Boston University versus University of Iowa

[Topo]

I would like to make my medical school decision based on which will give me the most opportunity (though I'm well aware that it's largely based on individual efforts) and advantage to get into competitive residencies at relatively prestigious schools. But, what with the discrepancy between match results and US news ranking, and the variable of location preference, I'm feeling that I have no real information to work with.

The comforts of lifestyle at a location aside (I'm sure many will prefer Boston over Iowa City), if accepted into both schools, which one would you guys pick?

Iowa has a great research ranking, but students mainly go into primary care, and their match list isn't exactly outstanding, whereas I feel BU's is. But, assuming that most Midwestern students want to stay in the Midwest, is it accurate to also assume, then, that had they wished to go to prestigious schools in the coasts, they could have easily matched?

I have this illogical fear that going to a Midwestern school will somehow limit my competitiveness for residency... I know BU's Step 1 average is really high, but I have no clue about Iowa's. Still, a 26th in US News for Iowa must mean something right?

Opinions?

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[ialwayslose]

are you from iowa?

is it important to stay close to your family?

is cost a factor?

all things being equal, I think BU would be the better route.

 

[Topo]

I would like to just focus on the school itself (with the exception of clinical contributions of a location I guess).

Yeah I had a feeling that BU seems to offer more.

 

[drizzt3117]

I would like to just focus on the school itself (with the exception of clinical contributions of a location I guess).

Yeah I had a feeling that BU seems to offer more.

Iowa is a better school with top programs in many fields (especially surgical subspecialties). That being said, location is an important factor in deciding between schools and regional bias is definitely important in residency selection. Ultimately if you'd prefer the east coast, BU may be a better choice. If you'd rather stay in the Midwest, Iowa may be a better choice.

 

[mipp0]

Iowa is a better school with top programs in many fields (especially surgical subspecialties). That being said, location is an important factor in deciding between schools and regional bias is definitely important in residency selection. Ultimately if you'd prefer the east coast, BU may be a better choice. If you'd rather stay in the Midwest, Iowa may be a better choice.

HOW is Iowa a better school? Are we going purely by USNEWS rankings (as flawed as that approach is) here? Board scores? Match? Clinical rotations? Diversity? Social mission?

Not trying to doubt or attack you. Just wondering how you came to that conclusion. What school do you attend?

 

[drizzt3117]

HOW is Iowa a better school? Are we going purely by USNEWS rankings (as flawed as that approach is) here? Board scores? Match? Clinical rotations? Diversity? Social mission?

Not trying to doubt or attack you. Just wondering how you came to that conclusion. What school do you attend?

I attend neither Iowa nor BU. BU is a good program for specialties like emergency medicine but is widely known to not be as academic an institution as Iowa. Iowa not only has more research but also has top departments in fields like orthopedic surgery, opthamology, general surgery, medicine (and many of its subspecialties), etc. BU has far less research and is good but not spectacular in those fields. Along with Tufts, it lags behind the other Boston programs in program strength in most fields.

 

[western1]

if accepted into both schools, which one would you guys pick?

I would cross this bridge when you come to it. No sense worrying yourself over a decision you might not actually have to make.

But in response. BU hands down. With everything they're doing to make a better community, reduce stress for students, and increase scores I'd definitely choose BU, hypothetically.....😎, over UI.

 

[drizzt3117]

I have this illogical fear that going to a Midwestern school will somehow limit my competitiveness for residency... I know BU's Step 1 average is really high, but I have no clue about Iowa's. Still, a 26th in US News for Iowa must mean something right?

Opinions?

Going to a midwestern school won't limit your competitiveness for residency. However, there are regional biases that may play a role. If you really want to be in the NE, I would go to BU. That being said, people from Iowa match all over.

 

[Topo]

I would actually prefer the west coast. This may be entirely off the mark, but it seems regional bias extends to east coast <----> west coast, and if so, that really does limit the midwestern schools does it not?

But thanks for your insight drizz. In terms of research opportunities and academic strength, Iowa seems to have it better...and that should hypothetically help in application to competitive residencies. I do feel that BU has a more organized, comprehensive program though. Or maybe they just did a better job selling themselves than Iowa did during interview...

Do schools/hospitals look at/take into account the patient population diversity one worked with in med school? Because if so, I guess that'd give BU another plus.

 

[MCATBUSTER]

Please go to Boston College! hahaha this will free up a spot at Iowa and hopefully I will get it!
I'm just joking, both schools are great. However, I would go to Iowa because I'm currently an Iowa student and I love it here!

 

[Brachyury]

I would like to make my medical school decision based on which will give me the most opportunity (though I'm well aware that it's largely based on individual efforts) and advantage to get into competitive residencies at relatively prestigious schools. But, what with the discrepancy between match results and US news ranking, and the variable of location preference, I'm feeling that I have no real information to work with.

The comforts of lifestyle at a location aside (I'm sure many will prefer Boston over Iowa City), if accepted into both schools, which one would you guys pick?

Iowa has a great research ranking, but students mainly go into primary care, and their match list isn't exactly outstanding, whereas I feel BU's is. But, assuming that most Midwestern students want to stay in the Midwest, is it accurate to also assume, then, that had they wished to go to prestigious schools in the coasts, they could have easily matched?

I have this illogical fear that going to a Midwestern school will somehow limit my competitiveness for residency... I know BU's Step 1 average is really high, but I have no clue about Iowa's. Still, a 26th in US News for Iowa must mean something right?

Opinions?

Iowa has 1.5 times the NIH funding of BU, Iowa is home to one of the twelve Doris Duke felloship programs, and if you need to get away, Chicago is only three hours away by car (there are also comercial busses that run between Iowa City and Chicago). I wouldn't let the primary-care-heavy match list bother you: the University of Iowa is the state medical school, and as such, it's going to enroll many students who want to stay and work in primary care within the state. IMHO, the best selling point of Iowa is the people: you get to be surrounded by Iowans, who some of the friendliest, down-to-Earth people you will ever meet; in my experience, the same cannot be said for BU students

 

[Yraqi]

What's the average step 1 scores for both schools?

 

[mndr]

Is there really regional bias for residencies? I mean I feel like people who go to school in certain regions may wish to stay there so it may seem heavily weighted, but do they really have problems if they wish to go to a different region?

 

[drizzt3117]

Is there really regional bias for residencies? I mean I feel like people who go to school in certain regions may wish to stay there so it may seem heavily weighted, but do they really have problems if they wish to go to a different region?

Yes. Visit the residency forums and look at how this cycle has gone for people.

 

[Brachyury]

What's the average step 1 scores for both schools?

They're not posted and they're not necessarily relevant in the OPs decission. Better questions to ask are what is the curriculum style (traditional, systems, or PBL), how much time are students given to study for step I, and is the grading scale P/F or something else.

 

[Topo]

Yes. Visit the residency forums and look at how this cycle has gone for people.

Is is true then that coastal schools prefer each other? For some reason, lots of east coast match lists show a lot of matches to California and UW. Though that could, perhaps, just be because they are private schools and accept a more diverse student body.

 

[Topo]

They're not posted and they're not necessarily relevant in the OPs decission. Better questions to ask are what is the curriculum style (traditional, systems, or PBL), how much time are students given to study for step I, and is the grading scale P/F or something else.

I do feel that a high Step 1 average says a lot about a school though: if not the effectiveness of the curriculum itself in preparing for Step 1 (e.g. bulk of focus isn't on non-board material with a few step questions sneaked into tests every now and then), then at least the calibre of students in the school, which I believe will also contribute greatly to how (and when) one goes about studying Step 1.

Iowans are amazing people. As far as the non-academic and non-clinical factors, I'd much prefer U of Iowa and Iowa City. However, again, I would like to, at least for the purpose of this discussion, disregard these factors. Carver College is one of those ABCD schools...Honours, High Pass, Pass, Fail; BU is Pass/Fail for the pre-clinical years. 🙁

 

[drizzt3117]

Is is true then that coastal schools prefer each other? For some reason, lots of east coast match lists show a lot of matches to California and UW. Though that could, perhaps, just be because they are private schools and accept a more diverse student body.

There's a lot of factors that matter including where you're actually from. A lot of the people at the east coast schools are FROM CA and Washington. I would contend that it's hard to get interviews at the top west coast programs no matter what school you go to. They offer interviews to 10% or less of applicants in my experience. That being said, programs in general are more receptive of programs from their region. I don't know that west coast programs are more receptive of people from the east coast than midwest, that hasn't been my experience, I would definitely say that midwestern programs are more receptive of midwestern applicants and east coast are more receptive of east coast programs, though.

 

[drizzt3117]

I do feel that a high Step 1 average says a lot about a school though: if not the effectiveness of the curriculum itself in preparing for Step 1 (e.g. bulk of focus isn't on non-board material with a few step questions sneaked into tests every now and then), then at least the calibre of students in the school, which I believe will also contribute greatly to how (and when) one goes about studying Step 1.

Iowans are amazing people. As far as the non-academic and non-clinical factors, I'd much prefer U of Iowa and Iowa City. However, again, I would like to, at least for the purpose of this discussion, disregard these factors. Carver College is one of those ABCD schools...Honours, High Pass, Pass, Fail; BU is Pass/Fail for the pre-clinical years. 🙁

I don't agree that a high Step 1 score says a lot about a school. Certain schools are known for having high step 1 because they teach to the boards (UF) Does than enhance their national reputation? Not really. Schools have a strong national reputation for residency selection because they have good residency programs and top faculty, not because of how their students do on the boards. Certain schools have a reputation of being extremely rigorous during the clinical years and training excellent medical students; I think that's a nice benefit to have. For example, it would be interesting to ask a California PD their thoughts on students from the different "top tier" West Coast medical schools.

 

[drizzt3117]

I do feel that a high Step 1 average says a lot about a school though: if not the effectiveness of the curriculum itself in preparing for Step 1 (e.g. bulk of focus isn't on non-board material with a few step questions sneaked into tests every now and then), then at least the calibre of students in the school, which I believe will also contribute greatly to how (and when) one goes about studying Step 1.

Iowans are amazing people. As far as the non-academic and non-clinical factors, I'd much prefer U of Iowa and Iowa City. However, again, I would like to, at least for the purpose of this discussion, disregard these factors. Carver College is one of those ABCD schools...Honours, High Pass, Pass, Fail; BU is Pass/Fail for the pre-clinical years. 🙁

I don't know why people are against pre-clinical grading, it's a nice mechanism to encourage studying. I highly doubt Iowa is going to be a hotbed of gunning. Another thing to take into account is that state schools (especially ones with an emphasis on primary care) aren't selecting for a population that is necessarily the best test takers. That's not really a problem, the most important factor here is individual student performance.

Furthermore, it's not necessarily an advantage to have a high percentage of your students specialize (although certain people seem to think it is) At schools that have 35 people going into radiology/anesthesia (such as RFU) it's certainly easy to get lost in the crowd if you are one of these applicants.

 

[Treesop]

As a dual-citizen of Canada and the US, would I be better off going to a private school like BU than a public one like Iowa if I wish to apply back to Canada for residency?

Private schools are more well known in Canada just because Canadians can apply to them. Case in point, I know quite a few Canadians at BU. Public schools rarely accept international students. In terms of general "international prestige" private schools usually trump public ones. But that's just to your average college joe, and not the PDs or adcoms.

 

[drizzt3117]

As a dual-citizen of Canada and the US, would I be better off going to a private school like BU than a public one like Iowa if I wish to apply back to Canada for residency?

Private schools are more well known in Canada just because Canadians can apply to them. Case in point, I know quite a few Canadians at BU. Iowa accepts no international students. In terms of general "international prestige" private schools usually trump public ones. But that's just your average college joe, and not the PDs or adcoms.

That's really specialty dependent. In general I don't think this should be on your radar in terms of deciding between schools. In the grand scheme of things it should be far down on your list of considerations.

 

[Topo]

I don't agree that a high Step 1 score says a lot about a school. Certain schools are known for having high step 1 because they teach to the boards (UF) Does than enhance their national reputation? Not really. Schools have a strong national reputation for residency selection because they have good residency programs and top faculty, not because of how their students do on the boards. Certain schools have a reputation of being extremely rigorous during the clinical years and training excellent medical students; I think that's a nice benefit to have. For example, it would be interesting to ask a California PD their thoughts on students from the different "top tier" West Coast medical schools.

But a high step score is the minimum to qualify for a lot of competitive residencies isn't it? E.g. Derm requires 250+ or something. I can only imagine the thresholds become higher and higher as medicine becomes more competitive in general.

 

[mipp0]

But a high step score is the minimum to qualify for a lot of competitive residencies isn't it? E.g. Derm requires 250+ or something. I can only imagine the thresholds become higher and higher as medicine becomes more competitive in general.

Topo, I think it would be best for you to hear someone who would advocate on behalf of BU now that we've heard all the Midwest advocates : )

 

[drizzt3117]

But a high step score is the minimum to qualify for a lot of competitive residencies isn't it? E.g. Derm requires 250+ or something. I can only imagine the thresholds become higher and higher as medicine becomes more competitive in general.

The point is that your classmates' performance have zero impact on you as an individual. Step 1 is again about individual choices. If 30 of your classmates choose to go into family medicine and feel like they need 210 for that and study accordingly, how does that affect you? This is to a certain degree true of match lists as well, although it would probably affect you to a certain degree to go to a school where a sizable percentage of people are going into a single competitive specialty. For example, in my class this year, 16 people are going into orthopedics. This is sort of suboptimal from an individual perspective.

 

[MIAYO]

I would take pre-clinical grading highly into consideration. Going to a P/F school is very high on my list for arranging what schools I choose to withdraw from in April/May.

 

[Topo]

Just wondering if anyone has any new input? I am still having trouble deciding 🙁

 

[OsteonMahn]

Just wondering if anyone has any new input? I am still having trouble deciding 🙁

A doctor once gave me really good advice. He said,

"In high school, the biggest thing in the world seems like where you're going to college. In college, the biggest thing in the world seems like where you're going to medical school. In medical school, the biggest thing in the world seems like where you're going to do your residency. In residency, the biggest thing in the world seems like where you're going to do your fellowship."

He then went on to tell me that while each step is important, his hindsight has showed him that in the end, while there may be differences between one medical school and another, you're going to get to where you want to be regardless as long as you work hard. For example, where you do your clerkship might seem like a huge thing. While it is important, keep in mind that when you graduate medical school, you know little to nothing about being an actual doctor.

You aren't going to attend Harvard and then free-float to any specialty of your choosing, and it's the same for any other school.

Take things like cost, style of curriculum, your impressions when you visited the school, and definitely where you think you might want to end up (east coast vs. west coast).

Ultimately, you're choosing between two very good schools and you can't go wrong either way.

 

[mipp0]

A doctor once gave me really good advice. He said,

"In high school, the biggest thing in the world seems like where you're going to college. In college, the biggest thing in the world seems like where you're going to medical school. In medical school, the biggest thing in the world seems like where you're going to do your residency. In residency, the biggest thing in the world seems like where you're going to do your fellowship."

He then went on to tell me that while each step is important, his hindsight has showed him that in the end, while there may be differences between one medical school and another, you're going to get to where you want to be regardless as long as you work hard. For example, where you do your clerkship might seem like a huge thing. While it is important, keep in mind that when you graduate medical school, you know little to nothing about being an actual doctor.

You aren't going to attend Harvard and then free-float to any specialty of your choosing, and it's the same for any other school.

Take things like cost, style of curriculum, your impressions when you visited the school, and definitely where you think you might want to end up (east coast vs. west coast).

Ultimately, you're choosing between two very good schools and you can't go wrong either way.

You, sir, are a wise man.