2018-2019 Waitlist Support Thread

[965978]

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Any difference between WLs at public schools vs private schools?

Prob not, other than maybe less movement at state schools since they're cheaper but for the most part they'd be the same

Maybe the movement is a bit slower simple because tuition is lower so public schools are more desirable

 

[futuredoc0307]

I know for a fact my WL school had a $100 deposit that was non refundable past 4/30. Not sure if everyone that didn’t withdraw is committed or if they are sacrificing their 100 until they decide. I hope it’s the latter lmao

 

[Nova6218]

I know for a fact my WL school had a $100 deposit that was non refundable past 4/30. Not sure if everyone that didn’t withdraw is committed or if they are sacrificing their 100 until they decide. I hope it’s the latter lmao

My schools deposit was $500 lol

 

[futuredoc0307]

My schools deposit was $500 lol

I like that better. This way people uncommitted will withdraw

 

[Dhooy7]

Why are DO schools deposits so much more?

 

[justalittlestar]

Why are DO schools deposits so much more?

I guess cuz MD applicants tend to use DO schools as a backup and they need assurance. I think the logic is that people wouldn’t be as quick to sacrifice a $1000 deposit without fully committing.

 

[soontobedoc123]

soooooo how early are some of these CTE deadlines, what have people been seeing. Trying to figure out when we can expect some more movement

 

[introp445]

Most are July 15th

 

[angryangryhippos]

2018-2019 "Commit to Enroll" Deadlines

This thread was suggested so that applicants can view this information in one place so let's see if we can compile a list. Please feel free to make additions and corrections where necessary. Selecting "Commit to Enroll" at a school means that you're agreeing to communicate to your other...

forums.studentdoctor.net

 

[Belphegor]

Most are July 15th

Jfc

 

[soontobedoc123]

Most are July 15th

schools have to be giving waitlists before then....that barely gives them time to fill their class before orientation since most of these CTE deadlines are 21 days prior to orientation.

 

[Rory_B_Bellows]

Why aren’t schools giving a hard PTE deadline? My acceptance made it very clear that if you didn’t PTE/CTE on April 30th then you were going to lose your spot.

 

[edb63]

Why aren’t schools giving a hard PTE deadline? My acceptance made it very clear that if you didn’t PTE/CTE on April 30th then you were going to lose your spot.

Even if people PTE they still can be on waitlists or holding other late acceptances. So it’s not like PTE really tells the school that they can count on that person attending. Financial aid or waitlists could change everything

 

[Goro]

I think AMCAS could still be liable for lawsuits because it is their responsibility to make the process go smoothly.

One would have to show how they were damaged by having to sit on a wait list.

Really, Clammy, leave law to the lawyers.

 

[introp445]

There really shouldn’t be a PTE option at all. It just leads to ambiguity. The April 30th deadline should be CTE and withdraw all other apps, or give up your spot at that school

 

[Rory_B_Bellows]

Even if people PTE they still can be on waitlists or holding other late acceptances. So it’s not like PTE really tells the school that they can count on that person attending. Financial aid or waitlists could change everything

Yea that’s a good point. The only way this system would make any sense is if every school was using the same deadlines and the guidelines weren’t “suggestions”....but here we are lol

 

[OchemOficionado]

There really shouldn’t be a PTE option at all. It just leads to ambiguity. The April 30th deadline should be CTE and withdraw all other apps, or give up your spot at that school

Whew, thank the Lord that isn’t the rule. That would only benefit those with no acceptances. I wouldn’t be going to my #1 because I would have had to withdraw from the WL. Also, believe it or not, some students haven’t heard back from all IIs by then. Schools also wouldn’t be able to negotiate to keep students that CTE elsewhere. Sure, they can keep their demographics by cherry picking the WL, but I think they still want a shot at those that already have been accepted.

 

[965978]

One would have to show how they were damaged by having to sit on a wait list.

Really, Clammy, leave law to the lawyers.

I’m not talking from the applicant perspective. I’m talking from the med school perspective if seats go unfilled.

 

[labscience]

Has it been established somewhere that the "5 days to respond" are business days?

 

[965978]

I feel like AMCAS wouldn’t have sent out that tweet the other day unless they knew for a fact that many applicants are keeping multiple acceptances. And AMCAS can easily access that information so they would be able to know very easily..... good news for us I guess?

 

[edb63]

I feel like AMCAS wouldn’t have sent out that tweet the other day unless they knew for a fact that many applicants are keeping multiple acceptances. And AMCAS can easily access that information so they would be able to know very easily..... good news for us I guess?

Idk what any of this means these days

 

[futuredoc0307]

I feel like AMCAS wouldn’t have sent out that tweet the other day unless they knew for a fact that many applicants are keeping multiple acceptances. And AMCAS can easily access that information so they would be able to know very easily..... good news for us I guess?

good point

 

[Dr. Mike Trout]

What is this tweet

good point

 

[Noc310]

What is this tweet

 

[tanbrucewayne]

Schools not enforcing PTE could be why the AMCAS sent out that tweet?

I spoke to admissions at one school recently and they said they were being less stringent on enforcing PTE, but would aggressively enforce CTE. They said they emailed students who hadn't selected and asked them to select PTE one week after the 4/30 deadline. For the CTE date, they said they would send an email the day after to students who hadn't selected CTE and give them 24 hours to select otherwise they would lose their spot.

 

[gyngyn]

@gyngyn if i've understood you correctly in previous comments, it seems many schools (I know you can't speak for all medical schools, but it appears you've got a pretty good pulse on what's going on nationally?) are hesitating to put out WL offers due to their blindedness of what their PTE/CTE students might still have on the side, right?

I guess they are just being rational self-interested actors, which is fair and the least we can expect of any party here. Given this framework of self-interest, what is the critical point that needs to be reached for this standoff to pass lol?

Edit: and if they can't even enforce a CTE, barring a specific contract of withdrawal, what is the difference between their confidence in yield the day after a CTE deadline passes and a month before?

Yes. Even the ones offering off the waitlist are doing so with imperfect information (and having massively under-accepted, as a strategy).

It's not even self-interest, exactly. The purpose of the admissions team is to fill the class. Over-filling is in no one's interest (inadequate resources, clinical sites...)

AMCAS CTE "deadlines" mean little and PTE means nothing.

 

[gyngyn]

Has it been established somewhere that the "5 days to respond" are business days?

Yes.

 

[oil_rig]

Yes. Even the ones offering off the waitlist are doing so with imperfect information (and having massively under-accepted, as a strategy).

It's not even self-interest, exactly. The purpose of the admissions team is to fill the class. Over-filling is in no one's interest (inadequate resources, clinical sites...)

AMCAS CTE "deadlines" mean little and PTE means nothing.

Thanks a ton for the response. but the standoff must end, schools can't have empty chairs on Day 1...do you have any idea what it will take at your schools and/or its peer?

 

[futuredoc0307]

Man I’m just mad that we had to be the guinea pigs of this mess. It’ll probably be improved by next cycle and we took the L of experimentation

 

[5yewy5r]

CTE deadline can’t be when this game of musical chairs begins, right? Since CTE means dropping all of your waitlists as well.

Unless people just ignore the CTE deadline too... in which case all of the shuffling would be settled in 2-3 days of chaos after schools begin to enforce it on their own.

 

[Medicalhopeful2k19]

Just found this thread... Sitting on 2 waitlists for osteopathic schools right now and trying to hang in there. Hope everyone is staying positive!

 

[oil_rig]

It is not clear to me why schools such as Harvard, Penn and Stanford that have had consistent and typically high yields in the past would "massively-underaccept". I get that they may have underaccepted somewhat this year, but massively so? Sure, they're operating with imperfect information, and the information is incomplete, but they know from past experience typical yields (which is unlikely, in the end, to change this year, despite the new traffic rules), they know the many students who have already CTE'd and they know only a small percentage of those who have PTE'd are likely to get in off waitlists. So I suspect it is a bit less problematic for the very top school.

But If what gyngyn say is true, there will be major movement very late in the cycle when schools bump up against their CTE deadlines. Chaos will then truly reign.

IIRC gyngyn is an adcom at a 'top' school and they have suggested this is a problem at their own school.

I think the only thing we truly know is no one knows anything right now, we're all just reading tea leaves lol

 

[gyngyn]

It is not clear to me why schools such as Harvard, Penn and Stanford that have had consistent and typically high yields in the past would "massively-underaccept". I get that they may have underaccepted somewhat this year, but massively so? Sure, they're operating with imperfect information, and the information is incomplete, but they know from past experience typical yields (which is unlikely, in the end, to change this year, despite the new traffic rules), they know the many students who have already CTE'd and they know only a small percentage of those who have PTE'd are likely to get in off waitlists. So I suspect it is a bit less problematic for the high yield schools.

But If what gyngyn say is true, there will be major movement very late in the cycle when schools bump up against their CTE deadlines. Chaos will then truly reign.

I am not saying that all schools massively under-accepted.
I am saying that it is a reasonable strategy for schools to under-accept (given historic norms) in a cycle without information, like this one.
It could also be a strategy for some schools to dramatically under-accept.

 

[meronebib]

It is not clear to me why schools such as Harvard, Penn and Stanford that have had consistent and typically high yields in the past would "massively-underaccept". I get that they may have underaccepted somewhat this year, but massively so? Sure, they're operating with imperfect information, and the information is incomplete, but they know from past experience typical yields (which is unlikely, in the end, to change this year, despite the new traffic rules), they know the many students who have already CTE'd and they know only a small percentage of those who have PTE'd are likely to get in off waitlists. So I suspect it is a bit less problematic for the high yield schools.

But If what gyngyn say is true, there will be major movement very late in the cycle when schools bump up against their CTE deadlines. Chaos will then truly reign.

I think yield for these schools will be changing though, but not because of the new tool. Instead, because of the better financial aid packages offered by other schools (NYU, Columbia, Cornell, etc.). Competition for top students is becoming more fierce!

 

[sherm123]

I think this thread needs more memes to keep morale high. Anyone have some dank memes they would like to share?

 

[heterozygousrecessive]

I think this thread needs more memes to keep morale high. Anyone have some dank memes they would like to share?

 

[futuredoc0307]

 

[sherm123]

Source: reddit r/premed

 

[5yewy5r]

But If what gyngyn say is true, there will be major movement very late in the cycle when schools bump up against their CTE deadlines. Chaos will then truly reign.

I hope this isn’t the case, sounds like a stupid system. I was fortunate enough to get an acceptance earlier in the cycle, but this school has one of the earlier CTE deadlines (July 1st, two weeks before most other schools on July 15). I am still holding out on some waitlists that I would be forced to drop on July 1st, simply because my school happens to have an earlier deadline...

Not really sure why schools can’t just enforce the PTE deadline. It sounds like some schools have, but based on the tweet it sounds like a lot of applicants are still holding onto their acceptances.

 

[heterozygousrecessive]

Source: reddit r/premed
View attachment 262159

I see your Thor meme and raise you two Thors.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Whew, thank the Lord that isn’t the rule. That would only benefit those with no acceptances. I wouldn’t be going to my #1 because I would have had to withdraw from the WL. Also, believe it or not, some students haven’t heard back from all IIs by then. Schools also wouldn’t be able to negotiate to keep students that CTE elsewhere. Sure, they can keep their demographics by cherry picking the WL, but I think they still want a shot at those that already have been accepted.

I might be wrong, but I'm guessing they meant withdraw all apps from school you hold acceptances at. That would benefit everyone as long as schools were also required to provide financial info prior to 30 April.

 

[futuredoc0307]

@Goro I am assuming you’re a faculty at DO from previous postings. I was just looking at match data for an osteopathic school for 2019 and noticed a dramatic change of the ratio of ACGME/AOA of matched applicants.
(2018 1.39/1 whereas 2019 is 7/1). Is there something special about 2019 or is this random? If I’m not mistaken I thought the merger doesn’t happen until 2020.

 

[ZukosRedemption]

 

[Goro]

@Goro I am assuming you’re a faculty at DO from previous postings. I was just looking at match data for an osteopathic school for 2019 and noticed a dramatic change of the ratio of ACGME/AOA of matched applicants.
(2018 1.39/1 whereas 2019 is 7/1). Is there something special about 2019 or is this random? If I’m not mistaken I thought the merger doesn’t happen until 2020.

A good number of AOA programs have already become ACGME ones (like Henry Ford in MI). Hence, the ACGME match numbers have gone up.

 

[OchemOficionado]

I might be wrong, but I'm guessing they meant withdraw all apps from school you hold acceptances at. That would benefit everyone as long as schools were also required to provide financial info prior to 30 April.

They said apps, not acceptances and CTE which means to withdraw from WL . . . but maybe so.

 

[dr.sunshine]

I see your Thor meme and raise you two Thors.
View attachment 262163

I don’t know whether to laugh or cry at this because it’s so sad it’s true

 

[AlphaDoctor]

I don’t know whether to laugh or cry at this because it’s so sad it’s true

Do the opposite, eat right and exercise/meditate daily. Live in the NOW. You will feel at ease regardless of your situation. All will work out, we are young and healthy.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

They said apps, not acceptances and CTE which means to withdraw from WL . . . but maybe so.

If that’s the case then yeah, it’s no bueno. But that doesn't really make sense so I assumed it was what I said lol.

 

[JiffyLube]

 

[sam the man]