2009-2010 Uniformed Services University of Health Sciences Application Thread

[grotto]

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Which is exactly what i said. No hooking up with enlisted chicks, or officers that are above or below you in the chain of command. How are you going to cry about what I said, then say the EXACT same thing? Psychotic.

I never said those were the only rules, i was just telling the person that asked a few of the basics.

Rules are the same for everywhere they exist. If you get caught you're in trouble, if you don't get caught you're fine. I think everyone knows that. If me saying it was news to anyone then I apologize, and i'd like to offer my sympathies to the painfully slow individual that just found that out.

Nice.

You need to slow your roll, partner. From looking at your other posts on this site, its pretty clear that you enjoy firing people up and being a snarky character. Good for you. Surely it provides you hours of enjoyment, but it seems like it would be logical for you to not refer to your (maybe) future classmates as "psychotic" or "slow." You can take that back to the regular pre-med forums - as this forum, until now, has been a helpful place for people to find and post information.

But what the heck, I'll lock horns with you just this one time. I didn't say (or "cry") that you were completely wrong. I said that what you posted was simplistic and while partially correct, was bad advice. I also advised, repeatedly, that people should seek out training within their chosen service to get a clear picture of standards. Good advice, don't you think?

I really don't want to get too personal but it is abundantly clear that you have zero credibility in regards to these matters - this is apparent by your spectacularly incorrect (and obviously naive) statement that engaging in frat is okay "as long as you don't get caught." No one I know or have met in my many years of military service would ever say something like that, with the exception of bootcamps who don't know any better. I can tell you from extensive experience that indeed you are wrong, and that people who do this stuff, even if not "caught" and punished, usually wreak horrible damage on units. The rules are there for a reason, and are written the blood and careers of hundreds, perhaps thousands, of officers and enlisted who thought they could just "get away with it." As you might learn at some point, an officer's job is to uphold standards - which is extremely difficult to accomplish when one can't maintain any semblance of personal standards.

That is all. You can now roll your eyes and go back to bashing historically black colleges and being generally sardonic and unhelpful.

 

[xmsr3]

ok i knw this is random but i have some questions for sum of you all who were accepted
1. what was some of yous all stats
2. what about your ec wat did you all do for those
3. personal statment


heres a little bout me i'm a bio/premed student just really starting out only a year of college under my belt but i really wnt to go to this school and i just really need some advice or guidence to make it possible🙂🙂

1. Cgpa: 3.97, Sgpa: 3.96, MCAT: 34S
2. 150+ hrs of ER volunteering, 50+ hrs ER doc shadowing, Served as volunteer and Board Member of Disabled Student Cultural Center and on Board of New Student Orientation Committee, charity running events, marathon training, daily gym workouts with emphasis on meeting military physical requirements.
3. Talked about why I was committed to serving my country in a medical capacity. Explained that I knew the downsides as well as upsides and I wanted a chance to prove myself.

General Advice: First, congrats on a fine choice of school. USUHS is great, IF you are sure that a career in military medicine is right for you. Make sure to do your research so you know what you are signing up for. Check out the military medicine forums on SDN for many long debates on the pros and cons and if you can, find the documentary: Fighting for Life which shows military medicine in graphic detail and features a lot of behind the scenes stuff that occurs at USUHS. (One of my interviews was with an Army Colonel who asked me if I knew anything about combat medicine. Lucky for me I had watched this documentary on the flight to DC and he was impressed with how much I knew, best $30 I ever spent).

If, after careful research you decide that USUHS is right for you, here's what I advice in terms of undergrad.

1. Focus on nailing your medical pre-reqs with as high GPA as possible, as this is the first thing USUHS looks at.

2. Nail the MCAT, get as high a score as possible when the time comes for that, (probably a year or two down the line for you). This is the second thing that USUHS looks at.

3. Make sure you have strong ECs that show 3 things.

a. Clinical experience, such as hospital volunteering where you interact with patients or being a paramedic.
b. leadership experience, (YOU WILL BE ASKED ABOUT THIS AT YOUR INTERVIEW) such as student groups, preferably also medical related, (depends on what school you go to and what groups exist). Of course you could always start your own medically related group, which would look great as far as an EC.
c. Affinity for physical activity, all USUHS matriculants need to pass their services physical fitness requirements 2 times/year. Having activities such as charity running and working out 3+ times/week looks great on your application as it shows you are physically fit and enjoy a physical lifestyle.

4. Letters of Recommendation: Start thinking about this now, forge strong relationships with your professors, learn to suck up now, (it will serve you well in your future military career😀) I had 5 letters, 1 from O-chem lab prof, physics 2 prof, physiology prof, volunteer coordinator, and my personal mentor, (Econ prof mentioned in personal statement and secondary essay). Make sure your letter writers like you A LOT, and make sure that you know what your letters say before you send them to USUHS. (Open a file at your University's Letter Rec service, have your writers send the letters here, then tell your university that you need 2-3 copies of each letter because you are applying to HPSP. They will give you sealed envelops containing the letters, keep 1 for HPSP, (they require the same letters) and open the other to verify that the letters are good).

USUHS requires 3 letters, 2 from science profs and 1 from clinical experience.

Note: USUHS DOES NOT participate in the AMCAS online letters program, you'll need to send these to the school seperately.

5. Personal Statement: You'll need 2, one for AMCAS, general why medicine essay and a secondary essay for why USUHS. I advice you to work on this during one of your breaks, make sure they are both something you are very confident and proud of.

6. APPLY EARLY! Remember that AMCAS typically opens in early June for the next year, make sure you get your application, (and have all your Letters of Rec) by this time (example for this cycle AMCAS opened June 2, applications sent to schools on June 26) By having your AMCAS app done and sent within the first week you guarantee that USUHS gets it on the first day. Applying early has 2 benefits.

1. Maximizes your chance of getting interview/acceptance
2. Allows you to interview on first available date, which means you hear about acceptance as early as 10/15 or so. Nothing takes the pressure off as much knowing you got into your first choice school. You can then relax and enjoy the rest of your semester or time between acceptance and matriculation.

7. Don't forget that USUHS has a Calculus requirement of 1 semester. I was able to get this waived because I took AP calc 1 in high school and Calc based physics 1,2 as well as a bunch of calc intensive econ classes, (my major) but you are just starting college so make sure you have this requirement.

8. Have a back up plan, if you're certain that a career in military medicine is for you, (otherwise don't apply to USUHS) then apply to other med schools and contact your preferred service medical recruiter and make sure to get started on HPSP paperwork around the same time you are doing your secondaries, (in case you don't get into USUHS but get in to another MD or DO school).

9. GET IN SHAPE NOW! As previously mentioned you need to be in good shape to go to USUHS. This means being able to do 40 pushups in a row, 50 situps and run a certain distance in a certain amount of time, (1.5 miles for AF and Navy in 13:15 or less, 2 miles in 16:36 or less for Army) There is also the weight requirements, which are based on height and sex. Don't let yourself get into my situation, (I was 370 lbs on Jan 1 of 2009 so I had to lose 160 lbs in 10.5 months) where you have to lose weight in a hurry. Get into the physical and healthy lifestyle now and you'll not only be healthier, improve your odds of getting into USUHS but will also enjoy undergrad life more.

Note: Train to try to get the full 300 points on the Physical Test, which is 77 pushups, 82 situps, (in a row and in 2 min or less) and running around a 6:30 mile pace. If you get 300 points on your PRTs it will help with promotions later in your career. Also, if you can honestly say at your interview that you are capable of 300 points, it will make you a more competative candidate for getting accepted to USUHS.

I know it may seem like a lot to think about now, but trust me friend, I have learned the hard way that knowing about the details and making sure you cross every T and dot every I is vital.

Becoming a pre-med gunner and locking your sights on USUHS early is a great way to guarantee you make it here in 3 years, (by this I mean planning ahead and making sure you know every little detail ahead of time, you need to enjoy undergrad too and become a well rounded individual or you won't get in)

Remember that its always better to plan too much than not enough and its never to early to get started on your USUHS application, (my sister has her heart set on USUHS as well and she's only in 6th grade! She's concentrating on getting straight As and works out with me when I train for the army requirements) even if that just means focusing on Acing every undergrad class and getting in the best shape of your life for now.

Best of luck and congrats again on setting your sights on the best medical school no one's every heard of😀

 

[mslall]

or maybe it would better titled as How to Totally Kick Butt and Get Into USUHS

I volunteer xmsr as lead author

 

[0919mmk]

or maybe it would better titled as How to Totally Kick Butt and Get Into USUHS

I volunteer xmsr as lead author

Agreed! Way to go xmsr. Your stats actually blow mine out of the water, but hey, i'm in! (In case people are curious, I had MCAT 32, and GPA 3.low.) And did you really lose 160 lbs? That's ridiculous - way to go! I've been an athlete all my life, but I doubt that I can do 80 pushups in a row...

Anyways, yes xmsr's advice is golden- follow it to the letter if you want to be competitive. I made things really difficult for myself with a low GPA.

 

[grotto]

Seriously XMSR, your post should be stickied at the top of the mil med forum... very comprehensive.

 

[ahowardmd]

1. Cgpa: 3.97, Sgpa: 3.96, MCAT: 34S
2. 150+ hrs of ER volunteering, 50+ hrs ER doc shadowing, Served as volunteer and Board Member of Disabled Student Cultural Center and on Board of New Student Orientation Committee, charity running events, marathon training, daily gym workouts with emphasis on meeting military physical requirements.
3. Talked about why I was committed to serving my country in a medical capacity. Explained that I knew the downsides as well as upsides and I wanted a chance to prove myself.

General Advice: First, congrats on a fine choice of school. USUHS is great, IF you are sure that a career in military medicine is right for you. Make sure to do your research so you know what you are signing up for. Check out the military medicine forums on SDN for many long debates on the pros and cons and if you can, find the documentary: Fighting for Life which shows military medicine in graphic detail and features a lot of behind the scenes stuff that occurs at USUHS. (One of my interviews was with an Army Colonel who asked me if I knew anything about combat medicine. Lucky for me I had watched this documentary on the flight to DC and he was impressed with how much I knew, best $30 I ever spent).

If, after careful research you decide that USUHS is right for you, here's what I advice in terms of undergrad.

1. Focus on nailing your medical pre-reqs with as high GPA as possible, as this is the first thing USUHS looks at.

2. Nail the MCAT, get as high a score as possible when the time comes for that, (probably a year or two down the line for you). This is the second thing that USUHS looks at.

3. Make sure you have strong ECs that show 3 things.

a. Clinical experience, such as hospital volunteering where you interact with patients or being a paramedic.
b. leadership experience, (YOU WILL BE ASKED ABOUT THIS AT YOUR INTERVIEW) such as student groups, preferably also medical related, (depends on what school you go to and what groups exist). Of course you could always start your own medically related group, which would look great as far as an EC.
c. Affinity for physical activity, all USUHS matriculants need to pass their services physical fitness requirements 2 times/year. Having activities such as charity running and working out 3+ times/week looks great on your application as it shows you are physically fit and enjoy a physical lifestyle.

4. Letters of Recommendation: Start thinking about this now, forge strong relationships with your professors, learn to suck up now, (it will serve you well in your future military career😀) I had 5 letters, 1 from O-chem lab prof, physics 2 prof, physiology prof, volunteer coordinator, and my personal mentor, (Econ prof mentioned in personal statement and secondary essay). Make sure your letter writers like you A LOT, and make sure that you know what your letters say before you send them to USUHS. (Open a file at your University's Letter Rec service, have your writers send the letters here, then tell your university that you need 2-3 copies of each letter because you are applying to HPSP. They will give you sealed envelops containing the letters, keep 1 for HPSP, (they require the same letters) and open the other to verify that the letters are good).

USUHS requires 3 letters, 2 from science profs and 1 from clinical experience.

Note: USUHS DOES NOT participate in the AMCAS online letters program, you'll need to send these to the school seperately.

5. Personal Statement: You'll need 2, one for AMCAS, general why medicine essay and a secondary essay for why USUHS. I advice you to work on this during one of your breaks, make sure they are both something you are very confident and proud of.

6. APPLY EARLY! Remember that AMCAS typically opens in early June for the next year, make sure you get your application, (and have all your Letters of Rec) by this time (example for this cycle AMCAS opened June 2, applications sent to schools on June 26) By having your AMCAS app done and sent within the first week you guarantee that USUHS gets it on the first day. Applying early has 2 benefits.

1. Maximizes your chance of getting interview/acceptance
2. Allows you to interview on first available date, which means you hear about acceptance as early as 10/15 or so. Nothing takes the pressure off as much knowing you got into your first choice school. You can then relax and enjoy the rest of your semester or time between acceptance and matriculation.

7. Don't forget that USUHS has a Calculus requirement of 1 semester. I was able to get this waived because I took AP calc 1 in high school and Calc based physics 1,2 as well as a bunch of calc intensive econ classes, (my major) but you are just starting college so make sure you have this requirement.

8. Have a back up plan, if you're certain that a career in military medicine is for you, (otherwise don't apply to USUHS) then apply to other med schools and contact your preferred service medical recruiter and make sure to get started on HPSP paperwork around the same time you are doing your secondaries, (in case you don't get into USUHS but get in to another MD or DO school).

9. GET IN SHAPE NOW! As previously mentioned you need to be in good shape to go to USUHS. This means being able to do 40 pushups in a row, 50 situps and run a certain distance in a certain amount of time, (1.5 miles for AF and Navy in 13:15 or less, 2 miles in 16:36 or less for Army) There is also the weight requirements, which are based on height and sex. Don't let yourself get into my situation, (I was 370 lbs on Jan 1 of 2009 so I had to lose 160 lbs in 10.5 months) where you have to lose weight in a hurry. Get into the physical and healthy lifestyle now and you'll not only be healthier, improve your odds of getting into USUHS but will also enjoy undergrad life more.

Note: Train to try to get the full 300 points on the Physical Test, which is 77 pushups, 82 situps, (in a row and in 2 min or less) and running around a 6:30 mile pace. If you get 300 points on your PRTs it will help with promotions later in your career. Also, if you can honestly say at your interview that you are capable of 300 points, it will make you a more competative candidate for getting accepted to USUHS.

I know it may seem like a lot to think about now, but trust me friend, I have learned the hard way that knowing about the details and making sure you cross every T and dot every I is vital.

Becoming a pre-med gunner and locking your sights on USUHS early is a great way to guarantee you make it here in 3 years, (by this I mean planning ahead and making sure you know every little detail ahead of time, you need to enjoy undergrad too and become a well rounded individual or you won't get in)

Remember that its always better to plan too much than not enough and its never to early to get started on your USUHS application, (my sister has her heart set on USUHS as well and she's only in 6th grade! She's concentrating on getting straight As and works out with me when I train for the army requirements) even if that just means focusing on Acing every undergrad class and getting in the best shape of your life for now.

Best of luck and congrats again on setting your sights on the best medical school no one's every heard of😀

Good post. Pre-meds need to realize that getting into medical school is a game that you have to play, and these are the rules!

 

[mslall]

wow

 

[Richsofresh]

dude thanks alot thts a lot of information i think it will serve me well yes i have done tons of reseach on military medicine and its most def the thing i wnt to do i wnt to sere my country the best way i know how but i have just a few more questions

1. why with usuhs its a seven year commitment but only 4 with hsps
2. he's gpa is impressive but what are some of your stats tht arent damn near a 4.0😍👍 what did you all have to do and was it more diffcult plz and thank you

 

[ahowardmd]

Ok maybe I have an idealistic impression about this... but opening letters of recommendation that were already sealed seems pretty unethical. I think there are pretty clear ethical guidelines this, which are: you waived your right to see the letter and its contents. Unless the letter writer specifically asks you or gives you permission, it is wrong. I really don't want to sound like I'm bashing whoever is going into the military or military medicine, because I have the utmost respect for you all... but I do expect your values and character (including ethics) to meet and/or exceed those of most people.

I meant to say something about this but forgot to: ditto. At my school, we had to waive our right to see the letters, or the letter writers and the ad-coms would be told that we hadn't waived our right to see them: meaning, the ad-coms knew the letters would be biased and thus probably worthless. I agree with most of XMSR3's post, but definitely not this point, it's totally unethical.

 

[xmsr3]

Ok maybe I have an idealistic impression about this... but opening letters of recommendation that were already sealed seems pretty unethical. I think there are pretty clear ethical guidelines this, which are: you waived your right to see the letter and its contents. Unless the letter writer specifically asks you or gives you permission, it is wrong. I really don't want to sound like I'm bashing whoever is going into the military or military medicine, because I have the utmost respect for you all... but I do expect your values and character (including ethics) to meet and/or exceed those of most people.

I see your point. To be perfectly honest I sent my letters to USUHS and then was driven crazy by not knowing what they said. So I decided to use this tactic to find out what they said. Turns out they were all very good letters.

However, I stand by my advice that you should know what your letters say for one simple reason.

It takes 4+ years of hard work and sacrifice to get into med school and if you have your heart set on a specfic school like USUHS you can't leave anything to chance. I had a friend who for medical reasons could only apply to her state school, (her state only has 1 med school) so this school was her one shot at fulfilling her life long dream of becoming a doctor.

She asked her church counselor to write a letter thinking this person was a good friend. She was rejected from her state school and her dream of medicine died.

My friend was devestated to the point of being near suicidal. The worst part was not knowing why her state school rejected her. Her grades were good, MCAT solid and lots of ECs similar to mine. So I adviced her to use my method to check her LORs.

She had 4 letters, 3 of them glowing, but 1, from her church friend, was a spiteful piece of lies that just flung crap all over my friend for 3 whole pages!

It seems incontravertible that this one letter killed my friend's dream of med school and after seeing the very real psychological toll it reaked upon her, I stand by my advice.

MAKE SURE YOU KNOW WHAT YOUR LORS SAY! Whether it is honest or not, LORS are an important part of your application. DON'T LET ANYONE SABOTAGE THE DREAM YOU SPENT YEARS BUILDING TOWARDS!

 

[ahowardmd]

dude thanks alot thts a lot of information i think it will serve me well yes i have done tons of reseach on military medicine and its most def the thing i wnt to do i wnt to sere my country the best way i know how but i have just a few more questions

1. why with usuhs its a seven year commitment but only 4 with hsps
2. he's gpa is impressive but what are some of your stats tht arent damn near a 4.0😍👍 what did you all have to do and was it more diffcult plz and thank you

USUHS is a seven-year commitment because the gov't is paying the tuition, and paying you a salary and benefits at the same time. So instead of being a poor med student like most are, we are actually getting a 2nd-lieutenants' salary, and health-insurance and such, while in med school. In repayment, you make what amounts to a 14 year commitment to the military (4 years med school, 3 year min. residency, THEN you start the 7 year repayment). It's an awesome deal, but don't do it for the money part: during the repayment, you will be making sig. less than your civilian counterparts. This is something you just have to accept if you want to serve in the military.

 

[ahowardmd]

MAKE SURE YOU KNOW WHAT YOUR LORS SAY! Whether it is honest or not, LORS are an important part of your application. DON'T LET ANYONE SABOTAGE THE DREAM YOU SPENT YEARS BUILDING TOWARDS!

Sounds like you're using somebody else's horror story to justify your actions, but it is still wrong.

When I asked my letter writers for a LOR, I simply sat with them in their office and talked with them for a good half-hour or hour. They knew me from class, but we didn't have much outside of class contact, so I brought along a resume for their reference. I asked them up-front if they thought they could write me a positive letter, and each agreed. Don't trap someone who doesn't like you into writing a letter!

I suppose there is the chance that you could ask some evil person to write you a letter by mistake, but hopefully you can see through other people's character enough to choose your LOR writers.

 

[Erald Coil]

Any advice concerning housing for August 2010-2014?
Rosedale, Metropolitan, Triangle Towers, Avalon... rent a house off of craigslist...?

Apartment reviews online aren't very reliable, and I won't travel to see anything in person until next May. If anyone has any recommendations or precautions then I'd really appreciate it!

 

[xmsr3]

I can not separate reading letters of recommendation from cheating on a test or lying during your interview. Yeah, that is a sad story.. but does that make it OK to bypass established ethical guidelines? Not at all. This girl had many options, even it did not seem like it at the time. Many schools offer to meet with rejected applicants and tell them how to improve their applications. Many schools do not look at previous applications/LOR's (though some still do!), which means reappling could be an easy way to go. Give me a break, one year of being rejected and a dream is sabotaged? Maybe this is just God/fate's way of asking her how badly she wants to pursue this particular dream.

In my very limited understanding, this could be nearly equated with lying on your AMCAS or during your interview about activities/EC's, which has been known to result in not only dismissal from that medical school but being black-listed at near all others as well, making transferring or reapplying out of the question. It is not only unethical, but a silly thing to risk.

4 points:

1. I only asked people I was certain liked me and did ask for positive letters.

2. I did not cherry pick letters, I sent all of them to USUHS sight unseen. When I read them there was nothing I could have done had some of them been negative.

3. What happened to my friend was very much sabatoge. This letter writer had pretended to be a friend for several years and harbored some kind of grudge that no one knew about. Oh and the university my friend applied to does keep your previous LORs on file, so her chances at that school are dead and buried and because of her medical issues, (she has good insurance that is only good for her state) she cannot apply to any OOS schools. So unfortunately her dreams of becoming an MD are dead.

4. I have to take umbridge with the assertion that looking at your letters is the same as cheating. As someone who has never cheated on an exam in my life (or lied at my interview), I find this offensive.

Keep in mind that cheating on your exams or lieing on your AMCAS means you are claiming qualificiations you do not have, in an attempt to leap ahead of people who ARE more qualified than you. Knowing what your LORs say so that you don't inadvertantly send some landmine to your dream school, is not the same thing.

Does knowing what your letters say mean you don't have intelligence that you earned with each and every exam including the MCAT? Does it mean you didn't actually spend hundreds of hours volunteering and shadowing in a hospital? Does it mean you didn't spend hundreds of hours working to help your fellow students as board members of school groups? Does it mean you didn't spend months pouring your heart and soul into your personal and secondary essays?

I simply wanted to see what the unbiased opinions of my letters writers was, figuring that, since USUHS had already recieved them all, there was nothing unethical about knowing what my professors really thought, (its the same as hearing a taped conversation of your profs discussing whether or not you would make a good doc after the fact)

Perhaps I was wrong to advice my particular method, but the point about making sure you have solid letters of Recommendation stands. Remember that the MD school application process is super competative and getting more so due to this economy. Unethical behavior? You think what I did was unethical?

No, wildcat, unethical IS cheating on exams, or paying someone to write your personal statements for you, (or paying profs to write LORS that you did not earn through hard work all semester long) or completly fabricating your ECs on your AMCAS or claiming to be an URM when you're not or having a family member bribe the admissions committee with a "generous gift from an alumni".

All of these things happen! There are truly unethical and dispicable people out there who don't care who's throat they have to slash or who's back they have to climb over to get into med school.

Knowing that your LORs portray you in a positive light is not unethical, its simply smart.

 

[ahowardmd]

4. I have to take umbridge with the assertion that looking at your letters is the same as cheating. As someone who has never cheated on an exam in my life (or lied at my interview), I find this offensive.

I am a pretty chill guy, but I find it offensive that my future classmate is encouraging pre-meds to cheat in the application process. Maybe you didn't cherry-pick, but other people who ask for extra-letters will do so. What you describe happening to your friend was terrible, but generally when somebody writes bad things in a LOR, they're being honest, and they think the ad-com should know those things.

You can only control what's in your LORs to a certain extent...part of that involves choosing the right people to write them.

 

[ahowardmd]

This is no more unethical than putting your friends as character refrences, knowing that they will give you a positive review compared to mear aquaintances.

By design, character references are supposed to be your friends, because these are the people who know you best. And part of the LOR process is choosing people who you know will review you positively. This is not unethical, it is smart. I'm not going to choose a prof. for a letter when I slept through his classes, I'm going to choose the one where I sat in the front row and answered his questions correctly. This stuff isn't random, you choose the best people to maximize your chances at acceptance.

 

[NavyCy]

Ok fellas, you've both made your points. Lets take a deep breath and relax for a minute. Back to the original question, I'm going to propose a theory that probably won't be very popular around here. Rich, other people's stats are irrelevant to you. Medical schools (especially USUHS) are looking for so many things that have nothing to do with the MCAT or GPA that it is impossible to determine anything from someone getting accepted or rejected with a certain set of stats.

Here is my advice to you. Study hard, get the best grades and MCAT you can, do your research on what the profession entails (don't just shadow to add something to your application)and then let the chips fall where they may. If you get in, congratulations. If you don't get in, then find out why and try again next year. Contrary to accepted SDN knowledge, you haven't failed if you don't get in the first time. You only fail when you quit trying. And above all, if you do choose to frequent these boards, remember to ignore at least 75% of the "advice" you read. Good luck.

 

[xmsr3]

By design, character references are supposed to be your friends, because these are the people who know you best. And part of the LOR process is choosing people who you know will review you positively. This is not unethical, it is smart. I'm not going to choose a prof. for a letter when I slept through his classes, I'm going to choose the one where I sat in the front row and answered his questions correctly. This stuff isn't random, you choose the best people to maximize your chances at acceptance.[/QUOTE]

I apologize for getting this advice thread off track. Ahowardmd and NavyCY bring up a great point and one that is most apt for someone who is just starting undergrad.

Become the kind of super applicant that everyone is afraid of😀 Become the gunner who has their **** down cold, each and every time! Always sit in the front row and go up to the professor after class with questions that show you were paying attention because you are applying what they taught to other problems.

Don't forget to go to office hours for those classes that give people the most trouble, (like physics 2) show your profs your unwaivering and unflappable dedication!

Become the best student they ever had or at least give it your best shot! Then when you ask them to write your letter, do what Ahoward did and give them your resume, (complete with all your kickass ECs😀) and also give them your Personal statement and don't forget to set up a meeting with each and everyone of them, (to explain your motivation).

My advice for the meeting? Search your soul for why you want to be a doctor, (and especially a military one) and be as sincere as possible.

I remember talking to my mentor about how much military medcine meant to me and it brought tears to my eyes, (and to his).

You don't need to have perfect grades or a super MCAT, (but try your damndest anyway😀) but you need to make super connections with some important profs and letter writers as well leaders in the student community, (also a good source of LORS).

The ways of the med school gunner are tough and the ways of the USUHS gunner are even tougher. But if you apply yourself you can and will succeed!

Its a matter of will and determination and heart. USUHS dosn't necessarily want the best and the brightest, they do want the most determined and most dedicated.

Reminds me of one of my favorite creeds:

"Dedication brings victory and victory is life"

-modified Jem H'dar creed

 

[Segovia]

For those of you that have sent grade updates to USUHS post-interview, how did you send them? I mean, can I just email them my grades and then send them the official transcript later on? Either way, I think it is kind of lame since I already have my degree and none of the classes I took this semester were prerequisites, but whatev. Any thoughts?

 

[mslall]

By design, character references are supposed to be your friends, because these are the people who know you best. And part of the LOR process is choosing people who you know will review you positively. This is not unethical, it is smart. I'm not going to choose a prof. for a letter when I slept through his classes, I'm going to choose the one where I sat in the front row and answered his questions correctly. This stuff isn't random, you choose the best people to maximize your chances at acceptance.

Agree completely. It's totally unethical and makes you look like a big dirtbag to look at LORs that you've waived the right too unless the writer specifically gives you a copy. My clinical reference e-mailed me a copy before he sent it to my advisor last year.

Again, not meaning to beat a dead horse, but howard is totally right. Telling anyone to read the letters they've waived their right to is stupid.

Looking at your LORs, even if they turn out to be good, is the same thing as looking at the guy next to you's test just to see if you have the same answer. "It's not cheating....i'm just checking my answers." Both situations speak to your integrity in the exact same way.

 

[H60 SONIC]

Ok fellas, you've both made your points. Lets take a deep breath and relax for a minute. Back to the original question, I'm going to propose a theory that probably won't be very popular around here. Rich, other people's stats are irrelevant to you. Medical schools (especially USUHS) are looking for so many things that have nothing to do with the MCAT or GPA that it is impossible to determine anything from someone getting accepted or rejected with a certain set of stats.

Here is my advice to you. Study hard, get the best grades and MCAT you can, do your research on what the profession entails (don't just shadow to add something to your application)and then let the chips fall where they may. If you get in, congratulations. If you don't get in, then find out why and try again next year. Contrary to accepted SDN knowledge, you haven't failed if you don't get in the first time. You only fail when you quit trying. And above all, if you do choose to frequent these boards, remember to ignore at least 75% of the "advice" you read. Good luck.

Well said my friend. This falls into the 25% of "advice" that Rich needs to pay attention to.

<break> <break> ... Rich I am a non-trad, re-applicant with less than stellar "numbers." PM me if you want the details, but definitely take Cy's advice about working hard and doing the best at what you choose to do from now until your app cycle. Good luck!

 

[Soba]

For those of you that have sent grade updates to USUHS post-interview, how did you send them? I mean, can I just email them my grades and then send them the official transcript later on? Either way, I think it is kind of lame since I already have my degree and none of the classes I took this semester were prerequisites, but whatev. Any thoughts?

Today I got the final grade of my class posted on the school's registrar website, so tomorrow I am requesting the school to send USUHS the official transcript.

I knew the final grade right after I took the finals last week, but USUHS requested the official transcript, so I thought, "what's the hurry?" It's not like the admissions office is going to say, "sure, we will TOTALLY take your word for it, and rush deliver your unconditional acceptance letter!"

But whatever. It is not like they are going to take away acceptance spots if you e-mail them without an official transcript. Do whatever you find convenient or gives you peace of mind.

 

[Richsofresh]

OK I GOT THT YU GET PAID WHILE IN SKOOL AT THE UNIVERSITY BUT THE HSPS DOES THE SAME THING EXCEPT YOU GO TO A CIVILIAN SKOOL WHAT I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND IS WHY THE COMITMENT IS LONGER AT THE UNIVERSITY THEN FOR THE SCHOLARSHIP👍👍👍

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

Nice.

(1)You need to slow your roll, partner. From looking at your other posts on this site, its pretty clear that you enjoy firing people up and being a snarky character. Good for you. Surely it provides you hours of enjoyment, but it seems like it would be logical for you to not refer to your (maybe) future classmates as "psychotic" or "slow." You can take that back to the regular pre-med forums - as this forum, until now, has been a helpful place for people to find and post information.

But what the heck, I'll lock horns with you just this one time. I didn't say (or "cry") that you were completely wrong. I said that what you posted was simplistic and while partially correct, was bad advice. I also advised, repeatedly, that people should seek out training within their chosen service to get a clear picture of standards. Good advice, don't you think?

I really don't want to get too personal but it is abundantly clear that you have zero credibility in regards to these matters - this is apparent by your spectacularly incorrect (and obviously naive) statement that engaging in frat is okay "as long as you don't get caught." No one I know or have met in my many years of military service would ever say something like that, with the exception of (2) bootcamps who don't know any better. I can tell you from extensive experience that indeed you are wrong, and that people who do this stuff, even if not "caught" and punished, usually wreak horrible damage on units. The rules are there for a reason, and are written the blood and careers of hundreds, perhaps thousands, of officers and enlisted who thought they could just "get away with it." As you might learn at some point, an officer's job is to uphold standards - which is extremely difficult to accomplish when one can't maintain any semblance of personal standards.

(3) That is all. You can now roll your eyes and go back to bashing historically black colleges and being generally sardonic and unhelpful.

(1). What i said was completely correct, you just got all uptight about it. I, and I'm sure anyone at USUHS, would agree that a person who does not know that if you break a rule and aren't caught doing it you will not get in trouble, probably has a learning disability. What I told them was perfectly good information, don't hook up with enlisted chicks. Once again, I never said that was the be all end all to the rule book. Of course if you want to know more information you should seek the proper training or manuals. That's common sense.

(2). My credibility is just fine, I have spent several years in the military and I had no problem saying this. A guy and a chick being awkward around each other because they hooked up and broke up is their problem. They're both military members, they'll still get the job done. The reason you probably haven't heard this said by other military personnel is because you're uptight, most of the laid back members would not have spoken so freely around you.

(3). Cry me a ****in river. What did i say in that forum that was so wrong? I said the minorities with higher scores usually choose non-HBCs. Oh no, what an a-hole of me.

Just relax. The military is not a hard life, it's not difficult to spend a career in the military without getting in trouble and there's no reason to be uptight about the rules. Just don't break them, and if you do, don't get caught. It's the same for everyone on earth.

Anyways, I'm sure everyone at USUHS will get along great.

 

[NoMoreAMCAS]

I meant to say something about this but forgot to: ditto. At my school, we had to waive our right to see the letters, or the letter writers and the ad-coms would be told that we hadn't waived our right to see them: meaning, the ad-coms knew the letters would be biased and thus probably worthless. I agree with most of XMSR3's post, but definitely not this point, it's totally unethical.

Mine was the same way. Like XMSR said, it does suck not knowing, but it was never an option for us. We couldn't even send them or bring them in, the letter writers had to take care of that.

Really, a professor could like you and be just plain lazy, giving you a poorly written or just insufficient letter. Personally, I've never seen mine and I haven't had any problems yet, but i definitely see where XMSR is coming from.

 

[xmsr3]

OK I GOT THT YU GET PAID WHILE IN SKOOL AT THE UNIVERSITY BUT THE HSPS DOES THE SAME THING EXCEPT YOU GO TO A CIVILIAN SKOOL WHAT I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND IS WHY THE COMITMENT IS LONGER AT THE UNIVERSITY THEN FOR THE SCHOLARSHIP👍👍👍

Ok, two things:

1. What the hell is with this question? All caps and intentially misspelled? Rich if you wish to be accepted to USUHS then you need to remember that the military is a very formal place.

If this was your first post I would think you're a troll but your other two posts seemed genuine.

2. In answer to your question, as has been explained USUHS students are active duty 0-1 officers with the full pay and benefits that this entails. While true that HPSP has a stipend to live on, it comes to about $24K/year and you don't get any of the benefits granted to active duty service members, mainly the health and dental benefits, (except during your 45 day/year of active duty).

So to compare HPSP and USUHS:

HPSP: attend civilian school, $24K/year of stipend, no health benefits, 4 year payback

USUHS: attend USUHS, $56K/year total pay, full medical and dental coverage, 7 year payback

One other difference is that HPSP students can only rotate into military hospitals for 2 rotations, while at USUHS its all of them.

The benefit with military rotations is that you can visit the medical centers where your preferred residency is and introduce yourself to the staff and hopefully prove yourself a good team member.

Then when it comes time to do a military residency, (both USUHS and HPSP students must apply for military residency in their service first, civilian deferments are rare and mostly occur in the Air Force) you have a better shot at matching into your dream residency because the staff at that med center remembers you.

Oh and one other difference is that you start networking at USUHS on day 1, since these will be your colleagues in the future. At HPSP civilian schools your classmates are not military and probably have no intention of every being military, so you can't make as many connections for any future career, assuming you want to be a military doc, (and as has been said many times but can't be overstated, don't do either HPSP or USUHS unless you are sure you want to be a mil doc or you will be miserable, check the mil med forum on SDN to see evidence of this).

However, I think the difference in payback time is mostly due to the pay and benefits difference between USUHS and HPSP.

 

[Richsofresh]

Ok, two things:

1. What the hell is with this question? All caps and intentially misspelled? Rich if you wish to be accepted to USUHS then you need to remember that the military is a very formal place.

If this was your first post I would think you're a troll but your other two posts seemed genuine.

2. In answer to your question, as has been explained USUHS students are active duty 0-1 officers with the full pay and benefits that this entails. While true that HPSP has a stipend to live on, it comes to about $24K/year and you don't get any of the benefits granted to active duty service members, mainly the health and dental benefits, (except during your 45 day/year of active duty).

So to compare HPSP and USUHS:

HPSP: attend civilian school, $24K/year of stipend, no health benefits, 4 year payback

USUHS: attend USUHS, $56K/year total pay, full medical and dental coverage, 7 year payback

One other difference is that HPSP students can only rotate into military hospitals for 2 rotations, while at USUHS its all of them.

The benefit with military rotations is that you can visit the medical centers where your preferred residency is and introduce yourself to the staff and hopefully prove yourself a good team member.

Then when it comes time to do a military residency, (both USUHS and HPSP students must apply for military residency in their service first, civilian deferments are rare and mostly occur in the Air Force) you have a better shot at matching into your dream residency because the staff at that med center remembers you.

Oh and one other difference is that you start networking at USUHS on day 1, since these will be your colleagues in the future. At HPSP civilian schools your classmates are not military and probably have no intention of every being military, so you can't make as many connections for any future career, assuming you want to be a military doc, (and as has been said many times but can't be overstated, don't do either HPSP or USUHS unless you are sure you want to be a mil doc or you will be miserable, check the mil med forum on SDN to see evidence of this).

However, I think the difference in payback time is mostly due to the pay and benefits difference between USUHS and HPSP.

my bad i did this on my cell phone not a computer im use to texting shorthand on the phone but thanks for the clarfication

 

[Richsofresh]

(1). What i said was completely correct, you just got all uptight about it. I, and I'm sure anyone at USUHS, would agree that a person who does not know that if you break a rule and aren't caught doing it you will not get in trouble, probably has a learning disability. What I told them was perfectly good information, don't hook up with enlisted chicks. Once again, I never said that was the be all end all to the rule book. Of course if you want to know more information you should seek the proper training or manuals. That's common sense.

(2). My credibility is just fine, I have spent several years in the military and I had no problem saying this. A guy and a chick being awkward around each other because they hooked up and broke up is their problem. They're both military members, they'll still get the job done. The reason you probably haven't heard this said by other military personnel is because you're uptight, most of the laid back members would not have spoken so freely around you.

(3). Cry me a ****in river. What did i say in that forum that was so wrong? I said the minorities with higher scores usually choose non-HBCs. Oh no, what an a-hole of me.

Just relax. The military is not a hard life, it's not difficult to spend a career in the military without getting in trouble and there's no reason to be uptight about the rules. Just don't break them, and if you do, don't get caught. It's the same for everyone on earth.

Anyways, I'm sure everyone at USUHS will get along great.

i'm a black and a women and i dnt even like hbcu's matter fact i'm transferring from one to anther school most people who go to alot hbcu's unless its a very well known one go there to transfer to a better school my experience with an hbcu is that the administartion tend to be very unprofessional and lazy and dont hold the teachers accountable for learning most of them are only out to get your money evry which way they can going to an hbcu is like extra years of high school any minority who grades are good enough to get in to a pwi should go , dnt even worry about money either i paying almost the same amount to go to a better school that i was paying to go to an hbcu . and no i'm not some surburban black upper class who doesnt even know what it is to be a minority i was born and raise in staten island ny and currently reside in batimore md raised by a single mother so i know about some things about being a minority 👍👍🙂

 

[Richsofresh]

for those of you who were accepted after reading the forums and hearing bout the pros and cons and other people opnions bout military medcine especially in these forums some have descibe really bad experiences .. what made you all decide to stick with it not change you all

 

[xmsr3]

Can someone decipher/translate this?

"Why did you choose to go into military medicine despite the horror stories on the military medicine forum?"

For me it was 3 main reasons.

1. Its the only chance I have to live my values. The military has a strong sense of community, honor, purpose, duty and discipline that I want to be a part of.

2. Uncle Sam saved my life, quit literally, so I feel I owe him any future career I have in medicine, (until I decided to pursue military medicine I was 370 lbs, getting fatter every year and unable to find the motivation to lose weight and get healthy, the way I was headed I wouldn't have lived to see the end of my residency since I was hypertensive and pre-diabetic at age 18 and doctors told me I would be dead by 30).

3. I talked with civilian docs and compared their complaints to those on the mil med forum and then weighed the pros and cons of both.

What I found was a lot of "the grass is greener". Many military docs want out and into civilian medicine. Many civilian docs want out and into non medical industries like finance. Meanwhile many, many people in finance, (including both my parents) abhor fiance and wish they had gone into medicine.

In the end the complaints that most people have, involving bad working conditions, lots of beuracracy and office politics are universal. Now there are unique draw backs to the military and unique benefits to the military, (living my values being one of them, paying back Uncle Sam for saving my life being another). When I weighed the unique pros and cons of military medicine I concluded that the benefits outweight the draw backs and so I signed on the dotted line.

Why did the unique pros outweight the unique cons? Because, for every con the military seems to offer a counter pro that at least partially offsets it.

So the value of the unique pros is high, the value of the unique cons is not as high as it initally seemed and the value of universal cons= 0 because you won't escape them by going into civilian medicine. There is also the issue of comparing the life of a military officer to that of a civilian, which is seperate from a military doc vs a civilian doc. That is very heavily skewed in favor of the military because of the security that the military offers. Then I had to added those numbers to the military med column because military medicine is the only real way I can become an officer at this point, (now that I have been accepted to USUHS). When all the calculations where complete military medicine won out over civilian medicine.

Similar calculations where then run comparing the pros and cons of each branch of the miliary, with top priority going to maximizing my ability to choose my preferred specialty, (the top reason for doctor disatisfaction is they chose the wrong specialty). The second most important consideration was the level of physician satisfaction,(as seen on the mil med forum at SDN) third most important was living conditions, which included both location and living conditions on post/base and the espirit de corps of each service. Finally I looked at what unique oppertunties each branch could offer, (Navy won this one because Navy Docs get to serve on ships, AF in second because they get to fly in cool planes and Army last since they can't do anything other than be a doc).

At the end of the day, I decided to join the Army Medical Department because Mathematics commanded me to do so, and since math is the most powerful force in the universe, I dare not disobey😀

P.S

Can you tell I was an econ Major?😀

 

[Richsofresh]

again i am sorry for the grammer i'm doing it from a cellphone not a computer

 

[ahowardmd]

again i am sorry for the grammer i'm doing it from a cellphone not a computer

Let's just say: if you make it through undergrad and to the AMCAS application process (many people don't), do yourself a favor and have a few different people proof-read your application. Computers catch the small spelling and grammar mistakes, but you shouldn't depend on them. I'm sure a few English and/or writing classes could help you with this. Also, the MCAT has a writing section (without a spellchecker), so if you depend on the computer to check your spelling, you'll be SOL.

 

[nmbutah]

does anyone know the date officer training starts for army, I know its sometime in June, trying to plan my spring...

 

[ahowardmd]

Did anybody answer these? I think the thread got derailed for a while so these posts were mostly ignored.

Any advice concerning housing for August 2010-2014?
Rosedale, Metropolitan, Triangle Towers, Avalon... rent a house off of craigslist...?

Apartment reviews online aren't very reliable, and I won't travel to see anything in person until next May. If anyone has any recommendations or precautions then I'd really appreciate it!

Personally I have only been to DC once, for my interview, so I don't know what I'll be doing for Housing as of yet. I was thinking maybe I could get a studio apartment in Bethesda for at least the first semester, then move into something better/cheaper once I'm in town and I have the low-down.

For those of you that have sent grade updates to USUHS post-interview, how did you send them? I mean, can I just email them my grades and then send them the official transcript later on? Either way, I think it is kind of lame since I already have my degree and none of the classes I took this semester were prerequisites, but whatev. Any thoughts?

Good question. I wasn't aware we needed to send grade updates? My semester grades just became official, so do I need to send in official transcripts? Emailing the grades would be easier!

 

[ahowardmd]

does anyone know the date officer training starts for army, I know its sometime in June, trying to plan my spring...

The OBC is June 13-July 26, according to the yellow paper we got at the interview.

 

[mslall]

"Why did you choose to go into military medicine despite the horror stories on the military medicine forum?"

For me it was 3 main reasons.

1. Its the only chance I have to live my values. The military has a strong sense of community, honor, purpose, duty and discipline that I want to be a part of.

Being disciplined means being able to control yourself and not looking at the LORs when you signed your name saying you wouldn't. Being honorable and having integrity would lead you to also not look at them.


As far as housing goes there's a bunch of stuff around. Rosedale is really convenient, but you'll spend more than your BAH on a 1 bedroom apartment. I've heard Triangle Towers is ok, but not great. There are a good number of students that live at the Palisades.

I mean, what you get really depends on what you want and your situation. If you have a family looking for a house on craigslist might not be a bad idea. There are a lot of apartments a little further down Rockville Pike (355/Wisconsin) that are still expensive but reasonable.
I would say that unless you're married I would plan on having a roommate or multiple roommates. You'll save a lot of money on rent that way (and probably can pocket some of your BAH).

Also, I"m not sure if you're planning on using the metro to get to school or not. I was, so I'm paying extra for a place thats closer to the metro. I've ridden the metro to school a grand total of zero times this semester. It's just easier to drive, and until the last few weeks with the return of the 3rd and 4th years, parking hasn't been too bad. I do use the metro to go out. Its nice to have a designated driver.....or not have $20+ dollar cab fare. I don't remember the names of the other places you mentioned off the top of my head.

PM me if you want to know more

 

[silverhorse84]

The OBC is June 13-July 26, according to the yellow paper we got at the interview.

That sounds about right - last year ODS started June 21 and OBLC started a week before us.

For the rest of the things that have been posted lately:

1. Do not read letters of rec unless you have explicitly been told by the writer that you can! I don't care if they've already been sent it - its still wrong.

2. USUHS is more expensive because it costs the gov't more to train us. More money = they want more out of you. I'll give you all the advice one of my USUHS interviewers gave me: if you are doubting making the military a career, don't do USUHS. He has seen many new physicians who get to that 4th payback year and wish they had the choice to get out. There have been many HPSP physicians who got to that 4th year and decided to stay in - some of the USUHS grads sometimes wish they had the choice at that point. At this point in my life I want to make the Navy a career - that may change in the next 15 years and I may get out after my 7 year commitment is done - it just depends on my family situation and my happiness. But at the point of choosing schools, I loved USUHS and the environment and have no problem dedicating the next 15 years.
For those of you wondering about the math: training time does not count for payback time so the 15 is from: 4 of school + 1 internship + 3 residency (assuming a short residency here) + 7 payback

3. I don't go to the mil med forum anymore because there are people there who are dedicated to turning newcomers away from the military at all costs. Generally people who come to internet forums are either a. really happy, or b. really mad/upset/disappointed. The people in the b camp usually outnumber those in the a camp. This is also why I don't trust online reviews of teachers/doctors/businesses - the only people who take the time to respond are ones who are angry and generally, they are people who screwed up themselves and are blaming it on someone else. I couldn't stand the mil med forum anymore, so I stopped going about 2 months ago.

4. Housing. While it may be scary, May is definitely not too late to just start looking at housing. I didn't decide to go to USUHS until the May 15 deadline, so thats when I started looking at housing. Apartments should be looked at in person if possible (doesn't have to be you, could be a roommate - I didn't see my apartment until I moved it because I trusted my roommate). Talk to the first and second years about where they are living and who they are living with - you'll find varying answers and hopefully you can choose the one that best fits you. Everyone who is accepted will be getting a sponsor (one of us first years) soon - I have mine, but haven't emailed yet because I just haven't had the time. Some sponsors wait a while before contacting you so don't freak out if no one contacts you soon. You can always ask me/someone else on here - I'll do my best to answer, although I only have my experience (Navy, non-prior).

If I missed something that someone asked about, I'm sorry. I haven't been here in 2 days and I see that it's exploded a little I'm always happy to help, as are the other med students that come here. Good luck to everyone still waiting.

 

[Richsofresh]

Let's just say: if you make it through undergrad and to the AMCAS application process (many people don't), do yourself a favor and have a few different people proof-read your application. Computers catch the small spelling and grammar mistakes, but you shouldn't depend on them. I'm sure a few English and/or writing classes could help you with this. Also, the MCAT has a writing section (without a spellchecker), so if you depend on the computer to check your spelling, you'll be SOL.

i know how to spell i was just saying sorry for the grammer because the last couple of post i did from a cellphone without a qwerty keyboard so i was basically shorthand some of the stuff like i do when i am texting someone i am well accomplished in my writing skills thank you

 

[memos87]

I have been accepted to USUHS (army-non prior), but I have also been pushed through the HPSP program because they are apparently doing administrative overrides (dropping scholarships) for those not commissioned yet as there is a strong demand. I was sworn in as a 2nd Lieutenant about 2 weeks ago, but I am still debating USUHS vs. a couple of other schools with the HPSP program.

Questions

1. Is anyone in a similar situation/ if anyone was what made them choose?

2. I know that you are basically guaranteed a residency after USUHS, but with HPSP you are still entered in the same pool, but it is more competitive?

3. If unaccepted into the FYGE program (in HPSP) and you go to an alternate civilian residency, the active duty/repayment is deferred, but what happens then?

 

[grotto]

I have been accepted to USUHS (army-non prior), but I have also been pushed through the HPSP program because they are apparently doing administrative overrides (dropping scholarships) for those not commissioned yet as there is a strong demand. I was sworn in as a 2nd Lieutenant about 2 weeks ago, but I am still debating USUHS vs. a couple of other schools with the HPSP program.

Questions

1. Is anyone in a similar situation/ if anyone was what made them choose?

2. I know that you are basically guaranteed a residency after USUHS, but with HPSP you are still entered in the same pool, but it is more competitive?

3. If unaccepted into the FYGE program (in HPSP) and you go to an alternate civilian residency, the active duty/repayment is deferred, but what happens then?

Interesting that you have already been commissioned, were you commissioned IRR? You questions have been talked about in the military medicine section fairly recently, so you might want to search there. I know that is an annoying answer but that forum tends to get people who are considering both options.

I can give you my perspective on your first question, however. Although I am almost 100% sure I'm going to USUHS and am currently in the military, I have had a hard time committing to the length of service that USUHS requires. I have offers from several other schools w/ HPSP and the choice to even get out of the military and go as a civilian if wish. If I was single, younger, and not used to a certain lifestyle, I would probably go HPSP. I love USUHS, and it is a good school and I think a good fit for me, but the other offers I've gotten would be almost impossible to resist if it weren't for my family.

HPSP offers a lot of flexibility - you can choose to stay in the military and do your training, or if you don't like it you can get out after a GMO tour. You can go to whatever school you want, and while there your interaction with the military is minimal, allowing you to do research or go on an international medical trip while you are in school. The negative with HPSP (and an advantage with USUHS) is that like a military academy (USMA, USNA) you are forming lifelong relationships with your future collegues. This is a huge positive as something like 80% of military physicians who serve 20 years in the military are USUHS grads. At medical school "x" on an HPSP scholarship, you could very well be the only future mil doc there, and you only do a couple military rotations.

I'm not sure about your residency questions, although I believe that there is no difference between HPSP and USUHS (officially) when going into residencies. However, a USUHS grad has the advantage of actually having rotated at many of those sites and hopefully having formed good relationships with the people that run them. I can't imagine this hurts a USUHS grads prospects when it comes time to match.

Again, search around the mil med forum and see what you find.

 

[xmsr3]

Being disciplined means being able to control yourself and not looking at the LORs when you signed your name saying you wouldn't. Being honorable and having integrity would lead you to also not look at them.


As far as housing goes there's a bunch of stuff around. Rosedale is really convenient, but you'll spend more than your BAH on a 1 bedroom apartment. I've heard Triangle Towers is ok, but not great. There are a good number of students that live at the Palisades.

I mean, what you get really depends on what you want and your situation. If you have a family looking for a house on craigslist might not be a bad idea. There are a lot of apartments a little further down Rockville Pike (355/Wisconsin) that are still expensive but reasonable.
I would say that unless you're married I would plan on having a roommate or multiple roommates. You'll save a lot of money on rent that way (and probably can pocket some of your BAH).

Also, I"m not sure if you're planning on using the metro to get to school or not. I was, so I'm paying extra for a place thats closer to the metro. I've ridden the metro to school a grand total of zero times this semester. It's just easier to drive, and until the last few weeks with the return of the 3rd and 4th years, parking hasn't been too bad. I do use the metro to go out. Its nice to have a designated driver.....or not have $20+ dollar cab fare. I don't remember the names of the other places you mentioned off the top of my head.

PM me if you want to know more

Ok, I'll admit I was wrong to advice others to look at their letters,(cherry picking is unethical) but to say that I lack integrity for looking at them AFTER I HAD SENT EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM TO USUHS, because it is the same as cheating on an exam by glancing at someone else's paper before handing it in, (which some have compared it to) seems a bit harsh. That kind of cheating on an exam is worthy of expulsion (which I believe is the standard policy at most colleges) because it is truely hanous, as it lies about your knowledge of the subject matter and gives you and unfair advantage over others.

Rather here is a more apt comparison:

I believe that when we took the MCAT we had to agree to the terms of the test, which I believe involved us not talking about the test to anyone.

Now I'll admit that after the MCAT I rushed home and went straight to SDN where people where discussing the MCAT they had just taken and comparing what they got on the test.

Was this unethical? To compare answers on a test you had already completed, (which every single person in every science class I ever took in college did!) and could not possibly change and the outcome of which would affect the course of your entire life?

Well technically it was! Since we all signed the agreement. BUT is it fair to compare everyone who discussed the MCAT in this way TO A CHEATER? AND is it fair to say that every person who compared their MCAT after the fact is a person of low ethical character? I would bet that almost every single person reading this did the same (or if they didn't post a comment they at least read the thread, which included people comparing answers, which is still technically unethical)! Are we all unworthy of the military because of it?

If it dosn't give you an unfair advantage and dosn't change in any way the outcome, then, IMHO comparing it to cheating, (or lieing on your AMCAS or interview) things that do affect the outcome by giving you an unfair and unearned advantage, is way over the top and in my view borders on the preposterous.

P.S

It seems that the consensus is strongly against me, and since most of you have some kind of previous military experience, it may be that I need to adjust my thinking. After all, a career in the military requires both hard work AND keeping your nose completley clean, so if that is the case, thanks everyone for the heads up.

I didn't think I had any kind of philisophical conflicts with the military mindset, since I have never cheated on a test or lied to give myself an unfair advantage, but perhaps I do to some extent, (I honestly never considered what I did to be unethical). In the future I will be sure to stick to the rules and regs 100%, just to be sure that nothing I do screws up my career.

 

[Segovia]

Anybody that knows anything about xmsr is that he is perhaps overzealous, but certainly not malicious. The fact that he was divulging this advice on a public forum shows that he was not intentionally misleading in his application process. Naive, but not misleading. He really just wants to see other applicants be competitive. To compare that to cheating on an exam is over the top. Either way, now he seems to understand that it was not the right way to go about things. QED

And about the grade updates...the only reason I am updating USUHS on my fall grades is because we had to submit that update letter along with our tentative spring schedule on the interview day. I wonder if USUHS will care if I drop my entire "tentative" spring schedule. I have another acceptance, so I really don't feel like spending my spring taking diff eqns. and whatnot if I don't have to. I would rather spend my spring self-studying anatomy and getting my ish ready for the USMLE.

 

[dwb8p]

Anybody that knows anything about xmsr is that he is perhaps overzealous, but certainly not malicious. The fact that he was divulging this advice on a public forum shows that he was not intentionally misleading in his application process. Naive, but not misleading. He really just wants to see other applicants be competitive. To compare that to cheating on an exam is over the top. Either way, now he seems to understand that it was not the right way to go about things. QED

And about the grade updates...the only reason I am updating USUHS on my fall grades is because we had to submit that update letter along with our tentative spring schedule on the interview day. I wonder if USUHS will care if I drop my entire "tentative" spring schedule. I have another acceptance, so I really don't feel like spending my spring taking diff eqns. and whatnot if I don't have to. I would rather spend my spring self-studying anatomy and getting my ish ready for the USMLE.

Don't waste your time studying anatomy before med school. If anything, biochem might be useful. But even then, probably not.

 

[ftrflyr29]

Being disciplined means being able to control yourself and not looking at the LORs when you signed your name saying you wouldn't. Being honorable and having integrity would lead you to also not look at them.

I think we all got it--particularly XMSR3! I agree that XMSR3 is overzealous and could stand to throttle back a bit, but give the guy a break!

Once you all move out of your glass houses you can then continue to throw stones. The point was made 18 posts ago.

What are you all going to do when it comes FITREP time on active duty and you fill out your own comments section, to find that everything you wrote (embellished or not) was not changed one iota? And if it was embellished, are you going to take it to your CO and ask him to change it?

 

[mslall]

Ok, I'll admit I was wrong to advice others to look at their letters,(cherry picking is unethical) but to say that I lack integrity for looking at them AFTER I HAD SENT EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM TO USUHS, because it is the same as cheating on an exam by glancing at someone else's paper before handing it in, (which some have compared it to) seems a bit harsh. That kind of cheating on an exam is worthy of expulsion (which I believe is the standard policy at most colleges) because it is truely hanous, as it lies about your knowledge of the subject matter and gives you and unfair advantage over others.

Rather here is a more apt comparison:

I believe that when we took the MCAT we had to agree to the terms of the test, which I believe involved us not talking about the test to anyone.

Now I'll admit that after the MCAT I rushed home and went straight to SDN where people where discussing the MCAT they had just taken and comparing what they got on the test.

Was this unethical? To compare answers on a test you had already completed, (which every single person in every science class I ever took in college did!) and could not possibly change and the outcome of which would affect the course of your entire life?

Well technically it was! Since we all signed the agreement. BUT is it fair to compare everyone who discussed the MCAT in this way TO A CHEATER? AND is it fair to say that every person who compared their MCAT after the fact is a person of low ethical character? I would bet that almost every single person reading this did the same (or if they didn't post a comment they at least read the thread, which included people comparing answers, which is still technically unethical)! Are we all unworthy of the military because of it?

If it dosn't give you an unfair advantage and dosn't change in any way the outcome, then, IMHO comparing it to cheating, (or lieing on your AMCAS or interview) things that do affect the outcome by giving you an unfair and unearned advantage, is way over the top and in my view borders on the preposterous.

P.S

It seems that the consensus is strongly against me, and since most of you have some kind of previous military experience, it may be that I need to adjust my thinking. After all, a career in the military requires both hard work AND keeping your nose completley clean, so if that is the case, thanks everyone for the heads up.

I didn't think I had any kind of philisophical conflicts with the military mindset, since I have never cheated on a test or lied to give myself an unfair advantage, but perhaps I do to some extent, (I honestly never considered what I did to be unethical). In the future I will be sure to stick to the rules and regs 100%, just to be sure that nothing I do screws up my career.

what if one of your interviewers had wanted to ask you some questions regarding something written in one of your LORs? Would that not give you some advantage over those interviewing who had not decided to cheat on the application process? SO here is a big difference reading your LORs and talking about an an exam you've already taken

Now I do agree with you that you shouldn't have talked about it seeing as how you said you wouldn't.

I'm just pointing out the contradiction between what you say and you're admitted actions and that yes there is a difference between talking about an exam and looking at LORs.

I can also guarantee you that an admissions committee would see a difference between talking about a previous exam and looking at LORs.

 

[BluSkye712]

Don't waste your time studying anatomy before med school. If anything, biochem might be useful. But even then, probably not.

At the same time, anatomy is way more fun than biochem (having taken both as an undergrad), so if you have a chance to take an anatomy (plus lab!) during college, go for it!

 

[mslall]

At the same time, anatomy is way more fun than biochem (having taken both as an undergrad), so if you have a chance to take an anatomy (plus lab!) during college, go for it!

you NERDS......including you dwb8p. You're going to be studying your nuts off for the next 4 years and then working yourself like a dog for at least 3 more after that.....probably the rest of your life (unless you're one of those derm, rads, path, optho kind of guys). ENJOY this time!.....and the first year of medical school.....its not that hard

 

[Soba]

you NERDS......including you dwb8p. You're going to be studying your nuts off for the next 4 years and then working yourself like a dog for at least 3 more after that.....probably the rest of your life (unless you're one of those derm, rads, path, optho kind of guys). ENJOY this time!.....and the first year of medical school.....its not that hard

Truer words were never spoken.

Seriously guys, go on a trip. A LONG trip if you can afford it. There are some of us who can't even if they want to. 🙁

 

[silverhorse84]

1. Is anyone in a similar situation/ if anyone was what made them choose?

I chose between USUHS and other medical schools last spring. I chose USUHS because I felt that I fit in with the students better and the school was a better fit for me. That said, there are benefits and negatives to both sides.
-HPSP has a smaller payback; however, if you're career military, USUHS years in school count once you hit 20 years (i.e. if you're in the military and get out before 20, your years at USUHS mean nothing. If you're in 20 years then retire, you'll get benefits for 24 years).
-The students were happier and seemed to help eachother more at USUHS. I know every school says this, but as a student at USUHS, my classmates upload/email material that we all have access to (study sheets, outlines, practice quizes, old exams, etc). One of the professors contributes this to the idea that we understand that our classmates will be our colleagues and our own physicians (the military is not that big) - we want our classmates to do as well as us, so when we refer our patients, or are patients ourselves, we have confidence in the man/woman standing before us.
-USUHS does have added classes. Military medicine and medical history aren't difficult (at least so far they haven't been, although we haven't started history yet), but they do take time. However, some of what we do can be fun. From what I hear our summer experience is a lot of fun - I'll let you know next fall 🙂
-USUHS students make more money while they are medical students. This said, money shouldn't be the reason to do military medicine.
-I think Bethesda is a nice area (and close to DC), and I actually wanted to get out of CA even though I had the option to stay.
-USUHS has actual grades (A, B, C, F). This can be a blessing and a curse. We aren't competative like schools that have H/HP/P/F - for them the top 10% get H, the next certain % HP, etc fostering a competitive environment. For us, everyone can get an A if everyone gets 90s or higher on exams/quizes/etc; I think this is the reason we're so generous with the study material we make and why we upload it for others. On the flip side, it is grades which can be a stressor for some people.
-The other USUHS advantage is answered in your next question below

2. I know that you are basically guaranteed a residency after USUHS, but with HPSP you are still entered in the same pool, but it is more competitive?

In theory USUHS and HPSP students are equal when considering residencies. However, as someone else has already stated, USUHS students do all of their rotations at military hospitals while HPSP only have 2 paid rotations. HPSP students can do all of their rotations at military hospitals if they're school allows them to, but they'll be paying out of pocket for all but 2 of them. This is an advantage for USUHS students because they get more "face time" with the program directors and other higher ups.

3. If unaccepted into the FYGE program (in HPSP) and you go to an alternate civilian residency, the active duty/repayment is deferred, but what happens then?

This I can't answer, sorry.

 

[xmsr3]

you NERDS......including you dwb8p. You're going to be studying your nuts off for the next 4 years and then working yourself like a dog for at least 3 more after that.....probably the rest of your life (unless you're one of those derm, rads, path, optho kind of guys). ENJOY this time!.....and the first year of medical school.....its not that hard

From your lips to god's ears....hopefully😀

I am taking this precious time to do the two things I know I won't have time to do once in med school.

1. Train for a marathon and a triathalon
2. Learn to trade currency

So far I'm loving both and hopefully they will serve me well in the future😀