HoWWrses: Game Thread

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vetmedhead said:
Hey @ziggyandjazzy @Crayola227 what is all this bickering about old games on thread accomplishing?

Y'all know it's literally impossible for a village of 1 to win, right?
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Sorry I was just about to respond to this

I feel the need to defend my honor. Anyone who questions my logic and repeatedly tells me I'm stupid or bad or need to get better can SMD IDGAF at this point

(but yes good point I will get off and cool down my spicy hot lil noggin)
 
vetmedhead said:
I'm going to start hitting everyone with a Get Along Stick, I swear.

I'm pretty sure I once wrote @Animal Midwife a four paragraph post about how much I hated her in one game. I definitely wrote several long, angry, bitter, capslocked, expletive filled posts to @PippyPony about how I wanted her dead in the same game where I wrote all that other stuff to AM!

And y'all are stressing me out with this meaningless argument about nothing

Y'all are stressing me out so much I looked up the damn hand clap emoji!

Edit and it won't even show up in this post! But I want you all to imagine the sound of phantom claps, because that is what is coming at you right now
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idk, I think my argument is meaningful. I'm afraid of what will happen if I just stew on the salt without saying anything.
 
Animal Midwife said:
I assumed me not voting for the leaders was the issue.
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Nope, that actually makes me feel better about you. Several other things have bothered me which I'd like to sit on for now. Keeping my eye on you though :cyclops:

genny said:
i'd like to lead the group in a round of kumbaya
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Will there be s'mores?i can bring graham crackers!
 
vetmedhead said:
You're all bad and wrong for making your friendly neighborhood vmh cry. We all know I am clearly the most precious and beloved player in this game and I have never done anything wrong, ever, in my whole life
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Remind us all why people call you meathead again? 😛
 
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The writeup made me sad and someone mentioned about hugs :cat::cat:

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Animal Midwife said:
I would leave the tie, actually, unless I had a strong reason to believe one was a more powerful PR or modcleared. Nothing is ever worth killing any of your village read unless it's self-prez.
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We’re gonna have to agree to disagree here. Moving my vote to the more wolfy of the 2 isnt an attempt to kill a village read. I see it more as trying to save a village lean
 
muttmanager said:
We’re gonna have to agree to disagree here. Moving my vote to the more wolfy of the 2 isnt an attempt to kill a village read. I see it more as trying to save a village lean
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In your hypothetical scenario, two villagers (or at least stronger leans) are tied. Killing either has a high chance for mislynch. Lynching one or the other only saves a wolf. It's different though if you're reading it v/w. That mentality leads to lower fear of ties or breaking it toward the wolfread (assuming you weren't voting there already).
 
Melchizedek said:
I do, and I understand the possibility that she hasn't been on because of work, which is why thats not the only reason she's setting off my wolfdar. See my posts yesterday.

and its also an hour and a half before lynch. :shrug: if this sounds cold, but I would want to see at least a quick "hello, busy today, goodbye." post or telling one of her PM partners "Hey I won't be on for lynch" or something.
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Kara's a good wolf. I feel like she would avoid suspicion by doing this if she was a wolf.
 
capri1722 said:
I kind of have a tinfoil about MSU so I think I'll vote there.

Also in general I think voting someone who said they wouldn't be around for lynch close is kind of rude, having had it done to me before. :yeahright:

### Lynch MSU ###
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Meh she had time all day to defend herself. Which she did not.

Had a similar tinfoil about those 4 being villagers though.
 
capri1722 said:
So when MSU voted there was a 4 way tie and she voted for none of them. Why? My thought is that she wanted to get a vote in before close, as she more or less said, but didn't have a preference who of the 4 died because none of them were her pack mates. If there was a wolf in there, she could easily have said "lynch [insert any villager in the tie here]" and claimed feels.
This would also clear Coffee, Bryndy, and MOOSE (and killer's original incarnation but…obviously).
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SnowshoeDog143 said:
Meh she had time all day to defend herself. Which she did not.

Had a similar tinfoil about those 4 being villagers though.
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Can you two take these tin foils a little further?if all 4 of them were village where do you think the wolves voted?
 
Crayola227 said:
This particular comment really concerns me. The more that someone's voting or not voting seems related to how they feel they will be perceived by others/popularity, vs being guided first and foremost by wolf-hunting..... the more suspicious I find it. Because guaranteed wolf vote choices are always affected by how they are caring for their town image.
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Hmm I agree. Stagg is pretty much saying he is avoiding voting for AM so he doesn't get lynched for it.
 
Skimble said:
She opened a pm with me, I mentioned it on thread earlier. I also didn't realize she wasn't next to me on the roster until a few minutes ago. I actually replied to her recently and mentioned this, and asked if we were supposed to be communicating, then I read the thread. Pm ability can go either way though, so I'm not sure it would have changed much if I had realized it sooner.
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Eh pm ability is primarily village.

Animal Midwife said:
Either/or is what I can tunnel version between two wagons. e.g. everyone can only vote here or here. Offwagon voting is viewed as pointless and bandwagons are encouraged. Usually, it's accidental if people aren't updating their reads. Other times, it's a counter test to run with a confirmed or otherwise strong wolf suspect. It's how cubs got lynched in the last game and MOOSE today. I dislike them because it so easy for wolves to hide in this environment and blocks genuine VCA.
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Yeah you need to be a lot more assertive if you want people to get their butts off a bad lynch and onto one you think would be more successful.
 
SnowshoeDog143 said:
Yeah you need to be a lot more assertive if you want people to get their butts off a bad lynch and onto one you think would be more successful.
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What should I say exactly? And at what point is it encouraging people to join me versus being a control freak about game outcomes?
 
Melchizedek said:
How do you know they aren't producing wolves? We haven't lynched anyone she's spotlighted.
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This is a good point. There are only certain people that you can say this about (wanting them to produce wolves).. like mel, pips, cray. People who will strongly and actively push player after players lynch - but I don't always like this rule, because everyone is wrong a lot of the time in ww. AM doesn't really qualify for this approach because she votes who she thinks is sketchiest, but she doesn't actively push for other people to join her (so you can't expect her to produce wolves if no one is lynching her sketch reads). The only way to know whether she's lynching wolves are to lynch them and see..

CoffeeQuestionMark said:
it's kind of an unspoken rule to not lynch the quiet players until mid game, not really interested in piling onto someone who hasn't posted the entire day within the first couple days, and I think it's not really productive to take that seriously at this point... even if we went and said "let's lynch gwen" uh, there is nothing to evaluate, and if she flips village then you're going to feel guilty for lynching someone who isn't on to defend themselves. So with like moose and kara, yeah, those are kind of the same deals.
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Uh at this point we have so many quiet players. It might be nice to have people lynch them until they are willing to talk. Otherwise we are going to end up in an endgame of silence.
 
Animal Midwife said:
I would leave the tie, actually, unless I had a strong reason to believe one was a more powerful PR or modcleared. Nothing is ever worth killing any of your village read unless it's self-prez.
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So you are saying you would leave a 4 way tie where everyone is reading villager? Wouldn't there be a higher chance that that kills 4 of your village reads?
 
Animal Midwife said:
In your hypothetical scenario, two villagers (or at least stronger leans) are tied. Killing either has a high chance for mislynch. Lynching one or the other only saves a wolf. It's different though if you're reading it v/w. That mentality leads to lower fear of ties or breaking it toward the wolfread (assuming you weren't voting there already).
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I see what you are saying, but I also agree with mutts. I don't like ties and wouldn't have a problem breaking a tie to the less villagey read of the two even if they are both reading village to save at least one person.

Melchizedek said:
Can you two take these tin foils a little further?if all 4 of them were village where do you think the wolves voted?
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It was so close all the way through lynch close with self-prezes that were the only reason killer/bryndy won. Looking back the lynch seems similar to the first day or so lynches of both basic games, where it was a villager vs villager lynch and so the wolves had no qualms and could vote wherever they wanted without any worries.

cubsrule4e said:
So was your original Kara vote just for jokes or do you actually have some suspicion?
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Eh it was mostly joke. A bit of reminder to myself not to get pocketed. I need to see more from her to decide. Not feeling the strong wolfy vibes that other people are.

Animal Midwife said:
What should I say exactly? And at what point is it encouraging people to join me versus being a control freak about game outcomes?
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"I think this is a bad lynch, does anyone want to switch to so-and-so or whatshisface?" "Here is who I'm voting. Here are the reasons. Here are more reasons." "Here is why I think they are the best choice to lynch today" (obviously I also do not have this assertive thing down lol)

People don't listen to everyone who strongly tries to get people on their lynch candidate. Name one person who plays ww that you think is a control freak that everyone listens to their reads? It just doesn't happen. People will always disagree with you. But it's hard for anyone to want to join you if all you do is make a quiet vote - remember no one can read your mind, so they don't know why you think that person is the most sketchy, or if you feel confident in your vote. It's your job to try to convince people at least. Especially if you think the leading people are both villagers. If you don't give reasons why to not vote there or a good third option, people are always going to vote either/or - it's just the way of the village.
 
I don't know what to do. I honestly just try to teach noobs the game best I can, no matter my affiliation. It's one reason that I don't just explain my thinking, but I try to share pearls of wisdom from other sites, sources that aren't me. I'm trying to teach what I've been taught, what I've learned to be better, not because I think I'm a great player, but because I've had to learn a lot, and I have a lot more to learn. I've tried to point to other players and their gameplay. I've tried to share what I've learned from others. I don't think this is me just expecting someone to think just like me or one player, that's why I'm trying to put a lot of things out there.

It's important to have your own thoughts and thinking, but it's also important to really try to consider if challenges to your thinking have any merit.

This was all a big stupid distraction. I wanna say it broke my spirit but the truth is that the noobs did this a while ago in many ways. I didn't get any of the analysis I wanted to get done, done today. I wanted to go back over my notes, and the early part of the thread, and then the roster and what happened today. As it is, I didn't even follow the side conversations and arguments happening with other players.

I only really have myself to blame, I know. Just, for now, I give up. I'm going to be busy-ish tomorrow, and likely minimal activity Thursday, because with deadline being 7 pm PST, and the fact that I basically never wake up before noon if not later, between phone calls, errands, work, and a rope bondage lab 7 pm - 10 pm, yeah. So probably not much before or after if at all. I'm preparing some bondage rope for the class (I'll end up posting updates in the hobby thread when it's all done eventually.)

Happy hunting friends. Read that how you like.
 
SnowshoeDog143 said:
Kara's a good wolf. I feel like she would avoid suspicion by doing this if she was a wolf.
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So you're saying this but then saying you don't think she's wolfy later? Seems like you're hedging as someone else pointed out. What are your actual thoughts on Kara? Wolfy or village lean for you? (Or neutral?)?

SnowshoeDog143 said:
Hmm I agree. Stagg is pretty much saying he is avoiding voting for AM so he doesn't get lynched for it.
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I've explained why this is wrong at least twice now. Do I need to explain a third+ time?
 
SnowshoeDog143 said:
This is a good point. There are only certain people that you can say this about (wanting them to produce wolves).. like mel, pips, cray. People who will strongly and actively push player after players lynch - but I don't always like this rule, because everyone is wrong a lot of the time in ww. AM doesn't really qualify for this approach because she votes who she thinks is sketchiest, but she doesn't actively push for other people to join her (so you can't expect her to produce wolves if no one is lynching her sketch reads). The only way to know whether she's lynching wolves are to lynch them and see..



Uh at this point we have so many quiet players. It might be nice to have people lynch them until they are willing to talk. Otherwise we are going to end up in an endgame of silence.
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I would like to leave non-participation to the mods @SportPonies @PippyPony
If we have to lynch 5 quiet players just because we have nothing to go off of and none are wolves that'd like really suck.
 
SnowshoeDog143 said:
Eh pm ability is primarily village.
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Not true. I’ve seen it as a wolf ability enough to know it’s NAI. It doesn’t really matter though because I didn’t realize her pming me was ability based until after lynch closed.
 
SnowshoeDog143 said:
So you are saying you would leave a 4 way tie where everyone is reading villager? Wouldn't there be a higher chance that that kills 4 of your village reads?
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Yes. I don't know what the chance of all 4 dying would be because ties rules vary by the game. It's not up to me to correct others' mistakes at the expense of breaking my village block. Someone that is on the tie can see if they feel the 4-way is an issue. I will, first and foremost, lynch my wolfreads. Lynching someone you feel is village to break a tie effectively give wolves an excuse to have been on said lynch in the first place.

It's easy to get lost in the thought process that this is only the beginning of the game and we have more lynches, but it's dangerous in a medium or small game to hold this mentality because the recovery stage won't be there if breaking ties overrides voting a wolfread. That game will be effectively lost before it started.

SnowshoeDog143 said:
I see what you are saying, but I also agree with mutts. I don't like ties and wouldn't have a problem breaking a tie to the less villagey read of the two even if they are both reading village to save at least one person.
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How many cycles in a row would you do this if every day your village reads we're tied up on the block?

SnowshoeDog143 said:
"I think this is a bad lynch, does anyone want to switch to so-and-so or whatshisface?" "Here is who I'm voting. Here are the reasons. Here are more reasons." "Here is why I think they are the best choice to lynch today" (obviously I also do not have this assertive thing down lol)

People don't listen to everyone who strongly tries to get people on their lynch candidate. Name one person who plays ww that you think is a control freak that everyone listens to their reads? It just doesn't happen. People will always disagree with you. But it's hard for anyone to want to join you if all you do is make a quiet vote - remember no one can read your mind, so they don't know why you think that person is the most sketchy, or if you feel confident in your vote. It's your job to try to convince people at least. Especially if you think the leading people are both villagers. If you don't give reasons why to not vote there or a good third option, people are always going to vote either/or - it's just the way of the village.
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I literally did this on day 1, but people we're afraid of lynching Weim because she wasn't posting.

Either/or does not have to be the way of the village and that is complacency. Wolves love it. Then they can just say "well, xyz and 5 others were voting there, against their village reads, so why single out me?" It's hard to argue this without appearing hypocritical and reachy. You will likely not be able to lynch said person effectively, if they even stick out to begin with.

The near town sweep happened because people will willing to move on when things felt v/v and stuck to their wolfreads.

Even now, I have to ask, do you think wolves were on the MOOSE/killer vote? The answer to this question is either/or in a nutshell.
 
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CoffeeQuestionMark said:
I would like to leave non-participation to the mods @SportPonies @PippyPony
If we have to lynch 5 quiet players just because we have nothing to go off of and none are wolves that'd like really suck.
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Mods straight up said in the beginning there's no participation minimum.
 
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