2013-2014 University of Michigan Application Thread

BU Medical Sciences
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BolloX said:
If they've only closed a couple thousand so far, then we have an even lower chance than if there were only, say, 500-1000 files still left open. I can't wait till I can stop over-analyzing!
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Yeah.
 
From the Twitter:

Interview outcomes from 11/8 interviews for MD candidates: 57% Accept/40% Waitlist/3% Defer #GoBlueMed


Uh, I wish they would let us off the hook already...why wait for 23 days to reveal a decision that's already been made 🙁
 
They could have their dates wrong or maybe they're confused. Last week they thought Thursday was Tuesday, and I'm pretty sure they're going to invite me to interview in 2006.
 
Or they really did close hundreds of files but they weren't our files 🙂
 
mine's down too. i wonder if it means our files have been closed.
 
snowys435 said:
mine's down too. i wonder if it means our files have been closed.
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That's not it! If you attempt to reach the status page from the U of M website, it's still down, meaning it has nothing to do with our files (thank goodness!!) 🙂
 
UMich is doing some work on the main servers today, so a few things like the status page won't be accessible until tonight or tomorrow morning. This doesn't affect the med students since we have a separate server for anatomy/histo/quizzing/other resources, but the status page should be up again soon!
 
Looks like it's back online! Status updates are accompanied by email, so no need to log in unless you have an upcoming interview and have to submit the HIPAA paperwork/photo/hosting request, or if you're sending an update.
 
Anyone know how many interview spots are left? Do you think December is the latest that one would receive an II?
 
mdhopeful 2014 said:
Anyone know how many interview spots are left? Do you think December is the latest that one would receive an II?
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Director Ruiz said they would still be interviewing in January/February. I doubt there would be many spots left for those dates, but at least there's still hope.
 
PolarBlue said:
Director Ruiz said they would still be interviewing in January/February. I doubt there would be many spots left for those dates, but at least there's still hope.
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Per their website, 2 dates in January, and 1 date in early Feb for interviews. Only 2 dates in Dec, the 6 and 13, but I think Dec might be already filled, unless folks drop out. They have 16 interview days, and last Friday was #11 per the tweets. Makes sense only 5 interview days left. usually interview 40, but last Friday, they only had 32 (again, per tweet). They will interview about 575 per Director Ruiz.
 
Great White Buffalo said:
Per their website, 2 dates in January, and 1 date in early Feb for interviews. Only 2 dates in Dec, the 6 and 13, but I think Dec might be already filled, unless folks drop out. They have 16 interview days, and last Friday was #11 per the tweets. Makes sense only 5 interview days left. usually interview 40, but last Friday, they only had 32 (again, per tweet). They will interview about 575 per Director Ruiz.
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Thanks for compiling and sharing this info 🙂
 
Twitter: @UMichMedAdmiss: The worst part of this work--what we are doing now--prepping to close several more hundred files this week.

SOOOO..does this mean they closed files last week? lol
 
sly1 said:
Twitter: @UMichMedAdmiss: The worst part of this work--what we are doing now--prepping to close several more hundred files this week.

SOOOO..does this mean they closed files last week? lol
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Sounds like it! Here's to hoping they don't close ours! 🙂
 
sly1 said:
Twitter: @UMichMedAdmiss: The worst part of this work--what we are doing now--prepping to close several more hundred files this week.

SOOOO..does this mean they closed files last week? lol
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Yeah I guess so. Maybe statuses don't actually update as closed, or really no one who posts on SDN has been closed..
 
I'm a bit surprised that, if between 1/4 and 1/3 of files have been closed, nobody on SND can report being anything other than under review. I'm just a bit skeptical that closed file decisions are shown to us right now. I'll believe it, and report back, when I see it. 😉
 
I am leaning more towards our statuses are not showing closed files. Wish the transparency went two ways. siighhh...
 
sly1 said:
I am leaning more towards our statuses are not showing closed files. Wish the transparency went two ways. siighhh...
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I think the students above said they would update the status online.
 
McRunner said:
I think the students above said they would update the status online.
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Yeah, that's what they said :thinking:...

However, do you think that none of the people who have contributed tens of thousands of views to this thread since files started closing would have reported it? All in all, I'm just trying to be cautiously optimistic here.
 
Received an invite the other day, complete in September! Keep the faith
 
Just wanted to share a cool infographic I found
edu_mdprogram_support_match_UMMS_5yr_Outcomes_2013.jpg


But does anyone know where the "Top of Mind: 2nd" ranking comes from? I struggle to find the source.
 
What happens to those people who don't match? I guess the school scrambles?
 
Great White Buffalo said:
Not to my knowledge. I'm still under perpetual review.
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+1. Expecting the official rejection to come in Feb or March, when they finally decide to put it up on the status page (long after all interview slots have been taken). 😛
 
safe said:
Just wanted to share a cool infographic I found

But does anyone know where the "Top of Mind: 2nd" ranking comes from? I struggle to find the source.
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In USNWR, if you have a subscription to their full data set, there's a section that shows overall ratings/rankings by residency program directors for each school's graduates. Not sure exactly what goes into this (it's not 100% correlated with the match list, but rather how residents from each med school are evaluated, because geographic variation in the matches is highly correlated with the student body's personal preferences), but I did manage to compile some data while I was deciding between schools last spring. Sorry it's not totally complete; my subscription expired (you have to look up each individual school). It's a score out of 5.

4.7: Harvard, Hopkins
4.6: Michigan, Stanford, WashU, Duke, UCSF
4.5: Penn
4.4: Yale, Columbia, Cornell, Vanderbilt
4.3: U Washington, Northwestern
4.2: Pritzker, Pitt
4.1: UVA, Mayo

I hadn't heard about this statistic until Dean Woolliscroft mentioned it (and the 5-way tie) at Second Look Weekend.
 
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Not trying to be cynical but sharing my honest opinion. Michigan's 'transparency' works for those invited for interview/accepted but against all the rest. Judging from my interview day there and impression of the admissions staff, Michigan seems like that insecure person we all know who is always one-upping others and looking for an edge to seem better than those around them. School pride is great, but why on interview day do they have to refer to Harvard as the 'Michigan of the East?' Seems to me like it's a Napoleon complex, or because they are recruiting ivy-leaguers who aren't accepted to Harvard/Penn/Stanford/Hopkins Med? Compared to other schools who use Twitter and Facebook to post helpful information - Johns Hopkins MD Admissions Facebook page is a great example - Michigan's use of Twitter is less than helpful; personal musings from the admissions director (do we really need to know about his bus commute home and weekend golf sessions?) peppered with a mix of attention grabbing admissions posts. Perhaps if they spent more time on negative admissions decisions and less on improving their brand, they might actually have closed hundreds or thousands of files at this point like other non-rolling schools - again Hopkins is a better example in this regard as well; is it ethical to string hundreds or thousands of people along for several months? Not if it can be avoided, yet Michigan is the only non-rolling top 10 school that does it and the only top 10 school that gave me a bad impression (other interviewees felt similarly). Michigan seems to be building a class primarily around stats/pedigree, with one of their top goals being to move up in the US News rankings. I'm thankful to have had the opportunity to interview here so that I could see that UMICH is not for me. To those of you who have been hopeful and under review for several months - please don't question/blame yourselves, your abilities, self-worth, etc. - there are many other schools out there that are the actual leaders and best, and that would be happy to have you. Please like this comment if you agree.
 
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GBODumich2012 said:
Pretty sure they tweet about closing files just to pacify applicants into thinking they don't string people along like they really do.
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They have indeed closed files and notified applicants via status update at this point in the application cycle, but perhaps the numbers are not as high as posted on the Twitter. Given that some people complete in July/August have recently received interview invites (including a friend of mine from undergrad complete early/mid-August), I'd say a wide spread of completion dates are still in the running. Don't lose hope, good luck!
 
gocards1 said:
Not trying to be cynical but sharing my honest opinion. Michigan's 'transparency' works for those invited for interview/accepted but against all the rest. Judging from my interview day there and impression of the admissions staff, Michigan seems like that insecure person we all know who is always one-upping others and looking for an edge to seem better than those around them. School pride is great, but why on interview day do they have to refer to Harvard as the 'Michigan of the East?' Seems to me like it's a Napoleon complex, or because they are recruiting ivy-leaguers who aren't accepted to Harvard/Penn/Stanford/Hopkins Med? Compared to other schools who use Twitter and Facebook to post helpful information - Johns Hopkins MD Admissions Facebook page is a great example - Michigan's use of Twitter is less than helpful; personal musings from the admissions director (do we really need to know about his bus commute home and weekend golf sessions?) peppered with a mix of attention grabbing admissions posts. Perhaps if they spent more time on negative admissions decisions and less on improving their brand, they might actually have closed hundreds or thousands of files at this point like other non-rolling schools - again Hopkins is a better example in this regard as well; is it ethical to string hundreds or thousands of people along for several months? Not if it can be avoided, yet Michigan is the only non-rolling top 10 school that does it and the only top 10 school that gave me a bad impression (other interviewees felt similarly). Michigan seems to be building a class primarily around stats/pedigree, with one of their top goals being to move up in the US News rankings. I'm thankful to have had the opportunity to interview here so that I could see that UMICH is not for me. To those of you who have been hopeful and under review for several months - please don't question/blame yourselves, your abilities, self-worth, etc. - there are many other schools out there that are the actual leaders and best, and that would be happy to have you. Please like this comment if you agree.
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Stay classy.
 
gocards1 said:
Michigan seems to be building a class primarily around stats/pedigree, with one of their top goals being to move up in the US News rankings.
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A lot of schools are moving in this direction. Particularly ones interested in moving their USNews ranking up because it's the easiest way to increase a school's USNews ranking. It isn't just UMich. Pritzker and Penn are bigger stat ****** in that regard.
 
gocards1 said:
Not trying to be cynical but sharing my honest opinion. Michigan's 'transparency' only works for those invited for interview/accepted and against all the rest. Judging from my interview day there and interactions with the admissions Dean and Director, Michigan seems like that really insecure person we all know who is constantly one-upping others and looking for an edge to seem better than those around them. School pride is great, but why on interview day do they need to refer to Harvard as the 'Michigan of the East?' Maybe it's a Napoleon complex, or perhaps because they seem to be a safety school for ivy-leaguers who aren't accepted to Harvard/Penn/Stanford/Hopkins Med? Compared to other schools who use Twitter and Facebook to post helpful information - Johns Hopkins MD Admissions Facebook page is a great example - Michigan's use of Twitter is less than helpful; personal musings from Mr. Ruiz ('transparency' implies that we should know about his bus commute home and weekend golf sessions, apparently) peppered with a mix of attention grabbing admissions posts. Perhaps if they spent more time on admissions decisions and less on improving their brand, they might actually have closed hundreds or thousands of files at this point like other non-rolling schools - again Hopkins is a better example in this regard as well; is it ethical to string hundreds or thousands of people along for several months? No, yet Michigan is the only non-rolling top 10 school that does it. This was the only top 10 school that gave me a bad impression, other interviewees felt similarly. Michigan seems to be building a class primarily around stats/pedigree, with one of their top goals being to move up in the US News rankings. I'm thankful to have had the opportunity to interview here so that I could see that UMICH is not for me. I will not be matriculating here. To those of you who have been hopeful and under review for several months - please don't question/blame yourselves, your abilities, self-worth, etc. - there are many other schools out there that are the actual leaders and best, and that would be happy to have you. Please like this comment if you agree.
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A few comments:
1) I wouldn't call Michigan a "safety school" by any means. A number of people in my class and the M2 class turned down other amazing offers to comparably ranked schools (i.e. Harvard/Penn/Hopkins/Stanford etc) to attend Michigan, several of whom came from out of state. They provided accepted students a list of contacts in the current M2 class who held multiple acceptances to help people deciding between Michigan & School X make an informed decision and see how the decision-making process played out. While there is a small cohort (~20/172) of Ivy League undergrad alums in my class, many chose Michigan over other great offers, so I wouldn't say that part of your argument is true. We have a very bright, diverse class, and selection/recruitment is based on much more than MCAT & GPA, but with such a low acceptance rate at every school these days, you can't treat anywhere as a safety school anymore (one of the Admissions directors I encountered last year informed our group that he rejected an applicant with a 45 and high GPA).

2) The non-admissions-related tweets are to help applicants/interviewees/accepted students get a sense for the community and opportunities outside the classroom. The Admissions Twitter and the student-managed UM Dose of Reality Twitter account are not just to give the play-by-play for admissions, but to rather paint a picture for life in Ann Arbor as a member of the vibrant medical community, to show that med school can in fact be a very enjoyable experience.

3) Every school has its own method of admissions. For some of the top-10 schools (using last year's threads for reference), Harvard, Yale, and Columbia send all rejections in March (albeit they're non-rolling), Stanford and Hopkins (both rolling) send batches of rejections starting in Nov/Dec through April, and Penn (non-rolling) doesn't send rejections until late January/early February (not counting the ambiguous "Status of Death" in November some people get). For Michigan, you won't be waiting past mid-January for a pre-interview decision. I find Michigan to definitely be the most transparent with its admissions process, providing positive and negative decisions to applicants in an expedited fashion. There are certainly some schools that get back to many applicants faster/earlier pre-interview (i.e. Pritzker, Pitt, Vanderbilt), but as far as transparency goes Michigan takes the cake. EDIT: I knew someone who interviewed at Hopkins in late March and was accepted late April, after their Second Look.

4) Rankings and metrics are important, and are often the only "objective" way for people to make decisions between schools and the trend is moving this way (as nemo123 pointed out). Admissions doesn't make the official rankings, match results, and other university stats. The Public Relations branch of the med school & Admissions simply compiles them into infographics and conveys them to prospective students to highlight the quality of the clinical and research programs at Michigan. It's a school that strives to be continually better. The primary goals of Admissions are to review files, accept students, and recruit the class each year, and of course off-campus recruiting is a part of any Admissions team, but a ton of time is spent carefully reading applications, so much so that it takes several months to do (especially with a small team), so patience is important for the application process.

5) Calling other schools the "actual leaders and best" is pretty disrespectful to Michigan. We hope you enter med school next year with a positive attitude toward your school and your peer institutions, including UMMS. You will no doubt network with med students across the country during the next four years, and you'll end up in a residency training program with a broad range of alums. Additionally, referring to Harvard as the "Michigan of the East" is meant in jest; the two schools differ in many ways.

6) While Michigan is not for everyone, and we're sorry to hear that you didn't have a good interview experience here, our SDN group and Admissions would love to hear your feedback on how we can improve how Michigan paints its picture for future interviewees. If you have any follow-up questions please feel free to send us a PM.
 
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BolloX said:
Eh, negative insight can be just as helpful as positive insight. There was nothing vindictive either.
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This is true, but I didn't see much in the way of insight.
 
I've been on ten interviews so far and Michigan's interview day was definitely one of the best. It was better run and more courteous to applicants than most other schools I have been to.

Coming from an undergrad school where sports are not big and school pride has a different flavor, I could understand some people being a little off-put by some of the rah-rah aspects of the day if you aren't used to that kind of enthusiasm/attitude. But I don't think any of that has to do with trying to one-up other medical schools. The 'Michigan of the East' comment is clearly a joke.
 
nemo123 said:
What happens to those people who don't match? I guess the school scrambles?
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It depends. Some people scramble, others take a research/5th year and reapply. If you're really set on derm or plastics and don't match you'll probably reapply (since most likely no spots will remain anywhere), but others take what's left over after March Madness.
 
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umms2017 said:
A few comments:
1) I wouldn't call Michigan a "safety school" by any means. A number of people in my class and the M2 class turned down other amazing offers to comparably ranked schools (i.e. Harvard/Penn/Hopkins/Stanford etc) to attend Michigan, several of whom came from out of state. They provided accepted students a list of contacts in the current M2 class who held multiple acceptances to help people deciding between Michigan & School X make an informed decision and see how the decision-making process played out. While there is a small cohort (~20/172) of Ivy League undergrad alums in my class, many chose Michigan over other great offers, so I wouldn't say that part of your argument is true. We have a very bright, diverse class, and selection/recruitment is based on much more than MCAT & GPA, but with such a low acceptance rate at every school these days, you can't treat anywhere as a safety school anymore (one of the Admissions directors I encountered last year informed our group that he rejected an applicant with a 45 and high GPA).

2) The non-admissions-related tweets are to help applicants/interviewees/accepted students get a sense for the community and opportunities outside the classroom. The Admissions Twitter and the student-managed UM Dose of Reality Twitter account are not just to give the play-by-play for admissions, but to rather paint a picture for life in Ann Arbor as a member of the vibrant medical community, to show that med school can in fact be a very enjoyable experience.

3) Every school has its own method of admissions. For some of the top-10 schools (using last year's threads for reference), Harvard, Yale, and Columbia send all rejections until March (albeit they're non-rolling), Stanford and Hopkins (both rolling) send batches of rejections starting in Nov/Dec through April, and Penn (non-rolling) doesn't send rejections until late January/early February. For Michigan, you won't be waiting past mid-January for a pre-interview decision. I find Michigan to definitely be the most transparent with its admissions process, providing positive and negative decisions to applicants in an expedited fashion. There are certainly some schools that get back to many applicants faster/earlier pre-interview (i.e. Pritzker, Pitt, Vanderbilt), but as far as transparency goes Michigan takes the cake.

4) Rankings and metrics are important, and are often the only "objective" way for people to make decisions between schools and the trend is moving this way (as nemo123 pointed out). Admissions doesn't make the official rankings, match results, and other university stats. The Public Relations branch of the med school & Admissions simply compiles them into infographics and conveys them to prospective students to highlight the quality of the clinical and research programs at Michigan. It's a school that strives to be continually better. The primary goals of Admissions are to review files, accept students, and recruit the class each year, and of course off-campus recruiting is a part of any Admissions team, but a ton of time is spent carefully reading applications, so much so that it takes several months to do (especially with a small team that ma), so patience is important for the application process.

5) Calling other schools the "actual leaders and best" is pretty disrespectful to Michigan. We hope you enter med school next year with a positive attitude toward your school and your peer institutions, including UMMS. You will no doubt network with med students across the country during the next four years, and you'll end up in a residency training program with a broad range of alums. Additionally, referring to Harvard as the "Michigan of the East" is meant in jest; the two schools differ in many ways.

6) While Michigan is not for everyone, and we're sorry to hear that you didn't have a good interview experience here, our SDN group and Admissions would love to hear your feedback on how we can improve how Michigan paints its picture for future interviewees. If you have any follow-up questions please feel free to send us a PM.
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Amen.
 
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