Liberty University COM (LUCOM) Discussion Thread 2013-2014

[Papa]

Those waiting, I will be giving up my seat here at LUCOM... Be patient, The waitlist will have movement!

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[Donkk]

Is there anyone on here holding an acceptance who's trying to do something other than IM/FM/peds?

I am highly interested in combined residency programs like IM/EM/CC or IM/EM but who knows at this point for sure. Maybe I will settle into one area or something completely different when the time comes years from now. For now, the goal is to pass the first semester and make lifelong friends =)

 

[scribblet113]

Is there anyone on here holding an acceptance who's trying to do something other than IM/FM/peds?

As of now I like EM. If you check their directory, they have two EM faculty members who currently practice in Lynchburg with what seem like solid backgrounds. They are emphasizing IM/FM/peds but not making it obligatory. I know other osteopathic schools, particularly in the region (WV, VA, NC, SC) also emphasize similarly.

 

[scribblet113]

I love EM, and know one (haven't checked yet, very likely know the other one) of the faculty you speak of... Kind of nervous to go hear. A friend told me that the dean said at her interview that he expects only the top 25% of the class to be competitive for non-IM/FM/peds residencies. Since I don't want to do any of those specialties.... it scares me.

I'd probably assume most schools sharing this stat, particularly DO. EM I've been told is mid-level competitive. Particularly these "regional" DO schools want their kids doing FM, OB etc, it's a fact. For example I know most vcom grads go into these fields. It's like the point of opening these schools , to remedy the shortage of primary care, so mentally we have to be prepared to go into one of these fields. For me I'm definitely gonna work hard to get into what I want. Ortho and ent would be particularly difficult. If you go here we can form a study group and make it haha. Those faculty members have been hired for a reason and there's no reason we shouldn't be able to get it if we want it.

 

[CaptainDO]

I am going to keep my mind open to things... but I have a couple really competitive fields I'm aiming for. I'm going to have to really kill the boards.

 

[hawaiinchick]

for those of you who called admissions what number did you call exactly/who did you speak to? im having trouble reaching them. havent heard anything yet either

 

[ryanc6060]

From what I understand they are meeting this week for the next round of decisions. (fingers crossed). I usually email: but here is a phone number.
(434) 592-6400

 

[Cookiesncreamm]

Is there anyone on here holding an acceptance who's trying to do something other than IM/FM/peds?

Ortho, PM&R, Derm

 

[CaptainDO]

Ortho, PM&R, Derm

Derm is aiming very high. Not trying to discourage you, as I think that would be great if you wanted it and got it. Just to let you know, the derm residency is one of the most competitive and you will have to score very high on your boards and do very well in med school. I am aiming high as well (not quite as high). Good luck! We will all be there to help you out to get you to your goal.

 

[ryanc6060]

Anyone from march 13 heard yet or am I just being neurotic?

 

[cytogirl01]

Is there anyone on here holding an acceptance who's trying to do something other than IM/FM/peds?

Pathology person over here. I love it! Thankfully it's traditionally very DO friendly.

 

[Cookiesncreamm]

Derm is aiming very high. Not trying to discourage you, as I think that would be great if you wanted it and got it. Just to let you know, the derm residency is one of the most competitive and you will have to score very high on your boards and do very well in med school. I am aiming high as well (not quite as high). Good luck! We will all be there to help you out to get you to your goal.

Yes I know...the stars have to be aligned perfectly for it to happen lols but it can't hurt to dream. And thanks I'll be there for you too!! This is why I already love our school

 

[Bootrum]

I called to Admissions and I found out that the class is already full.

Good luck

According to Mr. Cook and Mrs. Mendez, who I spoke to today on the phone, the class is not full yet. For those students who interviewed on 3-12 or 3-17, the board meets tomorrow and should be notifying those applicants the first of next week... hopefully on Monday. Good luck to everyone.

 

[scribblet113]

Hey everyone, a little more about our rotations can be read here http://www.omnee.net/

 

[scribblet113]

dude...

 

[ryanc6060]

I should post my handbook from berkeley, I bet there will be several similarities...just saying.

 

[LABBL]

.

 

[ryanc6060]

I will download it an pm you in the morning, there are many similarities. But several differences as well, obviously the religious end of things doesn't fly at a public university.

My two cents worth of advice pick up the phone if you have concerns...

 

[ryanc6060]

Since there are different colleges at berkeley I am posting the relevant ones below:
code of conduct: (alcohol, university officials, property use)
http://sa.berkeley.edu/sites/default/files/UCB-Code-of-Conduct-new Jan2012.pdf
my college (use of facilities,ext)
http://dev-monarch-test-site2.panth...efault/files/2013-14-SPH-Student-Handbook.pdf
graduate guide: (fraternization policy herein)
http://grad.berkeley.edu/policies/guides/full-version/


Now full disclosure I have not read LUCOM's handbook and the accuracy of my comments are only based off the information you posted, and cannot comment on anything not posted or taken out of context; and I have only interviewed there...That being said, many similarities arise probably with most other schools handbooks and policies, but yes several differences exist. Let me know if I missed anything or if you could send me a link to theirs so I can offer a better opinion. Another way to possibly look at it is similar to a job, the facilities and equipment are theirs and they have a right to say how they are used or misused for that matter, and they have a right to state dismissal procedures and grounds.

Remember that it is the inaugural class there and of course there will be things to be worked out, but that starts with communication...

 

[Donkk]

I'd love to see the similarities/differences. If I'm just overreacting, then fine I will retract my post entirely.

But I really don't appreciate being lied to by the dean of admissions, who told us in no uncertain terms that if students were drinking alcohol, using tobacco, and living with their girlfriends—they wouldn't be expelled.

The other things are annoying, and petty sounding, but not ultimately as "deal breaking" for me as direct lies...

My college has many, but not all of the same rules in its student handbook....... and it is one of the biggest party schools in the U.S. soooooo..... lol.

"Failure to comply with the directions of university officials or agents,
including law enforcement or security officers, acting in the good faith
performance of their duties."

"Violation of the Board or university rules or applicable laws governing
alcohol, including consumption, distribution, unauthorized sale, or
possession of alcoholic beverages."

"Sexual misconduct."

"ASU recognizes that tobacco use is a public health hazard and is dedicated to providing a healthy, comfortable and productive living, learning and working environment. Beginning Aug. 1, 2013, tobacco will be prohibited on university property, facilities, grounds, parking structures, university-owned vehicles and structures owned or leased by the university. ASU is joining 800 colleges and universities in protecting its students, faculty, staff and visitors from the health hazards of secondhand smoke."

"Interfering with or disrupting university or university-sponsored
activities, including but not limited to classroom related activities,
studying, teaching, research, intellectual or creative endeavor,
administration, service or the provision of communication, computing
or emergency services."

http://www.asu.edu/housing/handbook/codeofConduct.html
https://eoss.asu.edu/tobaccofree/officialpolicy

 

[trippenlatin]

I don't think you were lied to I think you missed the fact that the judge told you he would not enforce certain aspects of said laws. I think it's pretty bold to call the dean in a public forum a liar. Maybe a phone consult with him could have cleared up any issues you're having.

Sent from my SGH-T679 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Bootrum]

I agree with Ryanc that most of these standards are in line with most all professional/graduate programs and other companies. Essentially it all boils down to the fact that we are trying to become physicians, one of the most respected and looked up to professions there is. As such, we should conduct ourselves in a professional manner at all times. It only makes sense that you should strive to avoid doing anything that would bring negative attention or media coverage to the school that you have chosen to get your medical education from.

The only real issue that I have here is with the 9th point on the possession, use of alcohol, tobacco, drugs. Does this mean that I can't have a beer or glass of wine with my wife in my home or at a restaurant after a long day of classes or rotations at the hospital? I don't see how that is a problem when done in moderation and/or responsibly. Don't really have a problem with the tobacco or illegal drugs, but some students might have a problem with the tobacco. I would like clarification here and will email to get it. If anyone already does have clarification, please post. If not, I will once I receive a response.

In the end, we all have to choose a school that we feel is in line with our own standards. Make sure that the school you choose is a good fit for you and your family (if applicable). We all have to agree to the standards set in place by the school we choose to go to, so make sure you read them and make the best decision possible. With that being said, good luck to everyone out there. I hope we all find the school that is the best fit for us.

 

[CaptainDO]

So I'm reading through their student handbook now and some things jumped out at me. The sections delineated below are actual quotes, and I'm not misrepresenting the intent of the sections they're pulled from. I apologize in advance for the length of this post, but there was a lot that needs to be publicized before people make their final decisions.



This was encouraging. It's right near the beginning of the handbook. I was excited that they mentioned sexual orientation as a category of students against whom discrimination is prohibited. Good job LUCOM!



The tone is set early. They want you to understand that, if you break any of the rules in the handbook, they can have their way with you. That's pretty standard fare as far as student handbooks though, right?

Then it gets a little weird when they list one potential violation as being...



Hmm. Ok. Unquestioned obedience to any directives from a LUCOM official.

Continuing on.

After each course, students are required to fill out an evaluation form. This is a great idea! An opportunity for students and faculty to work together, identifying what aspects of the curriculum were most beneficial and which could use tweaking. It's inspiring! I'm excited to voluntarily give feedback to my professors! But:



Wait, what? If I forget to fill out the evaluation and zone out over Christmas break... I'm automatically expelled? The heavy-handedness is shocking. Compelling people to do something diminishes their desire to follow through with the task, because they resent you for mandating it.

Also, don't get sick or hurt or whatever, because:



And don't do anything any LUCOM employee wouldn't like, because another way to earn an expulsion is:


I'm curious what constitutes "embarrassing" and also starting to wonder why this school is so eager to expel its students.

So what will the day-to-day life of a LUCOM student be like. The dress code is business-casual, which isn't unheard of. Slacks and collared shirts, no t-shirts allowed. But then they throw in a list of things that will get you in trouble, including the inscrutable phrase:



What the hell is an inappropriately matched garments? Like, plaid with polka dots? Black with brown? Such an odd rule, I'd expect to see something like that a tiny Christian K-12 school, maybe, but definitely not at a COM. Then again, the school isn't totally removed from the odd rules of Liberty University's undergraduate program. They also mention that you can get expelled for:



Because hell, that's every med student's dream! To give alcohol to a residential student at LU! This made me feel like a child. They're so concerned with their foolish rules that assumed I gave have a flying f>** about them too, and would go out of my way to help undergrads break them.

Anyways, I don't bother with the undergrads. The dean of admissions directly stated to my interview group that if he saw us drinking a glass of wine with dinner he wouldn't care. And that he understands if some students use tobacco, because he's used it himself for 20 years before starting at LU (and quitting), so no we won't be in trouble. And that if a student wants to live with their SO, that's ok, though it's not what the COM would prefer. His guarantee made me feel a lot better about the school. They're going to be reasonable!

Then I read the handbook...



What! You told me the exact opposite! What's the deal, here? This is listed in several areas of the handbook—it wasn't a typo. They threaten expulsion for possessing or using alcohol or tobacco. And don't move in with your SO, because:



More lies from the dean of admissions.

They also have a very extensive computer resource policy. It lists 17 different examples (and are careful to say that it's not a comprehensive list) of ways that students can violate their 5 separate policies on the use of computer resources. Potential violations include "sending e-mails not related to the business of the college" and "use of resources for personal use" [wtf?]. Better not log into Facebook! Don't send your classmates an e-mail about getting together for dinner to relax! No watching a YouTube video during a break from studying! So absurd.

One last section that left my jaw open.



They really think that, when we're M4's, potential residencies should give a flying flip if a Dean's Letter says "This student ate a sandwich in the library on 10/17/15, then was seen with an open Pepsi can during Genetics on 3/12/16"? Or worse—they're openly stating that the university is prepared to attempt to harm the careers of their graduates for extremely petty offenses to their obnoxiously long code of conduct.

It's 83 pages long. And full of reasons that LUCOM has for why they can dismiss, suspend, or otherwise discipline their pre-schoolers medical students.

Oh! And don't forget the most important part:

Needless to say, they won't be getting a $2,000 non-refundable deposit from me anytime soon.

Well... I think you are going to find that most of the stuff in there is pretty standard for most COM's and some of the weirder stuff is not going to be governed over us that strictly... I think you may be reading into some of these things. We are adults going into one of the most (if not the most) professional field of study. They will treat us as adults and expect us to act professionally.

 

[lizzieb89]

Is there anyone on here holding an acceptance who's trying to do something other than IM/FM/peds?

I've been leaning towards emergency medicine. Definitely not FM or IM.

 

[lizzieb89]

I don't get the big deal with the rules. I mean, get over it. Personally, I just want to become a good physician. If alcohol, tobacco, dress code, and sex are more important to yall than medical school, maybe yall should just not go to medical school---it is a huge commitment. Me? I don't care if I have to shave my head and wear a feed sack, I want to be a physician who truly makes a difference in the world. So go somewhere else or suck it up. This isn't meant to be offensive, just being honest.

 

[LABBL]

I don't get the big deal with the rules. I mean, get over it. Personally, I just want to become a good physician. If alcohol, tobacco, dress code, and sex are more important to yall than medical school, maybe yall should just not go to medical school---it is a huge commitment. Me? I don't care if I have to shave my head and wear a feed sack, I want to be a physician who truly makes a difference in the world. So go somewhere else or suck it up. This isn't meant to be offensive, just being honest.

I think the consensus is that if you have an acceptance at another school, take it! if not, just suck it up and come here

 

[scribblet113]

Or you can come because you like it...crazy thought. Ie. having to live in Dothan or West Virginia.

 

[lizzieb89]

Well I may end up having multiple acceptances. I have an interview at my original 1st choice school however, I am not sure it is my first choice school anymore. I liked liberty a whole lot. And even if I am accepted post-interview at this other school, I still think liberty is where I want to be. Anyways, I think liberty is a first choice for people even with multiple acceptances. And something else to think about: it is part of a Christian undergraduate college. Hence why the med school hand book mimics the undergrad handbook. I don't think the Dean lied to anyone; I think the medical school, as part of a Christian university, must also have similar guidelines. And I don't think there's anything wrong with their guidelines.

PS when I take an exam, I guarantee I will be worrying more about doing well on the exam vs. whether or not I'm going to be allowed to have a drink afterwards. Alcohol will the last thing on my mind at that point. And maybe some people find it impossible to relax without alcohol; if that be the case, they make many medications for that now....ie xanax.... sorry, I'm just being a smart mouth at this point!

 

[EH123]

128 days until classes start!!!

 

[scribblet113]

you will engage in cadaveric dissection during Year-1 (rather than Year-2). Your Year-2 anatomic cadaver experience will enrich your clinical understanding through specific, focused dissections, the use of prosections and models, and examination the anatomical considerations of common clinical procedures (e.g., open cholecystectomy, joint injection, central venous line placement, tracheostomy, etc.).
This is an excerpt they sent to accepted students.

 

[GypsyHummus]

To the people who were accepted, congratulations! Would you guys mind sharing what your GPA and MCAT scores were?

 

[scribblet113]

.

 

[lizzieb89]

@lizzieb89

I'm not worried about whether or not I'm "allowed" to drink alcohol. I'll be having a beer with my dinner at home either way. I'm concerned by the prospect of an administration who's willing to tell students one thing to get them to go to school, then have completely different rules in place. Frankly that should terrify you whether you agree with the rules or not. What else are they guaranteeing to their students that won't be true? Maybe the rumors of two years anatomy with required lab time both years were actually true!!

No but seriously. What else has been purposefully misrepresented with the intention of attracting students who otherwise wouldn't go?

I don't think they're misrepresenting anything. I think that being a part of a Christian school, they must set standards in the handbook. I know people who attend Liberty for undergraduate school; and there are many rules. It's just the way it is. The medical school can't have a completely different set of standards just because it's a graduate school---it is still part of Liberty. Now, the dean, and many others have stated that they will not apologize for the Christian standards they have, and they shouldn't have to. Nevertheless, I believe they will be the kind of people who demonstrate grace. Will they kick you out for having a beer? No. They've personally stated that. Will they kick you out for going out and getting plastered and getting a DUI? I don't see why they shouldn't. I think it's all about setting the standards for behavior, and demonstrating grace when warranted.

My undergraduate university had similar rules; did people break them? Yes. Did my school kick students out for breaking them? Well, depended on the severity of the case (ie drinking on campus vs DUI, blatantly cheating on an exam vs asking/telling someone what was on an exam in an earlier class section, etc.). The school acted in a way so as to maintain the integrity of their Christian standards, as well as demonstrating grace when the situation warranted. Does this mean the school misrepresented itself in any way because it stated one thing in a rule book and acted in a different way? No. The decisions the school makes are left to the discretion of the dean and the board; they weigh a situation and act accordingly. And I think that's the way a successful university or graduate school operates.

I don't know if this makes sense to anyone however, it does to me.

PS Not much terrifies me In all seriousness though, I think people should give this school a chance.

 

[lizzieb89]

You are crazy. What part of "Christian standards" includes lying about the rules to prospective students? If something is going to be against the rules, then tell us at the interview when asked! Don't say "Naw man, it's no big deal!" That's deceitful.

I'm not crazy. But you have issues. Get a life....and some prozac.

 

[GypsyHummus]

I have a life! I really do! I promise!

For what it's worth, every single person I've talked with about this who doesn't have an acceptance at LUCOM has thought it's very important. The only ones who diminish its meaning have a strong reason for doing so (e.g. - they didn't get in elsewhere/really want to go here). This includes several doctors and members/former members of adcoms.

Agreed. Their house their rules.

 

[Bootrum]

Lizzie, I agree with you in that I am willing to do just about anything to be a physician that will make an impact on the community in which I end up practicing in. With that being said, I understand the concept of grace and am thankful for it. However, I don't feel that the school should be able to punish me if I have a glass of wine with my wife during dinner in my home. If that is the case though, like you Lizzie, I am willing to do whatever is necessary to be a physician.

And just to be honest here, I don't have acceptance here at LUCOM yet. I am supposed to hear back today. I do have acceptance at another school already, but was very impressed with the facilities and staff in place at LUCOM. I was very hesitant when I went for my interview, mostly due to the school being a first year program, but after seeing the school and staff in person, most of my reluctance was laid to rest. I do believe this school is going to do everything needed to turn out quality physicians, although there will probably be more growing pains here than at other schools, simply due to it being their first class.

 

[WTEngel]

ommnomm, are you voicing your opinion or trying to gather support for your position? From what you say, it seems like the latter. You take the position that something unprofessional occurred, and then you act unprofessionally yourself, coming here and voicing your concern instead of taking it directly to the party with which you have an issue. What do you have to gain by engaging in the discourse here, rather than with the individual you actually have an issue with?

From what you have written, it looks like you don't want Liberty, and if they read your comments here, they probably would think twice about wanting you. You've voiced your opinion, to which you are entitled, now move on. I was told the exact same things you were during the interview process, and took the time to read the student handbook. I am not as concerned as you are. This seems to be the shared opinion of most of the accepted students, too. If you can't adhere to the LUCOM rules, or conduct yourself with enough discretion (most likely what the majority of students will be doing) to avoid drawing negative attention to yourself, then choose another school, and go post in their thread.

Frankly, I know very few people who actively advertise to the administration how much they like to drink alcohol, what their sex life is like, what their living situation is, etc. If you are looking for a school where it is ok for you to do this, then you are probably out of luck, whether their handbook is as strict as LUCOM's or not.

 

[Bootrum]

Alright... let's move on to a more relevant discussion... I would like to hear anyone's reservations (not related to the code of conduct or standards) about LUCOM. We all know this is a brand new program. What are your major concerns coming in as part of the inaugural class?

 

[FFEMT850]

deposit in!

 

[trippenlatin]

My biggest concern is that my feet will be cold in the winter. I hate having cold feet.

Sent from my SGH-T679 using Tapatalk 2

 

[WTEngel]

Honestly my biggest concern is that I will grow so fond of LUCOM and the Lynchburg area that I may be compelled to stay there through residency and ultimately begin my practice there.

This concern doesn't stem from the fact that I do not want to live in VA, but more from the fact that my entire family and my wife's family live in Texas.

With that being said, the vibe I have gotten throughout this whole process is that LUCOM has immense support from the community and professional organizations around the area. Most medical schools have this to a certain extent, but the genuine passion that shines through when speaking with people in the area is pretty amazing. It just makes me feel good to go to a school that is in a good relationship with the community, and both parties bring something to the table.

For those of you who are already certified as EMTs or Paramedics, I have been doing some casual talking with the BREMS council and there may be some great opportunities to participate in research and gain EMS subspecialty experience. The BREMS medical director sat with the first group of physicians to take the EMS subspecialty licensing exam, and she has made it really clear that they are forward thinking. Like I said, opportunities seem to abound in Lynchburg. Assuming you can keep your head above water academically, outside opportunities will be what you make of them. The awesome thing about being the first class is that to a large extent, we get to cultivate relationships and academic opportunities in the area, along with support from the school. The scary thing about being in the first class is that to a large extent, we get to cultivate relationships and academic opportunities in the area.

The spotlight is on us, and a large part of the institution's success rests on our shoulders and our ability to make sure the professional community and citizens (potential patients) see us as compassionate, conscientious, strong, capable future physicians. We get to set the bar, and hopefully I speak for everyone when I say that as a whole, we should strive to set it high. This means everyone helping each other out, and making sure that it is clear there is no time for gunner antics.

 

[lilydoc]

For those of you have who received an acceptance call- what time of day did this happen? Thanks!

 

[Mr Roboto]

You'll be the first people going through the curriculum. They're still figuring out how to teach the information needed for boards. There'll be wrinkles, but I'm wouldn't anticipate any huge problems with it.

No upperclassmen to help guide you. The first cohort will be figuring things out with each other, professors, and the internet. It would be nice to have people who had recently gone through things to help.

LUCOM grads won't have a reputation, good or bad, so PDs may be less inclined to take them. I figure as long as you do well on the boards, there's a chance at whatever specialty you'd like, but youmay have to apply more broadly and do better on rotations/boards than peers at other institutions to have equal chances.

Alright... let's move on to a more relevant discussion... I would like to hear anyone's reservations (not related to the code of conduct or standards) about LUCOM. We all know this is a brand new program. What are your major concerns coming in as part of the inaugural class?

 

[ryanc6060]

you and me both lily

 

[Dimatchka]

Any one from the wait list received an acceptance yet?

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

 

[keralagrl007]

Hey everyone. Just got the call---rejection ms. Mendez also said that the class is now closed. I interviewed 3/13 btw.

 

[CaptainDO]

ommnomm... what are you trying to prove/disprove anyways... what is your point? I have to be honest with you... this discussion is really not on the top of my radar for concerns.

 

[prowd2beloud147]

Any one from the wait list received an acceptance yet?

Sent from my Nexus 4 usin' Tapatalk

NO!!! I really hope I hear something soon. This is my school of choice and I want to be able to apartment hunt/situate! Good luck to you!!

 

[tornado2]

Anyone who interviewed on 3/17 received any news?

 

[Sternocleidomastoid]

....