Pitt vs Feinberg (Northwestern)

[3838]

Okay, so here's the deal...I just got off the wait list at Northwestern. Back in March, Northwestern was my top choice, and I was heartbroken at being wait listed. I loved the curriculum, integration/focus on public health, and the early clinical exposure. That said, after second look at Pitt, I picked Pitt over another school I was considering. I fell pretty hard for Pitt. Interview day at Pitt, I was so impressed by the facilities and the wealth of research opportunities available at the school. What held me back from loving it was that I though the students were stressed. My interaction with one specific student who was struggling with relationship problems at the time (really really nice student, but was just having a hard time at the moment) and had not "chosen" the school for herself influenced this. During second look, those concerns were put to rest and I found that I meshed very well with the students at Pitt. At this point, it was a no-brainer. I knew I would be happy at Pitt and I actually quite liked the city/the size of the city. Right now, my mindset is very much that I will get a better clinical experience at Pittsburgh, that the environment is conducive to sort of "carving your own path," which I love (compared to a more structured program at Northwestern). Early clinical exposure is something that a lot of students at pitt seem to do for themselves (through shadowing). But the city of Chicago is calling to me. I absolutely love Chicago, and the weather isn't nearly as gloomy in the midwest as it is in Pittsburgh. My dad is of the view that any young person in their twenties should jump at the chance of living in a big city; he did his residency in Brooklyn, NY and would not have traded the experience of living in/near NYC for the world.

Both schools cost the same.

Some points about me/points it would be helpful if you address:

1. Public Health and advocacy (which go hand in hand) will be a major component of my future career, and I want to learn how integrate public health and medicine. This might be too specific of a point for anyone to actually comment on.
2. I am a pretty creative, self-guided person. I like finding my own direction and following it and not being limited in my ability to do that.
3. Any opinions on the curriculum at Northwestern, the degree to which you find the early clinical exposure helpful in your learning, the frequency of said exposure, and whether this exposure is basically just shadowing?
4. The quality of the clinical experience at either school/how much you believe that actually matters in medical school.
5. I'm a complete and total extrovert. Spending time with people helps me unwind and gives me energy.

Another question: anyone know if the research Northwestern requires is funded? I know that at Pitt, you tack yourself on to something a mentor is already doing/has funding for.
I really just want to make an informed decision...

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Serous Demilune]

Okay, so here's the deal...I just got off the wait list at Northwestern. Back in March, Northwestern was my top choice, and I was heartbroken at being wait listed. I loved the curriculum, integration/focus on public health, and the early clinical exposure. That said, after second look at Pitt, I picked Pitt over another school I was considering. I fell pretty hard for Pitt. Interview day at Pitt, I was so impressed by the facilities and the wealth of research opportunities available at the school. What held me back from loving it was that I though the students were stressed. My interaction with one specific student who was struggling with relationship problems at the time (really really nice student, but was just having a hard time at the moment) and had not "chosen" the school for herself influenced this. During second look, those concerns were put to rest and I found that I meshed very well with the students at Pitt. At this point, it was a no-brainer. I knew I would be happy at Pitt and I actually quite liked the city/the size of the city. Right now, my mindset is very much that I will get a better clinical experience at Pittsburgh, that the environment is conducive to sort of "carving your own path," which I love (compared to a more structured program at Northwestern). Early clinical exposure is something that a lot of students at pitt seem to do for themselves (through shadowing). But the city of Chicago is calling to me. I absolutely love Chicago, and the weather isn't nearly as gloomy in the midwest as it is in Pittsburgh. My dad is of the view that any young person in their twenties should jump at the chance of living in a big city; he did his residency in Brooklyn, NY and would not have traded the experience of living in/near NYC for the world.

Both schools cost the same.

Some points about me/points it would be helpful if you address:

1. Public Health and advocacy (which go hand in hand) will be a major component of my future career, and I want to learn how integrate public health and medicine. This might be too specific of a point for anyone to actually comment on.
2. I am a pretty creative, self-guided person. I like finding my own direction and following it and not being limited in my ability to do that.
3. Any opinions on the curriculum at Northwestern, the degree to which you find the early clinical exposure helpful in your learning, the frequency of said exposure, and whether this exposure is basically just shadowing?
4. The quality of the clinical experience at either school/how much you believe that actually matters in medical school.
5. I'm a complete and total extrovert. Spending time with people helps me unwind and gives me energy.

Another question: anyone know if the research Northwestern requires is funded? I know that at Pitt, you tack yourself on to something a mentor is already doing/has funding for.
I really just want to make an informed decision...

I can't imagine that both schools don't have funding for research, at least in the summer after 1st year. Even the lowliest state schools tend to have something to contribute.
In terms of location I would have to agree with your dad, being from Brooklyn myself. Perhaps I'm biased but I think living in a big city will give you the opportunity to get your head out of med school every once in a while and stay in touch with the real world. It is very easy to get lost in the med school bubble and lose touch with reality during the first two years. However, plenty of people love living in Pittsburgh as well, so there's no wrong choice really. Gun to my head I would choose Northwestern though.

 

[brrenters]

Both schools should offer equally good research opportunities, and finding funding at either should not be a problem. In terms of public health, it seemed like there were a good number of people who enroll in the mph program there. Can't really comment much on the curriculum as I'm an incoming student

Personally, location was the biggest factor that separated the two schools for me. Chicago is absolutely beautiful, and the location of Feinberg right in the heart of downtown is unbeatable. I know I will be able to unwind and blow off steam much easier in a city like Chicago. I wasn't too enamored by Pittsburgh, but it seemed most students at the interview day were content in the city (plus cheaper housing).

At the end of the day, you have to decide what will be the most conducive environment to you succeeding and living happily during the next four years. For me, I felt the curriculum at both schools would prepare me equally well, and I would have equal opportunities to set up shadowing. Those things being equal, location really set NU apart, and I knew I would be able to study/stay motivated better in a city that felt more energetic and vibrant.

 

[3838]

So far, this is my pro, con list. Anyone who went to second look willing to PM me?

Pitt -

+cheap housing @$700/month
+larger hospital system
+ more research funding
+I seemed to mesh pretty well with the people that I met here during second look
+Pittsburgh is a manageably sized city
+highly ranked school of public health
-two year curriculum
-ranked p/f

Northwestern -
+I love Chicago and how much there is to do
+ shortened 18 month preclinical curriculum that is completely integrated
+ unranked p/f
- hospital system seems less extensive/impressive than UPMC
- Chicago is expensive. Housing will cost me 1400 or more
-living in a big city might be overwhelming (haven't lived in such a big place since I was four!)
-I don't know what my class will be like because I didn't go to second look

 

[capnncrunch]

Honestly, I'm just speaking through your passion for each school, I feel like you should attend Pitt. If you just look at your pros/cons list, Pitt is severely outweighing northwestern. Personally, I love Chicago (Bears fan!) and would love to attend Feinberg because I feel their unranked p/f allows for a more "teamwork-esque" atmosphere and a lot less stress (unlike Pitt).

All in all, if I were you, then I would consider where you'd find yourself living in the future and residency. Do you have any idea what specialties you've considered? Research the school's residency programs and see if they have strong ties to their med students.

Good luck!

 

[3838]

Honestly, I'm just speaking through your passion for each school, I feel like you should attend Pitt. If you just look at your pros/cons list, Pitt is severely outweighing northwestern. Personally, I love Chicago (Bears fan!) and would love to attend Feinberg because I feel their unranked p/f allows for a more "teamwork-esque" atmosphere and a lot less stress (unlike Pitt).

All in all, if I were you, then I would consider where you'd find yourself living in the future and residency. Do you have any idea what specialties you've considered? Research the school's residency programs and see if they have strong ties to their med students.

Good luck!

I'm torn in half, right now, to be honest. Pitt might have more +'s but the weights are different. Curriculum wise, I like Northwestern's pre-clinical curriculum better hands down. It makes more sense to me and if I were going to design a curriculum to study medicine, I would divide it up the way Northwestern does. 1. First two years - Northwestern wins. 2. Second two years - Pittsburgh has the edge. It's hospitals are just a lot better, in my opinion. I think the clinical training I would receive is hard to match. IMO, it's in the top few outstanding clinical experiences in the country. 3. City wise - Northwestern wins, hands down. Also, I just have this uncomfortable feeling that I will never again be at a better time in my life to enjoy/make the most of a city than now. I didn't get the opportunity in college, something I honestly regret. Residency seems more time consuming while I think I will be past the age of loving city life post-residency. 4. Cost wise - Pittsburgh has an edge of around 8-10K/year. I can't make judgement calls about the research; although Pitt is stronger, I think the scope for public health research would probably be greater in a city like Chicago, in general. Specialties-wise, I have a feeling about OB/GYN, but really it's up in the air.

It's honestly points 2 and 3 that hold the most weight in my mind. IMO clinical training just seems more important than pre-clinical training in the long run of things (I base this opinion on what many physicians have told me). These points have the potential for leaving me with regret. But they're pulling me into opposite corners. Can someone in the know please comment on the quality of Northwestern's clinical training? Or the importance of clinical training in medical school? Or is that something I just shouldn't think too much about until residency?

I need to resolve this in such a way that I can look back on my decision and point to a palpable reason that will make sense even after I am separated from it with the distance of time.

 

[runnergirl6]

I'm torn in half, right now, to be honest. Pitt might have more +'s but the weights are different. Curriculum wise, I like Northwestern's pre-clinical curriculum better hands down. It makes more sense to me and if I were going to design a curriculum to study medicine, I would divide it up the way Northwestern does. 1. First two years - Northwestern wins. 2. Second two years - Pittsburgh has the edge. It's hospitals are just a lot better, in my opinion. I think the clinical training I would receive is hard to match. IMO, it's in the top few outstanding clinical experiences in the country. 3. City wise - Northwestern wins, hands down. Also, I just have this uncomfortable feeling that I will never again be at a better time in my life to enjoy/make the most of a city than now. I didn't get the opportunity in college, something I honestly regret. Residency seems more time consuming while I think I will be past the edge of loving city life post-residency. 4. Cost wise - Pittsburgh has an edge of around 8-10K/year. I can't make judgement calls about the research; although Pitt is stronger, I think the scope for public health research would probably be greater in a city like Chicago, in general. Specialties-wise, I have a feeling about OB/GYN, but really it's up in the air.

It's honestly points 2 and 3 that hold the most weight in my mind. IMO clinical training just seems more important than pre-clinical training in the long run of things (I base this opinion on what many physicians have told me). These points have the potential for leaving me with regret. But they're pulling me into opposite corners. Can someone in know please comment on the quality of Northwestern's clinical training? Or the importance of clinical training in medical school? Or is that something I just shouldn't think too much about until residency?

I need to resolve this in such a way that I can look back on my decision and point to a palpable reason that will make sense even after I am separated from it with the distance of time.

I'm an incoming Northwestern student, so I haven't personally experienced the curriculum or clinical experience yet, but I have heard good things about Northwestern's hospitals/clinical training from students. I don't know anything about Pitt so I can't compare, but at second look I did tours of the Northwestern hospitals and they seemed great. The children's hospital and women's hospital in particular were really nice, if you're interested in OB/GYN you'll see a lot of interesting cases at the Prentice Women's Hospital. Students also rotate at the VA, which provides good clinical experience, and it seems like students also can learn a lot in free clinics during the first two years. So, I wouldn't worry too much about clinical education at Northwestern. Maybe Pitt's is better, but either way I'm sure you will be well-prepared for residency.

Also, Chicago is AWESOME. I've lived here my whole life so I may be biased, but there isn't anywhere else I'd rather be. Northwestern's in the best part of the city, right on Lake Michigan and near some fun neighborhoods. The downside is that it is quite expensive to live here, but you can always get a roommate or live further away from the school to cut costs. But, you probably could enjoy yourself in Pittsburg too if you feel like that school is better for you, it really depends on what you're looking for in a city. Good luck with your decision!

 

[kanzeon]

Clearly UPMC is much larger than most academic medical centers. But I don't think quantity is going to equate to quality of clinical training. Don't get me wrong, Northwestern Medicine is a very large and extensive enterprise--but more importantly all of their hospitals rank in the top 10 also (Northwestern Memorial: 6th, Children's: 8th, RIC: 1st). You can also choose to rotate at the VA, the county hospital or one of Northwestern's other hospitals/outpatient centers/clinics throughout the Chicago area. So it is tough to say where you're going to get a better clinical experience--that honestly will probably depend on which attendings you get, who you work with etc. etc. rather than how extensive the hospital system is. You're definitely going to see a lot and be able to do a lot at both places.

One thing to note, however, is if you're interested in OBGYN, then I definitely think Northwestern has an edge over most school. The Prentice Women's Hospital is quite impressive and I believe Northwestern ranks #11 in terms of OBGYN. Most systems don't have a dedicated women's hospital like Northwestern does. Most upperclassmen that I speak with always love their OBGYN rotation and get to do a lot. In fact, something like 14 students matched into OBGYN last year simply because there is a disproportionate interest in the field here at Feinberg due to how well the school handles OBGYN.

Honestly, I'm sure at both school you'll get a similar level of education. The differences will be negligible so you should go to where you think you'll be happiest.

 

[3838]

So I added a pro to the Northwestern list that gives the "big city" thing a little bit more weight IMO. I want to know if this is a legitimate pro though. (As I said, for me, with weighting, the pros and cons added up pretty equally before. My list has changed a little bit since I last posted it, though.) Networking. In Chicago, a huge metropolitan center, I'm more likely to make contacts, even outside the medical field that I may be able to call on later in life, if I plan on becoming involved in advocacy, need expertise in an area (like business, perhaps) where I don't have any, or want to start a program that calls for interdisciplinary cooperation or even funding. Contacts and connections are so great to have. A friend of mine got a really sought after job with a 2.5 GPA because she had a discussion with the guy who manages the entire region of branches of the organization she'll be working for. Another friend got a job offer right out of college from the WHO, and when they didn't take it, they were written a letter by this person that landed them an extremely enviable position at a top school of public health + a job at the CDC. I've seen what connections can do, and it's kind of crazy. Part of it is being in the right place at the right time, though. And I feel like that's more likely to happen in Chicago. I know this isn't a tangible reason, and I'm only giving it a weight of "1" but it still pushes Northwestern ahead of Pittsburgh (by one). What do you guys think? My mother thinks it's not a very good reason...Do you guys think I could get that same chance at networking at Pitt?

 

[penguinism]

Clearly UPMC is much larger than most academic medical centers. But I don't think quantity is going to equate to quality of clinical training. Don't get me wrong, Northwestern Medicine is a very large and extensive enterprise--but more importantly all of their hospitals rank in the top 10 also (Northwestern Memorial: 6th, Children's: 8th, RIC: 1st). You can also choose to rotate at the VA, the county hospital or one of Northwestern's other hospitals/outpatient centers/clinics throughout the Chicago area. So it is tough to say where you're going to get a better clinical experience--that honestly will probably depend on which attendings you get, who you work with etc. etc. rather than how extensive the hospital system is. You're definitely going to see a lot and be able to do a lot at both places.

One thing to note, however, is if you're interested in OBGYN, then I definitely think Northwestern has an edge over most school. The Prentice Women's Hospital is quite impressive and I believe Northwestern ranks #11 in terms of OBGYN. Most systems don't have a dedicated women's hospital like Northwestern does. Most upperclassmen that I speak with always love their OBGYN rotation and get to do a lot. In fact, something like 14 students matched into OBGYN last year simply because there is a disproportionate interest in the field here at Feinberg due to how well the school handles OBGYN.

Honestly, I'm sure at both school you'll get a similar level of education. The differences will be negligible so you should go to where you think you'll be happiest.

Pitt has Magee-Women's hospital, which if you're concerned with rankings is #4 in gynecology compared to Northwestern's #11. I personally wouldn't put much stock in hospital rankings because it's not necessarily indicative of the clinical training that you will receive there (this is based more upon the quality and organization of the clerkships as well as the attendings/housestaff willingness to teach), but if you're going to bring up Northwestern's hospital I feel as though it's only fair to mention Pitt's strong OB/Gyn department as well as women's health program. Granted not everyone at Pitt loves the OB/Gyn clinical rotation, but I'm dreading it only because I have absolutely no interest in the field. Many of my classmates are planning for careers in OB/Gyn.

OP you have to go where you feel you fit the best. You'll have a great experience at either place. The preclinical curriculum at Pitt may not be the greatest, but it is always being revised to best fit the needs of the students. It's also pass/fail and lectures are not mandatory, which made it easier to customize to my personal style of studying. The clinical years is where Pitt really shines, and thus far I have been very satisfied even though I've only been on rotations for a few months. The attendings I have worked with have all been very eager to teach medical students, and most of the residents here are great as well. I am treated like a valuable member of the team rather than someone to boss around.

For full disclosure I'm an MS3 at Pitt. I know absolutely nothing about Northwestern (or Chicago for that matter) since I didn't apply or interview there.

Happy to answer more questions about Pitt if you have them.

 

[kanzeon]

Pitt has Magee-Women's hospital, which if you're concerned with rankings is #4 in gynecology compared to Northwestern's #11. I personally wouldn't put much stock in hospital rankings because it's not necessarily indicative of the clinical training that you will receive there (this is based more upon the quality and organization of the clerkships as well as the attendings/housestaff willingness to teach), but if you're going to bring up Northwestern's hospital I feel as though it's only fair to mention Pitt's strong OB/Gyn department as well as women's health program. Granted not everyone at Pitt loves the OB/Gyn clinical rotation, but I'm dreading it only because I have absolutely no interest in the field. Many of my classmates are planning for careers in OB/Gyn.

I don't doubt for one second UPMC's medical prowess. The OP did seem concerned however that Northwestern's hospital system was somehow subpar and I was trying to exemplify that it isn't. And yes, again, I totally agree that your experience is going to depend on the clerkships' organization and who you're working with rather than the hospital system itself.

 

[Frazier]

It's a tough decision, but a stress-free one -- as there is no wrong choice.

Both are great schools.

Pittsburgh (city) or Chicago (city)?

That is the real question.

 

[starlite911]

I know this thread is over a year old, but curious as to what you decided (if you're still on here), as I'm trying to make the same decision.

 

[TBlackS]

Hi @starlite911, I stumbled upon this here thread too while searching for Northwestern vs. [Any] SOM. I suggest you try the same, and maybe with Pitt too...I cant help you on that front as I know nothing about the school nor the city of Pittsburgh. But these threads have validated my decision to move to Chicago. It's happening! Excited as **** to be in one of the greatest cities in the country, and I vote that you join the party! Lol

For what it's worth, I have 2 friends at Northwestern and they both love it there. Both described it as a low stress, big opportunity environment (dont know about you but thats my ideal scenario). Education, research, huge national reputation from east-west coast, and the Windy City. Nothing to complain about except the cold weather, but po nlace ps ierfect!