WildZenge Presents: Horizon Zero DaWWn

[Animal Midwife]

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Again if no yeet is an option, we should do that now, see what AM thinks of and decide the next day

I would be fully with you, but no yeet is unfortunately not an option.

 

[Crayola227]

Was the night action performed on Cray by April ever fully explained?

I don't want to out someone else's PR, but I did make the claim, that the night after that, when I was deactivated, that I used an item on myself. AM is also claiming she got an item.

That's the thing as well, deactivation only affected my PR, it didn't stop me from using an item. I asked the mods this. I'm not sure your ability would stop a wolf from using the factional kill.

 

[Lawpy]

But just checked, and no vote is in fact not an option

Which is causing the current problem

 

[Lawpy]

I would be fully with you, but no yeet is unfortunately not an option.

Yeah it's troubling me especially if we're considering the possibility if intentional no wolf kills in play

 

[Lawpy]

I'm doubling down on 36/12 to think things through

 

[Aprilthearab]

I'm assuming April has used it before since she knew exactly what I was referring to.

I only craft and distribute items, I don't get to use them myself

 

[Lawpy]

I don't know if tying is a good idea or not. Very risky to bet on that for a no yeet RNG but i don't know how the numbers would be with different possiblities

 

[Crayola227]

I'm literally trying but at the same time, i'm also factoring in the Lawpy vs AM situation here by pointing out if the POE in fact narrows down to us two, then yeeting me is a better sacrifice than yeeting AM.

I've been fully insisting on a bussing possibility but it looks like not many are willing to consider that

I'm willing to consider the bussing issue, and I have tried. But it's hard for me to put aside the results last night to vote someone who was early on a wolf or has other mechanics in their favor.

Why are you, a claimed investigative role, a better yeet than AM?

Also, does it make sense for AM to ability or role reveal at this point?

 

[Crayola227]

Did anyone who's here play with AM the most recent time she wolfed? What did that look like? I think I only have GGoats as a reference point and she was extremely obvious to me then. I don't think she'd play that way again so that makes it really hard for me to know what to look for in wolf!AM when it's not blatantly obvious.

I played in a more recent and subtle wolf out by her. She and genny saved me for the end game misyeet.

 

[Aprilthearab]

I feel like if you're telling the truth, then the wolf is most likely to kill you or me compared to the others. If I block the wolf and they are targeting me, do I die anyway? Also per the rules at the start of the game (so I'm not likely saying anything anyone doesn't already know) I can't block AM again. I don't know who to block tonight.

We can yeet AM today and if she flips village, you block Lawpy tonight hoping that the block comes first in order of operations so that he can't kill you first

 

[Animal Midwife]

I only craft and distribute items, I don't get to use them myself

Was not aware you were a tinkerer.

 

[Animal Midwife]

I don't know if tying is a good idea or not. Very risky to bet on that for a no yeet RNG but i don't know how the numbers would be with different possiblities

Yeah, I wouldn't bank on that especially if it does double-death or something worse than that.

 

[Crayola227]

Wait you think cubs disables nightkills?

Dude, that's what everyone has been saying, which is why we've put forth two theories for the no wolf kill night. I blocked AM, and your ability was disabled by Cubs. The question is would that have disabled a wolf factional kill as well. I lean to no.

 

[Crayola227]

My ability description specifically says that the persons ACTION would be blocked. doesnt distinguish between just ability or all actions.

but what about the part where it disables them?

Because two things happened when I acted on you 1) my action on you that night failed and you fought it off and 2) I was damaged and unable to use my ability the following night. But note that I didn't lose the ability to do any and all actions. I lost being able to use my PR but I was able to still use an item. The "damage" done to me like didn't totally paralyze me or something.

 

[Crayola227]

If optional wolf kills are a thing, i'd only believe no yeets should be fair

who knows man. mods do what they want I guess

 

[Crayola227]

@cubsrule4e does your role description give much info about the extent it disables someone? Does it make them completely useless for a night? Or does it specifically say night ability, or something else?

Also while I can't speak to a wolf's factional kill, I've addressed this somewhat in saying that I lost the ability to use my PR (block) but I didn't lose the ability to use an item.

 

[Aprilthearab]

I feel like there's a better chance we end the game today voting you, or if you're a misyeet, moving on to the best person (maybe Lawpy tomorrow unless other night results help us here) tomorrow.

I agree with this reasoning for today's yeet

 

[Crayola227]

Again if no yeet is an option, we should do that now, see what AM thinks of and decide the next day

already said, no yeet is not an option this game

 

[supershorty]

Dedicated to the Mels yeet means nothing if deepwolfing is in play. Again deepwolves have every incentive to be dedicated to yeeting wolves just like villagers. Sounding the same as village!cubs doesn't mean much because wolves by their nature like to sound village. Even Mels was sounding village to some people here.

If cubs deepwolfed, it was with an incredibly high degree of dedication. He's only had 1 day so far where he didn't vote a confirmed wolf. It's the best VCA of the game.

I don't disagree with the shorty or Cray reads but it's not wise to ignore bussing being an option when at least 2 people who were widely viewed as sketchy/wolfy based on feels/tone/VCA ended up village. When something like this happens, especially near late game, it's necessary to reevaluate everyone, take into account of bussing and make an informed decision and not double down on another sketchy read, flip a villager, get even more disheartened when the remaining players look even more village, and then let village fatigue set in for the last wolf to win. We already have some fatigue setting in when people want to push for 12/12 rather than 36/12

I don't disagree with the second part of this, but it feels a little stretchy to say that I might have double bussed on the entire flipped pack.

You're misunderstanding that POE. I've repeatedly insisted on Mels/TME pack while briefly thinking about you/cubs until settling on TME. TME was widely viewed as sketchy, let's not kid ourselves here by retroactively condemning me for voting her as favoring Mels. Mels was already racking up enough votes and was likely doomed especially with how the Sporty yeet the previous day went. This even more suggests to me that bussing was likely in play especially if it's shown the no wolf kill was intentional

You were on the TME wagon early, but how did you feel about it suddenly going from just you to being at Mel (5), TME (3) near the end of vote close?

You're literally the only investigative role alive outside of me that I'm aware of.

Lawpy also has claimed an investigative role.

We need to further discuss this situation now:

If village sacrifices me and i flip village, who will be most likely to be wolf? AM? What if she's village? What if she's wolf who played well? What if it's cubs who's coasting along with aprils votes?

I think you could come up with what-ifs about any one of us, I'm not sure how this helps us solve the game.

 

[Animal Midwife]

If you yeet Lawpy tomorrow and he's village, you realize the game will be lost, right?

 

[Aprilthearab]

Also, if we yeet AM today, then she flips village and @Crayola227 blocks Lawpy tonight, that should theoretically tell us if Lawpy is wolf or not so we go into tomorrow better prepared to make the correct yeet vote

 

[Crayola227]

Gameplay and Mechanics

1. Yeet will close every other day at 10pm EST. Night will close as soon as all actions are received (assuming a mod is awake), or at 10am EST. Some nights may need to close earlier. Watch for these announcements. Late in the game we plan to accelerate to 12/12 cycles.

2. Unless otherwise noted, actions cannot be used on yourself, or on the same player consecutively. Actions are not compulsory.

3. You will have noticed that you did not receive character flavor in your role PMs. This was intentional, to prevent gamesolving via role reveals and to allow for more storytelling in the writeups. You do all have characters assigned to you, however, and these will be revealed upon death.

4. PMs will occur during the night cycle only. Each night you can open a PM with an "ally" of your choice, defined as someone who was on the same yeet vote as you. Please include the mods in your PMs.

5. Writeups will contain hints about game events, but will also be flavorful. We will try to keep story spoilers for the game as minimal as we can, but expect that some things will be spoiled.

Rules

1. Do not discuss the game outside of the thread and your role PM

2. Place votes in bold or ####between numerous octothorpes#### using the terms "vote" or "yeet". If you have already placed a vote, you must unvote to place a new one. "No vote" is not an option.

3. Participation requirements are in place. You must vote and make at least 10 posts each day cycle. The first infraction will incur a warning, the second will result in modkill.

4. Subs are available for extenuating life circumstances only, not to replace ghosty players. If you require a sub, please contact the mods directly. Do not post about it on the thread. We do not currently have anyone signed up to sub so...don't bank on that option.

5. Dead players should post in ******stars****** and keep commentary to a minimum. Also mind your reactions to posts.

6. Direct quoting or copy/pasting of PMs is not allowed. Screenshots are not allowed. Fake copy/pasting, quoting, and screenshots are not allowed either.

7. You may edit posts, but do not delete them, and do not edit yeet votes.

8. Do not discuss or share your night results before the writeup is posted. However, you are free to continue to strategize between yeet close and writeup.

9. Gifs are welcome but should be hidden in spoiler tags for ease of thread loading.

10. I am saving the most important rule for last. Remember this is a game and is meant to be fun. We will not tolerate personal attacks against other players. Think before you post. Things can get heated, but keep it to accusations and rebuttals about this game.

 

[supershorty]

There are only 2 people still alive who haven't ended any day on a wolf, and I was strongly village reading one of them and starting to village lean the other, but I feel really stuck right now.

 

[Animal Midwife]

This feels like when I'm trying to explain yolo vote mechanics but it's worse because it's going to be two cycles of torture instead of one.

 

[Crayola227]

I don't know if tying is a good idea or not. Very risky to bet on that for a no yeet RNG but i don't know how the numbers would be with different possiblities

Or all could die in the tie. Which might be OK if a wolf is tied in there, but what if it's an RNG and only kills villagers by chance?

 

[Animal Midwife]

It's fine though because I secretly enjoy having valid reason to hate mechanics.

 

[Aprilthearab]

@Animal Midwife are you in favor of 12/12 now? I'm seriously considering on being sacrificed now since it's better than getting sacrificed in mylo

I don't think your death today is going to make the village win happen any easier if you're village

 

[Aprilthearab]

I think i'm stuck facing a giant anti-Lawpy truck that's going to run me over either way.

I think this is a bit dramatic considering quite a few of us are considering yeeting AM today for game-solving strategy

 

[supershorty]

I mean if i'm doomed to be a village sacrifice thanks to the restoration of 2020 sub persecution

I don't see how today has anything to do with your subbing.

I'm having a really hard time reconciling how Mel interacted with the MsLawpy slot and with knowing that Lawpy was unable to act last night from acting on cubs the night before, there being no wolf kill, and looking at that alongside his (and MsP's) VCA.

 

[Aprilthearab]

Was the night action performed on Cray by April ever fully explained?

It was an item I gave her that protected her from an attack for the night if she used it but as a result she would sleep through the night and not get a night result

 

[WildZoo]

Every time y'all quote me I panic a little, thinking I've done a mod rojo

 

[Aprilthearab]

I'm literally trying but at the same time, i'm also factoring in the Lawpy vs AM situation here by pointing out if the POE in fact narrows down to us two, then yeeting me is a better sacrifice than yeeting AM.

But it's not, because then Cray wouldn't be able to block her tonight and then we'd be stuck with the WIFOM of AM's night results tomorrow

 

[Crayola227]

We can yeet AM today and if she flips village, you block Lawpy tonight hoping that the block comes first in order of operations so that he can't kill you first

I think we've thought this out, that the only way this doesn't work, is if AM AND Lawpy are not the last wolf. Which means we lost to a deep wolf busser, or I guess me with my mediocre VCA (I play Devil's Advocate and try to take outside perspectives that would consider the possibility of my being a wolf even though I obviously know I'm not. But it helps to try to see things from your fellow villagers' perspectives in trying to make a case for what should be done). Honestly guys though this feels like a level of gamesolving I can't fake as a wolf.

If block Lawpy, he isn't wolf, I don't know if the wolf kills me, if that lets Lawpy investigate as normal, or if it would stop Lawpy from investigating (or give him an excuse for saying he didn't). I don't know if the wolf can do a no kill night and how that changes the game going forward.

And then trying to consider if I block Lawpy and we both live and the wolf is a deep busser how that plays out... seems like the wolf would want to target me or Lawpy but then they don't have a no kill night to mess with people that way.

Frak man end game with mechanics hurts ma brain it's so much work

 

[supershorty]

Every time y'all quote me I panic a little, thinking I've done a mod rojo

No, rojos are @Zenge142's job.

 

[Aprilthearab]

I've been fully insisting on a bussing possibility but it looks like not many are willing to consider that

Who is your wolfiest read right now, if bussing is a possibility in your book?

 

[Crayola227]

Was not aware you were a tinkerer.

How did you miss this with the fact April was directed to me, and I'm saying the next night I used an item? And you are claiming to have an item and she seemed unsurprised by your saying so?

 

[Aprilthearab]

No, but I don't think it's necessary to be on thread at this point.

Lol whoops

Everyone already knows my ability and everyone already knows I gave Cray something N2 and she already used the item so I didn't see any point in hiding it

 

[Animal Midwife]

How did you miss this with the fact April was directed to me, and I'm saying the next night I used an item? And you are claiming to have an item and she seemed unsurprised by your saying so?

I didn't remember you saying anything about an item. I'm looking for wolves, not tracking ambiguous night actions.

 

[Aprilthearab]

How did you miss this with the fact April was directed to me, and I'm saying the next night I used an item? And you are claiming to have an item and she seemed unsurprised by your saying so?

To be fair it sounded like she assumed the item was in general circulation and got passed from one person to the next and I had already gotten the item previously and thus knew what it was. And I'm not certain if you ever specifically said you used an item, just that you were acted on

 

[Animal Midwife]

If it turns out I was right about Lawpy, I will be very proud of myself so that's one positive thing about this experience.

 

[supershorty]

@Aprilthearab can the items you make only be used at night?

 

[Aprilthearab]

Also the issue with blocking Lawpy, is what if the wolves do a no kill night just to ensure he's the misyeet tomorrow? If he is village he won't be able to investigate anyone if I block him.

That would assume wolves would intentionally go TWO nights in a row without a kill and that just seems unreasonable

 

[Crayola227]

I don't see how today has anything to do with your subbing.

I'm having a really hard time reconciling how Mel interacted with the MsLawpy slot and with knowing that Lawpy was unable to act last night from acting on cubs the night before, there being no wolf kill, and looking at that alongside his (and MsP's) VCA.

can you expound on this? What is the issue with MsLawpy's slot and VCA and the interactions?

God I don't want to try to reread any of the last 50 pages.

 

[Aprilthearab]

@Aprilthearab can the items you make only be used at night?

Yes

 

[Animal Midwife]

That would assume wolves would intentionally go TWO nights in a row without a kill and that just seems unreasonable

It always seems unreasonable until you experience it yourself.

 

[Aprilthearab]

@Aprilthearab can the items you make only be used at night?

Actually, I don't think my mod PM ever specified, but I specified the last two items I made as night-only. It might be possible for me to craft something tonight that is usable in the day but I'd have to get mod permission

 

[Crayola227]

It was an item I gave her that protected her from an attack for the night if she used it but as a result she would sleep through the night and not get a night result

which worked out great the night I used it because I couldn't use my ability to get a night result anyway. I used it that night because I had outted myself as village blocker. To be fair there were other juicy claims for the wolves to go after as well that night, but seemed silly to sit on the item and then freaking die with an unused protection item. No time like the present sometimes for doing stuff and trying to avoid a NK

 

[supershorty]

can you expound on this? What is the issue with MsLawpy's slot and VCA and the interactions?

God I don't want to try to reread any of the last 50 pages.

Yeah. I'll talk about the interactions in another post because I need to dig for a particular post (AM quoted it earlier so it shouldn't take me too long). The VCA is kind of concerning. MsLawpy hasn't ended a single day on a wolf - they voted Sporty 3 days in a row and then TME. It's the only slot in the game that has only voted for now confirmed villagers.

AM also hasn't voted for any flipped wolves, but one of her votes hasn't flipped yet. Although I don't think that person is a wolf.

 

[Aprilthearab]

Wait you think cubs disables nightkills?

It seems that it's been clarified since I posted that that it's unlikely it would

 

[supershorty]

Yes

See, that makes me want to give AM a chance to use it.