SDN Pre-Vet WW 10th Anniversary Game Thread

[Dinashadow]

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And with Dina confirming he’s lying, he’s def either a cult leader or (less likely imo) a wolf.

Either way, I don’t think wasting todays yeet makes sense since there are so many potentially killing items/roles out there. If he survives another night or two, then I’d be open to discussing yeeting him since then we’ll be starting to risk him successfully recruiting folks.

Yeah I think I'm leaning towards cult leader and that he was the one that visited shorty last night

 

[Cyndia]

I need to figure out where I want to go with todays vote… I’ve gotten so spoiled by D1 wolf yeets helping with game analysis and so I’m struggling this game 🤦🏾‍♀️

 

[justafluff]

I feel like her following paws’ vote around like that just isn’t good wolf play. It would be too obvious, and wolves typically try to avoid being on the same vote if possible. Cray is experienced enough and she’s discussed in wolf chat before that she doesn’t like all the wolves on the same vote. I would only believe that if Alissa had been a wolf and they were trying to not bus her.

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It’s not good village play either. Sheeping is wolfy.
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[Aprilthearab]

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Why using an item makes a person wolfy?
We don’t know what it does. It could be self protection or something.
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I got the shrug yesterday so I know what they do (as far as I know, what the shrug does isn't thread knowledge, right?). It could be beneficial to either a villager or a wolf, but I'd argue that it's much more useful to a wolf or 3P. There are no drawbacks for a wolf to use it that I can think of, but there would be drawbacks to a villager using it. It would be stupid for a wolf or 3P not to use it.

 

[justafluff]

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Did anyone fall for it? I shall be thoroughly disappointed if not
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I opened it now and I’m visualizing a stump dancing with little twig arms
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[Aprilthearab]

I think I should just give up on catching up at this point since I'm now nearly 30 pages behind, so @supershorty can you give me a tl/dr on the cubs discussion regarding what happened last night and the discussion about it today?

 

[Aprilthearab]

Lol I'm exhausted and my grammar is suffering

 

[Cyndia]

I think I should just give up on catching up at this point since I'm now nearly 30 pages behind, so @supershorty can you give me a tl/dr on the cubs discussion regarding what happened last night and the discussion about it today?

If you just read page 79 onwards it has most of the cubs relevant discussion… but key points from today - shorty got results that indicated someone tried to recruit her and failed. Her sharing that validated something that was sent to me that indicates cubs is able to try recruiting players to his group and is also tough to kill. Dina has also just shared that she knows cubs role is rojo (he had claimed on thread at close last night he was msp and had a 1xyeet avoidance).

 

[Cyndia]

Also someone vigged mel overnight - his role allowed him to convert 3p players from an exclusive to an inclusive win con.

 

[Truenamer]

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Just letting everyone know I am getting on a plane to go see my parents with Stoat, and I just left behind my baby boy all alone for the first time. Just going to have a sitter checking on him twice a day. I am a creature of pure anxiety.

Spoiler: my chungus

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[Truenamer]

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If you just read page 79 onwards it has most of the cubs relevant discussion… but key points from today - shorty got results that indicated someone tried to recruit her and failed. Her sharing that validated something that was sent to me that indicates cubs is able to try recruiting players to his group and is also tough to kill. Dina has also just shared that she knows cubs role is rojo (he had claimed on thread at close last night he was msp and had a 1xyeet avoidance).

Also someone vigged mel overnight - his role allowed him to convert 3p players from an exclusive to an inclusive win con.

Sounds like we should try to yeet him today and have the wolves clean up for us tonight if it fails. I'm sure they don't want a 3P Cult Leader roaming around either.

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[Aprilthearab]

If you just read page 79 onwards it has most of the cubs relevant discussion… but key points from today - shorty got results that indicated someone tried to recruit her and failed. Her sharing that validated something that was sent to me that indicates cubs is able to try recruiting players to his group and is also tough to kill. Dina has also just shared that she knows cubs role is rojo (he had claimed on thread at close last night he was msp and had a 1xyeet avoidance).

Okay perfect that's what I was thinking happened
I don't want to say how I know but I want to validate this line of reasoning that Cubs is recruiting

 

[Cyndia]

Nope, don't think so. But she said she used them and they just didn't get activated so my argument is null now lol

I’m still mulling over this whole exchange about the shrugs. Doesn’t your argument still stand if she even attempted to use them? Like was the failed activation due to something that clears her or is it just rng failure?

 

[Aprilthearab]

I’m still mulling over this whole exchange about the shrugs. Doesn’t your argument still stand if she even attempted to use them? Like was the failed activation due to something that clears her or is it just rng failure?

No, it's a passive item and activation vs not activated doesn't make any difference in the intention of its use. The intention of its use (or disuse) is the only thing that matters with how I analyze it

 

[Cyndia]

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Sounds like we should try to yeet him today and have the wolves clean up for us tonight if it fails. I'm sure they don't want a 3P Cult Leader roaming around either.

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Orrrr the better alternative - refuse to yeet cubs, force the wolves to use their kill on a 3p, thereby saving a villager from death and also giving us a chance to yeet a wolf.

If I knew for sure it was a one time death avoidance your plan would potentially have merit but I don’t have any info beyond him being challenging to kill.

 

[samac]

sorry I got pulled into a sx and I'm not caught up on the last 9ish pages or so

But cubs isn't MsP, or MsP is a cover role or something. 100% confirmed I know exactly who he is

Not sure what this says about the yeet avoidance claim

I like dis

 

[Aprilthearab]

If it becomes important I can reveal the item's purpose but my brain isn't working well right now so I'm struggling to explain and I don't think it's relevant to our discussion anymore

 

[Cyndia]

No, it's a passive item and activation vs not activated doesn't make any difference in the intention of its use. The intention of its use (or disuse) is the only thing that matters with how I analyze it

Okay… I’m still a little confused but I’ll take your word for it and move on from it for now.

 

[justafluff]

Yeah, I know, but it seems like only one person can get each item each night so it's not like it makes the wolves or 3Ps overpowered. It's a passive thing that only works for one night and only has a small chance of being helpful so I don't think it's that strong. It's just that if it does happen to be helpful, it would be more helpful to wolves/3P than village

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If items are passively activated why would you assume Paws didn't use the shrugs? Edit: I saw your responses above, no worries
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[Aprilthearab]

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If items are passively activated why would you assume Paws didn't use the shrugs?
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You can choose to use the item, but choosing to use the item does not mean it activates.

Imagine it this way (even though this has absolutely NOTHING to do with how the item works, btw, this is strictly an analogy)

You can place a landmine on the ground, and that would be "choosing to use the item." The landmine doesn't necessarily have to go off - it only goes off if it's stepped on (activated). Or you can choose not to place the landmine on the ground at all, and that would be choosing not to use the item at all.

 

[justafluff]

You can choose to use the item, but choosing to use the item does not mean it activates.

Imagine it this way (even though this has absolutely NOTHING to do with how the item works, btw, this is strictly an analogy)

You can place a landmine on the ground, and that would be "choosing to use the item." The landmine doesn't necessarily have to go off - it only goes off if it's stepped on (activated). Or you can choose not to place the landmine on the ground at all, and that would be choosing not to use the item at all.

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got it. But it looks like if you don't use an item for a night, it returns to auction? So village and wolves would choose to use it either way.
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[Aprilthearab]

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got it. But it looks like if you don't use an item for a night, it returns to auction? So village and wolves would choose to use it either way.
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Like I said, it could have a drawback for a villager to use it. The drawback has nothing to do with whether or not it gets returned to circulation

 

[alissa14]

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I opened it now and I’m visualizing a stump dancing with little twig arms
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Ok but a tree would look so good doing the lil shimmy that Rick Astley does
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[alissa14]

And with Dina confirming he’s lying, he’s def either a cult leader or (less likely imo) a wolf.

Either way, I don’t think wasting todays yeet makes sense since there are so many potentially killing items/roles out there. If he survives another night or two, then I’d be open to discussing yeeting him since then we’ll be starting to risk him successfully recruiting folks.

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So your logic is to not vote a potential wolf out? Do you have any better ideas? Because otherwise I think I hear howling!!!
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[samac]

This is interesting and I’m wondering where this is going.

I think it’s weird to fake claim any role of a person at this point.

Like if LiS wasn’t a wolf, then we clearly can’t game solve just based on who a person’s character is. So why not just claim to be the person you are?

I don’t see a down side. Like I said, if LiS wasn’t a wolf, then it’s clearly not an effect game solving strategy, but I’m also happy to wait if people have concerns about doing a reveal like this.

Quoted this to agree with it but the reveal comes later

The player he is is known famously for something they did as a wolf

Idk anything about this player in relation to 3Ps, but I don't know how obvious the mods would've made these things

Wheeee

And with Dina confirming he’s lying, he’s def either a cult leader or (less likely imo) a wolf.

Either way, I don’t think wasting todays yeet makes sense since there are so many potentially killing items/roles out there. If he survives another night or two, then I’d be open to discussing yeeting him since then we’ll be starting to risk him successfully recruiting folks.

I’m kinda torn on this. If he has one 1x avoidance we could yeet him today and wolves take him out tonight.
If he’s wolf and an alpha that’s a different story.

Okay I'm back already

I was told cubs was the drjojo aka rojo

I ****in love it

Yeah this is what I'm struggling with now, like how much do role names help with game solving. I'm leaning towards not that much, but I figured I should get the info out there and let people decide for themselves

I don’t think role names will necessarily solve the game, but catching someone in a lie is great.

How did we decide that cubs was cult and not wolf again? Cyndia, can you expand a little more on what happened?

 

[potentialsheltervet]

The only flaw I see with the "let's not yeet Cubs and hope the wolves take him out" is if he's an alpha wolf that can convert players or something. Then, of course the wolves won't kill him.
And if he's difficult to get rid of, then we'll waste at least one cycle trying to oust him without success.

 

[potentialsheltervet]

@Cyndia A yes or no question here: was it an item that helped you gain knowledge about Cubs?

 

[potentialsheltervet]

Also to add, the apparent strongarm genny kill last night is concerning but would be super duper helpful if a wolf used it on Cubs. If he's a 3p and not a wolf.
Cult related: assuming someone has been successfully converted, I have a guess as to who.
@violetvett I'm sorry but this would be a really good time to share just a bit more about why you're convinced there's a 3p faction and if you have any thoughts on it being related to Cubs. The most important question to me right now is whether Cubs is like a wolf convertor, an alpha wolf, or a cult leader.

 

[Truenamer]

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So your logic is to not vote a potential wolf out? Do you have any better ideas? Because otherwise I think I hear howling!!!
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Behind and I just saw that you're a stump now too. Hi! Glad to have another frand!

But also why the heck is it just the three of us?

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[potentialsheltervet]

But also why the heck is it just the three of us?

Looking like it's the first person killed in each cycle. You were the first NK/death (aside from weagle but different situation since she was chopped up in AM's freezer), fluff was the first one yoten, alissa was yoten yesterday.
My figuring is if we had an unsuccessful yeet day, then the night's NK would be stumped since that would become the first kill. Or maybe if someone was day-vigged. But nothing to substantiate that currently, and I doubt scum would be stumped either.

 

[Doctor-S]

I’m confused, can you go over why April using the whip on MJ makes you suspect Mj?

Using a whip on MJ doesn't make me suspect MJ.

But ... I was trying to get a "feel" for MJ because he didn't seem to be making an effort to search for woofs, and that was bothering me, and it was based on stuff I recall LIS saying about woofy behavior, and not letting woofs get away with jokey stuff, snarkiness, absenteeism, real life stuff, fluffy stuff, etc. I recall LIS saying stuff about woofs misleading, distracting, lying and deceiving, using any means - so don't become complacent. At least that's what I recall LIS saying a long time ago.

Then, I was acknowledging my understanding that April had claimed she used a whip on MJ because he was being a bit too rough with everyone. I didn't know if the whip item was/was not important. I was just acknowledging that I understood what April was saying about the whip, and about her using the whip on MJ earlier in the game. MJ also said that someone used a whip on him, and it turned out to be April.

My vote was stolen again. This time it was made clear it was by someone with a whip, so let me know if that sounds familiar to anyone. Dominatrix? Ringmaster? A very convincing Indiana Jones?

Full disclosure because I don't see the point in hiding it
I won the bid for LIS's whip during D2. Didn't know what it did (I asked for clarification and was met with a hmm), was just told someone would bend to my wishes. Used it on MJ just because I didn't know what it did and thought it would be fun to crack the whip on the person who was being a bit too rough with everyone. Was told after the fact that it would make his vote follow mine for today's cycle, which is what I suspected. Totally forgot that MJ's vote was stolen during the last cycle, btw, which is what I meant when I said I fudged up in my role PM because I wouldn't have used it on him if I realized that. Not useful for village to not see where his vote would have gone two cycles in a row.

Not the same mechanic as whatever was used on him yesterday because it seems whatever controlled his vote yesterday could put it wherever they wanted. In my case, it can only go wherever I vote.

 

[IvyMoose]

What does this mean about him chilling and watching the thread

basically he posted right after voting closed, meaning he was watching the thread without any input... seems like we are beginning to get a consensus on him anyways.

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Yeah… the only time I’ve seen her wolf was when I was a wolf but that game was practically a stomp and she was vig killed by Zenge. It’s just I’ve never seen her play like this and her wagon dissipated today.
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if im right about my sus read on sporty, i would be over the moon. i have not once had a good wolf read

Well she basically already did.

And I wouldn’t really be surprised if names could be game solved with. Especially** if there’s an EOD role name seer or if it’s an item or some other manner that limits the ability. I’d be surprised if every role name was hard and fast wolfy-associated like rojo.

**especially especially with cover roles provided as well, which is well within Dubz’s norm

i'm inclined to believe you can game solve using character names, but i guess be careful...? the character names probably give clues to the role but may not be exactly how you imagine it. just me meta-tinfoiling about game mechanics lmao

also where tf is the seer i got beef... lay out your cards you gotta benefit village now come on

 

[supershorty]

also where tf is the seer i got beef... lay out your cards you gotta benefit village now come on

I'm skimming while I'm at writing accountability group and trying not to get busted by my PI, but this kind of fishing is not something you should do. I know you're basically confirmed village so I'm not saying it makes me feel bad about you, but IF there's a seer, it benefits us a whole lot more if they make their pushes without outing their ability as long as possible because that's an instant top priority for a wolf kill.

44 more minutes of this torture halp

 

[SportPonies]

I'm skimming while I'm at writing accountability group and trying not to get busted by my PI, but this kind of fishing is not something you should do. I know you're basically confirmed village so I'm not saying it makes me feel bad about you, but IF there's a seer, it benefits us a whole lot more if they make their pushes without outing their ability as long as possible because that's an instant top priority for a wolf kill.

44 more minutes of this torture halp

I will say if there is confirmed cult in this game, Ivy really doesn’t stay clear for long but I do agree she’s probably still clear for today.

You were an attempted conversion last night? Which means that cult(?) can convert (likely?) every odd(?) night?

I don’t think ivy wouldve been a convert target prior to fluff’s flip.

Is cult even confirmed or is this all theorizing about cubs?

 

[SportPonies]

I will say if there is confirmed cult in this game, Ivy really doesn’t stay clear for long but I do agree she’s probably still clear for today.

You were an attempted conversion last night? Which means that cult(?) can convert (likely?) every odd(?) night?

I don’t think ivy wouldve been a convert target prior to fluff’s flip.

Is cult even confirmed or is this all theorizing about cubs?

No one is allowed to yell at me for talking about conversion because AM is dead.

 

[justafluff]

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Behind and I just saw that you're a stump now too. Hi! Glad to have another frand!

But also why the heck is it just the three of us?

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I was praying for stump!Mel last night
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[violetvett]

Also to add, the apparent strongarm genny kill last night is concerning but would be super duper helpful if a wolf used it on Cubs. If he's a 3p and not a wolf.
Cult related: assuming someone has been successfully converted, I have a guess as to who.
@violetvett I'm sorry but this would be a really good time to share just a bit more about why you're convinced there's a 3p faction and if you have any thoughts on it being related to Cubs. The most important question to me right now is whether Cubs is like a wolf convertor, an alpha wolf, or a cult leader.

I'm afraid to say anything more detailed, as I really don't want to reveal too much, but I know for a fact that there is a 3P group with a separate wincon. I do not know for a fact if it's a cult or if there's any conversion mechanics related to it. I also do not know for a fact if cubs is part of it.

Personally, I think we should get rid of cubs. I highly doubt he's village. It would automatically clear up the cult leader thing and the fact that both dina and Cyndia have come forward about his story not lining up makes him way too suspicious. The yeet thing does worry me though, so I'm really hoping someone has a vig shot to use on him. I really don't think he's making that up, since I also remember when genny was cult leader in StardeWW and her having a 1x death avoidance (which I think applied to yeets, as well?). If nothing happens there though today, I don't know if we should try to go and yeet him anyway (and hope the wolves come through with an nk) or if we should try yeeting someone else.

 

[Cyndia]

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So your logic is to not vote a potential wolf out? Do you have any better ideas? Because otherwise I think I hear howling!!!
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My logic is that I don't think he's a potential wolf - I'm pretty darn sure he's a cult leader and can't be yeeted today, so I'm not interested in us wasting a vote. I think we need to move on to discussing who IS a good wolf candidate because we're just going to waste post numbers debating this much further.

Quoted this to agree with it but the reveal comes later

Wheeee

I’m kinda torn on this. If he has one 1x avoidance we could yeet him today and wolves take him out tonight.
If he’s wolf and an alpha that’s a different story.

I ****in love it

I don’t think role names will necessarily solve the game, but catching someone in a lie is great.

How did we decide that cubs was cult and not wolf again? Cyndia, can you expand a little more on what happened?

I can't really expand a whole lot right now, but all my info is essentially on the thread. I was told that cubs is capable of getting players to join his group, and that he is challenging to kill.

With shorty talking about an attempted recruitment, it confirmed my suspicions that the cubs info indicates he's a cult leader and not a wolf that's able to convert. April has also said she validated the line of reasoning that cubs is recruiting. Dina's info has only shown that he was lying about his role claim. So ultimately we don't know 100% for sure he's a wolf, but with all the talk of recruitment and joining his group, it really sounds more like cult talk than wolf conversions.

In terms of the hard to kill aspect - I suspect he has at least one death avoidance considering he tried to tell the thread he had a 1x yeet avoidance at close yesterday when it seemed like he had lost. I'm assuming he posted that thinking he needed to explain himself when he survived. I don't know if the challenging to kill means he has only one death avoidance, or two, or if it's night kills only, or if a strongarm needs to target him, or whatever, but I don't think a yeet will work on him today.

@Cyndia A yes or no question here: was it an item that helped you gain knowledge about Cubs?

I'd rather not answer that right now.

 

[alissa14]

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Behind and I just saw that you're a stump now too. Hi! Glad to have another frand!

But also why the heck is it just the three of us?

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Mods just said I’m a stump now and I said hooray bc it is ultimate role

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[kaydubs]

I am tallying.
i saw 3 votes - alley, April, and Sporty. Who’d I miss?

 

[Viscernable]

I strongly disagree. VV said there's a 3p GROUP out there, someone tried to convert shorty, and Cyndia said there's a cult like group out there. The obvious and reasonable conclusion is it's a cult, or something that functions exactly like it.
Anti-village, in any case, and anti-wolf as well. Also, I'm mainly talking to wolves when I say they should kill cubs; what made you feel the urge to respond here?

This reply is kinda stretchy

 

[Viscernable]

Yeah sorry I just realized that. I'm very tired.

Ah got it. Get some sleep pls

 

[Viscernable]

Yeet vis

I know you’re at your externship rn, but I’d appreciate it if you could answer Samac

What am I supposed to be answering her about?

 

[potentialsheltervet]

Ah got it. Get some sleep pls

WW >>>> sleep

 

[potentialsheltervet]

Also @Viscernable this is gonna sound crazy, but a role reveal before the end of the night would be a good idea.
Thanks.

@Viscernable This one?

 

[Viscernable]

It would not at all shock me if Paws and Cray are both wolfing given Cray suddenly decided to vote me after Paws did.

That… would surprise me as a w/w move

 

[Viscernable]

WW >>>> sleep

Everything >>> WW homework is how I’m feeling right now LMAO. Every time I sign up I forget I’m basically voluntarily illiterate

 

[potentialsheltervet]

That… would surprise me as a w/w move

I'm not ruling it out.

 

[potentialsheltervet]

Hmm... hmm... If there's in fact a cult out there, I know who the likely top convert choice would be.
Can someone please vig Cubs already? Lol. It's impossible not to talk about the apparent cult business but I also want to have a plan in action for yeeting wolves.

 

[SportPonies]

I'm not ruling it out.

if you're not gonna lightly rule out anything, how are you planning on narrowing down your POE?