England - Game Thread

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I will note that my gut feeling on shorty is that she seems to have adopted some AM style strategies that I don't remember her using much previously (more questions/pushback than original contributions). Also that off-topic talk about teapots felt a bit like parts of cartoons when she was wolf (but is more likely just early game NAI chatter)

I'm not ready to oust her, but it did stand out to me as different.
 
I know you commented on Vis tinfoil today, but thoughts on TME today?
She's only posted 8 times so far and it hasn't been very content-heavy, I have her as neutral with the slightest village lean. I've only played with her as village, but her wanting to talk about mechanics wasn't unusual.
 
Day One - Green and Pleasant Land - Vote Tally

Capri (1) - AM
AM (1) - Ms P
Stagg (1) - Shorty
Sporty (0) -
Cray (1) - samac
Alissa (1) - Barks
Zenge (1) - genny
DocE (2) - April, Dina
April (2) - Dubz, Finn
Shorty (1) - DocE

11/28 players voting
Voting closes in ~30 hours ish?
 
I will note that my gut feeling on shorty is that she seems to have adopted some AM style strategies that I don't remember her using much previously (more questions/pushback than original contributions). Also that off-topic talk about teapots felt a bit like parts of cartoons when she was wolf (but is more likely just early game NAI chatter)

I'm not ready to oust her, but it did stand out to me as different.
Do you have thoughts on DocE?
 
I will note that my gut feeling on shorty is that she seems to have adopted some AM style strategies that I don't remember her using much previously (more questions/pushback than original contributions). Also that off-topic talk about teapots felt a bit like parts of cartoons when she was wolf (but is more likely just early game NAI chatter)

I'm not ready to oust her, but it did stand out to me as different.
I have felt that her posts haven't been any different from her recent village games so far
 
This is the second post from you today with just an image - are you telling us you're restricted?
The second image is of the master torturing the doctor and her profile pic is the doctor so I think you’re right.
 
Since I barely read the thread yesterday I decided to go back and reread and pull out some stuff I found



Looking back this weirds me out. Pushing yourself and then you weren't electable anyways. I guess all the royals might have been on your vote, but I think it's more likely that you knew you weren't able to be elected

And yet....

wait.... royals can vote? I was hoping to lean on this vote to see who might be a royal by their lack of involvement.

.​


Royals do not participate in the democratic process.
This means they cannot vote in public elections, nor can they be elected to Parliament.


It would seem I only found out royal can vote or run midway through my own campaign. So there goes your theory. That they CAN vote but it won't count runs against the wording from the mod and what I was using as my rule set until shown otherwise.
 
Leans? Sure. People like Doc E give me the heebie jeebies with his play yesterday. His whole pitch to be PM gave me the willies. Cray's interactions with him also felt super weird. This post in particular pinged me. Like "Oh isn't it so funny how untrustworthy you are?! lol"


Possible pack mates? She was supposedly distrusting of him and then voted to give him extra powers. She "explained" why she voted for him but it wasn't an explanation I found compelling. She later questioned me for wanting my vote to be relevant rather than me throwing it away. And then when I answered her question she completely blew me off and refused to answer my question back at her.

So overall, not feeling super great about that. And I don't think she would have pushed me about my voting if I had just "fallen in line" and voted for DocE. In fact, I don't think she pushed anyone who voted DocE or questioned them. On the one hand she could argue "why would I question people on a vote that I agree with". Which is true, but on the other hand, it really does emphasize how much she wanted to get her candidate elected. It actually puts a much greater emphases on her push to get DocE elected, than her shaky explanation for voting for him supports. Not feeling good about that at all.

She also attacked MsP here for self voting and then not only didn't go after DocE for it, she voted for him and pushed people who weren't voting for him. It's a sketchy dynamic.

Overall, we still have 32 hours left in the cycle. A lot of player's barely posted yesterday and some didn't post at all. Most of the roster hasn't posted at all yet today. So there's still a lot left to be seen.
Can you highlight some examples of these "bad takes" and "useless comments", and why you feel they're "bad" or "useless"?

Particularly interested in why you feel worse about those comments and takes than some of the people who have barely posted at all or flat out haven't posted.


Defense of Cray who tried subtly yet firmly to push to get you elected with extra powers. Interesting and noted.
I'm taking note of these two posts because I want to talk about them more when I'm not busy
oust april

SDN WILL NOT LET ME UNBOLD AND IT'S ANNOYING. I FINALLY GOT IT TO WORK BUT I'M LEAVING MY ANGER HERE.


Her logic feels contrived to me. Granted, there are a ton of you (April included) that I've never played with before and this may or may not be just normal behavior.
Well, I'm glad I didn't waste opening a PM on you 🤣
This made me chuckle because you recently did something similar in the HP speed game and now you're calling other people for it.
Again... In that game, I said I was leaving MsP in my neutrals after someone else called her wolfy for a characteristic that I've seen MsP use as a villager. I never put her in my village pile, I was just saying I thought it was silly to wolf read her over it.
 
I will note that my gut feeling on shorty is that she seems to have adopted some AM style strategies that I don't remember her using much previously (more questions/pushback than original contributions). Also that off-topic talk about teapots felt a bit like parts of cartoons when she was wolf (but is more likely just early game NAI chatter)

I'm not ready to oust her, but it did stand out to me as different.
From what I understand, Shorty and AM talk about game mechanics and theories in between games since AM was Shorty's manator, so I'm not surprised that she's adopted some AM styles and I'm not sure why that makes her inherently wolfy unless you're also reading AM wolfy.
 
Two votes for me?

Haters gonna hate. I'm out here stirring up good conservation and comments from everyone. You'll thank me later.

Anyway have rare day off with the wife so if I'm posting in the next few hours assume I'm getting yelled at by my wife to pay attention to her while hiding in the bathroom like a crazy addict trying to shoot off the posts. In other words, dont be surprised if I'm not the most responsive for the next handful of hours. If you really think it's that important ask me again if I don't answer in a reasonable time frame once I'm clearly back on the thread.
 
I'm confused about the double kill mayoral thing because I've literally seen a tiemaker die from that before.
I didn't make the tie!!!!

Wait did someone else die with me? I don't remember.
 
wait.... royals can vote? I was hoping to lean on this vote to see who might be a royal by their lack of involvement.
And yet....

It would seem I only found out royal can vote or run midway through my own campaign. So there goes your theory. That they CAN vote but it won't count runs against the wording from the mod and what I was using as my rule set until shown otherwise.
I don't see how the top post clears you the way you're acting like it does. You could genuinely not have known, or you could have planted that there knowing the answer. Is it enough to base a wolf read on by itself, no, but it's not this great "gotcha!" moment to counter Dina's point either.
 
Do you have thoughts on DocE?
still getting a feel for his playstyle. Didn't really follow his reasoning for wanting to be PM. I don't know that I'd go as hard as he is on shorty, but as mentioned i do kinda see where he's coming from. It's clear that theres royalty shenanigans involved in the votes for him/SAR, but i'm not sure if it's based on who ran or who voted. And while i do like overall mechanics talk (looks like my tinfoil was right after all) I do think I should be more careful about speculating too publicly into who the exact royals are, since some of them are likely village affiliated and outing them could bring them harm

I have felt that her posts haven't been any different from her recent village games so far
Since I didn't play bioshock i might have just missed a step in natural evolution from noob to more experienced player. I do think that some of her non-questioning posts this game have served more to stop conversation than to advance it, I didn't get that feel in goats. And I still feel like there's an AM influence in the types of questions she asks, but that's not necessarily wolfy, just evolving.
 
I don't see how the top post clears you the way you're acting like it does. You could genuinely not have known, or you could have planted that there knowing the answer. Is it enough to base a wolf read on by itself, no, but it's not this great "gotcha!" moment to counter Dina's point either.

The mod LITERALLY wrote that the royals can't vote in the rules. And it's somehow not logically consistent for me to TRUST the mods and what they said were rules?

That the game showed that apparently the mods didn't mean what they literally wrote is sort of irrelevant to me being shocked an hour or two into the game that their literal words shouldn't be taken literally. Maybe I'm from an older mod lineage but I always thought modgod words were law and the fun was in finding the wording loopholes. There wasn't a loophole there, the mods just didn't mean what they wrote.
 
still getting a feel for his playstyle. Didn't really follow his reasoning for wanting to be PM. I don't know that I'd go as hard as he is on shorty, but as mentioned i do kinda see where he's coming from. It's clear that theres royalty shenanigans involved in the votes for him/SAR, but i'm not sure if it's based on who ran or who voted. And while i do like overall mechanics talk (looks like my tinfoil was right after all) I do think I should be more careful about speculating too publicly into who the exact royals are, since some of them are likely village affiliated and outing them could bring them harm
So what affiliation are you leaning him?
 
From what I understand, Shorty and AM talk about game mechanics and theories in between games since AM was Shorty's manator, so I'm not surprised that she's adopted some AM styles and I'm not sure why that makes her inherently wolfy unless you're also reading AM wolfy.
I didn't say wolfy (yet), just different. but after goats I'm ALWAYS reading AM wolfy until proven otherwise lol.
 
still getting a feel for his playstyle. Didn't really follow his reasoning for wanting to be PM. I don't know that I'd go as hard as he is on shorty, but as mentioned i do kinda see where he's coming from. It's clear that theres royalty shenanigans involved in the votes for him/SAR, but i'm not sure if it's based on who ran or who voted. And while i do like overall mechanics talk (looks like my tinfoil was right after all) I do think I should be more careful about speculating too publicly into who the exact royals are, since some of them are likely village affiliated and outing them could bring them harm


Since I didn't play bioshock i might have just missed a step in natural evolution from noob to more experienced player. I do think that some of her non-questioning posts this game have served more to stop conversation than to advance it, I didn't get that feel in goats. And I still feel like there's an AM influence in the types of questions she asks, but that's not necessarily wolfy, just evolving.

I can't break this addiction. Just quickly: I wanted to be PM because *it's fun* and I haven't played in a long time and it would guarantee id stay invested. And I am NOT going hard on shorty. At all. That's about one step away from the easiest I can go on someone. Old players will back me up.

Saying you're a useless waste of a roster slot is one step below admitting you're good. I play aggressively and with ad homeneim. If me prodding shorty a little bit is going to be viewed as aggressive, this is going to be a very interesting game of sensitive souls
 
I can't break this addiction. Just quickly: I wanted to be PM because *it's fun* and I haven't played in a long time and it would guarantee id stay invested. And I am NOT going hard on shorty. At all. That's about one step away from the easiest I can go on someone. Old players will back me up.

Saying you're a useless waste of a roster slot is one step below admitting you're good. I play aggressively and with ad homeneim. If me prodding shorty a little bit is going to be viewed as aggressive, this is going to be a very interesting game of sensitive souls
sorry, by hard i didn't mean aggressive! more that i wasn't solid enough in my feelings to place a vote that way (meaning I'm wishy-washy, not you're being mean)
 
I can't break this addiction. Just quickly: I wanted to be PM because *it's fun* and I haven't played in a long time and it would guarantee id stay invested. And I am NOT going hard on shorty. At all. That's about one step away from the easiest I can go on someone. Old players will back me up.

Saying you're a useless waste of a roster slot is one step below admitting you're good. I play aggressively and with ad homeneim. If me prodding shorty a little bit is going to be viewed as aggressive, this is going to be a very interesting game of sensitive souls
Hi, I'd like an answer to this please.
 
The mod LITERALLY wrote that the royals can't vote in the rules. And it's somehow not logically consistent for me to TRUST the mods and what they said were rules?

I mean the mod also literally wrote that there are benefits and drawbacks to sharing your role class. Seems to me that it would be super counterproductive for the game mechanics to then immediately out all the royals by not including them in tallies even though their votes don't really count.
 
Yeet Stagg

Didn't post at all yesterday. Pressure vote.
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I assume you’re calling that vote trash but I don’t get the adipose baby toss. I’m sorry.
also full disclosure I’ll try best I can if you make actual doctor who references to get points across but I haven’t finished the most recent season, I’m on episode 5, and if you spoil it for me I’ll yeet you into oblivion until the end of time.
 
Literally read the post above where I voted to lynch. Read it. Just reads shady to me for the exact reasons I said. Nothing more to it and nothing less to it.

(Wife is charging her Fitbit. So not running yet)
So you'd rather not call people out on their inconsistencies or things they say that don't make a lot of sense?

Those posts of yours that I quoted strongly imply that you're talking about my voting. That you're avoiding actually addressing that, or correcting what you meant to say, is noted. Saying things like the bolded absolutely implies that you are talking about me changing my vote to be the same as the person I'm supposedly goading.
I never said you didn't vote. I said you're goading others to act in a way I find disingenuous. And if I wasn't going to be busy for a while I would have stayed silent and waited and watched for you to jump ship to whomever the person your goaded voted for. But I don't have the time and the day round is VERY long so I figured it's worth saying now.

I ask a lot of questions. It's how I come to my reads on people. You can look back at Bioshock or any of my other recent games to see that. Sorry you don't like it.
 
So you'd rather not call people out on their inconsistencies or things they say that don't make a lot of sense?

Those posts of yours that I quoted strongly imply that you're talking about my voting. That you're avoiding actually addressing that, or correcting what you meant to say, is noted. Saying things like the bolded absolutely implies that you are talking about me changing my vote to be the same as the person I'm supposedly goading.


I ask a lot of questions. It's how I come to my reads on people. You can look back at Bioshock or any of my other recent games to see that. Sorry you don't like it.

We are clearly talking about different posts. And going back and doing exactly what I keep saying you need to do, it's clear that you haven't even BOTHERED to even look. So rather than talk about the fact that I just don't like the way you're posting, you instead decide to post aspersions and not even bother to do the bare minimum requested of you.

Post that I have referenced, at least, four times now is listed below. It is the EXACT post above where I voted to lynch you. And as I said multiple times, it's just another example (of which there were a few) of you just kicking the tires in a way that rubbed me the wrong way.
Okay, but it was still a day of people posting and you have no leans at all from that just because it was an election day and not a yeet vote day?

I'm not saying you need to die in a wolf fire. I'm sayinf you had some piss poor reads day zero. You have some piss poor comments today. And you consistently avoid quoting me or addressing what I actually said and instead try to do the least amount of work while throwing out the most amount of dismissal of my vague suspicion. You're not doing yourself any favor at least as far as me feeling like you wouldn't be a bad villager to lose AT ALL if you're not a wolf.
 
I can't stress both of these things enough: statistically.... Supershorty is probably a villager. But she could be a wolf because of some possibly innocent possibly subtly wolfy ways she approached stuff. That's enough for me to just bring it up and let it sit there.

But also (barring her having a good role) the village is better off without her. Her takes are BAD.

But everyone else can do as they so wish. I'm "just saying" I'm not whipping up some mob to come for you with vigilante justice.
 
I can't stress both of these things enough: statistically.... Supershorty is probably a villager. But she could be a wolf because of some possibly innocent possibly subtly wolfy ways she approached stuff. That's enough for me to just bring it up and let it sit there.

But also (barring her having a good role) the village is better off without her. Her takes are BAD.

But everyone else can do as they so wish. I'm "just saying" I'm not whipping up some mob to come for you with vigilante justice.

I think people here can't take a little heat. Getting a little hot under the collar that I would dare question their bad takes. It's a game. This is part of it.
 
So AnimalMidwife, what is your read???

I think DocE leans wolf with comments but really think it is their style. I vote wait and see on him for now. I like the involvement

Someone said voting out silent ppl is bad. I disagree. Voting out silent person seems like a good chance of voting out lurking wolf. Any idea on ppl that normally play that are being silent this game???

Keep every one close and sus ppl closer.

What does NAI mean? (I’m playing naive to throw you off my trail) lol....seriously, what does it mean...
 
Someone said voting out silent ppl is bad. I disagree. Voting out silent person seems like a good chance of voting out lurking wolf. Any idea on ppl that normally play that are being silent this game???

Wasn't me who said but... voting out silent people just for being silent is most often just going to lead to a bunch of villager deaths for the sake of maybe capturing a lurking wolf. Yeah, maybe eventually if someone has been silent for a long time then it's okay to vote for them on the basis of that. But we're on literally the first vote.
 
How/why would it?
Because roles and abilities and classes all are going to impact the way people play. so someone might seem weird to me because they're a wolf, or they could be a villager with a class modifier that I don't understand that is influencing their decision making/ strategy. there may be within-class trends that look like wolfpack trends, etc. It seems like there's several layers of complexity to this game, so it's gonna be more complicated than wolf vs. not wolf. I think a focus on wolves is obviously the best starting point, I just want to be nuanced with my reads when possible
 
DocE feels like DocE (this doesn't necessarily mean anything) and I'm curious about what he's seeing with shorty since I'm always curious if he's right about stuff, but not so much feeling that myself. Still more interested in april's comments about zenge this morning.
 
So AnimalMidwife, what is your read???

I think DocE leans wolf with comments but really think it is their style. I vote wait and see on him for now. I like the involvement

Someone said voting out silent ppl is bad. I disagree. Voting out silent person seems like a good chance of voting out lurking wolf. Any idea on ppl that normally play that are being silent this game???

Keep every one close and sus ppl closer.

What does NAI mean? (I’m playing naive to throw you off my trail) lol....seriously, what does it mean...
My read on DocE? I have him as neutral. He's not doing anything I haven't seen him do as literally any affiliation. Not super impressed with his reasoning for the shorty push though.

I'm all for pressuring silent people. Unlikely that all will be wolves (though this literally has happened before rip), but getting reactions from them and seeing how other people respond to the pressuring is immensely helpful when whittling things down into mid and late game.

NAI means Not Affiliation Indicative. Meaning someone would do it whether they're a wolf, villager, or 3p.
 
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So AnimalMidwife, what is your read???

I think DocE leans wolf with comments but really think it is their style. I vote wait and see on him for now. I like the involvement

Someone said voting out silent ppl is bad. I disagree. Voting out silent person seems like a good chance of voting out lurking wolf. Any idea on ppl that normally play that are being silent this game???

Keep every one close and sus ppl closer.

What does NAI mean? (I’m playing naive to throw you off my trail) lol....seriously, what does it mean...
NAI means Not Affiliation Indicative, there are a list of terms below and definitions from the most recent noob game
Nicknames

Please see this thread lovingly curated by @Lawpy for a guide to commonly used nicknames. If you are still confused about who someone is, just ask.

WW Terminology - NOW IN ALPHABETICAL ORDER!
*may be updated with suggestions - manators please offer suggestions in our chat if you have them, so we don't clog up the thread.*

Bandwagon
- A buildup of votes on one player, usually one that quickly reaches the majority of votes

Bus/Bussing - when a wolf backstabs another to gain the trust of the village

Idiot Savant - Also known as "Who are you, STL?" The act of correctly voting a wolf, but for all the wrong reasons. Logic need not apply.

ISO - Short for "isolate", refers to when you search for a particular player's posts in the thread to read all of them at once. Often used to evaluate a single player at a time based on tone, or check for consistency in their posts.

Majority - How some lynches in WW games operate - the vote closes as soon as someone has more than 50% of the total number of possible votes

Meta - Wolf meta. Village meta. Meta meta meta. This simply refers to various aspects of a player's playstyle, through time, in multiple games, and in different roles. You may not see it used as much in this game since many of you are new and do not yet have an established meta.

Mod Flair - refers to artistic/creative license taken by the mods in writeups and individual players results. It is common for players to attempt to determine whether a particular portion of these writings is relevant to the game or simply mods having fun.

NAI - Not Affiliation Indicative. Usually refers to some aspect of a player's play that does not point to whether they are wolf or village. It simply...is.

NK - night kill - a death that occurs at night in the game. Usually refers to the wolf factional kill but can refer to other deaths as well!

Parity - When wolf numbers equal village numbers. This is how wolves win the game.

Plurality - How most votes in SDN WW games operate - the person who has the most votes when the cycle closes "wins" (and their prize is death)

Pocket - something mysteriously missing from a lot of women's clothing. Also the act of getting another player to trust you, typically by some form of sneaky emotional manipulation

POE - "Pot of Evil" "Pool of Eels" or, if you're boring, Process of Elimination. The suspects that remain when you eliminate your village reads, cleared villagers, etc from the roster.

PR - "Power role" - most often refers to a village role that has an ability (so not vanilla). May also be used to refer to a wolf with an ability.

RNG - Random Number Generator. Refers to the randomization of any part of the game, whether that be role distribution, a random d1 vote, breaking of a tie to determine who gets lynched, or an ability being used on a random player.

Rojo - One of the great old ones, his name has now the common term used to describe the act of accidentally posting something on the thread that was meant for PM, usually when a wolf posts something that was meant for wolf chat.

Scum - a catchall for the informed minority, usually the murderous ones. Someone the village needs to eliminate.

Sheep (verb) - refers to when players echo or follow another player's ideas/reasoning or yeet vote. Usually has a negative connotation.

Sketchy - If you look up sketchy in the dictionary you will see pictures of many of our illustrious manators, along with this modator (depending on who you ask). Synonymous include wolfy, shady, suspect, suspicious, and highly yeetable.

Soft clear - When a player determines that, in their opinion, another player is not a wolf based on interactions, analysis, or whatever else and NOT through trustworthy mod-given information

Tinfoil - crackpot guesses and theories - something that may be posited by a player on thread just in case they are correct, but is often a little nutty.

Tot - Spectator --> Spectatortot --> Tatertot --> tot. These are the people observing the game from the outside, commenting in their own group chat with the mods.

Tunneling - player A continues to go after player B day after day, perhaps in spite of evidence that player B is village

Vanilla - a player with no special abilities. Can refer to a villager - sometimes called a vanillager - or a wolf, who in that case would have no abilities other than killing. Can also refer to a type of game where no special abilities exist.

VCA - Vote Count Analysis - a way of analyzing the game based on previous votes. The goal is to figure out who the wolves (and the villagers!) are based on the progression of previous days' votes.

Village(r) Code - A terrible way to determine someone's affiliation based on the style/format of their role PM, due to the assumption that wolf PMs will be formatted different from villager PMs. Don't do it.

VoLo - Vote (correctly) or Lose. Also seen as "Yolo" (Yeet correctly or Lose). This is the point of no return for the village. If anything other than a wolf is voted out during VoLo, village loses the game. Other related terms include MoLo, which is the game state where a misyeet would lose the game for village but no death or the death of a third party would not, and Marvolo, which refers to Volo and Molo together when there is some doubt about which stage the game is in.

Waffle - A delicious breakfast food. Also, the act of switching your vote. If lots of votes are switching around the same time, especially towards the end of the day, we call that a wafflefest

Wagon
- simply refers to the collection of votes for a particular player, no matter how many votes there are or how quickly they were placed

WIFOM - Wine in Front of Me, taken from the poison scene in The Princess Bride. The circular reasoning that results from trying to determine the choices of someone who knows their actions would be analyzed. Probably overused.
 
oust april

SDN WILL NOT LET ME UNBOLD AND IT'S ANNOYING. I FINALLY GOT IT TO WORK BUT I'M LEAVING MY ANGER HERE.


Her logic feels contrived to me. Granted, there are a ton of you (April included) that I've never played with before and this may or may not be just normal behavior.


Is "oust" acceptable and non-confusing? 😛
Any other feelings besides april so far?
 
Someone said voting out silent ppl is bad. I disagree. Voting out silent person seems like a good chance of voting out lurking wolf. Any idea on ppl that normally play that are being silent this game???

Wasn't me who said but... voting out silent people just for being silent is most often just going to lead to a bunch of villager deaths for the sake of maybe capturing a lurking wolf. Yeah, maybe eventually if someone has been silent for a long time then it's okay to vote for them on the basis of that. But we're on literally the first vote.

In the games i've played so far, yeeting silent people early tends to end up catching people who just had IRL stuff that got in the way, rather than wolves. The one situation where I think it is better to pick the silent person is if there's a close vote, and you have good reason to believe that the other person is village - better to lose a non-participating villager than an active one. I do think that early votes for silent folk can help pressure them into participating sometimes though
 
I don't understand this part. Is this implying that people know who's in their class? Because otherwise how would there be trends within classes that look like wolfpack trends?
my initial assumption is no, unless they reveal to each other in PMs and forge bonds that way. But I don't know that for sure, since i don't know what all the classes are or what their abilities are, so i'm keeping the possibility open.
 
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