Class of 2021 . . . how ya doin?

[finnickthedog]

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I have--almost--finished a third of my large animal requirements (it's a 6 week rotation divided into three 2 week sections) and I haven't been killed yet. I also got to put sutures in a horse face yesterday. Gonna rest up this weekend and try to remember everything I know about dairy cows to prepare for the next two weeks which will be all dairy, all the time.

 

[vetmedhead]

I have--almost--finished a third of my large animal requirements (it's a 6 week rotation divided into three 2 week sections) and I haven't been killed yet. I also got to put sutures in a horse face yesterday. Gonna rest up this weekend and try to remember everything I know about dairy cows to prepare for the next two weeks which will be all dairy, all the time.

Dairy is fun! You going out to any dairies while you're on that service?

 

[finnickthedog]

Dairy is fun! You going out to any dairies while you're on that service?

We spend the 2 weeks at a specific dairy farm that is affiliated with MSU. I'm less than thrilled mostly because it means waking up earlier due to the longer commute... but hopefully dairy is as fun as you say. 😛

 

[Coopah]

Got an update today, they say maybe next week! Only 7 weeks until clinics.

Also they are now scheduling our mandatory vacation around the NAVLE for wellness. Since I already had my vacation scheduled then... I don't know what will happen they'll put it somewhere else I suppose. Hope it doesn't suck lol.

 

[PippyPony]

DONE

WITH

EXAMS

!!!!

 

[cheathac]

Whooooo!! My biggest weeks of exams are next week and the week after. I have 3 next week (2 final exams) and 2 the week after (1 final exam). I will then be home free and done with surgery! BRING ON SPRING BREAK. I hated surgery last semester but have come to enjoy it more this semester once I became more comfortable. Did some cool things with LA such as a sheep enucleation, cystotomy/tube placement, and horse limb procedures with a celiotomy. White coat ceremony in April and then clinics! I can't believe it's coming so soon. Good luck everyone!

 

[kaydubs]

Final push to clinics! Y’all got this!!

 

[battie]

Watching videos for the lab @SportPonies and I have in the morning and its hilariously phenomenal. See snapchat for the glory.

 

[vetmedhead]

Kind of curious, for those of you who are in fourth year or have graduated already - what did you use for notebooks to keep track of cases when you're on clinics? How did you organize them? Also, what sorts of resources did you find helpful on clinics?

I'm starting fourth year in a few months and thinking I should contemplate how to get my ish together now. I tend to be pretty disorganized because the way I think about things is not usually the best way to explain things to other people, so figuring out something now to help me structure my thoughts would probably be a good thing lol

 

[cdo96]

Kind of curious, for those of you who are in fourth year or have graduated already - what did you use for notebooks to keep track of cases when you're on clinics? How did you organize them? Also, what sorts of resources did you find helpful on clinics?

I'm starting fourth year in a few months and thinking I should contemplate how to get my ish together now. I tend to be pretty disorganized because the way I think about things is not usually the best way to explain things to other people, so figuring out something now to help me structure my thoughts would probably be a good thing lol

so we talked about this about a month and a half ago! Just wanted to make sure you saw it!

Okay my lovely friends, I am seeking advice! By now, I’m sure y’all have sort of gotten a handle on what you do to stay organized with patients and whatnot during clinics. What is this?

I’m going back and forth between getting like a large planner and a notebook, or several smaller notebooks specifically for patients & details, trying to find/ make a specific patient notebook, or a combination of everything?

any advice is appreciated

I have an A5 notebook that I used for pretty much everything - rounds discussions, case notes, keeping track of patients, everything.

When I was on my externship recently though I started using a smaller notebook for keeping track of patients. I think if I were to do it again, I'd do that instead, and use the A5 just for topic rounds and things like that. Mostly because while I can fit it in my whitecoat pocket, I didn't have an easy way to keep it with me on rotations where I wasn't wearing a white coat. The smaller notebook could fit in my back pocket.

Edit: actually I just checked and it's slightly smaller (in width) than A5

I used one of these notebooks, with basically a half to full page per patient depending on how in depth it was. Stole one of the stickers with patient info and plastered it on the top.

I used it for rounds notes, too, just started from the back of the book and worked forward.

Yeah, I kept and notebook for all my day to day stuff, as well as an Excel sheet that I would track my cases by rotation. I used the Excel sheet just to easily find past discharges (our emr doesn't keep track of them for you - I was quiet jealous of UC Davis' system for doing that), so I can do copy/pastes from past good discharges, and to keep track of what clinicians I worked with so I could get clinical competencies approved by them through an online system we have that tracks all those.

^^ I highly recommend keeping copies of discharges/cases for being able to look back at them and reference them for similar cases that arise. Additionally, I used the Clinical Notebook given to rising fourth years by the AVMA because it fits in most white coat pockets which is veryyyy convenient!

I did and still do handwritten small notebooks because I somehow absorb details by writing.

Someone can ask me about a case or patient and I’m like yeah, I remember them, I prescribed this, etc.

If I had a dr party trick, this would be it.

 

[vetmedhead]

so we talked about this about a month and a half ago! Just wanted to make sure you saw it!

I did see this, but don't know how helpful it was for me. I guess I'm more interested in asking how people actually organized the information they took down? I get distracted easily and can readily not get/not write down like half of the history from an appointment, or forget to write down diagnostics ideas and just never be able to remember what they were without having to check in with someone else. I am wondering if anyone has suggestions for ways to organize a notebook before an appointment so it's easier for me to efficiently capture these things before I completely forget them

 

[WildZoo]

Kind of curious, for those of you who are in fourth year or have graduated already - what did you use for notebooks to keep track of cases when you're on clinics? How did you organize them? Also, what sorts of resources did you find helpful on clinics?

I'm starting fourth year in a few months and thinking I should contemplate how to get my ish together now. I tend to be pretty disorganized because the way I think about things is not usually the best way to explain things to other people, so figuring out something now to help me structure my thoughts would probably be a good thing lol

I didn't really do this too much in my own notebooks because it's kind of what our SOAPs were for. The only things I tended to keep for patients were their identifying info and major problems/diagnoses. But if I had kept more info, I think the most useful thing would be a problem list, differentials for each problem or group of problems if you're able to group them, and then what your diagnostic plan and/or preliminary treatment plan would be based on that.

As far as getting the history, I don't have a super set way that I do that, it kind of evolves depending on what the issue is. And I usually just wrote things down as they spoke and would repeat things back at the end to make sure i didn't miss anything. And used open ended questions and all that. That never went in my notebook because that would mean having to write it down twice - it already had to be written on our paper forms - and type it into the computer for discharges or SOAPs, so I didn't need the extra redundancy lol

 

[SkiOtter]

Kind of curious, for those of you who are in fourth year or have graduated already - what did you use for notebooks to keep track of cases when you're on clinics? How did you organize them? Also, what sorts of resources did you find helpful on clinics?

I'm starting fourth year in a few months and thinking I should contemplate how to get my ish together now. I tend to be pretty disorganized because the way I think about things is not usually the best way to explain things to other people, so figuring out something now to help me structure my thoughts would probably be a good thing lol

A lot of people here have case log notebooks because we don’t get printed forms from the school to write everything on. Usually someone at the school has them made and sells them. Here’s what the insides look like of one of the few I’ve seen. There’s also a smaller one that fits in a white coat pocket but I couldn’t find pictures of the inside.

 

[JaynaAli]

I was gonna suggest something like what Ski posted if you are wanting something premade. A resident I knew as a student used one, probably check amazon?

I don’t think I had anything real fancy. Stuck a sticker top left and in the beginning I tried to have the problem list written below, ddx in middle of page, recommended tests below that. I didn’t keep up with it, tbh.

Not really what you asked about, but kinda related...I really like having a central to do list. A notebook of patients with a to do list for each patient is great, but when you’ve had an inpatient the whole rotation and her page is two weeks worth of cases back from your other new admit, it’s easy to forget or miss things. So during my internship I made a daily sticky note to do list. I’d pre-write any inpatients on it, then put my scheduled appts, then add emergencies as they came in. It didn’t have problem lists and tests or anything on it, but it was a central place to keep track of all my paperwork. And then if I had a free minute, I could check the list for a quick task I could bang out in a short amount of time.

They’d look kinda like this:
Teddy: MR[] rDVM letter [] discharges []
Rocky: MR [] SOAP [] Call Owner []
Blue: Neuro consult [] MR []
etc

I’d check the boxes when I was done with that paperwork, then cross out the whole line when everything for that patient was done for that day. I think it really helped my efficiency vs my internmates. Plus it was satisfying crossing out the lines late in the evening.

 

[Coopah]

I was gonna suggest something like what Ski posted if you are wanting something premade. A resident I knew as a student used one, probably check amazon?

I don’t think I had anything real fancy. Stuck a sticker top left and in the beginning I tried to have the problem list written below, ddx in middle of page, recommended tests below that. I didn’t keep up with it, tbh.

Not really what you asked about, but kinda related...I really like having a central to do list. A notebook of patients with a to do list for each patient is great, but when you’ve had an inpatient the whole rotation and her page is two weeks worth of cases back from your other new admit, it’s easy to forget or miss things. So during my internship I made a daily sticky note to do list. I’d pre-write any inpatients on it, then put my scheduled appts, then add emergencies as they came in. It didn’t have problem lists and tests or anything on it, but it was a central place to keep track of all my paperwork. And then if I had a free minute, I could check the list for a quick task I could bang out in a short amount of time.

They’d look kinda like this:
Teddy: MR[] rDVM letter [] discharges []
Rocky: MR [] SOAP [] Call Owner []
Blue: Neuro consult [] MR []
etc

I’d check the boxes when I was done with that paperwork, then cross out the whole line when everything for that patient was done for that day. I think it really helped my efficiency vs my internmates. Plus it was satisfying crossing out the lines late in the evening.

That's awesome! What does MR stand for?

 

[WildZoo]

I was gonna suggest something like what Ski posted if you are wanting something premade. A resident I knew as a student used one, probably check amazon?

I don’t think I had anything real fancy. Stuck a sticker top left and in the beginning I tried to have the problem list written below, ddx in middle of page, recommended tests below that. I didn’t keep up with it, tbh.

Not really what you asked about, but kinda related...I really like having a central to do list. A notebook of patients with a to do list for each patient is great, but when you’ve had an inpatient the whole rotation and her page is two weeks worth of cases back from your other new admit, it’s easy to forget or miss things. So during my internship I made a daily sticky note to do list. I’d pre-write any inpatients on it, then put my scheduled appts, then add emergencies as they came in. It didn’t have problem lists and tests or anything on it, but it was a central place to keep track of all my paperwork. And then if I had a free minute, I could check the list for a quick task I could bang out in a short amount of time.

They’d look kinda like this:
Teddy: MR[] rDVM letter [] discharges []
Rocky: MR [] SOAP [] Call Owner []
Blue: Neuro consult [] MR []
etc

I’d check the boxes when I was done with that paperwork, then cross out the whole line when everything for that patient was done for that day. I think it really helped my efficiency vs my internmates. Plus it was satisfying crossing out the lines late in the evening.

I did something similar when I was on small animal ECC and we had 7+ inpatients to deal with, which meant AM and PM treatments, owner phone calls, SOAPs, orders for the next day, +/- starting discharges for each of them. I haven't had another rotation where I had quite that many patients to juggle so haven't needed to do it since, but that daily to do list was great for that rotation.

 

[vetmedhead]

I was gonna suggest something like what Ski posted if you are wanting something premade. A resident I knew as a student used one, probably check amazon?

I don’t think I had anything real fancy. Stuck a sticker top left and in the beginning I tried to have the problem list written below, ddx in middle of page, recommended tests below that. I didn’t keep up with it, tbh.

Not really what you asked about, but kinda related...I really like having a central to do list. A notebook of patients with a to do list for each patient is great, but when you’ve had an inpatient the whole rotation and her page is two weeks worth of cases back from your other new admit, it’s easy to forget or miss things. So during my internship I made a daily sticky note to do list. I’d pre-write any inpatients on it, then put my scheduled appts, then add emergencies as they came in. It didn’t have problem lists and tests or anything on it, but it was a central place to keep track of all my paperwork. And then if I had a free minute, I could check the list for a quick task I could bang out in a short amount of time.

They’d look kinda like this:
Teddy: MR[] rDVM letter [] discharges []
Rocky: MR [] SOAP [] Call Owner []
Blue: Neuro consult [] MR []
etc

I’d check the boxes when I was done with that paperwork, then cross out the whole line when everything for that patient was done for that day. I think it really helped my efficiency vs my internmates. Plus it was satisfying crossing out the lines late in the evening.

A fourth year on my rotation this week actually sent me a link to a pre-made one that a recent grad made. I like the layout and I'm thinking of getting that for actual case notes, plus a separate notebook for me to write down rounds notes, To-Dos for the day, plus questions or clarifications I want to look up later.

I'm on internal med right now and having a blast, but I know I have way too many questions for cases to move forward at even a glacial pace if I asked all of them, so I've been scribbling learning issues down in the margins of my notes to look up on my downtime during the rotation. That's been working for me so far and I think it would be nice to have a consolidated place to have those written.

 

[vetmedhead]

Speaking of, I was looking up causes of urinary incontinence in cats and came across a few sources that mentioned that there is an FeLV-associated myelopathy that can cause urinary incontinence. Neat!

(I also learned today that Chinese chicken jerky treats can cause a Fanconi-like syndrome in dogs - also neat!)

 

[PippyPony]

(I also learned today that Chinese chicken jerky treats can cause a Fanconi-like syndrome in dogs - also neat!)

Oh my god my professors are OBSESSED with this fun fact. OBSEEEESSSED.

 

[JaynaAli]

That's awesome! What does MR stand for?

Medical Record. I couldn’t really remember exactly what categories I used 4 years ago, so I just made a few up today haha.

At my internship it was only semi digital records at that time so we used one giant word document as a combo official medical record/rDVM letter so literally everything had to go into it. We didn’t fill out a daily SOAP like with individual S O A and P sections, we’d start every case Word document with history, PE findings, recommendations and communication with the owners, diagnostics with results, evening updates, etc. If a patient was hospitalized we’d add a page break and do the same the next day so there’s be a single massive document for the visit. But that meant we had to do lots of updates and stay on top of things. They were also VERY adamant that discharges were in layman’s terms without medical jargon, which meant no copy and paste from the record into discharges.

I think I also had a box for treatment sheet since interns had to fill that out if a patient was hospitalized. Anesthesia sheets too. Really, it was just a list of whatever needed done in a day but I kept it all in one place stickied to my phone.

 

[JaynaAli]

That's awesome! What does MR stand for?

Medical Record. I couldn’t really remember exactly what categories I used 4 years ago, so I just made a few up today haha.

At my internship it was only semi digital records at that time so we used one giant word document as a combo official medical record/rDVM letter so literally everything had to go into it. We didn’t fill out a daily SOAP like with individual S O A and P sections, we’d start every case Word document with history, PE findings, recommendations and communication with the owners, diagnostics with results, evening updates, etc. If a patient was hospitalized we’d add a page break and do the same the next day so there’s be a single massive document for the visit. But that meant we had to do lots of updates and stay on top of things. They were also VERY adamant that discharges were in layman’s terms without medical jargon, which meant no copy and paste from the record into discharges.

I think I also had a box for treatment sheet since interns had to fill that out if a patient was hospitalized. Anesthesia sheets too. Really, it was just a list of whatever needed done in a day but I kept it all in one place stickied to my phone.

 

[kaydubs]

Oh my god my professors are OBSESSED with this fun fact. OBSEEEESSSED.

I read this and was like why does this sound so familiar

 

[vetmedhead]

Oh my god my professors are OBSESSED with this fun fact. OBSEEEESSSED.

Oh no, I'm becoming one of them

 

[mmmdreamerz]

Any of you going to SAVMA symposium?

 

[SkiOtter]

Any of you going to SAVMA symposium?

I think there’s a thread somewhere if you search for it

 

[jaboo]

I’m very anti-paper nowadays and was planning on just writing everything down on my iPad Pro via Notability for clinics. Bad idea?

 

[that redhead]

I’m very anti-paper nowadays and was planning on just writing everything down on my iPad Pro via Notability for clinics. Bad idea?

Not a bad idea necessarily but I guess I’d worry about charging, having it stolen, damage from unruly creatures/spills/etc and portability. Plus speed of access to particular information/apps/notes. It might help you be better organized on a patient-by-patient basis though.

 

[Coopah]

Is there anyone else waiting on their schedules for forth year or is it just me?

 

[aggievethopeful2021]

Is there anyone else waiting on their schedules for forth year or is it just me?

We're still waiting over here. 66 days until clinics. We HOPEFULLY are going to get them Monday but we'll see.

 

[PippyPony]

I’m very anti-paper nowadays and was planning on just writing everything down on my iPad Pro via Notability for clinics. Bad idea?

I'm also interested in answers to this, because I am pro-paper (hand writing stuff) but it results in endless loose sheets of it getting crumpled in my bag/my pockets or tossed in my car. Was wondering if a tablet & stylus could be an upgrade.

 

[WildZoo]

I haven't personally seen anyone in my class using a tablet for patient notes and things like that on clinics. It's just not as pocketable as a small notebook and is more likely to get badly damaged.

I use my surface pro a lot and always have it in the building, but more for looking things up for cases and doing medical record things. I don't usually carry it around with me. Sometimes I'll use it for taking notes in topic rounds.

 

[Coopah]

We're still waiting over here. 66 days until clinics. We HOPEFULLY are going to get them Monday but we'll see.

I just counted and we have 44 days until clinics, I think I like this method of measurement versus the 6 weeks.

 

[Coopah]

Random update: the class before us got their schedules two weeks before clincis started

 

[mmmdreamerz]

Is there anyone else waiting on their schedules for forth year or is it just me?

We’ve had our schedules for over 2 months...I have a renewed appreciation for the people doing our scheduling

 

[cdo96]

We’ve had our schedules for over 2 months...I have a renewed appreciation for the people doing our scheduling

yeah... same actually. I got mine mid December and I’m grateful now/ feel bad for bitching about it

 

[Coopah]

They said the soft schedule is coming out at 5pm today. But that changes will be made to accommodate any changes in externship dates or medical accomodations etc. Still...

 

[WildZoo]

We’ve had our schedules for over 2 months...I have a renewed appreciation for the people doing our scheduling

Yeah our scheduling is done by one dude with a love of spreadsheets and ours were done...idk, at least 5 months prior to starting clinics. I made a lot of alterations to mine after that, but that was by choice.

 

[Coopah]

They said the soft schedule is coming out at 5pm today. But that changes will be made to accommodate any changes in externship dates or medical accomodations etc. Still...

* This does not include our mandatory on call schedule which will only be released through December and then January through May will be released late October... FFS

 

[WildZoo]

* This does not include our mandatory on call schedule which will only be released through December and then January through May will be released late October... FFS

That's funny that they give you that so far in advance. We usually don't know on call schedules until a month or so before the relevant rotation, if that.

 

[Coopah]

That's funny that they give you that so far in advance. We usually don't know on call schedules until a month or so before the relevant rotation, if that.

Well that's because we frequently have to swap because they don't match up with our externship travel days, if we are accidentally double booked... You know because the program that does this sucks

 

[cohen2000]

Half past five, still no schedule 😡

 

[Coopah]

Half past five, still no schedule 😡

It's very past five. I've been continuously refreshing like I used to with the application portal it's just as frustrating

 

[SkiOtter]

Random update: the class before us got their schedules two weeks before clincis started

Lol @batsenecal tell her about the time 4th years got their schedules...uh...very late...

 

[Coopah]

It's very past five. I've been continuously refreshing like I used to with the application portal it's just as frustrating

So they never came out... Shocker

I had a second year look up my schedule because it's done but not released, jerks. And it's wrong because I changed the dates of my externship over a month ago so I'll have to apply for changes. I'm kinda hoping it's gonna change the **** show of my externship on the east coast -> Ortho -> east coast -> soft tissue madness.

 

[battie]

Random update: the class before us got their schedules two weeks before clincis started

Our class of 2018 didn't get their final schedule until two days before they started

 

[PippyPony]

I mean.... devil's advocate here -- how much does it really matter? Here at least, you know you're expected somewhere between 6-7am, 6-7 days a week.

Like if they told me to go to radiology first instead of large animal med, it would be like "okie dokie, I guess I will park in the another parking lot". Ultimately the rollercoaster ride has already started and you're not allowed to get off anyways, so time to let go and scream lol

...Although I may be a little more lackadaisical about these things than a lot of people. They actually deleted one of my first rotations because they decided to get rid of it overall, and I still haven't figured out a replacement Should probably get on that soon... but meh.

 

[WildZoo]

I mean.... devil's advocate here -- how much does it really matter? Here at least, you know you're expected somewhere between 6-7am, 6-7 days a week.

Like if they told me to go to radiology first instead of large animal med, it would be like "okie dokie, I guess I will park in the another parking lot". Ultimately the rollercoaster ride has already started and you're not allowed to get off anyways, so time to let go and scream lol

...Although I may be a little more lackadaisical about these things than a lot of people. They actually deleted one of my first rotations because they decided to get rid of it overall, and I still haven't figured out a replacement Should probably get on that soon... but meh.

Well, here it makes a big difference for planning. Like some rotations have weekend duty, some don't. Family wanting to know when it would be best for them to visit. I needed my schedule far in advance so I could start moving things around and lock down my externships and an international elective, and request time off for conferences. We do a fair amount of swapping between students. I did make one rotation swap basically two weeks before it happened, but the rest of my schedule was solid by then. So it kind of just depends on what you're doing. If they give you strict windows for making changes but you don't even have your schedule within that time frame, it's kind of ****ty.

 

[vetmedhead]

I mean.... devil's advocate here -- how much does it really matter? Here at least, you know you're expected somewhere between 6-7am, 6-7 days a week.

Like if they told me to go to radiology first instead of large animal med, it would be like "okie dokie, I guess I will park in the another parking lot". Ultimately the rollercoaster ride has already started and you're not allowed to get off anyways, so time to let go and scream lol

...Although I may be a little more lackadaisical about these things than a lot of people. They actually deleted one of my first rotations because they decided to get rid of it overall, and I still haven't figured out a replacement Should probably get on that soon... but meh.

I think my concerns fall under being able to prepare or plan for a rotation in any way. They typically have fairly different on-call/weekend/transfer expectations and I NEED to know that in advance so I can at least vaguely attempt to prepare myself for what is sometimes a huge schedule shift. My doctor has been getting on me about getting more sleep/a more regular sleep schedule, and if I have no idea that I need to be somewhere at 6 AM (vs other rotations that don't start until 9 AM), it's much harder to prepare for the schedule swing.

I think it's also helpful for planning externships etc or for planning, like, a personal life. I'm not going to try to go see a movie with friends if I know I'll be on call that weekend for the general surgery service, for example. It's hard getting things late because some of these events are planned way in advance (not movies necessarily, but say someone wanted to fly into town to visit you or wanted to see a concert with you or you wanted to go to a wedding but can't RSVP until you know you're free that weekend). It sucks because sometimes you find out that you WERE free for that weekend, but by the time you were told that it was too late to RSVP/buy a cheap flight ticket/whatever, and then you're hosed.

I think it also helps with figuring out time frames that might work well for you to schedule internship or job interviews, doctor's appointments, or what have you. If you're at a school that lets you pick what week you take boards, it's also helpful so you can decide what rotation you want to take boards during and if you might need to switch some rotations around so you have time to study appropriately (as needed).

I don't know. I get that we have very little control over things in our fourth years, but I also don't think that's an excuse to leave us completely out of the loop for that process. Schools have to make schedules for anywhere from 70-160 fourth years every year and if they don't have a process functional enough to produce schedules earlier than two days before clinics start (or six weeks), then it sounds like they need to start doing that process earlier so students aren't left in a bind to figure out important things like off-site rotations on really short notice.

 

[PippyPony]

Well, here it makes a big difference for planning. Like some rotations have weekend duty, some don't. Family wanting to know when it would be best for them to visit. I needed my schedule far in advance so I could start moving things around and lock down my externships and an international elective, and request time off for conferences. We do a fair amount of swapping between students. I did make one rotation swap basically two weeks before it happened, but the rest of my schedule was solid by then. So it kind of just depends on what you're doing. If they give you strict windows for making changes but you don't even have your schedule within that time frame, it's kind of ****ty.

Oh I realize it's important for externships, especially ones like zoo med. But if the school lets you schedule externships prior to getting your clinical schedule, then they are kind of making it their problem to switch things around to accommodate you after the fact if they didn't take those into account to begin with.

And I dunno, it just seems like these things tend to work out ok for people -- otherwise it probably would have been changed...? Vet school isn't cheap, if the majority of students were getting screwed over in their careers by sheer administrative incompetence, I would think that would have changed by now.

Again, kind of being devil's advocate and recognize I am seriously loosey-goosey with anything related to time or scheduling (as opposed to most vet students who usually have their **** together more than I do)

 

[PippyPony]

I think my concerns fall under being able to prepare or plan for a rotation in any way. They typically have fairly different on-call/weekend/transfer expectations and I NEED to know that in advance so I can at least vaguely attempt to prepare myself for what is sometimes a huge schedule shift. My doctor has been getting on me about getting more sleep/a more regular sleep schedule, and if I have no idea that I need to be somewhere at 6 AM (vs other rotations that don't start until 9 AM), it's much harder to prepare for the schedule swing.

I think it's also helpful for planning externships etc or for planning, like, a personal life. I'm not going to try to go see a movie with friends if I know I'll be on call that weekend for the general surgery service, for example. It's hard getting things late because some of these events are planned way in advance (not movies necessarily, but say someone wanted to fly into town to visit you or wanted to see a concert with you or you wanted to go to a wedding but can't RSVP until you know you're free that weekend). It sucks because sometimes you find out that you WERE free for that weekend, but by the time you were told that it was too late to RSVP/buy a cheap flight ticket/whatever, and then you're hosed.

Ah. Yeah for most rotations we don't get our on call or weekend schedule until the day we start on the rotation. Sooooo we are just advised not to make plans ever. Lol

We do have a doc from the current 4th years listing the typical hours for each service, but they are basically the same for most in-hospital rotations.

Weddings and such are not typically included as excused absences, either. They have us submit a form about 9 months in advance of clinics asking for scheduling considerations (not including externships -- only zoo and lab animal peeps are allowed to schedule those early, and maaaybe humane alliance?), and if we don't list the things on that form, it's up to the mercy of your rotation director at the time.