Mayo Medical School- ranking?

[mmmcdowe]

So, being from phoenix where we've got a Mayo clinic, I know all about the prestige of the clinic itself, but what about the school itself? I haven't seen much of it in terms of being one of the best schools or anything. Is it more a research school or a clinical school? Who would you compare them to?

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[copperfrog09]

They're pretty unique. Read up on the website, they are very different than other schools so you can't really say MMS is very similar to X school. They're also very small (42 MD's per class), so thus the reason you don't hear much about them.

 

[aebvd97]

So, being from phoenix where we've got a Mayo clinic, I know all about the prestige of the clinic itself, but what about the school itself? I haven't seen much of it in terms of being one of the best schools or anything. Is it more a research school or a clinical school? Who would you compare them to?

Yeah, I'd definitely say that they are pretty unique. But they are a research institution; according to the Mayo website they got around 215 million in research funding, so that is definitely research heavy.

 

[PremedIowa]

Actually, for their size that is not a particularly large amount of research funding. From the summers I spent there, they seem very focused on clinical practice and education rather than purely research. They do have a required research quarter in the third year, though.

 

[mmmcdowe]

I see what everyone's saying about being unique, but unique doesn't mean better per-se. So lets rephrase part of the questions, what school would you personally go to over Mayo?

 

[copperfrog09]

I see what everyone's saying about being unique, but unique doesn't mean better per-se. So lets rephrase part of the questions, what school would you personally go to over Mayo?

That's a completely different question. I'm not really sure what you're getting at. It is unique which, no, isn't necessarily better for everyone. As such, it's definitely a "fit" school so there are people who love it because it fits them and there are also people that would choose another school over Mayo because it's not the right fit for them individually.

 

[mmmcdowe]

So Mayo is either your top choice or your bottom? I just want to know if, given the chance, would people go to Mayo over other schools. Another way to ask it, how many people would have loved to get into Mayo rather than their top choices?

 

[shnuffles]

The other posters are right, mayo is a different place. However, it is definitely my top choice and if I get in there, I will withdraw from everywhere, no questions asked.

 

[mmmcdowe]

What makes it so different, besides the free tuition and small class size that is 😉

 

[lrkoehle]

Their overall approach is very learning centered, which as I have heard is only second to the patients. I would go to Mayo over any other school. Seriously, look at their website and if it doesn't excite you, then go to the hospital because you are dead.

Also, its not actually free tuition, but everyone gets at least half their tuition covered. Also, for those of us from Minnesota, Arizona, or Florida, we are in state.

 

[mmmcdowe]

Their overall approach is very learning centered, which as I have heard is only second to the patients. I would go to Mayo over any other school. Seriously, look at their website and if it doesn't excite you, then go to the hospital because you are dead.

Also, its not actually free tuition, but everyone gets at least half their tuition covered. Also, for those of us from Minnesota, Arizona, or Florida, we are in state.

It is free this year for the class. Big donor, so they are giving everyone a free ride. Usually, half gets full and half gets half I believe. So yo usay learning centered, which confuses me. What would you call other medical school's approach then?

 

[lrkoehle]

.

 

[lrkoehle]

good point, I didn't make that clear, they are very good at integrating the medical school portion with the clinical portion. If you want a better description look at the "Mayo 2009!!!!" thread at anything phoenix says. It may be Mayo 2008, but that is good thread for information.

This is a post by phoenix about the Mayo thread:

"Quote:
Originally Posted by mdmarty
'What is up with everyone wanting to go to Mayo? I have never heard anyone at my school (a UC) be so in love with it. Besides the small class size, what makes Mayo so special?'

Check out posts 274, 331, 338, 372, 397 and 564 in this thread"

 

[copperfrog09]

It is free this year for the class. Big donor, so they are giving everyone a free ride. Usually, half gets full and half gets half I believe. So yo usay learning centered, which confuses me. What would you call other medical school's approach then?

Where did you get this info from?

We were told at the interview that their scholarships would be handed out 60% full-ride and 40% half-tuition.

Have you interviewed at Mayo?

 

[mmmcdowe]

Where did you get this info from?

We were told at the interview that their scholarships would be handed out 60% full-ride and 40% half-tuition.

Have you interviewed at Mayo?

No, but I work with Mayo Phoenix and I know through my contact there, who is involved in adcom.

 

[SDN2013]

What makes it so different, besides the free tuition and small class size that is 😉

I could list all my own reasons for you, but they are my own reason. My reasons for wanting to go to Mayo would probably sound irrelevant to you as you have your own qualities that you look for in a medical school. If you are having this much trouble trying to decide why you may want to go to Mayo over higher USNews ranked schools, then it might not be such a good fit for you. The reduced tuition is certainly nice, but I am more than willing to still go to Mayo if the scholarships didn't exist. I didn't even know that everyone receives a scholarship until my student host told me.

At the end of the day, there is one school where you would fit in the best at. It's likely different for different people. Say someone wants to go into research. A "higher ranked" med school in research may not necessarily be better in catalyzing a research oriented career than a "lower ranked" one.

 

[pianola]

We were told at the interview that their scholarships would be handed out 60% full-ride and 40% half-tuition.

Correct me if I'm wrong but 25K isn't a full ride when the tuition is 30K and increasing every year...(am I wrong about this? I feel like I'm missing something because I know my host definitely said she had a full-tuition scholarship).

 

[SDN2013]

Correct me if I'm wrong but 25K isn't a full ride when the tuition is 30K and increasing every year...(am I wrong about this? I feel like I'm missing something because I know my host definitely said she had a full-tuition scholarship).

I believe the host said she still had to pay around $4000 in tuition, and according to the handout given to us on interview day, the tuition increases a little per year.

 

[JLC]

I could list all my own reasons for you, but they are my own reason. My reasons for wanting to go to Mayo would probably sound irrelevant to you as you have your own qualities that you look for in a medical school. If you are having this much trouble trying to decide why you may want to go to Mayo over higher USNews ranked schools, then it might not be such a good fit for you. The reduced tuition is certainly nice, but I am more than willing to still go to Mayo if the scholarships didn't exist. I didn't even know that everyone receives a scholarship until my student host told me.

At the end of the day, there is one school where you would fit in the best at. It's likely different for different people. Say someone wants to go into research. A "higher ranked" med school in research may not necessarily be better in catalyzing a research oriented career than a "lower ranked" one.

True but research opportunities are greater (there are more HHMI and many more sucessful labs) when you look at the higher ranked schools.

 

[pianola]

I believe the host said she still had to pay around $4000 in tuition, and according to the handout given to us on interview day, the tuition increases a little per year.

Look at the numbers, though. By senior year you will be paying 10K/year in tuition (or 20K if you get the 15K scholarship). This doesn't include cost-of-living which is somehow miraculously estimated at $27,355 according to the MSAR (Does it REALLY cost that much to live in Rochester (???))

Not that it's not an amazing deal. It is, clearly. But it's not quite a "full ride".

Just something I've been wondering/thinking about.

 

[Sarg's kid]

If I understand the heart of your question to be "If I go to Mayo, will people everywhere hush when I enter the room and say 'Look there goes MMMCdowe. He attended the very prestigious Mayo Medical School. Let us bask in his prestige and be honored by his presence', then I don't think you'd like Mayo anyway. If you're hunting for name recognition, people have heard of Mayo. It has a good reputation worldwide and the medical school is top notch. It won't get the oohs and awws of, say a harvard.

Since you work at Mayo, as do I, I will also venture to guess that you are acquainted with the Mayo culture. I will go one step further and say that if your primary concern in choosing a medical school is it's rankings on the US News so that you can brag about your school rank, then I doubt you would like going to Mayo anyway. If you could get in. I don't know about the Az campus, but all of the Mayo Rochester Docs that I've shadowed and met outside of work are there because of the values of the institution, NOT its ranking on some list.

In conclusion, I would suggest that you not waste your money applying to Mayo. Anybody with your exposure to the institution who would ask this OP question wouldn't enjoy the Mayo environment and certainly would have a hard time covering up that degree of "Asshattedness" through the app process anyway.

I say go for harvard, hopkins, and the rest of the top 10's. Good luck to you and may your medical career reward your ego in all of the ways that you seek.

 

[mmmcdowe]

If I understand the heart of your question to be "If I go to Mayo, will people everywhere hush when I enter the room and say 'Look there goes MMMCdowe. He attended the very prestigious Mayo Medical School. Let us bask in his prestige and be honored by his presence', then I don't think you'd like Mayo anyway. If you're hunting for name recognition, people have heard of Mayo. It has a good reputation worldwide and the medical school is top notch. It won't get the oohs and awws of, say a harvard.

Since you work at Mayo, as do I, I will also venture to guess that you are acquainted with the Mayo culture. I will go one step further and say that if your primary concern in choosing a medical school is it's rankings on the US News so that you can brag about your school rank, then I doubt you would like going to Mayo anyway. If you could get in. I don't know about the Az campus, but all of the Mayo Rochester Docs that I've shadowed and met outside of work are there because of the values of the institution, NOT its ranking on some list.

In conclusion, I would suggest that you not waste your money applying to Mayo. Anybody with your exposure to the institution who would ask this OP question wouldn't enjoy the Mayo environment and certainly would have a hard time covering up that degree of "Asshattedness" through the app process anyway.

I say go for harvard, hopkins, and the rest of the top 10's. Good luck to you and may your medical career reward your ego in all of the ways that you seek.

That's really rude of you, frankly. I am not considering applying to this medical school, and this question was not about official rankings. I wanted to know what the real perception of Mayo is by the members of SDN. So sorry to step you your toes, and by the way its not that hard to cover asshattedness when you don't have to submit a seconday,

 

[Slack3r]

Any school I want? UCLA. Where I'll end up? Probably Arizona, if anywhere.

 

[Sarg's kid]

That's really rude of you, frankly. I am not considering applying to this medical school, and this question was not about official rankings. I wanted to know what the real perception of Mayo is by the members of SDN. So sorry to step you your toes, and by the way its not that hard to cover asshattedness when you don't have to submit a seconday,

Kudos. This was a well reasoned response to my empassioned post and I salute you.

Good point about asshattedness.

May I ask, what does it matter what people on SDN think? It's riddled with the bitter, the overeager, the gunners and the trolls. (And the normals too.) Mayo Medical School is Mayo. It's obsessively patient centered. And the medical school schedule allows lots of opportunity to get exposure to the clinics on campus. (the selectives after every block 1st and 2nd year) Past that, this whole process is about finding a place where you're happy, with people that won't drive you crazy for 4 years, and will help you reach your career goals.

I think people LOVE mayo, or they don't really care about it.

Good luck to you.

 

[copperfrog09]

No, but I work with Mayo Phoenix and I know through my contact there, who is involved in adcom.

Hmm.. interesting information. If it's true, they certainly didn't let on.

Ooookay. If you work there, I get a better picture of where you're coming from. I was going to point you in the direction of googling the "Mayo Clinic Model of Care" but you're probably already familiar with the philosophy. I think for most people who are really attracted to Mayo, it's that philosophy that does it. The idea that you probably see in the clinic that doctors are there because they want to be there and provide the best care they can for patients without things like procedures-based compensation, extreme hospital politics, unaccesible resources and other nonsense getting in the way. In order to provide this, Mayo takes care of its physicians, perhaps not with the absolute highest salaries they could receive, but in other ways that make their lives and practice of medicine more efficient so that they can in turn make patients' visits more efficient and provide the best possible care. The medical school operates on the same guiding principle: Make the students' lives and education better, so that they can in turn make patients happier. The scholarship aspect that everyone always rags on about is just one part of that puzzle.

That was a little long, but from my perspective that's Mayo's "uniqueness" in a nut-shell. If someone steals it and puts it in their LOI next week, so be it.

Hope that helped?

Out of random curiosity, what's the Phoenix clinic like? I was wondering when I was there how the satellite sites compared to the main campus, and none of the students really knew.

 

[musicalmedicine]

Their overall approach is very learning centered, which as I have heard is only second to the patients. I would go to Mayo over any other school. Seriously, look at their website and if it doesn't excite you, then go to the hospital because you are dead.

Also, its not actually free tuition, but everyone gets at least half their tuition covered. Also, for those of us from Minnesota, Arizona, or Florida, we are in state.

WE'RE CONSIDERED INSTATE?!? Thats sweet!!! I'll be sure to apply there!

 

[musicalmedicine]

Any school I want? UCLA. Where I'll end up? Probably Arizona, if anywhere.

U of A has a good medical school don't get down on it! It will be one of my top choices for sure when I'm applying.

 

[musicalmedicine]

Hmm.. interesting information. If it's true, they certainly didn't let on.

Ooookay. If you work there, I get a better picture of where you're coming from. I was going to point you in the direction of googling the "Mayo Clinic Model of Care" but you're probably already familiar with the philosophy. I think for most people who are really attracted to Mayo, it's that philosophy that does it. The idea that you probably see in the clinic that doctors are there because they want to be there and provide the best care they can for patients without things like procedures-based compensation, extreme hospital politics, unaccesible resources and other nonsense getting in the way. In order to provide this, Mayo takes care of its physicians, perhaps not with the absolute highest salaries they could receive, but in other ways that make their lives and practice of medicine more efficient so that they can in turn make patients' visits more efficient and provide the best possible care. The medical school operates on the same guiding principle: Make the students' lives and education better, so that they can in turn make patients happier. The scholarship aspect that everyone always rags on about is just one part of that puzzle.

That was a little long, but from my perspective that's Mayo's "uniqueness" in a nut-shell. If someone steals it and puts it in their LOI next week, so be it.

Hope that helped?

Out of random curiosity, what's the Phoenix clinic like? I was wondering when I was there how the satellite sites compared to the main campus, and none of the students really knew.

I volunteer at the phoenix campus, it is a bit small but when you walk in it looks like a hotel; which I thought was really odd the first time I went there. All of the people there that I've met have been really friendly and seem to really care about the patients so it seems that the Mayo philosophy is hard at work. I'm kind of disappointed that they don't do pediatrics but from what I've heard there is a master plan for that hospital to be expanded quite a bit to be made of two hospitals right next to each other, one for pediatrics and one for adults. Overall it is a really great hospital!

 

[Slack3r]

I'm not down on, I'm actually really psyched about it. Top 50 public med school (if you put any weight on USNews rankings (hint: I don't 😱)) and I'll get in state tuition, and basically 70% of applicants at least merit an interview.

It's just UofA for undergrad --> UofA med. That's an AWFUL long time to be in Tucson (typical college town). UCLA was my dream school since I was a kid; couldn't afford it for undergrad and I f'ed up too much in ugrad to consider it for med school.

Ohwell, live and learn I suppose. My little sister is thinking about med school now, so she has all my failures to learn from. 😀

 

[copperfrog09]

WE'RE CONSIDERED INSTATE?!? Thats sweet!!! I'll be sure to apply there!

Just clarifying musicalmedicine's sarcasm ( I believe 🙂 )

There is no difference between in and out-of-state at Mayo...

 

[Godzilla26]

Hey everyone,

I'm a fourth year Mayo student and I thought I'd provide a perspective. I'm on the residency interview trail right now and being from Mayo has definately been a positive for me. As far as the focus of the school, it is a real balance between clinical and research. I think our stat is that 80% of our grads are published by the end (that's including abstracts though). Another huge bonus is that we get to do our rotations at the Mayo Clinic. Since Mayo is one of the largest residency training programs in the country, that means the staff at Mayo are largely connected as many directors and staff at other institutions trained at Mayo. The importance of this fact was something I underestimated before going to med. school. Also, the school is cheap and the students are happy and there is a $5,000 travel budget. Moreover, they pay for half of all your boards exams which adds up to about 1.5k extra that stays in your pocket!

The negatives- We are a small medical school and we do not do class rank. Thus, you cannot be AOA at Mayo. That hasn't hurt me so far, but something to think about. Otherwise, Rochester is the biggest downside of Mayo. It's freezing here in the winter and the winter is really long. Also, there are not many cool places to eat (our best are like Olive Garden, Friday's...you get the point).

Good luck in school hunting.

 

[copingmethods]

So Mayo is either your top choice or your bottom? I just want to know if, given the chance, would people go to Mayo over other schools. Another way to ask it, how many people would have loved to get into Mayo rather than their top choices?

I interviewed there, and just about everyone seemed like it was their top choice...except me 😳. I just don't know if I could do Rochester for 4 years, although the school itself seems nice. I agree w/ others that it definitely seems like a "fit" school.

 

[Nerday Shortay]

So Mayo is either your top choice or your bottom? I just want to know if, given the chance, would people go to Mayo over other schools. Another way to ask it, how many people would have loved to get into Mayo rather than their top choices?

I was recently accepted, and after interviewing at most of the "Top 10" schools, I am convinced that Mayo is the best medical school in the country. I share this opinion with a number of doctors, including ones who work/teach at Yale Medical School.

Their patient focus and student focus is unrivaled, and they are far more humble than the other great schools (with far more reasons not to be humble). So yes, I would take Mayo over most other schools I interviewed at (including Hopkins, Harvard, Yale, Pritzker, Cornell, etc.).

 

[GoSpursGo]

Good for you.

Moving to School-Specific Discussions.

 

[mmmcdowe]

I was recently accepted, and after interviewing at most of the "Top 10" schools, I am convinced that Mayo is the best medical school in the country. I share this opinion with a number of doctors, including ones who work/teach at Yale Medical School.

Their patient focus and student focus is unrivaled, and they are far more humble than the other great schools (with far more reasons not to be humble). So yes, I would take Mayo over most other schools I interviewed at (including Hopkins, Harvard, Yale, Pritzker, Cornell, etc.).

Wow, this is such a blast from the past.

Good, I am very glad to hear that you have found the proper school for you (though it is extremely dangerous for you to make the generalization that it is the best medical school. Best is relative to the person, Mayo was not best for me though it clearly is for you). I'm sure there are a huge number of students that would greatly appreciate you withdrawing from Hopkins Harvard Yale Pritzker etc, now that you have found your dream school and had the blessing of being accepted to it.

 

[ApoK]

Wow, this is such a blast from the past.

Good, I am very glad to hear that you have found the proper school for you (though it is extremely ignorant of you to make the generalization that it is the best medical school. Best is relative to the person, Mayo was not best for me though it clearly is for you). I'm sure there are a huge number of students that would greatly appreciate you withdrawing from Hopkins Harvard Yale Pritzker etc, now that you have found your dream school and had the blessing of being accepted to it.

I could not agree with this post more. The above poster always seems to mention something about a superiority complex... I don't understand how that can really play that big of a role in one's decision process. I've met docs from Mayo who are arrogant as hell, but I'll still admit most of the docs there are pretty great. Also, it does get really damn cold in the winters here. You should be ready for it to begin in October and end in April. That's how long they go here in MN.

 

[Nerday Shortay]

Wow, this is such a blast from the past.

Good, I am very glad to hear that you have found the proper school for you (though it is extremely dangerous for you to make the generalization that it is the best medical school. Best is relative to the person, Mayo was not best for me though it clearly is for you). I'm sure there are a huge number of students that would greatly appreciate you withdrawing from Hopkins Harvard Yale Pritzker etc, now that you have found your dream school and had the blessing of being accepted to it.

Whoa now, I didn't mean to offend. I didn't realize this was an old post, and if I'd realized you were already enrolled at another school I wouldn't have said Mayo was the best. It is my opinion, but it wasn't meant to be a superiority thing (I thought you were trying to decide whether or not to go there, so I was just plugging the school). I'm not sure if you were being sarcastic, but I am glad that I found my dream school and got accepted. No, it won't have the name-throwing capacity of Columbia or Harvard, but I'll be happier at Mayo, so that's fine. Again, no offense intended.

 

[JasonE]

yea mayo is nuts. great place to learn about medicine. but it has huge drawbacks (at least imo). its location is too isolated, the town is pretty much old ppl and sparesly populated (feels like the middle of nowhere), and its bitter cold.

i always thought of it as the place to go if you love medicine and want just that. the students there made it sound like going to mayo was a sacrifice, and i dont think med school has to be that way. but they seem to have the tools and focus to train the best physicians. very much a love/hate sorta thing

 

[jbz24]

Mayo is an excellent place for patients to receive care, but it's not as highly regarded as a medical school or place to train for residency. Check some of the subspecialty forums and you'll see that Mayo isn't as coveted for residency in a lot of specialties as other research-heavy institutions. It obviously doesn't mean as much since this is for medical school, but you effectively lose out for in-house residency matches by choosing Mayo over other top 10 programs. I think it's great that you found a school you love, and that's much more important than choosing a school for prestige, but I just wanted to put things in perspective 🙂

 

[JasonE]

Mayo is an excellent place for patients to receive care, but it's not as highly regarded as a medical school or place to train for residency. Check some of the subspecialty forums and you'll see that Mayo isn't as coveted for residency in a lot of specialties as other research-heavy institutions. It obviously doesn't mean as much since this is for medical school, but you effectively lose out for in-house residency matches by choosing Mayo over other top 10 programs. I think it's great that you found a school you love, and that's much more important than choosing a school for prestige, but I just wanted to put things in perspective 🙂

hmm...i think others may attack you for this. just a guess

 

[jbz24]

hmm...i think others may attack you for this. just a guess

Probably. Just trying to be honest with my opinion though!

 

[PremedIowa]

Mayo is an excellent place for patients to receive care, but it's not as highly regarded as a medical school or place to train for residency. Check some of the subspecialty forums and you'll see that Mayo isn't as coveted for residency in a lot of specialties as other research-heavy institutions. It obviously doesn't mean as much since this is for medical school, but you effectively lose out for in-house residency matches by choosing Mayo over other top 10 programs. I think it's great that you found a school you love, and that's much more important than choosing a school for prestige, but I just wanted to put things in perspective 🙂

...are you kidding? Top tier IM program, more or less every IM fellowship is in the top 3, top 5 derm, #1 in Orthopedics, extremely well regarded anesthesia, top 10 psychiatry, top tier NS and neurology, well regarded peds program with superb fellowships, top couple PMR, top 10 ENT, top 5 urology, top 10 OB and a solid RadOnc program.

Have you ever actually been here or even talked to anyone here?

Any why did this thread get resurrected after 4 months?

 

[mmmcdowe]

Because it is my curse to have the stupidest thread I ever created haunt me forever.

 

[jbz24]

...are you kidding? Top tier IM program, more or less every IM fellowship is in the top 3, top 5 derm, #1 in Orthopedics, extremely well regarded anesthesia, top 10 psychiatry, top tier NS and neurology, well regarded peds program with superb fellowships, top couple PMR, top 10 ENT, top 5 urology, top 10 OB and a solid RadOnc program.

Have you ever actually been here or even talked to anyone here?

Any why did this thread get resurrected after 4 months?

You seem to be quoting it's hospital rankings from US News for most of those specialties. Those were designed for patients, not for residents. Mayo is certainly well-regarded for residency, but it doesn't stack up to some of the other top tier programs. Many of the residency programs at Mayo are considered "cush" and fellow-driven, meaning less opportunities for the residents to get their hands dirty and less patients for the residents to see and learn from. But I certainly meant no insult, I was just trying to give a different perspective.

 

[Jolt21]

So Mayo is either your top choice or your bottom? I just want to know if, given the chance, would people go to Mayo over other schools. Another way to ask it, how many people would have loved to get into Mayo rather than their top choices?

now that this cycle is winding down, for me it's Mayo vs. Harvard. The Mayo Clinic is INCREDIBLE from a patient care/hospital standpoint. I tell everyone it's a candyland for doctors.

The school was amazing from what i could tell, too. I do not mind the small class size at all and found it to be rather friendly and helpful. the resources for the students are great as well. with 42 kids per class, you can get pretty much anything you want.

the location is the killer.

 

[bamtuba]

now that this cycle is winding down, for me it's Mayo vs. Harvard. The Mayo Clinic is INCREDIBLE from a patient care/hospital standpoint. I tell everyone it's a candyland for doctors.

The school was amazing from what i could tell, too. I do not mind the small class size at all and found it to be rather friendly and helpful. the resources for the students are great as well. with 42 kids per class, you can get pretty much anything you want.

the location is the killer.

And this is why you won't hear SDN residency forums going nuts with love for Mayo. Many people choose with location in mind considering the length of stay for many of the specialty programs. This has nothing to do, however, with the quality of education or reputation of the program.

There is no point in arguing about this though, no matter your position. I personally believe Mayo will present me with the best education at the greatest value possible. That does not mean everyone else must agree with me. I really don't care where people go so long as it is the best thing for them.

If I were coming straight from undergrad, had been living in Boston for the past 4+, or thought "partying/going out" were my #1 reason for going to school (or even a big part of my existence), then I would have problems with Mayo. But I am not placing judgment here, everyone really should go with where they want to end up.

I will say though that I have not seen another program planned so well from the educational viewpoint as Mayo and believe that it has the best model for education and patient care of any institution. That's as far as I will go in my biased opinion of the school/clinic.

But to each his/her own.

 

[bamtuba]

You seem to be quoting it's hospital rankings from US News for most of those specialties. Those were designed for patients, not for residents. Mayo is certainly well-regarded for residency, but it doesn't stack up to some of the other top tier programs. But I certainly meant no insult, I was just trying to give a different perspective.

As were hospitals/clinics. Who is the customer in the field of medicine? For whom do residents work?

The point of this is confusing at best, but whatever. As for the second point, agree to disagree. The location certainly doesn't stack up to the other "top tier programs," but those rankings to which you referred earlier have a section devoted to "reputation among peers" or something like that which works into the placement of a program. In which defined variable would you argue it "doesn't stack up?" Not trying to pick a fight, just really curious.

 

[jbz24]

As were hospitals/clinics. Who is the customer in the field of medicine? For whom do residents work?

The point of this is confusing at best, but whatever.

Again, to each his/her own.

You're right that the patient is a customer, but it is not really a dichotomy to say that US News hospital ranking does not translate into residency training. That's why you'll see some hospitals on the US News Hospital ranking with no residency programs affiliated with them. However, I'm fine saying agree to disagree.

 

[jbz24]

The point of this is confusing at best, but whatever. As for the second point, agree to disagree. The location certainly doesn't stack up to the other "top tier programs," but those rankings to which you referred earlier have a section devoted to "reputation among peers" or something like that which works into the placement of a program. In which defined variable would you argue it "doesn't stack up?" Not trying to pick a fight, just really curious.

To be honest, I haven't looked at the hospital ranking methodology in a while so I'm not sure. But I'm pretty sure the reputation among peers does not refer to the residency program, but the division as a whole (i.e outcome measures, dealing with difficult cases, etc.). In terms of not stacking up, Mayo has excellent clinical research, but they are lacking in bench research. They don't drive in as much NIH funding as other top key players. Their residency programs are very fellow-driven such that the hands-on opportunities for the residents is less. Many consider it a cush program in that the interns/residents carry small numbers of patients. This alleviates stress, but it decreases learning, and it may be a culture shock moving out of Rochester after residency to a more urban environment where things are less cush. However, despite its location, Mayo seems to be one of the best places to train for many fellowship positions. Just it seems to be not as true for residency.

 

[alibai3ah]

Mayo is an excellent place for patients to receive care, but it's not as highly regarded as a medical school or place to train for residency. Check some of the subspecialty forums and you'll see that Mayo isn't as coveted for residency in a lot of specialties as other research-heavy institutions. It obviously doesn't mean as much since this is for medical school, but you effectively lose out for in-house residency matches by choosing Mayo over other top 10 programs. I think it's great that you found a school you love, and that's much more important than choosing a school for prestige, but I just wanted to put things in perspective 🙂

I don't think this is true. And I certainly wouldn't use SDN forums to make this kind of an assumption.