Columbia vs. Duke vs. Emory vs. VCU

[Ambitionista]

Hey everyone!

So I've heard from almost all of the schools I interviewed at this cycle (with the exception of Baylor but who knows when I'll hear from them) and I am having a tough time trying to decide where to go. I've narrowed it down to the schools below and would appreciate some input!


Factors that are important to me:
-Cost (parents cannot contribute, likely to not receive significant aid, already have loans from undergrad)
-Proximity to a support system (family, friends, and SO)
-Clinical opportunities (during preclinical years and quality of rotations)
-Flexibility of curriculum for research and/or masters (interested in doing an MPH)


Columbia
P&S was my pre-interview top choice. I felt that they had everything I was looking for in terms of curriculum, clinical opportunities, and research. I also enjoyed the fact that the students seem to be so proactive outside of the classroom (P&S club). However, I wasn't able to gauge 'fit' on my interview day and I am not able to attend Second Look.
Pros:
-Early clinical experiences during pre-clinical years
-Step 1 taken after rotations
-Likely great opportunities for research
-Diverse patient population
Cons:
-Cost (300K+ over 4 years but perhaps better financial aid?)
-Dorm style housing 1st year
-Far from family, friends, and SO
-Not entirely sure about living in the city

Duke
I was super impressed with Duke and could see myself attending here.
Pros:
-1 year condensed curriculum, P/F
-3rd year off to pursue another degree or research
-Step 1 taken after rotations
-Likely great opportunities for research
-Family, friends, and SO 3-4 hour drive away
-Diverse patient population
Cons:
-Cost (300K+ over 4 years but perhaps better financial aid?)
-Location (Durham) is not ideal
-No early clinical exposure during pre-clinical year

Emory
I was super impressed with Emory and could see myself attending here.
Pros:
-Early clinical experience during preclinical years
-Diverse patient population; emphasis on underserved
-Likely great opportunities for research
-Like the location (Atlanta)
Cons:
-Cost (300K+ over 4 years)
-Family, friends, and SO far away

VCU
I completely underestimated VCU and was pretty impressed on my interview day. This is my top choice in-state school.
Pros:
-Cost (240K over 4 years)
-Early clinical exposure during preclinical years
-Awesome eCurriculum + personalized board prep + pre-matriculation program (must commit by 4/15)
-Diverse patient population; emphasis on underserved
-Family, friends, and SO nearby
-Like the location (Richmond)
Cons:
-Strong emphasis on TBL/PBL
-Less of a prestige factor (how much does this matter really?)
-Less awesome research opportunities?

UVA (likely to withdraw)
I like UVA and can see myself attending however it is not high on my list.
Pros:
-Cost (270K over 4 years but perhaps better financial aid?)
-Early clinical exposure during preclinical years
-Family, friends, and SO 1-2 hour drive away
-Likely great opportunities for research
Cons:
-Hate the location (Charlottesville)
-Rural patient population (hoping to learn in an environment with diverse patients)
-Strong emphasis on TBL/PBL


If I have anything incorrect please let me know. I would love for current students who attend one of these institutions and/or students deciding between same/similar schools to chime in! 🙂

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[fbtkdrbs]

Congrats on your success! I also had the opportunity to interview at Columbia, Emory, Duke as well. Although I have been waitlisted at Duke, I still think that Duke was the best fit for me (and possibly for you). If you are looking to to do MPH, UNC is literally down the road with its awesome program. I love the idea of one year preclinical curriculum and with one year research/academic year to do what you want. Durham may not be Boston, Chicago, NYC or LA but it can be an awesome college town and plus it is closer to your family for support.

 

[Instatewaiter]

what do you want to do in terms of specialty ?

 

[Endure]

Wow, very impressive! Congratulations on a fantastic application cycle. I suspect this decision is really between Emory, Duke and Columbia?

I don't have very much to contribute outside of the fact that P&S seems to have an eerily happy student body. I was bounced from there pre-interview, so I didn't get a chance to observe the atmosphere directly, but I am good friends with a student there who constantly raves about the place. I get the impression that the students there love learning, each other and the institution, which is about all you can ask for in a school's culture, right? Regarding NYC, I understand your concerns fully. I hate New York and I live 20 minutes outside of it.

I should also mention limited clinical exposure at Duke during first-year isn't awful. When other people will be sitting in a classroom during second-year, you'll be doing your clerkships. Sounds pretty cool if you ask me, but then again - I'm (likely) matriculating at school that does something very similar, so I'm biased.

 

[Ambitionista]

Thanks for the responses!

@fbtkdrbs I am equally impressed by Duke and love their curriculum. Do you think it is worth the price tag?

@Instatewaiter I'm open as far as specialities go but as of now I am interested in EM, IM-Card, and possibly Surgery (general or CT).

@Endure That's good to hear. Have you heard anything in regards to the competitiveness of the atmosphere?

 

[fbtkdrbs]

@Ambitionista Well, Columbia and Emory are equally expensive. In my opinion, I think Duke would be worth it.

 

[Endure]

@Endure That's good to hear. Have you heard anything in regards to the competitiveness of the atmosphere?

Nonexistent.

 

[Instatewaiter]

Thanks for the responses!


@Instatewaiter I'm open as far as specialities go but as of now I am interested in EM, IM-Card, and possibly Surgery (general or CT).

With the exception of EM, those are somewhat competitive things to get into. You'd be better served going to a stronger school (Duke, Columbia, Emory) provided you'd be ok being away from friends/family. That is not to say that you can't match to one of those residencies from VCU by any means. But given identical applicants, the stronger school wins. There are plenty of people from VCU in very competitive IM/Cards, EM and surgery programs but it is just easier from a very strongly ranked school like Duke.

Also, whether you want to do academics should be taken into account. Then prestige matters much more and a good pedigree will go a long way.

 

[mmmcdowe]

Come back to Columbia on a non-second look day if you can't make second look. I'm happy to host you but the school often sets those up if you ask. Average debt at Columbia is like 120 if you exclude those students with 0 debt.

 

[CyberMaxx]

Hey Ambitionista, I've seen you around on some the school specific threads (such as Emory) during this application cycle. I don't generally like to contribute to School X vs. School Y threads but did want to drop in and say congratulations on such a successful cycle. You have a lot of great choices and will have amazing opportunities at all of them! 🙂

 

[Patros]

That's one hell of a list, I don't think you can go wrong regardless of your choice. Anyway, I would support Columbia.

1) Cost: You haven't factored in financial aid yet, right? Why wouldn't you receive significant aid? I remember Duke recruits heavily with scholarships to the best applicants, so maybe wait till you get the final word. At least on MSAR, the average indebtedness for these schools tend to be low (close to 100k).
2) Proximity: Between Duke, Columbia and Emory, I don't think you will be able to visit family often. Yeah Duke is ~4hr away, but that is not a trip you can make regularly (I live ~5hr from my family atm and I only travel interstate once every few months). Combine this with a busy schedule, and long-trips will become a rarity. So I suggest you treat these equally, and only consider VCU or UVA as family-oriented options.
3) Clinicals: I think NewYork Presbyterian trumps the others. Duke and VCU are solid no-doubt, but NYP is massive and world-famous. If you're interested in surgery, Columbia is famous for graduating large numbers of surgeons. Hence the joke "College of surgeons and surgeons."
4) Flexibility: Duke and Columbia both have unique curricula with emphasis on research and scholarship. Duke compresses preclinicals into one year to make room for one free year, whereas Columbia shuffles around both clinicals and preclinicals to make room for 4 months of research/scholarship. Which you prefer is up to you.

Also, I think location should play a very important role in your choice. As a NYC native, I think Manhattan is way more exciting than any other city I have been to. You don't necessarily have to live in Manhattan either, there are many options a short commute away in the other boroughs. I think it would be worth your time just to experience NYC for medical school, your last chance for the big-city life as a student. It'll be fun!

 

[RocDiva4040]

Hey Ambitionista. First off congrats on your amazing app season!

It seems like Duke may be the best fit for you/the one that you're more comfortable with BUT I think that attending Columbia could help to push you outside of your comfort zone. NYC is amazing, so maybe you will end up liking it. Idk if you not being able to attend Columbia's second look is because of financial reasons, but if so I would just call and let the admissions office know. For top schools they usual have the funds to pay for travel expenses for students in need. I really think you should try to go back to Columbia to get a better feel for it if you can.

Having said all this, only you know how much being near family, friends and your SO matters to you. If this is the most important factor, then perhaps go to VCU (hopefully with a bomb scholarship).

Good luck!

 

[Ambitionista]

Come back to Columbia on a non-second look day if you can't make second look. I'm happy to host you but the school often sets those up if you ask. Average debt at Columbia is like 120 if you exclude those students with 0 debt.

I am going to look into setting up a non-second look day. I've also decided to wait for my financial aid packages before deciding. Thanks!

Hey Ambitionista, I've seen you around on some the school specific threads (such as Emory) during this application cycle. I don't generally like to contribute to School X vs. School Y threads but did want to drop in and say congratulations on such a successful cycle. You have a lot of great choices and will have amazing opportunities at all of them!

Thank, I really appreciate it! I hope you hear good news soon!

That's one hell of a list, I don't think you can go wrong regardless of your choice. Anyway, I would support Columbia.

1) Cost: You haven't factored in financial aid yet, right? Why wouldn't you receive significant aid? I remember Duke recruits heavily with scholarships to the best applicants, so maybe wait till you get the final word. At least on MSAR, the average indebtedness for these schools tend to be low (close to 100k).

2) Proximity: Between Duke, Columbia and Emory, I don't think you will be able to visit family often. Yeah Duke is ~4hr away, but that is not a trip you can make regularly (I live ~5hr from my family atm and I only travel interstate once every few months). Combine this with a busy schedule, and long-trips will become a rarity. So I suggest you treat these equally, and only consider VCU or UVA as family-oriented options.

3) Clinicals: I think NewYork Presbyterian trumps the others. Duke and VCU are solid no-doubt, but NYP is massive and world-famous. If you're interested in surgery, Columbia is famous for graduating large numbers of surgeons. Hence the joke "College of surgeons and surgeons."

4) Flexibility: Duke and Columbia both have unique curricula with emphasis on research and scholarship. Duke compresses preclinicals into one year to make room for one free year, whereas Columbia shuffles around both clinicals and preclinicals to make room for 4 months of research/scholarship. Which you prefer is up to you.

Also, I think location should play a very important role in your choice. As a NYC native, I think Manhattan is way more exciting than any other city I have been to. You don't necessarily have to live in Manhattan either, there are many options a short commute away in the other boroughs. I think it would be worth your time just to experience NYC for medical school, your last chance for the big-city life as a student. It'll be fun!

You raise excellent points and your post just reminds me of some of the reasons why I fell in love with Columbia to begin with. In terms of the location, I think I am just getting cold feet. Haha I will definitely visit the area again before making a final decision.

Hey Ambitionista. First off congrats on your amazing app season!

It seems like Duke may be the best fit for you/the one that you're more comfortable with BUT I think that attending Columbia could help to push you outside of your comfort zone. NYC is amazing, so maybe you will end up liking it. Idk if you not being able to attend Columbia's second look is because of financial reasons, but if so I would just call and let the admissions office know. For top schools they usual have the funds to pay for travel expenses for students in need. I really think you should try to go back to Columbia to get a better feel for it if you can.

Having said all this, only you know how much being near family, friends and your SO matters to you. If this is the most important factor, then perhaps go to VCU (hopefully with a bomb scholarship).

Good luck!

Thanks girl! And congrats to you as well! (Have you decided where you’re going??) I’m going to try to visit Columbia once more and also see if I can coax a scholarship out of VCU before deciding. 🙂

 

[No Limits]

Penny Proud! Lol just showing love, congrats on a successful cycle! That's a tough decision... I'm voting for Duke. No matter what you choose I'm sure you'll be successful. Good luck🙂

 

[nemo123]

Congrats on your cycle, Ambitionista! Like the above poster, I always liked your Penny Proud avatar popping up on various school specific threads. It was such a funny show!

Anyways, I would go with where you will be most happy considering financials. Just adding onto the Columbia info that one if the posters gave, P&S is only a 10 minutes walk from the GWB and so you could probably easily live across the bridge in suburbia in Fort Lee in NJ if you wanted to. Buses come and go between the bridge and Fort Lee all the time (plus Columbia has a free shuttle that shuttles back and forth between the two).

 

[3838]

Congratulations on the awesome acceptances!!! You know yourself. Which of those environments will be a pleasant place for you to be as you complete your medical education? You will perform well where you are happy and where the environment fits your personality. What kind of person are you? These programs are very different from each other. Duke is research focused, but the classes run from 8am to 5pm and students generally go home and study. But you finish in one year and after that, you'll spend a year doing research and then clinicals. I don't know about the culture at other schools (except UVA). Think about the day to day life and culture at a school and ask whether it suits your personality. Are you a person who thrives/loves intensity and competition? Narrow it down to Duke and Columbia. Will you be stressed out by a large city like NYC? Go with Duke. (I know nothing about these schools. I'm just giving examples. You need to fill in the blanks based on your experience of these schools/what m3s/m4s say)

I know that I am a fairly internally driven person and sometimes my passions differ from what I "ought" to be doing. I really value the ability to choose my own path. I also value relationships and social support so I will choose a school where the students are close and help each other out. I don't think I could handle the stress of living in a city as big as NYC, at least for medical school. I will be happier if I get early clinical exposure. I also know I need time to be able to unwind, so I wouldn't be able to handle Dukes intense one year curriculum. These are my limitations and the essential things I need to succeed. Now your turn. You need to assess which school will allow you to show your strengths and standout.

***looking at your assessment, you really seem like you will be really comfortable at VCU. I would either go with that or Emory, if you feel uncomfortable about the prestige issue. Duke is intense dude. And NYC is intense too...if you have to wonder if a big city is for you, now is not a good time to find out.

 

[yankees26]

Great schools, to be honest, you should go based on location/finances. This a personal decision in my opinion.

 

[Ambitionista]

So in case anyone was wondering...I've decided to commit to VCU/MCV School of Medicine! 🙂

All of these schools are absolutely wonderful but after evaluating my pro/con list a bit further and receiving a nice scholarship I decided to follow the $$$ and my gut. I had a great time at VCU both on my interview day and second look and feel comfortable passing up prestige to attend where I feel I will be happy and thrive best. I really appreciate everyone's input/advice. Thanks everyone!!! 😀

 

[North meets South]

Marching to the beat of your own drum. I like it.

 

[scarlett14]

congrats on making a decision! been reading this thread but not commenting so finally wanted to just say congrats! 🙂

 

[yankees26]

congrats on a great cycle. youre gonna be an awesome doctor

 

[mmmcdowe]

Good choice, you dont get a second chance to live your life once your a doctor, going to the school that will keep a bounce in your step for 4 years is the right choice.

 

[Ambitionista]

Thanks everyone!