Official 2013-2014 Help Me Rank Megathread

[NaOut]

I'm sure a lot of us are done/ almost done with interviews and are starting to think about how to rank our programs. Lets bounce some ideas off each other w/help from the usual suspects (jdh/gutonc). Will post my beta list in a little while, want to think about it some more.

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[IM2GI]

Sigh, Im sure this will go well.

 

[gutonc]

Sigh, Im sure this will go well.

It never does. But like herpes or a JAMA subscription, you can't stop it, only hope to contain it.

 

[IM2GI]

It never does. But like herpes or a JAMA subscription, you can't stop it, only hope to contain it.

Haha, I have no idea how or why I get JAMA. Well done.

 

[HelpPleaseMD]

im looking forward to it. always good to get some veteran advice and for .... some laughs. will post after all my interviews are over. gotta say though, instatewaiter gave me great advice about a year ago when asking him about my chances.

 

[Jorts]

Sigh, Im sure this will go well.

Hey can you go through some more match lists with us....Michigan or vandy.....lets circle jerk

 

[IM2GI]

Hey can you go through some more match lists with us....Michigan or vandy.....lets circle jerk

Guys! I cant decide between MGH, Brigham and Hopkins!! What should I do?? Which program is better and likely to get me a nephro fellowship??

 

[Jorts]

Guys! I cant decide between MGH, Brigham and Hopkins!! What should I do?? Which program is better and likely to get me a nephro fellowship??

good one on the nephro, we all know real docs do cards or GI (yes thats what I want to do), there are no other specialities

 

[235009]

Guys! I cant decide between MGH, Brigham and Hopkins!! What should I do?? Which program is better and likely to get me a nephro fellowship??

you never know what kind of advice you'll get....maybe gutonc had an MGH PC look at him funny 15 years ago so he'll tell everyone to rank it dead last below SUNY downstate

 

[gutonc]

you never know what kind of advice you'll get....maybe gutonc had an MGH PC look at him funny 15 years ago so he'll tell everyone to rank it dead last below SUNY downstate

Nah...I'm just gonna completely bomb this thread all season long. But I'll make sure the advice alternates randomly between completely serious and complete bulls**t.

 

[amine2086]

Guys! I cant decide between MGH, Brigham and Hopkins!! What should I do?? Which program is better and likely to get me a nephro fellowship??

None of the above. I heard Downstate has the best nephro fellowship match.

 

[NaOut]

I pretty much have my top 2 set but having trouble with the middle of my list. I have duke at 3 right now but kinda apprehensive about durham. The weather is good and cost of living is super low but there isn't too much to do. Also apprehensive about columbia cause of it usual issues. I liked yale but also new haven kinda sucks. Chicago and nwern were both awesome but weather sucks balls. Also don't know what to do with stanford. Seems really cush but palo alto isnt really my kinda town. So all in all this is kinda what I have surmised so far
3-4: Mount Sinai, Duke
5-6: Columbia, BID,
7-11: cornell, Nwern, uchicago, yale, stanford
I feel like this list is all wrong tho. For eg is it worth going through hell at columbia just to be in NY, when I can have a much chiller time at Nwern(tho while freezing to death). Also, would it be silly to rank sinai over duke(durham ugh). I had a great time at BID but I didn't get the feeling that they get their hands too dirty. Im not geographically limited and thinking GI in the future.

 

[Thama]

I pretty much have my top 2 set but having trouble with the middle of my list. I have duke at 3 right now but kinda apprehensive about durham. The weather is good and cost of living is super low but there isn't too much to do. Also apprehensive about columbia cause of it usual issues. I liked yale but also new haven kinda sucks. Chicago and nwern were both awesome but weather sucks balls. Also don't know what to do with stanford. Seems really cush but palo alto isnt really my kinda town. So all in all this is kinda what I have surmised so far
3-4: Mount Sinai, Duke
5-6: Columbia, BID,
7-11: cornell, Nwern, uchicago, yale, stanford
I feel like this list is all wrong tho. For eg is it worth going through hell at columbia just to be in NY, when I can have a much chiller time at Nwern(tho while freezing to death). Also, would it be silly to rank sinai over duke(durham ugh). I had a great time at BID but I didn't get the feeling that they get their hands too dirty. Im not geographically limited and thinking GI in the future.

Durham is awesome. Best mid-sized city I've ever lived in. Unless you have a serious case of urban ADD and can't live anywhere without at least 20 nightclubs per square mile then you won't run out of things to do.

 

[IM2GI]

I pretty much have my top 2 set but having trouble with the middle of my list. I have duke at 3 right now but kinda apprehensive about durham. The weather is good and cost of living is super low but there isn't too much to do. Also apprehensive about columbia cause of it usual issues. I liked yale but also new haven kinda sucks. Chicago and nwern were both awesome but weather sucks balls. Also don't know what to do with stanford. Seems really cush but palo alto isnt really my kinda town. So all in all this is kinda what I have surmised so far
3-4: Mount Sinai, Duke
5-6: Columbia, BID,
7-11: cornell, Nwern, uchicago, yale, stanford
I feel like this list is all wrong tho. For eg is it worth going through hell at columbia just to be in NY, when I can have a much chiller time at Nwern(tho while freezing to death). Also, would it be silly to rank sinai over duke(durham ugh). I had a great time at BID but I didn't get the feeling that they get their hands too dirty. Im not geographically limited and thinking GI in the future.

So someone had to go and try to make this a serious discussion huh?

I dont know why you seem to hate on the UNC/Duke area and claim "nothing to do." Lots of people love that area. Whether or not the NYC sacrifice is worth it is a very personal decision. Personally I didnt think it was worth the cost of living and program issues to deal with NYC, but many people think that the sacrifices are worth it just to be in NYC.

 

[EMdoc1974]

Anyone have any feedback from this site? emergencynotes.com. Supposedly they make note templates for emergency medicine situations.

I'm an attending at a Midwest private practice in my first 6 months out from residency. My practice doesn't have dictation and my typing skills took a huge decline since I was able to dictate in residency. Was thinking about using these templates. Anyone have any input or other sites like this?

 

[Cnote81]

So someone had to go and try to make this a serious discussion huh?

I dont know why you seem to hate on the UNC/Duke area and claim "nothing to do." Lots of people love that area. Whether or not the NYC sacrifice is worth it is a very personal decision. Personally I didnt think it was worth the cost of living and program issues to deal with NYC, but many people think that the sacrifices are worth it just to be in NYC.

this is not the first time people have started a thread like this. i'm not sure why you're so vocal against it. i looked through a lot of last years discussion and thought it was very useful.

 

[gutonc]

this is not the first time people have started a thread like this. i'm not sure why you're so vocal against it. i looked through a lot of last years discussion and thought it was very useful.

They happen every year and inevitably descend into chaos with the final recommendation always being "rank them the way you liked them". So, ipso facto, they're stupid. It's bad enough that people use the advice of random people on the internet to help decide where to apply, but using those same *****s (myself very much included) to help you make a decision about where to spend the next 3 years (and possibly set up or destroy your career)...that's nuts.

But...again...carry on. I won't stop you...hell, I stickied the thing.

 

[NaOut]

So someone had to go and try to make this a serious discussion huh?

I dont know why you seem to hate on the UNC/Duke area and claim "nothing to do." Lots of people love that area. Whether or not the NYC sacrifice is worth it is a very personal decision. Personally I didnt think it was worth the cost of living and program issues to deal with NYC, but many people think that the sacrifices are worth it just to be in NYC.

It seems like Mount Sinai doesnt have a lot of the issues that are present at cornell, columbia, nyu, thats why I'm ranking it higher.

 

[IM2GI]

this is not the first time people have started a thread like this. i'm not sure why you're so vocal against it. i looked through a lot of last years discussion and thought it was very useful.

Youll notice I also gave you some actual feedback to your question.

The reason it is silly to try to rank programs for someone else is that so much should be going into it other than "what is the best program." And even that is a difficult question. At BEST you can try to throw programs into tiers, but even that is problematic. When an applicant posts 5-7 outstanding programs, and wants someone else to try to rank them for them, it is difficult to give relevant advice other than "where do you want to live?." You are certainly also going to get regional and personal bias from the advice you get on here. If I went to program X, it is in my best interest to make other people think program X is the best program ever.

Hopefully youll have a chance to attend one of the ~20 "top ten!" programs.

 

[NaOut]

Durham is awesome. Best mid-sized city I've ever lived in. Unless you have a serious case of urban ADD and can't live anywhere without at least 20 nightclubs per square mile then you won't run out of things to do.

Thats what I keep hearing..but I walked around the downtown durham area and I gotta say it leaves a lot to be desired, but I mean I'm sure I missed a lot of the area. But I mean if everyone says its awesome I guess it is. What are some of the things you liked about living there anyway?

 

[gutonc]

It seems like Mount Sinai doesnt have a lot of the issues that are present at cornell, columbia, nyu, thats why I'm ranking it higher.

Back in the day, I liked MSSM much better than the other NYC programs...it was my #2.

 

[TooMuchResearch]

Good evening,

Since you are a new member of our community, I wanted to take a moment to welcome you and to let you know it is generally considered poor form to introduce yourself in such a blatantly spammy manner.

Thanks,
TooMuchResearch

 

[Thama]

Thats what I keep hearing..but I walked around the downtown durham area and I gotta say it leaves a lot to be desired, but I mean I'm sure I missed a lot of the area. But I mean if everyone says its awesome I guess it is. What are some of the things you liked about living there anyway?

Durham isn't really a walking town. There's no pretty centralized riverfront district to catch the eye. The downtown area was a dump 10 years ago and has recently rebounded to be a legit place to go out, but still isn't really the center of anything. Raleigh, Durham, and Chapel Hill all kind of exist in pods accessible by car. In each one, such as Durham's American Tobacco Campus or Brightleaf Square, Raleigh's Warehouse District or Glenwood South, or Franklin Street in CH, you can walk around and there is quite a bit to do. The nice thing about those areas, though, is that as a resident you can actually afford to do pretty much everything. In a place like NYC/SF/LA you have tons to do around you and yet a massive portion of it is completely unattainable on a resident salary unless you had a previous career in investment banking. In the Triangle, you have a pretty reasonable disposable income thanks to modest rents and then you can go to a baseball game for 10 bucks or get a nice meal for 2 for 40-50. You've got multiple large theaters and small venues, tons of ethnic food, decent sports (though not as much for the pro fan), a lot of live music, tons of parks and proximity to hiking/mountains/beach/outdoors and a huge community of educated young professionals that are here working in hospitals, biotech, telecom/IT research, pharma startups, etc. It's a fantastic area to live in and a completely uninteresting place for tourists, which is what you kind of end up being in one day when you're somewhere for a residency interview.

 

[EMdoc1974]

Good evening,

Since you are a new member of our community, I wanted to take a moment to welcome you and to let you know it is generally considered poor form to introduce yourself in such a blatantly spammy manner.

Thanks,
TooMuchResearch

Where would you prefer that I ask if anyone has used these? Thanks for your concern.

 

[HarryGary]

Back in the day, I liked MSSM much better than the other NYC programs...it was my #2.

Generally a fan of MSSM, but I'd keep in mind they've had a lot of turnover in the program director's role recently. I would speak to some of the current residents and get their sense of how they like the current PD.

Additionally, the cardiology fellows at Sinai complain that since there are so many private attendings at Sinai, the residents are in the habit calling consults for every organ system. They feel the residents don't learn to take care of a lot of issues on their own. This of course could be utter bs, but it's worth thinking about.

 

[keindo]

Pitt vs. OHSU vs. Tufts vs. USC?

 

[GTV]

Pitt vs. OHSU vs. Tufts vs. USC?

If you go by US News rankings, the 2013 version had Pitt well within the top 20. Anecdotally I've heard only great things about the program, and from what I gather the general consensus seems to be that it has an upward trajectory. That said, it's Pittsburgh. OHSU, though not ranked within the top 20 in US News seems to also be held in very high esteem and does a great job of balancing exposure to primary care and setting those up for fellowship who are interested. I have not heard as many great things about Tufts. At my home institution, I worked with an ER doc who recently completed his residency there (yes, it was in EM but he interacted with a lot of the IM residents) and said he felt that the medicine residents generally seemed pretty disgruntled and actually suggested to me that I drop my interview there (I don't have any more specific info on that, sorry). USC I know nothing about.

Just my opinion based on a lot of subjective data, but if I were to rank them I'd go Pitt > OHSU > USC > Tufts (or switch OSHU and Pitt if you really prefer the West/Portland).

 

[Cnote81]

If you go by US News rankings, the 2013 version had Pitt well within the top 20. Anecdotally I've heard only great things about the program, and from what I gather the general consensus seems to be that it has an upward trajectory. That said, it's Pittsburgh. OHSU, though not ranked within the top 20 in US News seems to also be held in very high esteem and does a great job of balancing exposure to primary care and setting those up for fellowship who are interested. I have not heard as many great things about Tufts. At my home institution, I worked with an ER doc who recently completed his residency there (yes, it was in EM but he interacted with a lot of the IM residents) and said he felt that the medicine residents generally seemed pretty disgruntled and actually suggested to me that I drop my interview there (I don't have any more specific info on that, sorry). USC I know nothing about.

Just my opinion based on a lot of subjective data, but if I were to rank them I'd go Pitt > OHSU > USC > Tufts (or switch OSHU and Pitt if you really prefer the West/Portland).

Tufts doesn't have an EM residency at its main hospital where IM residents spend most of their time. I was pleasantly surprised by Tufts, which seems to get no respect on the SDN boards. I hope you didn't miss out on seeing it based on an ER doc that was likely training at Baystate

 

[legionella]

Agree with the above. Is there a reason Tufts isn't regarded more highly on here? I thought the program director and associate PDs seemed warm and genuine, the small size means residents can be more close-knit, and the subspecialty services are ideal for people who wants to explore and go into a subspecialty. And if I recall correctly, their match list was pretty solid too. Can someone tell me what the major downsides are to Tufts? Or if it's easier to be more concrete, what makes it not as "good" a program as places like Jefferson and Maryland (realizing that the program structures are quite different and this is all subjective, of course)?

 

[CanIMakeIt]

If you go by US News rankings, the 2013 version had Pitt well within the top 20. Anecdotally I've heard only great things about the program, and from what I gather the general consensus seems to be that it has an upward trajectory. That said, it's Pittsburgh. OHSU, though not ranked within the top 20 in US News seems to also be held in very high esteem and does a great job of balancing exposure to primary care and setting those up for fellowship who are interested. I have not heard as many great things about Tufts. At my home institution, I worked with an ER doc who recently completed his residency there (yes, it was in EM but he interacted with a lot of the IM residents) and said he felt that the medicine residents generally seemed pretty disgruntled and actually suggested to me that I drop my interview there (I don't have any more specific info on that, sorry). USC I know nothing about.

Just my opinion based on a lot of subjective data, but if I were to rank them I'd go Pitt > OHSU > USC > Tufts (or switch OSHU and Pitt if you really prefer the West/Portland).

Who in their right mind is not disgruntled with ER physicians who order pointless tests and then want someone else to save the **** show they started. Ordering unnecessary tests and calling medicine for all stupid admissions = disgruntled residents. This has nothing to do with how a medicine residency is structured. On the contrary, i would say the more the residents are disgruntled the more they know medicine because they can spot ER BS.

 

[jdh71]

I'm just going to tell you animals to rank the programs the way you liked them. That will be the bottom line. If you are all hoping for me to go into an angry rant or start up a fight with a random, I don't think that will happening.

You need to go to the places you like, and just because one place may have a higher academic spot based on the estimation of people on this board, or anywhere, that's is not reason enough to rank it higher than a place you really liked.

 

[obiwan]

You need to go to the places you like, and just because one place may have a higher academic spot based on the estimation of people on this board, or anywhere, that's is not reason enough to rank it higher than a place you really liked.

hear hear

 

[keindo]

Tufts doesn't have an EM residency at its main hospital where IM residents spend most of their time. I was pleasantly surprised by Tufts, which seems to get no respect on the SDN boards. I hope you didn't miss out on seeing it based on an ER doc that was likely training at Baystate

Speaking of which, does anyone have the rank list broken down by year for Tufts? jdh, your advice on these forums is well regarded, but for myself if I like a couple places roughly equally I'll go to the 'stronger' of the two programs.

 

[235009]

Can someone tell me what the major downsides are to Tufts?

my take....

- small program = less chances for coverage and more nightfloat ...if i remember correctly they also have no prelims
- the EMR is a disaster, i think notes are still hand-written
- why would a well-off well-insured patient go to tufts instead of MGH/BID/BWH? where does this hospital get it's patient population? from what I remember they said something about community attendings with strong ties to tufts admitting their patients there. sounds...interesting.
- the response of the PD when someone brought up the +1 system was very unsettling. made the program seem inflexible, resistant to change and seems like it prioritizes tradition over all else.
- not that this should be a deciding factor but i think they pay their residents the least out of the 5 university hospitals in boston

 

[jdh71]

Speaking of which, does anyone have the rank list broken down by year for Tufts? jdh, your advice on these forums is well regarded, but for myself if I like a couple places roughly equally I'll go to the 'stronger' of the two programs.

Well all things otherwise bring equal . . . That's kind of a "duh". I'm glad to hear you pups are engaging your brains here a bit.

 

[Cnote81]

my take....

- small program = less chances for coverage and more nightfloat ...if i remember correctly they also have no prelims
- the EMR is a disaster, i think notes are still hand-written
- why would a well-off well-insured patient go to tufts instead of MGH/BID/BWH? where does this hospital get it's patient population? from what I remember they said something about community attendings with strong ties to tufts admitting their patients there. sounds...interesting.
- the response of the PD when someone brought up the +1 system was very unsettling. made the program seem inflexible, resistant to change and seems like it prioritizes tradition over all else.
- not that this should be a deciding factor but i think they pay their residents the least out of the 5 university hospitals in boston

they are rolling out a new EMR. as for the point about the patient population- there is a definite paucity in ER admissions, which is concerning in that you may not have a chance to establish a new diagnosis as often as you might in other hospitals. but the argument that every insured person in boston will head elsewhere is soft. they are obviously seeing enough patients to keep the hospital running, and i would imagine that by virtue of keeping the training program small, your census numbers are comparable to other city programs. as for the program director- he seemed like a nice, affable guy. but you're right- the leadership has been in place for a long time and there doesn't seem to be any impetus for change. that being said, the format of the tufts program is surprisingly unique and some people with subspecialty practice in mind may favor it.

 

[sdndoc]

UPMC vs University of Michigan

Would be happy at both. Liked Pitt a bit more but Michigan seems to have a better rep. Interested in cardiology.

Thanks!


PS. In response to the above...residents at Tufts seemed very tight on interview day. Would be a great program I think, downsides were small program, no VA, H&P are still by hand and EMRs don't fully integrate. Upside I think is definitely the residents.

 

[amine2086]

UPMC vs University of Michigan

Would be happy at both. Liked Pitt a bit more but Michigan seems to have a better rep. Interested in cardiology.

Thanks!


PS. In response to the above...residents at Tufts seemed very tight on interview day. Would be a great program I think, downsides were small program, no VA, H&P are still by hand and EMRs don't fully integrate. Upside I think is definitely the residents.

In addition to what you mentioned, pittsburgh is a better place to live than Ann Arbor. But, you can't go wrong with either. So, you may as well flip a coin if location is not BIG on your list. Just my (a fellow applicant) $0.02.

 

[GTV]

How would you guys compare UCLA and Michigan? Loved both programs and felt that the residents seemed very happy at each. Michigan's fellowship match list seemed a little stronger (cards) and I came away with the impression that they maybe had more unique research opportunities than UCLA did. Basically, I would be totally fine with either, but wondered if anyone had any other insight on how to differentiate the two (besides location).

 

[timbuktu]

I've got Utah and Colorado as my top two, but I'm having trouble ranking my next four: Virginia Mason, Kaiser San Francisco, U of Arizona, Mayo Scottsdale. Thoughts?

 

[gutonc]

I've got Utah and Colorado as my top two, but I'm having trouble ranking my next four: Virginia Mason, Kaiser San Francisco, U of Arizona, Mayo Scottsdale. Thoughts?

UA
VM
Miracle Whip
KSF

 

[Decisions]

3 Tiers and 3 Questions

MY FAVORITES

1 - Jefferson
2 - Yale
3 - Columbia

QUESTION - Is it crazy to put Jeff above Yale and Columbia? I know Columbia is by far the strongest reputation on my list, but does that really matter? It seems like you can match into whichever specialty you want to coming from all these university programs. The only difference is that coming from Columbia you'll land a big name fellowship instead of a mid-tier fellowship. But in the end it seems like this doesn't mean much when it comes to getting a job.

SO, would it be foolish not to put Columbia # 1? I’m mainly worried that Columbia residency will be a real grind. On the other hand, I imagine Jeff and Yale being a less difficult 3 years. However I have heard that Jeff is somewhat rough as well with private attendings and longer hours than the impression you get from interview day...



NEXT TIER

4? - NS/LIJ
5? - UIC
6? - Brown

QUESTION - Don't really know how to rank these. Does Brown's reputation really mean more than NS/LIJ or UIC? Looking at fellowship match lists, all 3 of these places seem VERY similar quality, mainly keep their own residents. So I don't know why on this forum people consider reputation as Brown > NSLIJ >> UIC.



LAST TIER

7 - Beth Israel NYC
8 - Tufts
9 - Montefiore
10- Georgetown
11- U of Maryland
12- St. Luke's-Roosevelt

QUESTION - Is it foolish to rank a community program like BI higher than these university places? From interview day, it seems like 97%+ of people at beth israel match into their specialty of choice (with about 2-3 each for GI/Cards/Heme every year). So how is this much different than a university program? The people that want a fellowship seem to all get it… (although they match at lower tier programs)


PS - don't know what my future career plans are but would like to keep all options open (specialty vs GIM vs nontraditional medicine careers, Academic vs PP, etc...)

 

[trickster123]

3 Tiers and 3 Questions

MY FAVORITES

1 - Jefferson
2 - Yale
3 - Columbia

QUESTION - Is it crazy to put Jeff above Yale and Columbia? I know Columbia is by far the strongest reputation on my list, but does that really matter? It seems like you can match into whichever specialty you want to coming from all these university programs. The only difference is that coming from Columbia you'll land a big name fellowship instead of a mid-tier fellowship. But in the end it seems like this doesn't mean much when it comes to getting a job.

SO, would it be foolish not to put Columbia # 1? I’m mainly worried that Columbia residency will be a real grind. On the other hand, I imagine Jeff and Yale being a less difficult 3 years. However I have heard that Jeff is somewhat rough as well with private attendings and longer hours than the impression you get from interview day...



NEXT TIER

? - NS/LIJ
? - UIC
? - Brown

QUESTION - Don't really know how to rank these. Does Brown's reputation really mean more than NS/LIJ or UIC? Looking at fellowship match lists, all 3 of these places seem VERY similar quality, mainly keep their own residents. So I don't know why on this forum people consider reputation as Brown > NSLIJ >> UIC.



LAST TIER

7 - Beth Israel NYC
8 - Tufts
9 - Montefiore
10- Georgetown
11- U of Maryland
12- St. Luke's-Roosevelt

QUESTION - Is it foolish to rank a community program like BI higher than these university places? From interview day, it seems like 97%+ of people at beth israel match into their specialty of choice (with about 2-3 each for GI/Cards/Heme every year). So how is this much different than a university program? The people that want a fellowship seem to all get it… (although they match at lower tier programs)


PS - don't know what my future career plans are but would like to keep all options open (specialty vs GIM vs nontraditional medicine careers, Academic vs PP, etc...)

If I were in your shoes, I would put Columbia #1 mainly because of reputation lol...however, with that said, you gotta go where you're gonna be happy... I am actually ranking a community program above academic ones mainly due to geographical convenience...once the novelty of bragging where you are training at wears off you're stuck with 3 years of being in a hell-hole

 

[NaOut]

Three questions.
1. Lets say one is interested in GI, should one rank the better IM program or the better GI program higher? For eg Duke is a better IM program than Sinai but Sinai's Gi program is much better.
2. Has anyone seen Nwern match list lately? Its as good if not better than a lot of top places ie duke, ucsf etc. How come it is not held in as high regard as these places? This was on their website: Cardiology
Joe Campbell – Cleveland Clinic
Jacob Chacko – University of Illinois
Chintan Desai – Johns Hopkins
Andy Kott – Vanderbilt University
Ike Okwuosa – Johns Hopkins
Yana Svetlichnaya – University of California – San Francisco
3. What are your thoughts on Sinai vs BID vs Yale Vs Cornell. I liked Sinai and BID more on interview day. Is the Harvard name at BID just water weight or is it something to take into consideration? Thanks!

 

[IM2GI]

How would you guys compare UCLA and Michigan? Loved both programs and felt that the residents seemed very happy at each. Michigan's fellowship match list seemed a little stronger (cards) and I came away with the impression that they maybe had more unique research opportunities than UCLA did. Basically, I would be totally fine with either, but wondered if anyone had any other insight on how to differentiate the two (besides location).

Well, they are pretty much polar opposites in terms of city and cost of living. Michigan may be a touch "better" but both are well respected programs where you will be able to get a top notch fellowship if you work hard and are liked.

You really need to think about where you want to live. Do you like big cities, high population, urban? Are you single? Do you prefer a smaller college town, with outdoor activities, cheap cost of living, big-time college sports?

Personally, it would come down to which city I could see myself living in as both are great programs.

 

[IM2GI]

3 Tiers and 3 Questions

MY FAVORITES

1 - Jefferson
2 - Yale
3 - Columbia

QUESTION - Is it crazy to put Jeff above Yale and Columbia? I know Columbia is by far the strongest reputation on my list, but does that really matter? It seems like you can match into whichever specialty you want to coming from all these university programs. The only difference is that coming from Columbia you'll land a big name fellowship instead of a mid-tier fellowship. But in the end it seems like this doesn't mean much when it comes to getting a job.

SO, would it be foolish not to put Columbia # 1? I’m mainly worried that Columbia residency will be a real grind. On the other hand, I imagine Jeff and Yale being a less difficult 3 years. However I have heard that Jeff is somewhat rough as well with private attendings and longer hours than the impression you get from interview day...



NEXT TIER

4? - NS/LIJ
5? - UIC
6? - Brown

QUESTION - Don't really know how to rank these. Does Brown's reputation really mean more than NS/LIJ or UIC? Looking at fellowship match lists, all 3 of these places seem VERY similar quality, mainly keep their own residents. So I don't know why on this forum people consider reputation as Brown > NSLIJ >> UIC.



LAST TIER

7 - Beth Israel NYC
8 - Tufts
9 - Montefiore
10- Georgetown
11- U of Maryland
12- St. Luke's-Roosevelt

QUESTION - Is it foolish to rank a community program like BI higher than these university places? From interview day, it seems like 97%+ of people at beth israel match into their specialty of choice (with about 2-3 each for GI/Cards/Heme every year). So how is this much different than a university program? The people that want a fellowship seem to all get it… (although they match at lower tier programs)


PS - don't know what my future career plans are but would like to keep all options open (specialty vs GIM vs nontraditional medicine careers, Academic vs PP, etc...)

On your first question, not at all. Rank them as you like them. Do you really want to live in NYC, with all the benefits and negatives (tons to do, great single scene, but expensive as **** and lousy housing)? If not, then its probably not worth putting up with the negatives of a NYC program. People put up with them because they love the city. I dont know about Columbia medicine, but I know the GI program is considered fairly malignant.

Most people would probably rank columbia > Yale = Jefferson. Yales IM residency just doesn't have the clout of its undergrad or medical school. It will impress your friends and family more than Jefferson however. I would much rather live in Center City Philly though than New Haven.

Second question, I only interviewed at Brown of those programs, cant really help ya. Brown was OK.

Third question, yes it is foolish UNLESS you 100% are sure you want to just go into private practice and not do a fellowship. Even then, you are giving up a lot of future options by not going to a University program. What if you fall in love with cardiology? If you go to a community program you will be in rough shape. I strongly advise you to go to a University based program > Community. That said, by this point in your list given your above interviews, this is probably an irrelevant point. Unless you are a total train wreck on interviews...

 

[IM2GI]

Three questions.
1. Lets say one is interested in GI, should one rank the better IM program or the better GI program higher? For eg Duke is a better IM program than Sinai but Sinai's Gi program is much better.
2. Has anyone seen Nwern match list lately? Its as good if not better than a lot of top places ie duke, ucsf etc. How come it is not held in as high regard as these places? This was on their website: Cardiology
Joe Campbell – Cleveland Clinic
Jacob Chacko – University of Illinois
Chintan Desai – Johns Hopkins
Andy Kott – Vanderbilt University
Ike Okwuosa – Johns Hopkins
Yana Svetlichnaya – University of California – San Francisco
3. What are your thoughts on Sinai vs BID vs Yale Vs Cornell. I liked Sinai and BID more on interview day. Is the Harvard name at BID just water weight or is it something to take into consideration? Thanks!

All things being equal, go to the best IM program you can. Unless you really want to go to that specific GI program, you will have more options/mobility coming from a very strong IM program. Plus what if you end up not loving GI?

 

[trickster123]

Three questions.
1. Lets say one is interested in GI, should one rank the better IM program or the better GI program higher? For eg Duke is a better IM program than Sinai but Sinai's Gi program is much better.
2. Has anyone seen Nwern match list lately? Its as good if not better than a lot of top places ie duke, ucsf etc. How come it is not held in as high regard as these places? This was on their website: Cardiology
Joe Campbell – Cleveland Clinic
Jacob Chacko – University of Illinois
Chintan Desai – Johns Hopkins
Andy Kott – Vanderbilt University
Ike Okwuosa – Johns Hopkins
Yana Svetlichnaya – University of California – San Francisco
3. What are your thoughts on Sinai vs BID vs Yale Vs Cornell. I liked Sinai and BID more on interview day. Is the Harvard name at BID just water weight or is it something to take into consideration? Thanks!

If you're interested in cards, do you go to Cleveland Clinic IM because their cardiology is strong?.... General consensus is go to top IM program...

 

[IM2GI]

If you're interested in cards, do you go to Cleveland Clinic IM because their cardiology is strong?.... General consensus is go to top IM program...

I dont know if this was a question or if you are trying to make a point, but no I would still go to the best IM program you can.

 

[hago2014]

Hi all...anyone willing to help give me ranking advice via Private Message to protect anonymity? I would greatly appreciate it...