useless and brilliant, so I'm not really sure how to defend against this claim. The idea that a wolf pack was feeding my giant paragraphs of text D1 is asinine though. If anyone wants to go super meta and read some argumentative work of mine for future games, I'm happy to send you some works - my academic writing style is basically the same way I approach WW. (Do you like Medieval Middle Eastern social history and cultural geography? How about pastoral nomadic societies? Because if you do.... Man, oh, man, do I have a treat for you!)

2. Didn't get on board with the genny lynch
Lots of people didn't, and I stand by the fact that this was a Lynch-A-B**** Bandwagon. Did it work out? Sure did. But there were other good lynch candidates at the same time and 12 other people didn't vote for her either. I also didn't jump on board with other bandwagons (snowy, lotf) that I thought were dumb. The LotF vote in particular would have been an unremarkable vote that would have resulted in a dead villager, so I'm not sure why I would bother defending her if I were a wolf.

3. Disrupting communication networks with my ability
Unless someone openly said on thread they were knee deep in pms, I wouldn't have any way to know what I was breaking up or not. It's clear that some players are more pm-heavy than others, and I got a pretty good sense this game of who those people were for future reference. If you go back and look you'll see I never broke up any 2 person groups to try to minimize isolating anybody and I never moved cyndia/STL/WZ again when it was clear that the move really f*cked up their communication.

The pairings I made are also clearly match ups of people I said seemed more likely to be village vs. questionable on thread. Overall, the pairings I made seem like a really stupid way to use my ability if I were a wolf. Instead, I could have been purposefully trying to be more disruptive by isolating players or trying to push wolfy intel fishing. And using my power in an innocent way the whole game, just so I could say that's what I did on N8, would be a hell of a long con and very WIFOM.
Click to expand...

Good defense.

ETA: especially this bit:
"The idea that a wolf pack was feeding my giant paragraphs of text D1 is asinine though."
Touche. Makes total sense.
 
Crayola227 said:
This is bringing me back to LIS & WZ. They are veterans that know how to pull off wolf in villager's clothing, and subtly manipulate the village into lynching who they want. They could be village, but I know they can make for cunning wolves.
Click to expand...

I'm sorry, but WHICH part of my voting for Ceke all game was subtle?

I was wrong. Whatever. It's happened before. Will happen again.
 
Crayola227 said:
I've been saying LIS riding Ceke was sketchy since day 1.

I defended genny and was wrong. I was also Snowy and DVM's biggest critics. Doesn't make much sense for a wolf to NOT bus genny AND ride DVM - before anyone openly suspected DVM.

I've suspected LIS from early on, and said that I would take Ceke's lynch as the end of a distraction and a data point on LIS.

I also suspect you, WZ. Even more now that Ceke didn't flip wolf.

With Ceke's death, I suspect LIS and Britz more now. LIS might have used Ceke as a distraction this whole time, and to keep us from seeing any more meaningful things that might have shown us more about his true intentions. Ceke always suspected Britz - she may not have been right, but now we know it wasn't wolfy distraction from Ceke.

Ceke and I both suspected Britz for the same reasons from the start - best analysis of the game came from Britz. Really saying something when you're playing with DVM and LIS - except now we know we weren't getting DVM's villager-all. Is this true of LIS? Or is Britz the miracle woof noob?

Since I've narrowed down to Britz, WZ, and LIS, and have decided I would rather this was a noob-ran defeat than one to veteran wolves, my vote will likely be for WZ or LIS.

I am aware this stake in the sand might result in my death by lynch or night. I don't care. My usefulness as a villager, besides numbers, has come to an end. My words and suspicions will outlive me. I'd rather die going down against these guys than let them win.
Click to expand...

So basically, your entire argument comes down to "LIS pushed for Ceke all game, therefore LIS is a wolf?"

That's pathetic.
 
LetItSnow said:
So basically, your entire argument comes down to "LIS pushed for Ceke all game, therefore LIS is a wolf?"

That's pathetic.
Click to expand...

Hey, I also said I found you "logic lite" and that your like history matched DVMD's. I said the same of her and she denied it, but I was right about her.

I admit that with DVMD flipping wolf, and Ceke being a villager, I probably won't continue to get "lucky" going for the folks that feel like "off" villagers.

LIS, who is your new pick for lynch? What do you make of Fern, Britz, WZ, or Ski? Assuming you don't vote for me? In fact, even if you do vote for me, I'd still like to see you commit to who your next pick would be. It would help village if you don't make it to morning +/- you or I are lynched and flip village. If you're really village that shouldn't be asking for a lot.
 
LetItSnow said:
So basically, your entire argument comes down to "LIS pushed for Ceke all game, therefore LIS is a wolf?"

That's pathetic.
Click to expand...

Actually, I think it's ingenious, and since I'm so silly and stupid, one of these days when RNG finally makes me a wolf, I'll need to read back through these threads and take notes. Especially since I'll need some "pathetic" wolf logic for wolf me to pass as village me, since all I use is pathetic logic.

If you're a wolf, you can easily identify the sketchiest village player, who provides a lot of distraction, yet there is a good chance will be tolerated for much of the game because of the ambiguity. Then rather than meaningfully have to engage everyone else, you just "tunnel" them the whole game. If they are lynched and you are wrong, everyone will believe it was an honest mistake, on to the next easy target. If they are not, you have little to do all game besides cry how sketchy they are.

I wouldn't be surprised if your next move is to cry I'm a wolf, and I don't even care. Because if you're not a wolf you should feel just as comfortable telling us your next pick.
 
~Night Closed~

giphy.gif
Last night someone pointed out that there was an underage child at the bar, skating by and putting our liquor license in danger. Of course @Trilt and I had to take action. With everything else going wrong, the last thing we needed was to lose our license. Why would the wolves tattle on someone? I guess the wolves just didn't want to kill such an adorable little girl

8. @SkiOtter - Gosling's Ginger Beer Innocent Child who could ask the mods to confirm her Villager status on thread at any point in the game.
​
It is now Day 9. Lynch closes 2200 EST.

_ _ __ ___ ____ ______ __________ ______ ____ ___ __ _ _​

​

Roster

(Lonely) Hearts
1. @LetItSnow

Spades
2. @TheGirlWithTheFernTattoo

Diamonds
14. @WildZoo

Clubs
22. @britzen
10. @Crayola227

19. @Animal Midwife - Southern Tier Pumking Beer
20. @tartesos - Malibu "Rum"
13. @genny - Jack Daniels Whiskey
16. @Jilary - Strongbow Cider
3. @SnowshoeDog143 - St. George Absinthe
11. @finnickthedog - Water
4. @rabbott1971 - Tanqueray Gin
12. @SummerTheLynx - Angel's Envy Whiskey
23. @PippyPony - Pabst Blue Ribbon Beer
17. @allieh8607 - Jose Cuervo Tequila
6. @Kam325 - Blue Moon Beer
15. @Cyndia - Josh Wine
21. @LadyOtheFarm - Raleigh Rum Company Rum
18. @raf2769 - Guinness Beer
5. @PrincessButterCup - Maker's Mark Whiskey
7. @DVMDream - Johnnie Walker Whiskey
24. @mmmdreamerz - Captain Morgan Rum
9. @Ceke2002 - Herradura Tequila
8. @SkiOtter - Gosling's Ginger Beer
 
Last edited:
If we are down to 2 wolves, then this next lynch is lylo, right?

I'm hoping there's only one.

Which means I have to decide if I'm voting for WZ or LIS. Fern I thought we had cleared, and Britzen is no more sketch than the rest to me now as far as I am concerned.

I should be up before lynch close but there's a chance I won't be. I'm not up for the day, in fact, I'm just about to turn in.

I'm tempted to contingency lynch WZ over LIS for various reasons, but I want to see some defense from them both first. LIS is right I could be tunneling him, and he could be villager and just tunneled Ceke. WZ, I find her night cancel ability less than convincing in light of the STL/Cyndia/WZ debacle. Possibly I'm playing into the hands of Britzen or Fern who could have set either of them up to look wolfy. I'd rather lose to those two, though. Unless someone can convince me about Britzen or Fern.

Possibly the 4 of you will decide I am the sketchiest, and sadly, if there are 2 wolves, it won't take much to put me down and hand them the game. If you can resist the urge to lynch me, the question is, besides me, who is the most sketchy?
 
Um, so it came up at least twice that LIS is clutching a box of wine to his chest... maybe this had something to do with a PM box, I had at least one PM box this game that wasn't set up by Britzen.

It was between me and Allieh. I wasn't sure the mechanic that generated it, but I opened it because that's what I do, I open PMs. Nothing exciting happened.

LIS has claimed vanillager. But then I thought he also implied a "harmless" PM ability. He claimed vanillager after I did.

How many vanillagers are there in this game? I think I said earlier I thought there was one killed already, so I could see there being more than one.

But that this point, do we really think both LIS and myself are vanillagers? I know I am. But is he?

Moreso than WZ, I'm getting the feeling of deception from LIS about this. I'm thinking it's less and less likely we are both vanillagers.

lynch LIS
 
I'm a little tired of the Cyndia/WZ/STL debacle being brought up every single day as if one of us had to be a wolf. The ONLY person who thought there was an issue was STL, and even when he outted my ability no longer thought there was a discrepancy with Cyndia, but rather wanted to make sure that the ability I had was a night cancel, and not a lynch avoidance. That has been proven. I used my boost to cancel kills without canceling village actions which I did not have to do. No one else would have know that was even an option.
 
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