Tulane vs. Louisville vs. EVMS vs. Temple

[ChalaHeadChala]

---

Members don't see this ad.

Accepted: Temple (Bethlehem program), Tulane, EVMS, Louisville

Waiting on many others, but as of now...

Just looking for some information that I don't have from current students, faculty, or other applicants.

 

[ChalaHeadChala]

Bueller...Bueller? The Great Depression. Anyone...anyone?

 

[TheMightySmiter]

Congrats on all the acceptances! Are you in-state in any of these places? If so, go to that one. Do you like warm weather? Then I'd stay south. Personally I'd choose Tulane because of the location and patient population, but I think it's the most expensive.

 

[ButterfingerBBs]

You need to post some more details here if you want to actually get information from people. Maybe post a few of your personal pros vs cons for each school and you might get some worthwhile information.

 

[PeterPesto]

Can't comment on Louisville and Eastern Virginia, but having interviewed at Tulane and Temple it all depends on whether you want to live in NOLA or Philly.

Also, Temple is more expensive if you are OOS, but not enough to make a difference, IMO. It takes a particular type to want to live in NOLA whereas Philly is similar to any other major metropolitan area. I think Temple and Tulane are roughly equally caliber schools as well...

 

[ChalaHeadChala]

You're all right.

Here is where I am now. I don't care about weather and other tertiary things like that.

Louisville - Pros
- Variety of hospitals to rotate at
- Great Children's Hospital (interested in Pediatrics at the moment)
- unique clinical opportunities (i.e. clinic for Hispanic population that work at Churchill Downs)
- Both rural and urban medical settings
- I like Louisville as a city
- Great research

Louisville - Cons
- The biggest: The merger that was not allowed to take place. The Governor did not allow UofL to merge with some of its major affiliates who are now controlled by Catholic Health Initiatives; I am very wary of hospitals that have religious affiliations. I agree with Beshear that the merger could possibly do more harm then good, but he also allowed UK to partner with Norton Healthcare, Kentucky's largest healthcare system, and one of Louisville's best hospitals. I am not concerned about sharing rotations with UK students, but during my time at UofL, I got the feeling that the two schools are EXTREMELY competitive, UK especially, and that kind of brinkmanship makes me nervous. And Beshear is a UK grad, who I'm sure is biased towards UK, after all, he is a politician.

Tulane - pros
- Quality of life for med students seems good
- Like Louisville, unique clinical opportunities (i.e. family medicine rotations in the bayou).
- Biggest: new UMC to be completed by my 4th year!
- rotations at LSU
- Very geared toward helping the underserved
- New Orleans is one of the best, if not the best, for working with underserved populations
- New Dean seems to know what he's doing

Tulane - cons
- No Charity Hospital
- Biggest (at least for me): Tulane Medical Center is a For-profit hospital, and they notoriously are not as efficient and do not provide as good of quality care as non-profit.
- New Orleans is very corrupt
- Facilities are lacking (But it's New Orleans)
(Out of curiosity, and I know this doesn't matter, but what was Tulane's ranking before Katrina?)

EVMS- pros
- Very community oriented
- Norfolk General is a great big hospital
- City is essentially immune to recessions due to the naval base
- Quality of life seems good (one of the best I saw)
- Nice facilities

EVMS - cons
- The name might keep me from getting some residencies
- kind of isolated; might not get as much exposure as Temple or Tulane.
- Not a lot of research going on

Temple (Bethlehem campus) - pros
- Awesome medical school building
- Underserved community
- Philly is a great city, and Bethlehem is a neat town with a great hospital.
- Interested in getting both a rural and an urban education
- Research powerhouse
- Anatomy lab is one of the best in the country
- CHOP takes from Temple

Temple - cons
- I am a little worried about being too isolated in Bethlehem. Even though I am able to do my elective rotations in Philly, I will be in Bethlehem 3 years. I'm just concerned about this. Does anyone have experience with rural programs? Do you feel walled off from the main campus?
- Upenn essentially controls Philly
- The Bethlehem campus is brand new and I can imagine that some of the kinks haven't been worked out.
- Not a great Peds rotation

Here are the schools I am waiting to hear back from: Ohio State, Indiana, Loyola, Georgetown, Cincinnati, Kentucky, Drexel (thinking of withdrawing here)

Any suggestions?

 

[Slack3r]

- Upenn essentially controls Philly

Not sure this is true...

 

[Brachyury]

Here's a ranking based on NIH research dollar$$$ for the 2011 fiscal year

Tulane: $71,100,000
Louisville: $52,600,000
Temple: $51,700,000
EVMS: $3,700,000 (this is not a typo)

 

[moodle]

Here's a ranking based on NIH research dollar$$$ for the 2011 fiscal year

Tulane: $71,100,000
Louisville: $52,600,000
Temple: $51,700,000
EVMS: $3,700,000 (this is not a typo)

Although EVMS doesn't get much research funding, it still is a great school. I wouldn't necessarily diss a school based on research alone (unless you're really interested in doing crazy research while in med school or are in an MD/PhD program)

just my $0.02

Many MD schools in the US are great institutions. Go in. Do well. Rock the boards.

 

[Slack3r]

Here's a ranking based on NIH research dollar$$$ for the 2011 fiscal year

Tulane: $71,100,000
Louisville: $52,600,000
Temple: $51,700,000
EVMS: $3,700,000 (this is not a typo)

Interesting, considering Temple is ranked much higher than Tulane and Louisville in the US News Research rankings.

 

[Brachyury]

Interesting, considering Temple is ranked much higher than Tulane and Louisville in the US News Research rankings.

The funding difference between temple and Louisville isn't that big, however, the research rankings use additional parameters to rank schools (ie selectivity, peer scoring, etc)

Tulane, like Penn State (as well as a few other institutions) does not participate in USNews, thus it isn't ranked

 

[ChalaHeadChala]

Do you mean that the medical school doesn't participate in US News. Because Tulane law and business are ranked.

 

[synesthete]

Tulane

 

[Brachyury]

Do you mean that the medical school doesn't participate in US News. Because Tulane law and business are ranked.

Why would I be talking about the law or business school? Yes, the med school does not participate in USNews

 

[Geekchick921]

Temple (Bethlehem campus) - pros
- Awesome medical school building
- Underserved community
- Philly is a great city, and Bethlehem is a neat town with a great hospital.
- Interested in getting both a rural and an urban education
- Research powerhouse
- Anatomy lab is one of the best in the country
- CHOP takes from Temple

Temple - cons
- I am a little worried about being too isolated in Bethlehem. Even though I am able to do my elective rotations in Philly, I will be in Bethlehem 3 years. I'm just concerned about this. Does anyone have experience with rural programs? Do you feel walled off from the main campus?
- Upenn essentially controls Philly
- The Bethlehem campus is brand new and I can imagine that some of the kinks haven't been worked out.
- Not a great Peds rotation

I can only speak about Temple. I am an MS-1 there and I'm really happy with it. I'm not in the St. Luke's program, though. You are right about all the pros. As for the cons... I would not call Bethlehem rural. It's a small city and you can get to Philly pretty quickly... about 90 minutes mostly on the NE extension of the turnpike. The rural campus is Danville. That's a small town in the middle of bum**** nowhere. I only know where it is because we drive past it on I-80 on the way to my in-laws, who live in west-central bum**** nowhere.

You mentioned CHOP. Are you interested in Peds? Temple is more affiliated with St. Chris but that hospital is nothing to sneeze at either, and some online residency interview reviews I've read in the past suggest the people at St. Chris are happier than the ones at CHOP (I have no idea why, though).

 

[ChalaHeadChala]

Here's a ranking based on NIH research dollar$$$ for the 2011 fiscal year

Tulane: $71,100,000
Louisville: $52,600,000
Temple: $51,700,000
EVMS: $3,700,000 (this is not a typo)

I think this is incorrect. Where did you get this info? Try looking here: http://www.brimr.org/NIH_Awards/NIH_Awards.htm

 

[Brachyury]

I think this is incorrect. Where did you get this info? Try looking here: http://www.brimr.org/NIH_Awards/NIH_Awards.htm

This link isn't accurate; use the 'NIH Report Data' directly from the NIH website http://report.nih.gov/

 

[themaplekind]

Louisville is the only school I can talk about, but i'll share my opinions anyway.

It really doesn't matter that the merger didn't take place. Louisville doesn't charge oos an outrageous sum to attend, which I like because it attracts more students from around the country instead of around the state like most state schools. Preparing students for the boards is an appropriate focus. It's not everything to the teachers, but they acknowledge the importance of those tests and structure their curriculum accordingly. They recognize med school is just another stepping stone for something farther down the road. Their clinical years are fantastic. They have an excellent reputation with residency programs because of their clinical years. If i remember right from their pre-orientation meeting, there are 7 student run clinics in the Louisville area. Plenty of shadowing opportunities with just about any doc in any of the surrounding hospitals. incredible mentoring from faculty and upperclassmen. many other reasons too. If you get in to UK don't go. They are changing their curriculum. it's for the better, but nobody wants to be someone's guinea pig.

 

[JohnGalt87]

Also, just to mention:

Temple just affiliated with Fox Chase Cancer Center, one of the best dual cancer research-hospitals in the country (with several top scientists and nobel laureates to its name). So the Temple research ranking and NIH$ will certainly jump in the next year or two. I think if you're interested in oncology or even oncology research it is something to consider at least. (e.g. TU epigenetics research team will rival UPenn's in just a few years)

 

[HandBanana1]

I'm a third year Tulane med student, and I'm going to address several of your points.

First, Charity hospital, the physical building, is no longer used, but even before Katrina, many of the services of Charity Hospital were moved to the more modern University Hospital down the street. By the time Katrina hit, Charity Hospital was almost empty since operations had moved to University. Currently,University Hospital is still open, and when the new University Hospital is finished in 2014, operations will be moved down the block to the new University Hospital. Just to recap: Charity Hospital = University Hospital = new University Hospital. Charity Hospital provided medical care to the indigent of New Orleans, when the building became too old, they built and moved the operation to a new hospital called University Hospital, and the new Universitywill house the same system. In 2012, and in 2014, students still see the same patients and still treat the same diseases; the only difference is that this happens at University not Charity (i.e. it's not accurate to say Charity Hospital no longer exists)

Tulane and LSU students rotate at Charity/University and the VA, however,only Tulane students rotate at Tulane's hospital. Tulane owns a stake of the hospital and HCA owns the rest. HCA may be for-profit, but the overwhelmingmajority of patients at TUMC are indigent patients. Tulane has a 150+ year history of serving the indigent population of New Orleans, whether at Charity/Universityor taking Medicaid and Medicare patients at TUMC (Medicaid in LA pays very,very poorly (yes, even compared to other states), so most hospitals and private physicians will not accept Medicaid patients). Tulane also operates permanent primary care clinics in the community that provide free or reduced care to community members. Tulane medical students also run their own free clinics, and there are numerous opportunities starting in your first year to start providing medical services to underserved communities in the city.

The last year Tulane participated in US News med school rankings was 2008,and it was ranked 55 http://web.archive.org/web/20080408034142/http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/grad/mdr/items/04042

I choose Tulane over several other schools because the students were,hands-down, the happiest I encountered out of all of my interviews. I was also attracted to NOLA because in the wake of Katrina, the city is turning around for the better, and it is so exciting to be a city that is alive and full o fenergy (if you've ever been to Berlin or Warsaw, you know what I mean). From top-to-bottom, Tulane emphasizes public service and social justice, and it does an excellent job of selecting students who share their vision. Finally, a large portion of my classmates are doing the MD, MPH program, and if you are interested in earning an MPH, Tulane has one of the best schools of public health.

Good luck with your decision

 

[ChalaHeadChala]

I'm a third year Tulane med student, and I'm going to address several of your points.

First, Charity hospital, the physical building, is no longer used, but even before Katrina, many of the services of Charity Hospital were moved to the more modern University Hospital down the street. By the time Katrina hit, Charity Hospital was almost empty since operations had moved to University. Currently,University Hospital is still open, and when the new University Hospital is finished in 2014, operations will be moved down the block to the new University Hospital. Just to recap: Charity Hospital = University Hospital = new University Hospital. Charity Hospital provided medical care to the indigent of New Orleans, when the building became too old, they built and moved the operation to a new hospital called University Hospital, and the new Universitywill house the same system. In 2012, and in 2014, students still see the same patients and still treat the same diseases; the only difference is that this happens at University not Charity (i.e. it’s not accurate to say Charity Hospital no longer exists)

Tulane and LSU students rotate at Charity/University and the VA, however,only Tulane students rotate at Tulane’s hospital. Tulane owns a stake of the hospital and HCA owns the rest. HCA may be for-profit, but the overwhelmingmajority of patients at TUMC are indigent patients. Tulane has a 150+ year history of serving the indigent population of New Orleans, whether at Charity/Universityor taking Medicaid and Medicare patients at TUMC (Medicaid in LA pays very,very poorly (yes, even compared to other states), so most hospitals and private physicians will not accept Medicaid patients). Tulane also operates permanent primary care clinics in the community that provide free or reduced care to community members. Tulane medical students also run their own free clinics, and there are numerous opportunities starting in your first year to start providing medical services to underserved communities in the city.

The last year Tulane participated in US News med school rankings was 2008,and it was ranked 55 http://web.archive.org/web/20080408034142/http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/grad/mdr/items/04042

I choose Tulane over several other schools because the students were,hands-down, the happiest I encountered out of all of my interviews. I was also attracted to NOLA because in the wake of Katrina, the city is turning around for the better, and it is so exciting to be a city that is alive and full o fenergy (if you’ve ever been to Berlin or Warsaw, you know what I mean). From top-to-bottom, Tulane emphasizes public service and social justice, and it does an excellent job of selecting students who share their vision. Finally, a large portion of my classmates are doing the MD, MPH program, and if you are interested in earning an MPH, Tulane has one of the best schools of public health.

Good luck with your decision

I agree about New Orleans; it definitely seemed to have a very vibrant community, and I certainly was not saying that the lack of Charity meant that the diversity of the patient population would decrease. As someone who is looking to work in a disadvantaged part of the world, NOLA is a fantastic place to start learning.

Do you know why Tulane stopped participating in US News? And the new UMC will be completed in 2014, but it won't be ready for rotations/operation until 2015, is that correct? And lastly, I heard some of the Family Medicine rotations are completed in Northern LA (in the bayous). Do you have any experience with those? Thanks for the info, it was extremely helpful. If I am able to rotate at the new UMC, it would be a huge pro for going to Tulane.

 

[HolySmokes]

Here is where I am now. I don't care about weather and other tertiary things like that.


Louisville - Cons
- The biggest: The merger that was not allowed to take place. The Governor did not allow UofL to merge with some of its major affiliates who are now controlled by Catholic Health Initiatives; I am very wary of hospitals that have religious affiliations. I agree with Beshear that the merger could possibly do more harm then good, but he also allowed UK to partner with Norton Healthcare, Kentucky's largest healthcare system, and one of Louisville's best hospitals. I am not concerned about sharing rotations with UK students, but during my time at UofL, I got the feeling that the two schools are EXTREMELY competitive, UK especially, and that kind of brinkmanship makes me nervous. And Beshear is a UK grad, who I'm sure is biased towards UK, after all, he is a

 

[HandBanana1]

I agree about New Orleans; it definitely seemed to have a very vibrant community, and I certainly was not saying that the lack of Charity meant that the diversity of the patient population would decrease. As someone who is looking to work in a disadvantaged part of the world, NOLA is a fantastic place to start learning.

Do you know why Tulane stopped participating in US News? And the new UMC will be completed in 2014, but it won't be ready for rotations/operation until 2015, is that correct? And lastly, I heard some of the Family Medicine rotations are completed in Northern LA (in the bayous). Do you have any experience with those? Thanks for the info, it was extremely helpful. If I am able to rotate at the new UMC, it would be a huge pro for going to Tulane.

I'll first say that I don't know why Tulane does not participate in US News; I think this was a decision by the current dean (he's a wonderful man). Since 2008, Tulane has seen an increase in NIH and non-NIH funding, new residencies, an increase in applications to the school, as well as an increase in the average MCAT and GPA of entering students. Point is, if Tulane did participate, it would do as well as it did in 2008 if not slightly better.

For the family practice rotation, T3s do it in rural Louisiana one-on-one with a preceptor for 6 weeks. All other rotations are done in New Orleans with the traditional attendings-residents-medical students model. However, some students (i.e. people with kids or other circumstances) are able to do their family practice rotation in New Orleans. Tulane also has two optional tracks: one is in Baton Rouge (the LEAD program), and it allows students to have more one-on-one interaction with attendings and have more 'continuous care' of patients. The other track is the TRuMed, which is aimed primarily at people interested in primary care, where you live in a rural town during your third year, and you set your own schedule to work with local physicians. No one is forces into either of these tracks; entering these tracks is entirely voluntary.

The new VA hospital and new Charity are both schedule to open in late 2014, and since both the VA and current University already have staff (although the number of staff, beds, and residencies will increase), rotations will be starting shortly after the buildings are completed and open.

 

[Dr McSexy]

The new VA hospital and new Charity are both schedule to open in late 2014, and since both the VA and current University already have staff (although the number of staff, beds, and residencies will increase), rotations will be starting shortly after the buildings are completed and open.

Scheduled has been delayed to early 2015. They had issues with moving a historical school building and thus weren't able to drive some of the pilings for the foundation until just recently, which set them back on the time line a couple of months.

Just wanted to chime in on that.

 

[makauzi]

my 2 cents, do not worry too much about rankings or research (EVMS), you can always do your research somewhere else if your school does not have the type of research you want. Choose a school based on the one that will give you the best resources and environment to pass step 1. Personally, I love EVMS even though they I am OOS and they do not have research, and if I can get off that damn waitlist into the acceptance pile, I would really have to reconsider my other options.