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Anyone get any calls? I can't handle this tension every week!
2011-2012 Michigan State Application Thread
- Thread starter Sammich117
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Do we need to update MSU with the fall of 2011 grades?
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No call here either. Interviewed 11-10 in GR. 🙁
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interviewed 11/3...
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I just got an email that I was placed on the alternate list. I interviewed 11/3. The email states that alternate files are not reviewed until May 15th, so there is a lot more waiting in my future! I'm certainly glad I was not rejected, but I am still hoping to get accepted.
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by alternate do you mean the waitlist or the ABLE program?
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The waitlist.
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Keep your chin up! This is not a reflection of how likely you are to succeed at CHM. I was accepted off of the alternate list and at first I had a bit of an inferiority complex. However, I studied hard and was very successful this semester.
If you REALLY want to be at CHM, make sure the admissions committee knows it. Send update letters or a letter of interest/intent. Some applicants told me I was overzealous last year but it worked out for me. If you have any questions feel free to message me. I recently posted copies of both my update letters on my mdapps.
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no news for me. so I guess the next notification date is January 18th
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Thanks for posting those letters on MDapps. As soon as I received their e-mail, I immediately started thinking about writing my own letter of intent. CHM is my first choice, so I'm sure it won't be hard to express my interest in attending. My biggest concern is that I will start school at MSUCOM before hearing anything back from CHM. They say they accept students from the alternate list as late as the first week of class (which is after the 1st semester at COM has already ended). Luckily, I will be able to get a place set up in E. Lansing anyway and find daycare for my daughter. If I get accepted up until the COM start date, it would be an easy switch. Although, I really wanted to go to GR because my daughter's father lives in Kalamazoo. Ahh, I wish I could just know now!
Good luck to everyone else still waiting to hear back!
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Just got the same thing this morning. I don't think it's a complete rejection, more like a wait list to be interviewed. I'm not expecting too much. I'm also oos and complete end of sept.
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Thanks for posting those letters on MDapps. As soon as I received their e-mail, I immediately started thinking about writing my own letter of intent. CHM is my first choice, so I'm sure it won't be hard to express my interest in attending. My biggest concern is that I will start school at MSUCOM before hearing anything back from CHM. They say they accept students from the alternate list as late as the first week of class (which is after the 1st semester at COM has already ended). Luckily, I will be able to get a place set up in E. Lansing anyway and find daycare for my daughter. If I get accepted up until the COM start date, it would be an easy switch. Although, I really wanted to go to GR because my daughter's father lives in Kalamazoo. Ahh, I wish I could just know now!
Good luck to everyone else still waiting to hear back!
I say take the COM admission and run with it! I have children too, though, so I totally value what you're saying about your daughter's father and the drive to Kzoo. Could you defer your COM admission? Just a thought. Best of luck though! Keep us posted.
Not sure about the hold for interview decision....wish I could offer something there.
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Thanks for the suggestion. I could defer, but I would much rather earn one more year of a physician's salary than wait another year and play the application game again.
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Ah! I'm wondering the same about me (11-10). Should we call and check in? If they are a hung committee about me, I don't want to rush them KWIM?
hey man good luck with the rest of the app. hopefully they review our apps again in Feb and give us interviews.
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Thanks for posting those letters on MDapps. As soon as I received their e-mail, I immediately started thinking about writing my own letter of intent. CHM is my first choice, so I'm sure it won't be hard to express my interest in attending. My biggest concern is that I will start school at MSUCOM before hearing anything back from CHM. They say they accept students from the alternate list as late as the first week of class (which is after the 1st semester at COM has already ended). Luckily, I will be able to get a place set up in E. Lansing anyway and find daycare for my daughter. If I get accepted up until the COM start date, it would be an easy switch. Although, I really wanted to go to GR because my daughter's father lives in Kalamazoo. Ahh, I wish I could just know now!
Good luck to everyone else still waiting to hear back!
I was in the exact same boat as you! To throw another wrench in the mix, I graduated June 17 and COM started classes June 22. I was planning to go to COM in east lansing, but just kept holding off on housing because I REALLY wanted CHM... and my dream was CHM in grand rapids. Final exams were definitely stressful but as I was studying in the nerd cave (errrr, quiet study room) last week, looking out over downtown GR, I still wanted to pinch myself, like is this real? How blessed am I?
Anyways, best wishes! According to SDN, alternate list movement is decent, however I can count on one hand the number of my classmates whom I know were also accepted off the alternate list. So my experience differs from SDN rumors. Just make sure the admissions committee knows why you are a good fit. Another recommendation letter won't hurt either.
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Congratulations!!! When did u find out?
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is it wise to send letters of interest/update letters if you have interviewed (11/3) and simply haven't heard any news yet?
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I was thinking something similar. I interviewed 11/10.
They say that if you haven't heard anything, it's just because they haven't reviewed your application yet. So apparently no update is completely neutral and you shouldn't be worried because of that. I mean, you could have a 45T 4.0, but if the committee hasn't reviewed your app yet, then they can't accept you.
That being said, a letter of interest could still help. But you should contact the admissions office regarding IF they accept letters of interest
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CHM also does interviews at the Marquette campus for applicants in the UP. I went to MTU for undergrad and CHM does a really nice presentation every year for the premeds there about the med school and emphasizing the Rural Physician Program.
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Late March. Sorry for late reply!
Good luck, MWB. To anyone else that is interviewing much later like I did, I actually interviewed on March 24th, and was sure I was destined for the alternate list, but I (and quite a few others) ended up getting a call that I was accepted at the next notification date in Mid-April!
Edited to add that I was also put on pre-interview hold in Oct. prior to me getting the invite in Feb., so hang in there you all!
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This is the first I've heard of someone getting pulled of the pre-interview hold list. Thanks for sharing - keeps my hopes up!! 🙂
Mind if I ask what your stats were?
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Hi all. I'm a current second year in the MD/PhD program. Just dropping by to wish everyone luck. Also, congrats to those who've been accepted! I'm happy to answer any questions about research, being married in med school, or anything else.
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Just received the hold email pre-interview as well, now for the wait
OOS , complete November
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So if I wanted to swing by the GR campus again, would one of the current students let me follow them around to lecture and stuff? I didn't really expect to be accepted to multiple schools, so I'm trying to get the best feel for each that I can 🙂
Congrats to those recently accepted and good luck to those waiting to hear!
Congrats to those recently accepted and good luck to those waiting to hear!
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Congrats on the multiple acceptances! I'd let you come along with me, but I watch almost all lectures online - and it's one of the reasons I love CHM (they really allow you to dictate your own learning experience). I think it's a good idea to check out schools the way you want to, but mostly so that you can get a better grasp on what almost all med students will say: most schools are pretty similar education-wise, pre-meds don't put enough emphasis on the 2nd half of their education when deciding about schools (i.e. the clinical learning scenarios), and one of the biggest factors that should play into your decision is whether you'll be happy in the location/atmosphere.
I heard that so many times while on the interview trail, but never really paid that much attention to it. Think about it, though, is your happiness and future success going to be drastically different if school x teaches you this material in this way and school y doesn't? Probably not, unless that teaching style is forced on you (i.e. you are required to attend lecture for 8 hours a day). The thing with med school is that it is very much up to you, all your learning is your own responsibility. There can only be so much spin on how to learn how the immune system functions.
What's probably more different between schools are the hospitals. Some schools have one university hospital, so you get one patient population and service style. CHM has many, many hospitals. Even on one campus (GR) there are at least two major hospital affiliations with two VERY different patient populations (more traditional county-like hospital and fancy bells and whistles), plus tons of clinics across West Michigan (from urban to rural, yes there are rural opportunities on the GR campus). And I don't know of many schools that have hospitals like the ones in Midland or Traverse City, much less Marquette.
Long story short, I chose CHM because it offered freedom to learn medicine how I wanted to, and I really agree with the "in the community" approach to clinical care. I didn't choose CHM because lecturer number 3 of the 6 or so that teach physiology used x and y to teach me z, especially since 90% of my experience learning z happens outside of lecture, using textbooks or the university provided course pack (it's like an in-house textbook of lecture notes and slides that is used for lectures and is given to you). Does that make sense? Hopefully that perspective might help guide you in your decision, and you really should follow your heart when deciding what school to choose. In the end, you're still going to become a doctor and you're still going to slave away to do that. Go where your heart is.
EDIT: If you're looking for things that separate CHM apart from the others in the first two years, I'd point to the clinical training. We've already had a number of patient interviews, are learning the physical exam now (I'm a first year), and starting a months long relationship with a single patient through two person team visits to that patient's home. CHM tries to address what it means to be a physician as a whole, just as they try to understand patient's as a whole. If you're looking for the details about curriculum style: the first year is mostly traditional lecture style in and integrated and mostly systems based format (meaning that all the different classes you take at once are basically all on the same topic at the same time, within reason, and that those topics try to follow an organ system based approach when possible because you can only do so much of that in basic sciences without distorting the information). For the second year it is much more PBL and system focused. Overall I'd say CHM has a good balance on curriculum, not leaning one way or the other too hard.
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I have a few questions about CHM that I wasn't able to get completely answered on my interview, so if any current students (or anyone in the know) can answer any or all of these I would really appreciate it.
1) Years 3 and 4: How is the quality of the rotation sites? The 4th year schedule they gave us is a little confusing, could you comment on the schedule and structure of the courses in year 4? Do students have flexibility in choosing what they want their electives to be and where they get to do them? Do students get a lot of responsibility, or are they bombarded with scut work?
2) Years 1 and 2 (Acoustic did a great job addressing this above but any other insight is welcomed): Do you like how the curriculum is structured? Do you feel like taking anatomy by prosections was a major disadvantage or extremely difficult (I am especially concerned about this as I have not taken anatomy before)? Do you feel like it is organized or do you feel like the content is all over the place and does not flow well? Do you feel like the schedule permits you to have enough free time to enjoy other hobbies?
3) Are you close with your other classmates? Do you spend a lot of time with them and help eachother out? Do you guys do non-school things with eachother (go out, play sports, etc.)? And finally, are you ultimately happy with your decision to attend CHM?
Again, I know there is a bunch of questions there so you don't have to answer them all. Unless of course you want to 😀. Thank you!
1) Years 3 and 4: How is the quality of the rotation sites? The 4th year schedule they gave us is a little confusing, could you comment on the schedule and structure of the courses in year 4? Do students have flexibility in choosing what they want their electives to be and where they get to do them? Do students get a lot of responsibility, or are they bombarded with scut work?
2) Years 1 and 2 (Acoustic did a great job addressing this above but any other insight is welcomed): Do you like how the curriculum is structured? Do you feel like taking anatomy by prosections was a major disadvantage or extremely difficult (I am especially concerned about this as I have not taken anatomy before)? Do you feel like it is organized or do you feel like the content is all over the place and does not flow well? Do you feel like the schedule permits you to have enough free time to enjoy other hobbies?
3) Are you close with your other classmates? Do you spend a lot of time with them and help eachother out? Do you guys do non-school things with eachother (go out, play sports, etc.)? And finally, are you ultimately happy with your decision to attend CHM?
Again, I know there is a bunch of questions there so you don't have to answer them all. Unless of course you want to 😀. Thank you!
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Here's a shot at it:
1) There are a million different ways of interpreting what "quality" means. For some people, it's the chance to be in a research/academic hospital that offers cutting edge treatments on super specialized cases. For others, it's working in an environment where you're the only learner so that you get to do a TON of procedures and work one-on-one with attendings. CHM has both, and everywhere in between. So I'd say CHM has very high quality sites based simply on the notion that it offers such diverse learning scenarios. Add into it that CHM attracts physicians and students that genuinely care about each other, and aren't always looking to stomp out the other guy and maintain the hierarchical history of medicine, and you get an even better learning experience. If you ask a faculty member about the clinical training at CHM, I can almost guarantee you that they will mention how students that graduate from here often get noticed as considerably better clinically during residency than their peers. Of course, all this means nothing if you won't be happy in the type of scenarios that CHM has to offer, as with any school, I just happen to feel that they uniquely have just about everything under the sun.
2) I LOVE how the curriculum is structured and have only very minor gripes. Mostly that sometimes the lecture material can be confusing. We go through a lot of lecturers (I think there is slated to be 6 or so for physiology alone this semester), so it takes some getting used to when adjusting to the different lecture notes styles (i.e. the course pack varies from all slides to a narrative style etc.). This is only minor though. Individual lectures can sometimes be disorganized (it would be weird if that didn't happen) but as a whole the curriculum can be described best as "integrated". As I mentioned earlier, the different classes you take all try to follow the same subject, so much so that it's easy to forget if you learned about topic x in class y or class z, because they all blend together very well. The school gives you all the paper lecture notes up front and electronic versions as well (for quick searching), so they make it as clear as possible for knowing what it is you need to know. Of course nothing is perfect, but they do a fine job at it.
I cannot stress enough how pivotal it was for my experience in anatomy to have prosection. I couldn't handle dissection. Here's why. In dissection you have to spend hours and hours and hours and hours cutting through fascia just trying to find this one thing that you will probably accidentally cut or throw away and be super frustrated that you can't find it. And for what? So you can have a theoretically more "hands on" experience? You save a lot of time if you look at and manipulate professionally prosected samples that display the structure in a way that is easy to learn. You'll get it when you take anatomy, but if you're super hung up on wanting the experience of dissecting, a dissection lab is offered after your first year. I would say that the strong consensus amongst many med students I've talked to is that dissection is outdated and unnecessary.
You're not going to have much free time in med school no matter where you go. They say to expect to work 60-80 hours a week, but its more like an average of 80. That's just how it is. Given that, CHM has BARELY any required events, and lectures are all online, so they make it as easy as possible for you to utilize your time how you see fit. This is crucial, because med school is all about making things happen how you work best, which you have the freedom to do if you aren't stuck in mandatory lectures all day. The first semester we maybe had an average of maybe 10 required hours a week, and this semester we have maybe an average of 5. That's a lot of time outside class, and if you work hard, you can certainly find time for outside activities. But it will be hard to do this no matter where you go, because there are only so many hours left after an 80 hour week.
3) The school and the students are very much a cohesive and functional group. There is no competition and there is a great sense of community amongst the students. So yes, I'd say that most students are close with each other, especially given the relatively small class size (100 at each preclinical campus). Like with above, you only get so much time to do stuff that isn't related to med school, and even then the topic often turns to med school anyway haha. To answer what I think you're asking: you will find a strong sense of community and togetherness at CHM, which is helped by the class size and true pass or fail grading.
I couldn't be happier with my school choice (why else would I write this super long post about it haha), but that doesn't mean it's for everyone. Most of the things I wrote above may mean nothing to you, and more importantly, they may not impact your happiness at all. You need to be happy where you go, because nothing else really makes that much of a difference in the end.
Let me know if you have any other specific questions, and good luck!
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1) For the most part, the clinical rotations are excellent. I've heard positive things about all of the campuses, but I know the most about my husband's campus. He's a 4th year and he's been very pleased with his experience. He's met some great clinical mentors. Everyone seems to put a lot of effort into teaching. He's gotten to do first assist on surgeries, collaborate on treatment plans, etc. The "scut" seems to be kept to a minimum... he does documentation on his assigned patients, but I don't consider that to be busywork- it's part of the learning process. As one might expect, he's encountered a few logistical issues here and there, but they've been minor (e.g., scheduling issues). He's had a wide array of electives to choose from. Even with a rotation-off for residency interviews, he's had at least 5 elective slots (I think, though the exact number varies by campus anyway). Many students do international rotations, sub-Is, etc. My husband did a sub-I in his intended field and loved it.
2) I generally agree with Acoustic on all of this. A few points of emphasis... a) We get exceptional training in clinical skills and patient interaction. There's a real sense of pride in both the art and science of medicine here. I'd give examples to make that sound less cliche, but I don't want to ruin it for you. You'll just have to trust me 🙂 b) Prosection is a huge advantage IMO. You can spend your time learning the material instead of cutting. If you're inclined, there's a dissection elective. It's pretty intensive and involves lots of one on one time with the Anatomy faculty. c) The CHM supports its students. I wanted to do an MD/PhD combination that had never been done before. Once I made my case, they were 100% behind me. That says it all for me... They're flexible (within reason) and invested in you as a person/ future clinician.
3) I'm not the best person to ask about this one... the MD/PhDs are split across classes, so we have less of a cohesive class culture than the regular MDs. Everything Acoustic said seems representative of the two classes I've seen.
I hope that helps. Feel free to ask more questions.
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The clinical campus selection process occurs at the end of first year. I'm not sure on the specifics (because all MD/PhDs go to the same place), but I know that you can put in special requests based on family, research, etc. Everyone else submits a preference list. Switching is possible but unlikely once you've been assigned (i.e., you need a very compelling reason).
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Yep. You have ample time to check out the clinical campuses, and there is at least one day where all the campus deans come and give presentations about the different sites. Again, it's mostly up to what will make you happy (i.e. large academic/urban vs. smaller community hospital, and everywhere in between).
For preclinical campuses, you only get a preference if you're not MD/PhD like hoya, since all the PhD stuff is on the main campus in EL. For just MD, you do get to cite reasons for staying in one location or another, but those are mostly related to family (i.e. children in a school, partner at a local college or in a secure job). You state your preference, and are assigned accordingly in May I believe. In general, it has been more difficult to be assigned to GR, but this is probably because the building is like 2 years old. This can extend to people you just deem "domestic partners", so you can just be living together and not even married. They're lenient, within reason so as not to promote people coming up with crazy connections. This can even apply to theoretical reasons to go to one place or another, but bears less weight than the other more concrete reasons. For instance, saying "GR would be really great for my partner because it is more likely to have this type of job opportunity". They really try to work to make you as happy as you can be, in all aspects of your life as a med student.
Switching is probably not very likely, although I know of a few people who were admitted off the waitlist in summer who were then on the waitlist for GR, and were eventually placed in GR.
All that being said, there really isn't that much of a difference between the two sites. The building is a little different, but that doesn't matter after you get over the initial adjustment (so a few weeks). The cities are different, but not drastically so. More lectures seem to originate from EL, but that will also probably not matter to you. The biggest differences come from the clinical years, and there isn't much of a difference in the preclinical ones.
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Just to be clear, I was referring to clinical campus selection (hence, choosing at the end of first year). I believe that Acoustic is talking about preclinical campus selection (EL or GR). The process is similar between the two, but the timing and rationale are quite different.
EDIT: I now realize that the question was actually about preclinical... my bad. Sorry for any confusion.
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Thanks!!
Do you think "I've already signed a lease in East Lansing" suffice ? True story...
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so everyone ready for another stressful day of staring at the phone?
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It appears from your previous posts that you interviewed in november, and that they do necessarily let you know the following "release date" if you have been accepted? That is scary because I foolishly assumed they let you know the following "release date" Do you mind posting /PMing me your stats? I'm interviewing shortly, and am petrified. Also, did you ask them/ do they tell you when they will let an applicant will get accepted after interviewing?
On a separate note, I may be acting very sensitive but do you think if i wear glasses to the interview I will appear smarter? Same thing with cuff-links and a watch? Will i come off as a person just interested in the "money"
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I actually thought about the same thing. I kept the glasses and watch but went out last minute and bought a high quality shirt I didn't need cuff links for, thought they may come off wrong. In hind sight, I doubt it mattered. I did get accepted everywhere I interviewed.
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I probably have better insight into your second and third question so I will answer those.
2) I love our curriculum. Prosection was great because I spent less than 2 hours per week in lab and essentially slept with my Rohen anatomy atlas instead. I'm a spatial learner and didn't need a lot of time with the bodies to learn the anatomy. I did very well in the course and saved a ton of time. I used those extra hours to actually sit down and study, go to the gym, volunteer and relax. I spoke with some friends at wayne over break and they said they spent at least 8 hours (some weeks more) in the anatomy lab.
I have also discovered that I learn best on my own. Therefore I usually come to school and study on my own in the morning, cruise through the lectures on double speed in the afternoon, then study more after that. However, there are plenty of people who still attend lectures every morning. I really really REALLY appreciate the flexibility our schedule provides.
We have a lot of different lecturers and they all have different lecture and course pack styles. I have gotten used to this. Our curriculum is rather cohesive and I really appreciate this fact. For example, right now immunology and physiology are hugely overlapping (immune system and lymphatic system). Our classes are not perfect, but they are pretty good.
3) I get along with nearly everyone in our class. The second year students are really awesome too. About 1/4 of our class are members at the local ymca a mile from school and we take classes together. This sunday I went to yoga with some male classmates and a huge group of us usually do zumba at least once per week. A small group of us play ultimate frisbee every week. Of course not everyone will get along and our class has definitely split into friend groups at this point. We make time to go out, eat together etc. when our schedule isn't too crazy.
CHM is a great fit for me and I'm very happy here. Medical school is exhausting in many ways, but it's doable with a great administration and wonderful classmates who support you. I love CHM, no joke.
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any calls yet?
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