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Lol I went and spoke with some people about the shortcomings in my application and all they said was there were a lot of competitive applications and it’s not that “my application was weak”. Idk how to take that.

My school’s CTE deadline is July 1st sooooo we will see.

Yeah it’s like what do they expect you to do to fix that... somehow get rid of all the other competitive applicants? Hahaahah... haha.. ha

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One of the challenges of providing useful feedback (besides litigation) is that the committee vote as well as their conversation is confidential.
What passes for feedback tends to therefore be vague generalizations that do not distinguish the waitlisted applicant from the accepted.
No feedback is realistically quite similar to useless feedback.

I respect that the conversation has to be largely confidential. But I do not see the harm in admissions officers, for example, paraphrasing 1 or 2 reasons why I was not good enough to be accepted (e.g. recommending more volunteering, retaking the MCAT, etc.)--they can, of course, add a disclaimer that says that addressing our app deficits is no guarantee of admission in the following cycle. To protect themselves. What is wrong with that? I do not see the need for this AMOUNT secrecy
 
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Yeah it’s like what do they expect you to do to fix that... somehow get rid of all the other competitive applicants? Hahaahah... haha.. ha
Conspiracy theory: They give us ****ty or no feedback not for confidentiality reasons but so we keep reapplying and they collect that secondary $$$... LOL.

Or maybe it's not conspiracy... maybe it's real...
 
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I respect that the conversation has to be largely confidential. But I do not see the harm in admissions officers, for example, paraphrasing 1 or 2 reasons why I was not good enough to be accepted (e.g. recommending more volunteering, retaking the MCAT, etc.)--they can, of course, add a disclaimer that says that addressing our app deficits is no guarantee of admission in the following cycle. To protect themselves. What is wrong with that? I do not see the need for this AMOUNT secrecy
Sadly, disclaimers do not reduce litigation.
It is considered a best practice for admissions officers not to be present for the meeting (unless their presence is required for a point of clarification). Thus, committee discussion cannot be paraphrased.
 
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Conspiracy theory: They give us ****ty or no feedback not for confidentiality reasons but so we keep reapplying and they collect that secondary $$$... LOL.
Committee members volunteer their time.
 
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Does this school offer post-interview feedback? Mine does not... so I will never know why I was WLed. I flew across the country for this i terview. It is a crime to me that they can't give me 15 minutes of feedback, frankly
Actually I'm not sure, I'll find out. Thing is I've already gotten feedback from many sources.
 
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One of the interviewers at this one school straight up said I interviewed really well and was very much impressed by me. I’ve been on the waitlist since October.

Lol I got handed their business card and I didn’t even ask for it to keep in touch for research related matters. But got waitlisted since October lol. Weirdest thing
 
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The feedback I received was very vague. And when I said things in my app that I thought were weak it was either that is fine (in terms of mcat/gpa) or super vague. If you are looking for actions to take, you probably aren't gonna get anything.

I received feedback from one of the school's that rejected me post-interview. They were like you can improve by volunteering in underserved areas and add more clinical experience. Funny thing is I sent an update letter highlighting these experiences because I already saw this was a weakness on my app. Now I'm sure they didn't check out my update letter at all.
 
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Btw, 2 people have withdrawn from my WL school over the past week because they were accepted off the waitlist somewhere else which leaves me to assume my WL school now has vacancies and will accept some and so on. It’s a slow domino effect but movement is indeed happening
 
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Committee members volunteer their time.
For clarification, I mean that there is no monetary insentive for schools in general to release paraphrased application tips from adcom members. I know that adcom members do not benefit financially from the app cycle.

But lack of transparency could cause adcoms to lose out on future cycles. For example, I am applying EDP this cycle because 1 school I applied to last cycle encouraged me to do so, saying I have a strong chance at interviewing and becoming accepted. Was I really close at getting accepted at my other waitlist schools?? Should I therefore apply to them again? No idea. If they might want to accept me this cycle, they lose out. I am applying to that 1 school as EDP. I need some idea of where I stand
 
Lol I got handed their business card and I didn’t even ask for it to keep in touch for research related matters. But got waitlisted since October lol. Weirdest thing
I got a business card from the faculty interviewer who really liked me too. I was tempted to email her to ask if I can do anything to get off the WL... lol. But I do not want to waste her time, and she probably can't do anything anyway. She is not an adcom, and our fates are in the adcom's hands.
 
But lack of transparency could cause adcoms to lose out on future cycles. For example, I am applying EDP this cycle because 1 school I applied to last cycle encouraged me to do so, saying I have a strong chance at interviewing and becoming accepted. Was I really close at getting accepted at my other waitlist schools?? Should I therefore apply to them again? No idea. If they might want to accept me this cycle, they lose out. I am applying to that 1 school as EDP. I need some idea of where I stand
I can understand your frustration.
 
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Btw, 2 people have withdrawn from my WL school over the past week because they were accepted off the waitlist somewhere else which leaves me to assume my WL school now has vacancies and will accept some and so on. It’s a slow domino effect but movement is indeed happening
Has WL movement started at your desired school?
 
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Has WL movement started at your desired school?

Yes that is my desired WL school that I’m talking about. It doesn’t look like they’ve replaced the empty seats yet. But they’ve accepted a couple earlier in May. they told us earlier they will email us in June (a second time) to ask if we are still interested. My other WL has been having decent movement may be because they enforced the rules by the letter.
 
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It doesn’t look like they’ve replaced the empty seats yet. But they’ve accepted a couple earlier in May.
As long as they have depleted the surplus seats from the original acceptance phase, there should be continued movement.
 
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As long as they have depleted the surplus seats from original acceptance phase, there should be continued movement.
This is my biggest fear for my school. What if they’ve depleted all the surplus seats and now only a few seats are up for grabs... It’s so scary to think about.
 
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How do students get involved in the admissions process? Sorry if I'm off topic.
It varies by school. Some schools have student interviewers and committee members. Others only have interviewers. Others have little student involvement. Student involvement is not required by the LCME.
 
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I see, I'm at LA Fitness. All the girls wear headphones, so I take that as a sign they dont want to be bothered.
i do this all the time, - at work too :))) hahahha. If i do not want to be talked to, i put in my headphones (SILENT headphones), and nod my head once in a while, pretending to be listening to stuff... hahaha. no wonder i have only 2 friends :) introvert
 
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class starts in 2.5 weeks and I’m still on WL. Clinging on to the threads of fate.
 
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I was wondering why my waitlist anxiety gets worse at night, I truly understand now


267758
 
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Irrespective of its configuration, the interview process with one or two interviewers is inane, fraught with bias. It is an indefensible process. Should be stopped and replaced by MMIs.
Heading that direction. A few of the schools I interviewed at provided us with surveys asking if the MMI format would work better for their school.
 
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Irrespective of its configuration, the interview process with one or two interviewers is inane, fraught with bias. It is an indefensible process. Should be stopped and replaced by MMIs.

MMI is literally one of the dumbest things I’ve ever had to do, especially having the perspective of being on the other side of interviews. At least in traditional interviews, there is a chance for the interviewer to get to know a candidate and vice versa. In my opinion, the MMI quick question format has a greater likelihood of being gamed by the most savvy interviewers than actually revealing a candidate's true character or skill set. To think you can judge someone's teamwork ability just by asking about a teamwork-related scenario...ridiculous. You'll get a better sense from the answer to "how many years have you played a team sport."

If the goal is to have multiple data points, host an interview panel (or 2 separate panels) where multiple interviewers listen to and rate answers to the same questions.

In MMI, you are probably more likely to lose out if you mess up a question (especially where a single low mark might be considered a "ding"), because you don't have the chance to make up for it with a given interviewer.

The ideal interview format would be an active one, where you are being judged on your actions rather than ability to B.S., and where the scenario does not necessitate medical knowledge. Unfortunately, this is also difficult to implement
 
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Irrespective of its configuration, the interview process with one or two interviewers is inane, fraught with bias. It is an indefensible process. Should be stopped and replaced by MMIs.
While I would like to agree, the interview is but a portion of the larger picture. You could argue almost every stage of the medical school process has bias.. literally from the beginning. A few people had to see you on paper and like you for some reason! At the end of the day, an entire committee of ADCOMs vote on you. An average interview without red flags would not be the reason you wouldn't get admitted whether it was an MMI or not. It's the collective of information and how you presented yourself in your entire app. Do you fit the mission of the school? Have the stats? Carried yourself well on interview day? EDIT: I don't mean "you" singling you out, but generally.

FYI, I asked for interview feedback from a school that I was waitlisted at to see if I needed to work on it. I actually was told my interview was above average, yet I was still put on the WL for months [ultimately accepted though].

While I agree that interviews with 1-2 people are filled with bias, that's the way of the world. Most jobs have a single, make or break, interview! I'd much rather have 2 30 minute interviews with faculty where I can connect with them than short convoluted stations in MMI [personal opinion].
 
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While I would like to agree, the interview is but a portion of the larger picture. You could argue almost every stage of the medical school process has bias.. literally from the beginning. A few people had to see you on paper and like you for some reason! At the end of the day, an entire committee of ADCOMs vote on you. An average interview without red flags would not be the reason you wouldn't get admitted whether it was an MMI or not. It's the collective of information and how you presented yourself in your entire app. Do you fit the mission of the school? Have the stats? Carried yourself well on interview day? EDIT: I don't mean "you" singling you out, but generally.

FYI, I asked for interview feedback from a school that I was waitlisted at to see if I needed to work on it. I actually was told my interview was above average, yet I was still put on the WL for months [ultimately accepted though].

While I agree that interviews with 1-2 people are filled with bias, that's the way of the world. Most jobs have a single, make or break, interview! I'd much rather have 2 30 minute interviews with faculty where I can connect with them than short convoluted stations in MMI [personal opinion].

This. I had a much better experience with 1-2 interviewers as opposed to the MMI. I received good feedback from the interviewers, so I'm thinking it may be the way I presented myself in my app. I reread my app and saw it can be improved by just editing it.
 
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This. I had a much better experience with 1-2 interviewers as opposed to the MMI. I received good feedback from the interviewers, so I'm thinking it may be the way I presented myself in my app. I reread my app and saw it can be improved by just editing it.
I had good experience with both . Maybe I got lucky ... I feel like you can connect on both levels , but you need to think quick on your feet , and read ppl well
 
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Irrespective of its configuration, the interview process with one or two interviewers is inane, fraught with bias. It is an indefensible process. Should be stopped and replaced by MMIs.
I would agree that interviews, as conducted in the manner described above, are not acceptable.
I would offer that there are ways to make the personal interview superior to an MMI and that there are advantages that might be wrought. Sadly, there are too few places where training and quality assurance are tolerated by the faculty.
MMI's were developed and adopted because of the behaviors and conditions described above. They were happily accepted because faculty were all too keen to be relieved of the onerous (and uncompensated) job of interviewing.
 
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cheers to a new week of stress, anxiety, waiting and reapplying limbo
 
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Lol I went and spoke with some people about the shortcomings in my application and all they said was there were a lot of competitive applications and it’s not that “my application was weak”. Idk how to take that.

The admissions process is an olympic event. So if you're off by a few millisecond in a track event, you're still great,but others are better.

I respect that the conversation has to be largely confidential. But I do not see the harm in admissions officers, for example, paraphrasing 1 or 2 reasons why I was not good enough to be accepted (e.g. recommending more volunteering, retaking the MCAT, etc.)--they can, of course, add a disclaimer that says that addressing our app deficits is no guarantee of admission in the following cycle. To protect themselves. What is wrong with that? I do not see the need for this AMOUNT secrecy
We can't come out and say that you were sacary or your interview suckes, or you don't understand questions. These are real reasons some people have gotten rejected at my school.

Also, this process is a seller's market and it's not the job of the school to offer advice or feedback. You have to go in well advises, practiced and competent. The school saw that on paper, you were competitive. And no one forces you into this process.
 
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The admissions process is an olympic event. So if you're off by a few millisecond in a track event, you're still great,but others are better.


We can't come out and say that you were sacary or your interview suckes, or you don't understand questions. These are real reasons some people have gotten rejected at my school.

Also, this process is a seller's market and it's not the job of the school to offer advice or feedback. You have to go in well advises, practiced and competent. The school saw that on paper, you were competitive. And no one forces you into this process.
asking for clarification of a question can hurt you.......?
 
And no one forces you into this process.

Sure, but there is only one way to become a doctor (2 if you count DO as separate) and anyone willing to put themselves through the struggle generally have strong reasons for doing so. I of course don't have the facts or experience of being on an admissions committee. However, I feel like it is generally inexcusable to employ a bad process and then to perpetuate or make the process worse (as appears to have happened this year). And it's not as if medical schools are without resources. When I was interviewing candidates in my last job, one of the qualities I looked for was a willingness to challenge the the status quo and take the initiative to make changes. For me, this was a more measurable form of evaluating work ethic, creativity, and leadership ability and is a quality I wished for those in leadership positions. If the deficiency of the current application process is due to AMCAS, then why not go with a vendor other than AAMC?
 
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asking for clarification of a question can hurt you.......?
No, asking for clarification isn't a problem [unless you do it for every question lol]. However, answering questions with a rehearsed answer that actually does NOT answer the question asked is a problem. If they ask a question, answer the question. Going off on unwarranted tangents/not giving an answer to their question could hurt.
 
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Sure, but there is only one way to become a doctor (2 if you count DO as separate) and anyone willing to put themselves through the struggle generally have strong reasons for doing so. I of course don't have the facts or experience of being on an admissions committee. However, I feel like it is generally inexcusable to employ a bad process and then to perpetuate or make the process worse (as appears to have happened this year). And it's not as if medical schools are without resources. When I was interviewing candidates in my last job, one of the qualities I looked for was a willingness to challenge the the status quo and take the initiative to make changes. For me, this was a more measurable form of evaluating work ethic, creativity, and leadership ability and is a quality I wished for those in leadership positions. If the deficiency of the current application process is due to AMCAS, then why not go with a vendor other than AAMC?
it's a bad process only to those who don't get accepted. Seller's market
 
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whether it is this cycle or the next, I really commend everyone willing to sacrifice and go through this process to achieve their dreams and make a difference.
 
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whether it is this cycle or the next, I really commend everyone willing to sacrifice and go through this process to achieve their dreams and make a difference.
Hopefully this cycle will turn out good for us within this month we have left... and we won’t have to go through this process again.
 
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Hopefully this cycle will turn out good for us within this month we have left... and we won’t have to go through this process again.
true. personally, I don't even care anymore because I want to see how my improved app floats in this next race and mentally and financially prepared. last minute shuffle and fumbling into school will be difficult too. nonetheless, I do wish everyone here gets what is necessary for their greatest good.
 
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as someone who was accepted on her THIRD cycle, i can tell that even though it seems like the end of the world when you are not accepted, sometimes getting in the next cycle is the best thing that could happen to you. More time to learn, more time to grow, more time to make sure this is exactly what you want to do for the rest of your life
 
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as someone who was accepted on her THIRD cycle, i can tell that even though it seems like the end of the world when you are not accepted, sometimes getting in the next cycle is the best thing that could happen to you. More time to learn, more time to grow, more time to make sure this is exactly what you want to do for the rest of your life
thank you. I wish you so much success on your journey. I think it helps to remember all the great people that do not succeed on their first try but eventually make it. I know that I will definitely appreciate it more and will probably be better prepared..
 
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thank you. I wish you so much success on your journey. I think it helps to remember all the great people that do not succeed on their first try but eventually make it. I know that I will definitely appreciate it more and will probably be better prepared..
Lmao, my already-shed tears from this past year will appreciate the crap out of it right now if I get in too.
 
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I, and most of us, am/are not pursuing this so I can win a gold medal and adorn myself and achieve something (which is fair), I want to provide treatment and compassionate care to the suffering. Yes it takes a lot of sacrifice and commitment, and I chose that sacrifice and commitment, but that doesn't mean that we shouldn't maintain respect and dignity for applicants, med students, physicians who often live to serve and suffer from this process. The process may or may not be fair, but can it be better and more compassionate (as compassionate as expected by the higher ups)? probably.
 
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@gyngyn After doing some self-reflecting, receiving feedback, and following your advice, I've completed my reapp. Brand new essay, edited my works and activities to include new experiences and present myself better, and received updated letters of rec. I received multiple interviews last year, here's to hoping for an even better cycle.
 
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