Mission ImpoWWssible Game Thread

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Day 4 Yeet Vote

  • Total voters
    15
  • Poll closed .
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GreedyBanger said:
My main EOD analysis is that Zenge was frozen scum, commited to voting late and then realising their options were to either hard bus or obviously join the competing wagon that might not have gone through anyway, and decided to conveniently find something else to do for 10 minutes
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What do you think about chic? Vampy?
 
I think theres between 0 and 1 scum on the top 2 wagons basically. Either we crushed it and both wagons are on scum, mads is scum or scum was just nowhere
 
GreedyBanger said:
Vampy is on the townier side of null to me. Chic would be my target if I cannot get Zenge
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What makes you think zenge is Clem’s partner over chic? Are you looking at it from that standpoint or just individually scummy?
 
KayJayQueue said:
What makes you think zenge is Clem’s partner over chic? Are you looking at it from that standpoint or just individually scummy?
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The frozen nature of it. The fact that chic called it out that they were just not moving deliberately as opposed to vanishing.
 
GreedyBanger said:
I think theres between 0 and 1 scum on the top 2 wagons basically. Either we crushed it and both wagons are on scum, mads is scum or scum was just nowhere
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How are you feeling about fruitsalad? I think the bottom of my reads are still chic, SAR, fruitsalad and zenge. Vampy would be next but that’s probably omgus because I don’t understand why I’d be sussed so it makes me not townread those players - I guess I need to be more open minded. I don’t think mads is scum because there was literally no vote made, even by them, to tie her wagon with EoD approaching. But I guess with Clem flipping scum that makes it possible in a 2 person scum team if that’s what we have. But I guess I’m not seeing that as the solve.
 
GreedyBanger said:
The frozen nature of it. The fact that chic called it out that they were just not moving deliberately as opposed to vanishing.
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Well zenge has said he thought his vote went through on clem, which we can’t know. I think it’s less likely he’s partnered with Clem because he did post a vote and it’d be crazy to pull that as scum - fake voting your partner and them being limmed correctly so eyes are on you. It seems really careless as a scum move.
 
KayJayQueue said:
How are you feeling about fruitsalad? I think the bottom of my reads are still chic, SAR, fruitsalad and zenge. Vampy would be next but that’s probably omgus because I don’t understand why I’d be sussed so it makes me not townread those players - I guess I need to be more open minded. I don’t think mads is scum because there was literally no vote made, even by them, to tie her wagon with EoD approaching. But I guess with Clem flipping scum that makes it possible in a 2 person scum team if that’s what we have. But I guess I’m not seeing that as the solve.
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I'm pretty aligned with that
 
Can you talk to me about the specifics of the Genny read since its our main small discrepancy?
 
genny said:
it means he came in, said a bunch of things that seemed surface-level helpful, and then peaced out. usually as a villager he doesn't say anything even remotely resembling something helpful at all on day 1.
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@GreedyBanger this is what I’m referring to as the read she had on Clem
 
Pretty sure if I was scummy I’d move to Clem to prevent this exact situation where I last minute toss in a “I’m purposefully not voting Clem today because D1 shenanigans” and then seem sus af. That’s also not any more a soft defense than me saying I’ll deal with Greedy tomorrow (today).

GreedyBanger said:
I thought clem was built as a counterwagon to SAR and was annoyed not to get my way.

Alternatively im scum and just openly said in chat that I was annoyed with the flip right before it happened.

You can decide whats more likely.

The vig should always shoot me today. We are SO far ahead and you can **confirm yourself with 2 deaths** for when you claim later.

Bodyguard, roleblocker and something about my role I have not revealed yet makes me think a vig is exceptionally likely. I don't care if you are one shot and townread me, i'm such a good shot
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Do you usually declare very confidently that someone is not going to flip scum when you don’t get your way?

Agreed it’s stupid to say that, if you were wolfing with Clem, but then we get into a WIFOM situation 🧐

Can you clarify what you meant by the bolded? Two deaths?

I haven’t played with miller much so can you ELI5 why vig should obviously shoot you?

And you’re telling me you’re negative utility AND you have a shiny modifier on you?

EDIT: forgot this is bbcode and not markdown, bold was not bolding
 
chicandtoughness said:
Pretty sure if I was scummy I’d move to Clem to prevent this exact situation where I last minute toss in a “I’m purposefully not voting Clem today because D1 shenanigans” and then seem sus af. That’s also not any more a soft defense than me saying I’ll deal with Greedy tomorrow (today).



Do you usually declare very confidently that someone is not going to flip scum when you don’t get your way?

Agreed it’s stupid to say that, if you were wolfing with Clem, but then we get into a WIFOM situation 🧐

Can you clarify what you meant by the bolded? Two deaths?

I haven’t played with miller much so can you ELI5 why vig should obviously shoot you?

And you’re telling me you’re negative utility AND you have a shiny modifier on you?

EDIT: forgot this is bbcode and not markdown, bold was not bolding
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I usually confidently say everything yeah.

Vig kills scum kills, vig can claim who they shot later when they are outed.

Vig is very unlikely to hit scum with a scum already gone, i'm always going to have suspicion due to my claim, im not anything worth saving. So i'm a good shot.

And yes I have secret upside, I will likely never activate it during the game
 
GreedyBanger said:
I usually confidently say everything yeah.

Vig kills scum kills, vig can claim who they shot later when they are outed.

Vig is very unlikely to hit scum with a scum already gone, i'm always going to have suspicion due to my claim, im not anything worth saving. So i'm a good shot.

And yes I have secret upside, I will likely never activate it during the game
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What happens if scum just claims the kill on you if we have a vig to get the vig to claim? I only see this in a 3 scum world and it would be risky. I dunno. But I guess if I say it now it’s less likely to happen…hopefully lol
 
KayJayQueue said:
What happens if scum just claims the kill on you if we have a vig to get the vig to claim? I only see this in a 3 scum world and it would be risky. I dunno. But I guess if I say it now it’s less likely to happen…hopefully lol
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I mean if scum want to claim vig with an unspecified amount of shots they can do so. Vig doesnt need to counterclaim lol they can just get blasting
 
GreedyBanger said:
I mean if scum want to claim vig with an unspecified amount of shots they can do so. Vig doesnt need to counterclaim lol they can just get blasting
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Oh I guess that’s true. Actually, cool. That’s good lol RIP you. Make sure to use this “night” (day) to its fullest if you’re about to die. Help me in my blind spots if you can.
 
This again assumes the existence of a town aligned vig.

What’s to stop a scum vig from shooting you, claiming the kill, and either 1) getting erroneously soft cleared by town or 2) now we’re down a non-scum and still don’t know vig alignment.

Yes yes, I know, game balance and all that. But I’m still not going to be solving for mech unless it’s more than speculation.

GreedyBanger said:
Vig kills scum kills, vig can claim who they shot later when they are outed.
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Let me mentally walk myself through this to make sure I understand.

How does this corroborate anything about the vig if you have publicly baited them into shooting you?

You could die tonight from an vig shot and I, on the chopping block tomorrow, could claim that I’m the vig, I shot you as requested, plz don’t yeet me. Real vig could cc? But then neither of our claims are provable unless we have a watcher/tracker/seer/etc who just so happened to have tracked me and/or the vig. I guess in your scenario the next step would be to yeet me and use the flip to see the trustworthiness of the cc (assuming the cc is real).
 
Other side thought is whether this flavor of miller flips miller on yeet or scum on yeet 🤔 (I believe our mods wouldn’t be deceptive like that but idk anymore sob)
 
One strategy I could have went for if we had limmed town was to agree to just doublevote the most consensus townread player. But now I have the same incentive to do that as scum. If anyone has any questions on my thoughts or reads tonight im happy to engage, I dont really think we need to get deep in the weeds about reading me though cause I think its just townsided for me to die regardless

chicandtoughness said:
This again assumes the existence of a town aligned vig.

What’s to stop a scum vig from shooting you, claiming the kill, and either 1) getting erroneously soft cleared by town or 2) now we’re down a non-scum and still don’t know vig alignment.

Yes yes, I know, game balance and all that. But I’m still not going to be solving for mech unless it’s more than speculation.


Let me mentally walk myself through this to make sure I understand.

How does this corroborate anything about the vig if you have publicly baited them into shooting you?

You could die tonight from an vig shot and I, on the chopping block tomorrow, could claim that I’m the vig, I shot you as requested, plz don’t yeet me. Real vig could cc? But then neither of our claims are provable unless we have a watcher/tracker/seer/etc who just so happened to have tracked me and/or the vig. I guess in your scenario the next step would be to yeet me and use the flip to see the trustworthiness of the cc (assuming the cc is real).
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The real vig doesnt need to CC you during the day. Fakeclaim vig all you like they will blast you
 
This assumes an X-shot vig and not a 1-shot vig though right? If they shot you they’re out of bullets.

I guess it would be a leap of faith for mafia to assume the vig is 1-shot only.
 
Maf would be betting the whole game on it at this point. I'm comfortable with that
 
I just don’t see how greedy is not town here. He’s begging to be vigged and HE’D have to bet the entire game that there is no vig or SK to not die tonight or he’d just screw his entire team and imo thrown the game, even if not purposely since he claimed early and would have to commit. I just don’t see it. If anyone still scumreads greedy, I really need to know why.
 
I'm so sorry I got a role thats incentivised to town it up really hard for once with you Kay and the best thing I can advocate for is for someone to shank me about it
 
GreedyBanger said:
I'm so sorry I got a role thats incentivised to town it up really hard for once with you Kay and the best thing I can advocate for is for someone to shank me about it
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Yeah not ideal for us working together past day 1 lol but if it helps us win, so be it
 
chicandtoughness said:
Tell me more about this, vampy
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i dont like the buddy system KJQ and greedy have going on right off the bat. in theory, it would be great if they were both confirmed town but i don’t buy it right away.

with greedy claiming “miller” and just following KJQ’s lead and being able to skate by, i’m interested to see KJQ eliminated and leaving greedy to their own devices.
 
vampyrica said:
i dont like the buddy system KJQ and greedy have going on right off the bat. in theory, it would be great if they were both confirmed town but i don’t buy it right away.

with greedy claiming “miller” and just following KJQ’s lead and being able to skate by, i’m interested to see KJQ eliminated and leaving greedy to their own devices.
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Instead of eliminating the claimed miller? Has anything we’ve said/done not given you the impression that we’re just both town? Why would either of us be this “buddy/buddy” as scum? What benefit does it give? What kind of strategy would this be? Can you read us independently at all? I’ve given way more reads than just greedy. Frankly, I think you’re using us openly townreading each other as a crutch to sus us.
 
KayJayQueue said:
Instead of eliminating the claimed miller? Has anything we’ve said/done not given you the impression that we’re just both town? Why would either of us be this “buddy/buddy” as scum? What benefit does it give? What kind of strategy would this be? Can you read us independently at all? I’ve given way more reads than just greedy. Frankly, I think you’re using us openly townreading each other as a crutch to sus us.
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what good does that do eliminating the claimed miller on D1 with no support for their claim? you’re still neutral-town leaning in my book, but i was wrong about clem so i’m reconsidering all my options.

if one of you is scum and leaning on the other, it seems like an attempt to clear your own name rather than anything else.

greedy is more of scum read in my book. sure a miller for this particular game makes sense, but there’s no support for that claim. plus i dont like the “don't bother checking me” comment. just sits weird with me.

i’m not sus of you, i’m sus of them. however, their trust in you and willingness to follow your lead can and would work out in your favor if you are scum, because you have someone parroting your ideas and influencing other people’s decisions, making your votes and reads echoed.

(if there’s spelling errors or sentences don't make sense, it’s 5am and i got up to get water so my brain is still in sleep mode)
 
vampyrica said:
what good does that do eliminating the claimed miller on D1 with no support for their claim? you’re still neutral-town leaning in my book, but i was wrong about clem so i’m reconsidering all my options.

if one of you is scum and leaning on the other, it seems like an attempt to clear your own name rather than anything else.

greedy is more of scum read in my book. sure a miller for this particular game makes sense, but there’s no support for that claim. plus i dont like the “don't bother checking me” comment. just sits weird with me.

i’m not sus of you, i’m sus of them. however, their trust in you and willingness to follow your lead can and would work out in your favor if you are scum, because you have someone parroting your ideas and influencing other people’s decisions, making your votes and reads echoed.

(if there’s spelling errors or sentences don't make sense, it’s 5am and i got up to get water so my brain is still in sleep mode)
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Greedy said not to bother checking him because it’s a waste to check a claimed miller. You’ll get a bad result on them no matter what and it proves literally nothing. Instead you could get an accurate result on someone else.

He’s also begged to be shot by a vig and since the vig (if they exist) can’t be roleblocked now, I’d say it’s a big chance if one exists that greedy will be confirmed tomorrow especially with him having more insight to the setup with his (claimed) role modifiers and believes there should be a vig. And if mkg is true claiming, gives credence to another KP existing other than just scum.

I hope this argument doesn’t matter by tomorrow and we can just confirm him.
 
I am TELLING You that you will get a guilty result on me as an investigative. Im not denying it will be guilty. I'm not avoiding scrutiny im inviting it. But I don't want to waste key roles powers
 
In response to an earlier question: yes, it's typical to have open nights here. Nights are open more than they're closed but it's become mod-dependent. The closed nights on the champs practice were to emulate the champs format
 
it would be wild if it was a clem/greedy/KJQ team, but i don't buy it so i'm going to steer away from this for a little but will be very willing to revisit once things continue to play out
 
We've definitely previously had games with 2 maf and 1 malicious 3p so it's theoretically a possible setup, but again without further writeup hints, 2 kills indicating an SK, or someone flipping 3p I'm going to focus on mafia since we know they exist. Seems like a small game for something like a cult + mafia team.
 
Think I agree with KJQ that it'd be surprising for GreedyBangs to be scum here, unless his wincon is something exotic and weird.
 
Shading people on the second biggest wagon after a scum flip when you WERE NOT ON THE WAGON is wild behaviour, and doesn't speak to a coherent attempt to solve.

Chic rising in my rankings, vamp plummeting
 
potentialsheltervet said:
Think I agree with KJQ that it'd be surprising for GreedyBangs to be scum here, unless his wincon is something exotic and weird.
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in an alternate universe, the miller claim is bluff and both are maf working together under the false narrative of both being town and defending eachother.

but thats just an AU.
 
sue me for thinking outside the metaphorical box. its not totally out of left field to say that the miller claim can be total bluff
 
vampyrica said:
in an alternate universe, the miller claim is bluff and both are maf working together under the false narrative of both being town and defending eachother.

but thats just an AU.
Click to expand...
I mean, maybe, but this relies on the assumption that there isn't a vig out there to just whack Greedy like he's asking for. In a closed setup with potential to be role madness, that's a huge gamble. It's not impossible but it's enough of a "well, that'd be strange" that I think the more plausible conclusion is he's just a miller.
Plus he made the claim so early that there would've been pretty minimal time to lay it out in scumchat, yeah?
 
potentialsheltervet said:
I mean, maybe, but this relies on the assumption that there isn't a vig out there to just whack Greedy like he's asking for. In a closed setup with potential to be role madness, that's a huge gamble. It's not impossible but it's enough of a "well, that'd be strange" that I think the more plausible conclusion is he's just a miller.
Plus he made the claim so early that there would've been pretty minimal time to lay it out in scumchat, yeah?
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they made the claim 1 hour and 59 minutes after the game started. who says this wasnt discussed during those 2 hours? there was a handful of people who were not active at D1 start, they could in theory have messaged the chat and said “hey im going to do this, just go along with it”.

again- just food for thought, not saying this is the end all be all. i’m just not comfy around them yet so staying cautious.
 
vampyrica said:
they made the claim 1 hour and 59 minutes after the game started. who says this wasnt discussed during those 2 hours? there was a handful of people who were not active at D1 start, they could in theory have messaged the chat and said “hey im going to do this, just go along with it”.

again- just food for thought, not saying this is the end all be all. i’m just not comfy around them yet so staying cautious.
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Okay so that’s a possible world for you. Give us another. You’re eventually going to need to pivot into a different solve as soon as one of us proves this theory wrong by flipping. So what else do you think could be a solve?
 
The options in my brain are:

1. KJQ is scum, Greedy is miller like he says (or some other town-aligned role), she’s pocketed him hard.
2. Greedy is mafia who made a very bold claim and is running with it.
3. Greedy is a jester variant who wins by getting killed (there’s a name for this, I cannot remember it).
4. KJQ and Greedy are both town and feel extremely confident in their D1 reads on each other.

Of these, I think 2 is actually the least likely. My brain took a while to get there and while I do not fully understand the reasoning, I understand it enough to not have Greedy in the mafia list. Doesn’t rule out 3p shenanigans but I’ll focus on mafia hunting and deal with this later. Still racking my brain thinking about what modifier could be on a miller though.

1 and 3 are rising in my possibilities though.
 
I guess there’s option 5 that they’re both mafia and KJQ has a PR (or plans to claim a PR, like a tracker/watcher) that can somehow support Greedy’s fakeclaim or spin an inevitable vig shot, but that’s lower on the list due to the things that would need to align to make this happen.
 
GreedyBanger said:
Shading people on the second biggest wagon after a scum flip when you WERE NOT ON THE WAGON is wild behaviour, and doesn't speak to a coherent attempt to solve.

Chic rising in my rankings, vamp plummeting
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It’s also heavily reliant on pre-flipping SAR as town when even as scum the most you could know about SAR is “not scum with me” in this setup (I’m assuming) so it’s putting a lot of eggs in the you/me basket which feels very lazy but at first glance they could think it looks like a believable thought to have. I do find it odd that she’s dismissing the amount of people that townread me (including her somewhat) Because even her own read that says she mostly leans town on me or something to that effect should give her pause to push a world where we’re both bad. Yet here we are. It’s definitely odd.
 
potentialsheltervet said:
Plus he made the claim so early that there would've been pretty minimal time to lay it out in scumchat, yeah?
Click to expand...
vampyrica said:
they could in theory have messaged the chat and said “hey im going to do this, just go along with it”.
Click to expand...
I do somewhat agree with vampy here though. PSV how many times have you wolfed and discussed your entire strat with the team? Because most of my wolf games (forum, live action extended, even party game style live action) have looked a lot more like “hey I saw an opportunity to do this given the game state so I took it, let’s figure out the damage control now”.
 
chicandtoughness said:
The options in my brain are:

1. KJQ is scum, Greedy is miller like he says (or some other town-aligned role), she’s pocketed him hard.
2. Greedy is mafia who made a very bold claim and is running with it.
3. Greedy is a jester variant who wins by getting killed (there’s a name for this, I cannot remember it).
4. KJQ and Greedy are both town and feel extremely confident in their D1 reads on each other.

Of these, I think 2 is actually the least likely. My brain took a while to get there and while I do not fully understand the reasoning, I understand it enough to not have Greedy in the mafia list. Doesn’t rule out 3p shenanigans but I’ll focus on mafia hunting and deal with this later. Still racking my brain thinking about what modifier could be on a miller though.

1 and 3 are rising in my possibilities though.
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Explain to me why 1 would ever be the world. What do I have to gain from this kind of play when greedy is claiming miller? What does it get me besides this insane amount of sus for believing someone is town. I feel like I’ve already asked this. I get I’m easy to jump on if you’re scum but if you’re not, you need to entertain a solve that doesn’t involve me. How high is 4 on your worldview? Because as far as I’m concerned, that’s the most likely. I know I’m town so 3 could be technically possible but I think it’s far less likely.
 
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