**Official 2023 Ortho PASS/Interviews/Match/Non-Match**

[CaliDDS1986]

have you been interviewed all 5 times?

Nope 3 cycles I had 1 interview but did not match. On the plus side I paid off all my student loans and have about 500k in savings. I guess I’m just torn between keeping the money invested and letting it grow vs using it for GSO. Might be a better return on investment keeping it invested for 30 years….

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[blablabla1]

Nope 3 cycles I had 1 interview but did not match. On the plus side I paid off all my student loans and have about 500k in savings. I guess I’m just torn between keeping the money invested and letting it grow vs using it for GSO. Might be a better return on investment keeping it invested for 30 years….

You would be losing 3 years of income potential + most of your savings. Depending on how much you make a year right now (I’m guessing around 180k?), that could be almost a 1 million dollar swing in finances

The better financial move by far is to invest your savings. However, if general dentistry makes you miserable, then applying to GSO may be worth it despite the huge financial and time sacrifice you’d be making

 

[charlestweed]

Hi all, I’ve applied about 5 cycles now and haven’t match anywhere. Is it worth it for me to go to Georgia if I can go in? I will not have any loans.

This shows that the pathway to become an orthodontist is not easy and that ortho is still a very “hot” specialty (despite the oversaturation and increase in number of GPs who do ortho). You are not the only one. I am sure there are plenty of people who couldn’t get in after several attempts. There are just too many applicants and the number of residency spots is limited. Even Georgia has no problem filling all of its seats. That’s why it increased the class size to 45.

Getting into Georgia is not easy either. Not everyone can get into this program. According the program’s website, you have to show proof that you can pay for the tuition when you apply there. It’s like buying a house. Not everyone can buy a house because one must show proof of having good income. If you are broke, have poor credit history, and have no one to co-sign for the private student loan, you can’t apply there. I wouldn't quality for this program if such program existed at the time that I applied because I was a broke dental student. I don’t think one can get the government loans when he/she goes there. The program does offer full scholarship (free tuition) for one resident. I am sure it’s not easy to earn this scholarship.

Just remember that your greatest asset is your income earning ability. You have saved $500k (and paid off debt) working as a GP. You must have good work ethic. There’s no reason why you can do the same working as an ortho.

 

[stylinistamtt]

Has anyone heard from Eastman or know when offers will be sent?

 

[artist2022]

How about everyone chills out, thanks!

 

[porcelainshadeOM1]

Has anyone heard from Eastman or know when offers will be sent?

Probably before the 14th. One cannot withdraw from the match after the rank submission deadline.

 

[Ortho Applicant 27]

Does Jacksonville send second round of acceptances or waitlist notifications for the Ortho residency program?

 

[Jamesxxixx45]

If a program director tells us in the interview that they will rank us high and hope that we will do the same how likely is it we will match to that school if we rank them #1? What are the chances they say this to many people?

 

[dolichodefender]

If a program director tells us in the interview that they will rank us high and hope that we will do the same how likely is it we will match to that school if we rank them #1? What are the chances they say this to many people?

I think the match algorithm is made in such a way that we are genuinely supposed to rank programs in order of where we want to go. How high you think a program ranks you should not affect your personal rank list.
Directors might be saying that to everyone to increase their own chances of getting who they want.

 

[Jamesxxixx45]

I think the match algorithm is made in such a way that we are genuinely supposed to rank programs in order of where we want to go. How high you think a program ranks you should not affect your personal rank list.
Directors might be saying that to everyone to increase their own chances of getting who they want.

Wouldn't it be decreasing their chances of getting who they want if they even tell the applicants they're not interested in to rank their program high?

 

[dolichodefender]

I feel like theres two ways this can go down:
A. The school actually ranked you high, and thus if you rank them #1 you match in.
B. The school didn’t rank you that high, and if you rank them #1 then you don't match w them.
But theres a third option, and reason why we should always rank in order of true preference:
C. The school ranks you high, but you put them in a lower rank. As long as you dont match into any schools ranked higher than this school, you will still match into the school. It doesnt lower your chance of getting in, the algorithm just first attempts to match you into the schools you ranked higher first.

 

[dolichodefender]

Wouldn't it be decreasing their chances of getting who they want if they even tell the applicants they're not interested in to rank their program high?

If they rank us in order of who they really want, and convince all of us to rank them #1, it will get them the students they want. *assuming my understanding of the algorithm is correct

 

[Gustavo dos Santos]

If a program director tells us in the interview that they will rank us high and hope that we will do the same how likely is it we will match to that school if we rank them #1? What are the chances they say this to many people?

this video does a great job explaining the match.

TL;DW - It is always in your best interest to rank where you want to go first. Ignore anything a program director says about ranking them highly. Shouldn’t affect your rank order at all. As long as one program ranked you to match (if they have 6 spots and they rank you in their top 6) , you are guaranteed a match regardless of where you ranked them.

 

[dentalworld101_]

Rochester went out?

 

[stylinistamtt]

Yes, just got a decline letter.

 

[sparkledoc4]

does anyone know what time match results are released on Nov 21st? (EST)

 

[dentalworld101_]

I think 7 AM

 

[momjeans]

Any advice for getting into research if you have been out of school for some time and are no longer associated with a learning institution? Looking to improve my application for next year. I’ve emailed researchers at two orthodontic programs with my resume and intentions but haven’t gotten any response. Thank you!

 

[Big Time Hoosier]

Hypothetical Question:

Student A only got 1 interview and ranks school "X" #1
Student B got 10 interviews and ranks school "X" #2
School X ranks Student B #3 and they rank Student A #5

Assuming only one of them can get into school X, who will get in? Trying to determine how much weight is given to ranking a school #1 if you're not super competitive

Student B will, assuming they ranked the school and did not match to a program they ranked higher. This also assumes that whoever the program ranked as 1 and 2 did not Match there.

You need to watch this, because it doesn’t seem you have a solid grasp on how the Match works.



Big Hoss

 

[porcelainshadeOM1]

Hypothetical Question:

Student A only got 1 interview and ranks school "X" #1
Student B got 10 interviews and ranks school "X" #2
School X ranks Student B #3 and they rank Student A #5

Assuming only one of them can get into school X, who will get in? Trying to determine how much weight is given to ranking a school #1 if you're not super competitive

Student B will still get the spot if he doesn't match to his #1 rank.

 

[gryffindor]

Hypothetical Question:

Student A only got 1 interview and ranks school "X" #1
Student B got 10 interviews and ranks school "X" #2
School X ranks Student B #3 and they rank Student A #5

Assuming only one of them can get into school X, who will get in? Trying to determine how much weight is given to ranking a school #1 if you're not super competitive

"Weight" doesn't matter. What you left out here is how many spots School X has. If they have 5 spots, Student A will definitely get in, and Student B will also get in if he/she isn't ranked high enough by their #1 choice. If the school has 4 spots, Student A might still get in. Student B's fate remains the same. wi

Edit - I reread your hypothetical and if only 1 of them can get in, it will Student B only if the program has at least 3 spots. But Student B could still get in at his/her #1 choice. If the program has only 2 spots, then it's very possible neither of them will get in. Again, you left out how may spots at the program which changes the answer with each scenario.

Every year, people don't understand how match works. Your hypothetical scenario shows you don't understand it either. I read everything and Big Hoss did not say anything unprofessional. If anything, the video posted was to try and help you make sense of match.

 

[MIIMtodent]

does anyone know what time match results are released on Nov 21st? (EST)

Last year I received the email at 7:06 central time so around 8 eastern.

 

[artist2022]

I'm going in and deleting the off-topic posts that add no value to the thread. Keep your posts professional and to the point, instead of argumentive and accusatory.

Posts that continue to derail this thread will be deleted and the offending user will be temporarily banned from the thread.

Thanks.

 

[Docortho1212]

MATCH deadline to verify and submit rank list is tomorrow. Don’t forget and good luck.

 

[dentalworld101_]

anyone anxioussssss af?!

 

[paamp]

I'm going in and deleting the off-topic posts that add no value to the thread. Keep your posts professional and to the point, instead of argumentive and accusatory.

Posts that continue to derail this thread will be deleted and the offending user will be temporarily banned from the thread.

Thanks.

Doing God's work 👏. For reapplicants who fared better this cycle (in terms of number of interviews since match hasn't been released yet) what did you do to improve your respective applications? What would you have done differently to be more successful in your first cycle?

 

[Docortho1212]

Doing God's work 👏. For reapplicants who fared better this cycle (in terms of number of interviews since match hasn't been released yet) what did you do to improve your respective applications? What would you have done differently to be more successful in your first cycle?

More site visits. Some of this s h i t is who you know. Nothing one can do about the GPA that’s pretty much set in stone.

Outside of taking GRE or ADAT. the academic marks is what it is.

Strong rec letters. I even helped draft and edit a couple of them for my recommenders. Just to make sure it was sound and strong.

And my personal y statement was way better. And submitted all applications the first week applications were open.

Lastly followed up with each program to make sure every application is complete and under review.


Site visits is the best cheat code overall. If the program will allow it of course.

 

[Ortho Applicant 27]

Does Jacksonville send second round of acceptances or waitlist notifications for the Ortho residency program?

Anyone knows about this?

 

[dbkv]

Anyone knows about this?

I can see them waiting until after match

 

[Ortho Applicant 27]

I can see them waiting until after match

Thank you for your response, any idea what are the chances of getting a position in post match cycle, if they ask people to pull out from match during acceptances?

 

[dbkv]

First time applying and I didn’t go to dental school in the states, I can’t comment on the chances of getting in.

They can’t ask you to pull out of match once your list is submitted. But I can see them sending out acceptances / invitations after match. (Assuming people who don’t match will reach out to the school to express interest).

My friend got an interview invite around feb.

 

[Ortho Applicant 27]

First time applying and I didn’t go to dental school in the states, I can’t comment on the chances of getting in.

They can’t ask you to pull out of match once your list is submitted. But I can see them sending out acceptances / invitations after match. (Assuming people who don’t match will reach out to the school to express interest).

My friend got an interview invite around feb.

Thank you for the info, Feb of the same year (the year in which the program starts)? I didn't go to dental school in states either. Hopefully it works out. Keeping fingers crossed.

 

[dbkv]

Thank you for the info, Feb of the same year (the year in which the program starts)? I didn't go to dental school in states either. Hopefully it works out. Keeping fingers crossed.

Yes the invite was Feb 2022 to start July 2022

 

[Faefly]

if one decided not to rank any program, but particpate in phase 2.
Should we withdraw?
cause the page says
Phase II Only: If you plan to participate only in Phase II of the Match, you should not withdraw from Phase I of the Match. Your status shown in the NMS Match System should remain Active, and you will be able to submit rankings for Phase II of the Match beginning on December 12, 2022

 

[dolichodefender]

if one decided not to rank any program, but particpate in phase 2.
Should we withdraw?
cause the page says
Phase II Only: If you plan to participate only in Phase II of the Match, you should not withdraw from Phase I of the Match. Your status shown in the NMS Match System should remain Active, and you will be able to submit rankings for Phase II of the Match beginning on December 12, 2022

I would not withdraw, might be difficult to get back into the match system which is tied to your adea pass application

 

[Penn2024]

Good luck everyone! It is a really stressful process but so worth it in the end. I went through the process last cycle and matched my #1 so if anyone has any questions i would be happy to answer! I have nothing to do for the next couple weeks waiting for my program to start

Here is the list from last year so everyone can have a rough idea of when things were sent out:

1. 7/28(email) University of Oklahoma 10/21 or 11/5
2. 8/2(email) University of Texas San Antonio in person "get to know you" visits in August and September followed by October zoom interview
3. 8/4(email) Iowa 9/10
4. 8/25(email) University of Colorado 9/30 or 10/1 or 10/4 in-person interview
5. 8/30(email) University of Illinois at Chicago 10/13 or 10/14 or 10/15
6. 8/31(email) Medical University of South Carolina 10/15 or 10/22
7. 9/1(email) Indiana University School of Dentistry 10/7 and 10/8 in-person interview
8. 9/1(email) Seton Hill University 9/24 and 9/25
9. 9/2(unknown) UBC 10/30 virtual interview
10. 9/7 (email) Mayo Clinic 10/8 or 10/15 virtual interview
11. 9/8 (email) UMKC 10/18 in person interview with resident social night before
12. 9/8 (call) Pitt “visit” and interview Nov 5th or 8th
13. 9/10 (email) Arizona in-person interview Oct 4th or 5th
14. 9/13 (email) Washington virtual interview Oct 11th with Oct 10th virtual social
15. 9/13 (email) OHSU virtual interview Oct 13th or 14th
16. 9/13 (call and email) University of Kentucky virtual interview Oct 25 or 26 w/virtual social Oct 24
17. 9/14 (email) University of Tennessee in-person interview Oct 18 w/ social Oct 17th
18. 9/14 (email) University of Florida Oct 18th with social Oct 17th
19. 9/15 (phone) University of Michigan Oct 11th or 18th virtual interview
20. 9/15 (phone) UNC-Chapel Hill Oct 18 or 19 virtual interview
21. 9/16 (phone) Nebraska Oct 5 or 6 virtual interview
22. 9/17 (email) Columbia University Oct. 18 or 19 virtual interview
23. 9/17 (phone) Texas A&M Oct. 26, 27, or 28 in-person interview
24. 9/17 (E-mail) Ohio State - October 11, 12 via zoom
25. 9/17 (email) LSU October 21st or 22nd in person interview or Zoom if preferred
26. 9/17 (email) UCSF October 26 or 27 virtual interview
27. 9/17 (email) UCLA October 4 or 5 with virtual meet and greet on Oct 3rd
28. 9/20 (email) UTSD Houston October 13/14 or 14/15, in person with social the night before
29. 9/20 (email) Boston University November 1 zoom interview
30. 9/21 (email) CWRU Oct 27 or 28 in-person interview with social on the evening of the 27th
31. 9/22 (email) St. Barnabas Oct 20 zoom with social on the evening of Oct 18 or 19
32. 9/22 (email) Buffalo Oct 15 or 18th in person interview
33. 9/22 (email) UOP Oct 18 or 19 in person with social the night before
34. 9/23 (call and email) Roseman Oct 12 or 13 zoom with social on the afternoon of each day
35. 9/24 (email) NOVA Oct 22nd virtual interview with social
36. 9/24 (email) Marquette October 21 or 22 in person social on Oct. 21st evening
37. 9/27 (email) Montefiore October 6th or 8th virtual interview
38. 9/27 (phone) Loma Linda Oct 18 or 19 on zoom
39. 9/27 (email) NOVA ROUND 2, Oct 28th virtual interview with social
40. 9/27 (email) University of Alabama at Birmingham, October 21st or 22nd
41. 9/27 (email) UNLV, 10/22 (Virtual)
42. 9/28 (email) University of Maryland, Oct. 20 or 21 in-person, with social the day before
43. 9/28 (email) NOVA ROUND 3, Nov 1 virtual interview with social
44. 9/29 (email) University of Connecticut, virtual 10/21 or 10/22
45. 9/29 (email) VCU, in person 10/28 AND 10/29
46. 9/30 (email) Saint Louis University, virtual 10/25-10/28
47. 9/30 (email) Rochester, virtual 10/14 or 10/18
48. 9/30 (phone) Albert Einstein, interview offered, declined invite (didn't hear dates), all virtual
49. 10/1 (email) Rutgers, virtual 10/20 or 10/22
50. 10/1 (phone) BronxCare, in-person 10/20 with social the day before
51. 10/2 (email) Tufts University, virtual 10/28 and 10/29 with virtual social and school tour
52. 10/4 (email) University of Pennsylvania, Oct. 20 virtual
53. 10/4 (email) University of Detroit Mercy, 11/4 or 11/5 virtual
54. 10/4 (email) West Virginia University, 10/25 virtual
55. 10/6 (email) Jacksonville, October 12-14 virtual
56. 10/6 (email) Stony Brook, Nov 4th virtual (email mentioned 10/28 as a date as well)
57. 10/6 (email) Louisville, October 21st or 22nd virtual
58. 10/6 (email) Temple University, 10/26 & 10/20 (In person)
59. 10/6 (email) University of Minnesota, 10/24 social & 10/25 interview (in person)
60. 10/8 (email) New York University NYU, 10/21 social & 10/22 interview (virtual)
61. 10/12 (email) Maimonides Medical Center, 11/9 (virtual)
62. 10/12 (email) Harvard, 11/1 virtual (social also 11/1 in the evening)
63. 10/26 (email) Howard, 11/3 virtual

If I applied for Ortho and didnt get in, and want to apply the next year, during my gap year what is the best thing to do? (GPR, AEGD, or fill in blank____)

 

[Docortho1212]

If I applied for Ortho and didnt get in, and want to apply the next year, during my gap year what is the best thing to do? (GPR, AEGD, or fill in blank____)

The best thing to do would be to strengthen your application by any means. Perhaps reach out to a couple of program directors and see what tips they may give.

Gpr, aegd hardly ever provide ortho experience. I would work as a GP and find an orthodontist(s) to shadow And write the best rec letter possible.

Perhaps involve yourself with Clear aligner cases as a GP to get your beak wet with ortho experience.

Personally I completed a GPR, and I am working as a GP now. Albeit, all of my recommendations came from faculty from my residency. I even met my mentor at the hospital I was working at. So GPR is not a bad look but don’t count on any ortho experience or even coming into contact with an orthodontist.

 

[gryffindor]

The best thing to do would be to strengthen your application by any means. Perhaps reach out to a couple of program directors and see what tips they may give.

Gpr, aegd hardly ever provide ortho experience. I would work as a GP and find an orthodontist(s) to shadow And write the best rec letter possible.

Perhaps involve yourself with Clear aligner cases as a GP to get your beak wet with ortho experience.

Personally I completed a GPR, and I am working as a GP now. Albeit, all of my recommendations came from faculty from my residency. I even met my mentor at the hospital I was working at. So GPR is not a bad look but don’t count on any ortho experience or even coming into contact with an orthodontist.

One has to do their research to find which GPRs have orthodontic experience, lectures, and orthodontist attendings on staff. They are definitely out there.

I would not recommend dabbling in clear aligners.

 

[Parrot$84]

Best of luck to all!

 

[dolichodefender]

T minus ~16 hours!

 

[phenomenal]

Good luck everyone!!

 

[dentalworld101_]

So what time we expecting it again?!

 

[Inanna234]

About 8 AM eastern time.

So what time we expecting it again?!

 

[Kattman]

No matter what happens for all of us tomorrow, it's been an honor to be among such an esteemed and accomplished group. Thank you for all the time and effort that has been put into this platform. There is no doubt in my mind that all of you will be wildly successful in your professional and personal endeavors. It's been a genuine privilege, and I wish all of you the very best as the future orthodontists of America! Cheers!

 

[jcldds]

So what time we expecting it again?!

On the Match website It says to be expected by 12:00pm ET

 

[Lemillion]

On the Match website It says to be expected by 12:00pm ET

They typically email at 8 AM eastern time but will post the official result on the website at 12 PM along with post match spots too!

 

[wafflemire]

Congrats ahead of time to all who match tomorrow! Use this template to reduce the number of questions and to help those who don't match and for following years!
Name of Ortho Program:
Dental School Attended:
Year Earned DMD/DDS:
AEGD/GPR/Fellowship/Residency:
International Student (yes/no):
NBDE Part I/II scores:
ADAT Score:
GRE Score:
Class Rank:
Match/Non-Match:
Externship(s)/where:
Research:
Extracurriculars:
Programs Applied to/Interview Invites/Interviews Attended/Programs Ranked:

 

[jcldds]

Nothing yet?

 

[Inanna234]

Nothing yet?

Yea, nothing yet

 

[UKtoUSdentist]

Nothing…refreshing like crazy!