Werewolf in the Garden of Good & Evil - Game Thread

[ziggyandjazzy]

We know AM might still be a wolf. But for me she's lower on the list. If you were really village I think your first instinct would be to vote AM rather than try to discredit me.

I voted Miz cuz I thought she was wolfy and I had no clue between the three of you on D2, plus no deaths to evaluate.

Im sorry if you feel like im trying to discredit you. I was really trying to understand your role. I guess I just find it a bit unbelievable that pip would include a mechanic in her game that allowed you to narrow down 3 wolves in 3 nights and clear half the field, in addition to a seer. And I was asking the bit about barks and AM, because again, I dont really understand this and it seems like people were wanting a vote between two people. I'll

Lynch AM
bc seems most logical given the info

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[Navilly]

Okay so I think we have a mechanistic win, but let’s play it out in my head (the worst case scenario):

12 people remaining.

Lynch AM or ziggy today, 11. Let’s say we are wrong, it’s the other. Goes to 9 over night with MsP dying, assuming MsP is not a wolf and is truthful about dying. We lynch the other one of AM/ziggy if we were wrong. Down to 8. 7 after evening. Now, tin foil portion of theory below, but assuming no tin foil, we lynch Barkley assuming MsP wasn’t a wolf, 6 people remaining, 1 wolf. 5 overnight. Let’s say you lynch me instead of MJ the next day, down to 4. MJ does final kill, 3. MJ lynched, game over.

The only tin foil is this was a ploy by paws. Which until proven otherwise should not be the first thought. But if both AM and Ziggy aren’t wolves, then the obvious vote is paws (and they wouldn’t have a win until then) . If the pairings are correct, could it be a ploy for her to win at end game? Sure, but it seemed like a mostly unnecessary way of trying to win the game, as if she was a wolf, she was doing quite well until this morning.

However THE KEY TO THiS GUARANTEED WIN IS EVERYONE SHOULD ELECT TO CONTINGENCY NOT USE THEIR ROLE THE REST OF THE GAME. This is important. As if MJ can use their delayed kill mechanism, then the worst case scenario pulls off a win for wolves.

*********lynch ziggy*******

 

[Navilly]

Okay so I think we have a mechanistic win, but let’s play it out in my head (the worst case scenario):

12 people remaining.

Lynch AM or ziggy today, 11. Let’s say we are wrong, it’s the other. Goes to 9 over night with MsP dying, assuming MsP is not a wolf and is truthful about dying. We lynch the other one of AM/ziggy if we were wrong. Down to 8. 7 after evening. Now, tin foil portion of theory below, but assuming no tin foil, we lynch Barkley assuming MsP wasn’t a wolf, 6 people remaining, 1 wolf. 5 overnight. Let’s say you lynch me instead of MJ the next day, down to 4. MJ does final kill, 3. MJ lynched, game over.

The only tin foil is this was a ploy by paws. Which until proven otherwise should not be the first thought. But if both AM and Ziggy aren’t wolves, then the obvious vote is paws (and they wouldn’t have a win until then) . If the pairings are correct, could it be a ploy for her to win at end game? Sure, but it seemed like a mostly unnecessary way of trying to win the game, as if she was a wolf, she was doing quite well until this morning.

However THE KEY TO THiS GUARANTEED WIN IS EVERYONE SHOULD ELECT TO CONTINGENCY NOT USE THEIR ROLE THE REST OF THE GAME. This is important. As if MJ can use their delayed kill mechanism, then the worst case scenario pulls off a win for wolves.

*********lynch ziggy*******

With this, I am wondering if mod would allow it to turn into speed cycles. As essentially wolves are piddling around with 1 pawn and a king, while our queen, knight and bishop are all still alive.

 

[JustPaws]

With this, I am wondering if mod would allow it to turn into speed cycles. As essentially wolves are piddling around with 1 pawn and a king, while our queen, knight and bishop are all still alive.

While I like that idea, I don't have the ability to be around for the whole day to read and make multiple votes, hence why I'm not playing the single day games in the lounge this weekend

 

[Lawpy]

Okay so I think we have a mechanistic win, but let’s play it out in my head (the worst case scenario):

12 people remaining.

Lynch AM or ziggy today, 11. Let’s say we are wrong, it’s the other. Goes to 9 over night with MsP dying, assuming MsP is not a wolf and is truthful about dying. We lynch the other one of AM/ziggy if we were wrong. Down to 8. 7 after evening. Now, tin foil portion of theory below, but assuming no tin foil, we lynch Barkley assuming MsP wasn’t a wolf, 6 people remaining, 1 wolf. 5 overnight. Let’s say you lynch me instead of MJ the next day, down to 4. MJ does final kill, 3. MJ lynched, game over.

The only tin foil is this was a ploy by paws. Which until proven otherwise should not be the first thought. But if both AM and Ziggy aren’t wolves, then the obvious vote is paws (and they wouldn’t have a win until then) . If the pairings are correct, could it be a ploy for her to win at end game? Sure, but it seemed like a mostly unnecessary way of trying to win the game, as if she was a wolf, she was doing quite well until this morning.

However THE KEY TO THiS GUARANTEED WIN IS EVERYONE SHOULD ELECT TO CONTINGENCY NOT USE THEIR ROLE THE REST OF THE GAME. This is important. As if MJ can use their delayed kill mechanism, then the worst case scenario pulls off a win for wolves.

*********lynch ziggy*******

Ok this is reasonable but what are your thoughts on lynching barky now and immediately verifying Pawsy's statement and MsPro's claim? I mean right now i have zero reason to doubt Pawsy or MsPro but i'm thinking this mechanically based on what Stagg outlined.

 

[Stagg737]

Who's the third one?

Myself, MJ, and Mel.

 

[Navilly]

Ok this is reasonable but what are your thoughts on lynching barky now and immediately verifying Pawsy's statement and MsPro's claim? I mean right now i have zero reason to doubt Pawsy or MsPro but i'm thinking this mechanically based on what Stagg outlined.

Okay so 12 people again, let’s think this out:

Barkley is lynched, Barkley is not a wolf, 11. MsP is still alive, and is a wolf (which I am reiterating is not going to be the case but anyway). Down to 10. Lynch MsP, 9. Kill to 8. Lynch am/ziggy 7. Kill, 6 Lynch other 5. Kill 4. Then we do have to be correct the next day.

I mean, I feel quite strongly that Barkley is wolf and MsP is not. But on the off chance I am wrong, we would have to get the lynch correct on the last day. So step wise it’s smarter to do AM/ziggy today.

Edit: typo, meant to say Barkley is wolf and MsP is not

 

[Lawpy]

Ok makes sense

Unlynch barky
Lynch zigjazzy

 

[JustPaws]

I like lynching Ziggy today because then we confirm Ms pros claim cuz she dies and we know her affiliation. If she doesn't die, there is no reason for a villager to lie about being poisoned, right? So defacto a wolf?

 

[JustPaws]

Lynch ziggy

 

[Stagg737]

Okay so I think we have a mechanistic win, but let’s play it out in my head (the worst case scenario):

12 people remaining.

Lynch AM or ziggy today, 11. Let’s say we are wrong, it’s the other. Goes to 9 over night with MsP dying, assuming MsP is not a wolf and is truthful about dying. We lynch the other one of AM/ziggy if we were wrong. Down to 8. 7 after evening. Now, tin foil portion of theory below, but assuming no tin foil, we lynch Barkley assuming MsP wasn’t a wolf, 6 people remaining, 1 wolf. 5 overnight. Let’s say you lynch me instead of MJ the next day, down to 4. MJ does final kill, 3. MJ lynched, game over.

The only tin foil is this was a ploy by paws. Which until proven otherwise should not be the first thought. But if both AM and Ziggy aren’t wolves, then the obvious vote is paws (and they wouldn’t have a win until then) . If the pairings are correct, could it be a ploy for her to win at end game? Sure, but it seemed like a mostly unnecessary way of trying to win the game, as if she was a wolf, she was doing quite well until this morning.

However THE KEY TO THiS GUARANTEED WIN IS EVERYONE SHOULD ELECT TO CONTINGENCY NOT USE THEIR ROLE THE REST OF THE GAME. This is important. As if MJ can use their delayed kill mechanism, then the worst case scenario pulls off a win for wolves.

*********lynch ziggy*******

Here's the only problem with this plan. Let's say we lynch Ziggy and she flips village and MsP doesn't die overnight. It's likely we'd lose another villager overnight. We're then down to 10 with 3 wolves left and no guarantees that our following lynch would be a wolf as we'd still have AM alive along with both Barks and MsP and no confirmation as to whether Paw's claims are true. So at that point we'd still be working under an assumption of Paws' claim as well as having to assume that MsP was lying and assume that AM is a wolf. Which is a lot of assumptions. If we lynch Barks and she flips village and MsP dies overnight as village, we know at the start of the day tomorrow that Paws lied. If MsP still lives then we can lynch her first thing. So by lynching barks there's a higher probability that we'll only need to use one lynch cycle to confirm Paws vs. more likely to require 2 cycles for further substantiation.

Imo it comes down to a few things:
1. How solidly do you believe Paws' claim.
2. How solidly do you believe MsP's claim.
3. Is Ziggy or Barkley the stronger wolf read?

For now I'm working under the assumption that Paws is being truthful, that MsP is likely being truthful, and that Barks is my stronger wolf read. Which is why my vote is sitting on Barks. Honestly, I think village is going to be alright as long as we lynch either Barkley or Ziggy today and any other votes/wagons that occur today are suspicious AF.

Imo it kind of just comes do

 

[JustPaws]

I also think village!Ziggy would have hardcore come out swinging at AM after my reveal

 

[Stagg737]

@Ms Procrastinator , what exactly happened to you that will lead to your death? When did this happen? What were the exact words regarding the time you'll die?

 

[JustPaws]

Here's the only problem with this plan. Let's say we lynch Ziggy and she flips village and MsP doesn't die overnight. It's likely we'd lose another villager We're then down to 10 with 3 wolves left and no guarantees that our following lynch would be a wolf as we'd still have AM alive along with both Barks and MsP and no confirmation as to whether Paw's claims are true. So at that point we'd still be working under an assumption of Paws' claim as well as having to assume that MsP was lying and assume that AM is a wolf. Which is a lot of assumptions. If we lynch Barks and she flips village and MsP dies overnight as village, we know at the start of the day tomorrow that Paws lied. If MsP still lives then we can lynch her first thing. So by lynching barks there's a higher probability that we'll only need to use one lynch cycle to confirm Paws vs. more likely to require 2 cycles for further substantiation.

Imo it comes down to a few things:
1. How solidly do you believe Paws' claim.
2. How solidly do you believe MsP's claim.
3. Is Ziggy or Barkley the stronger wolf read?

For now I'm working under the assumption that Paws is being truthful, that MsP is likely being truthful, and that Barks is my stronger wolf read. Which is why my vote is sitting on Barks. Honestly, I think village is going to be alright as long as we lynch either Barkley or Ziggy today and any other votes/wagons that occur today are suspicious AF.

Imo it kind of just comes do

I totally understand where you are coming from so will vote barks if that is the majority. I get that you need to confirm my claim in some way

 

[Stagg737]

I also think village!Ziggy would have hardcore come out swinging at AM after my reveal

I don't think I'm very good at reading Zigs or Genny, but Barks feels very off to me this game. I know I've said this in the past, but normally she starts to redeem herself around D2-3 which she has not at all this game. Also, while I'm village leaning AM, there's some things that have made me side-eye a bit. The thing that puts her solidly in the non-vill pile hasn't happened this game, but I'm still more comfortable with looking at the Barks/MsP pairing first and then looking into AM/Zig than the other way around.

 

[Stagg737]

I totally understand where you are coming from so will vote barks if that is the majority. I get that you need to confirm my claim in some way

I'm at the same place. I don't have a problem with a Ziggy or Barks lynch at this point as long as we're moving forward in a logical manner that will lynch less than 2 villagers in the 3 cycles assuming your info is correct. Any situation in which there's only 1 wolf lynched in the next 3 days is very problematic. Also the final group of 3 is potentially problematic despite MJ being the seemingly obvious option. I'd like to hear from @Ms Procrastinator to clarify some of this MJ information (sorry for the double tag, wanted to make sure you got the request for additional info).

 

[ziggyandjazzy]

I also think village!Ziggy would have hardcore come out swinging at AM after my reveal

I'm sorry that I didn't understand you role and have been more focused on school??

SDN is blocked on my computer again till 6 pm.
But since it looks like I'm going to get lynched I'll just say that if I am lynched, I don't think there will be protection tonight. I'm not sure how much that matters though as the wolves have at least one strong arm.

 

[Barkley13]

Lynch ziggy

I’ve been tempted to lynch MsP too but it makes sense to wait to see if she’ll die on her own

 

[JustPaws]

Lynch ziggy

I’ve been tempted to lynch MsP too but it makes sense to wait to see if she’ll die on her own

Lol

 

[Ms Procrastinator]

I'm at the same place. I don't have a problem with a Ziggy or Barks lynch at this point as long as we're moving forward in a logical manner that will lynch less than 2 villagers in the 3 cycles assuming your info is correct. Any situation in which there's only 1 wolf lynched in the next 3 days is very problematic. Also the final group of 3 is potentially problematic despite MJ being the seemingly obvious option. I'd like to hear from @Ms Procrastinator to clarify some of this MJ information (sorry for the double tag, wanted to make sure you got the request for additional info).

Clarify how?

 

[dolphin106258]

Lynch ziggy

I’ve been tempted to lynch MsP too but it makes sense to wait to see if she’ll die on her own

...this is all you got?

 

[dolphin106258]

Lynch Barks

 

[Barkley13]

...this is all you got?

I mean I know I’m not a wolf but just saying that won’t convince anyone so the best way is for everyone to see that MsP is

 

[Ms Procrastinator]

@Ms Procrastinator , what exactly happened to you that will lead to your death? When did this happen? What were the exact words regarding the time you'll die?

I can't say it word for word but it basically says that I start feeling a little weird like something's attacking my nervous system. A toxin's in my body and it's eventually gonna work its way up to, and shut down, my CNS. I was told I would specifically die on N5 unless I received medical attention.

 

[dolphin106258]

I mean I know I’m not a wolf but just saying that won’t convince anyone so the best way is for everyone to see that MsP is

I’ve seen several posts from Stagg claiming how your play had been different. I haven’t seen any type of defense from you. Which definitely makes me feel worse about you.

 

[Coopah]

We need to Lynch the more confirmed wolves first to get a better ratio.

Also is no one erked by Ms P saying she would die "tomorrow" but now it's n5?

She said she would die n5

 

[Coopah]

Well, that was not what I expected to catch up to. Yes, someone seered me N1 and saw my inner nature - not sure how she got wolf but whatevs

Come on! Wolf brag!

 

[Coopah]

Sounds like a pretty wolfy thing to ask since it will make my ability useless if I get more specific on how it works to explain why I chose my targets. It's not a complicated ability, but it's specific

Not when you consider you're on the short lists for wolves and you have a kill ability.

 

[Stagg737]

I'm sorry that I didn't understand you role and have been more focused on school??

SDN is blocked on my computer again till 6 pm.
But since it looks like I'm going to get lynched I'll just say that if I am lynched, I don't think there will be protection tonight. I'm not sure how much that matters though as the wolves have at least one strong arm.

Why do you know this?

I can't say it word for word but it basically says that I start feeling a little weird like something's attacking my nervous system. A toxin's in my body and it's eventually gonna work its way up to, and shut down, my CNS. I was told I would specifically die on N5 unless I received medical attention.

When did you get this information?

 

[Ms Procrastinator]

@Navilly did anything interesting happen to you night three?

 

[Coopah]

Mutts died overnight, please check in today, we need to pick Ziggy or barks as the next Lynch

Yeah but why did mutts die?

 

[Ms Procrastinator]

When did you get this information?

At the end of N3 (beginning of D4)

 

[Ms Procrastinator]

I mean I know I’m not a wolf but just saying that won’t convince anyone so the best way is for everyone to see that MsP is

I love that you're obsessed with me

 

[Barkley13]

I’ve seen several posts from Stagg claiming how your play had been different. I haven’t seen any type of defense from you. Which definitely makes me feel worse about you.

As I said in dead chat last game, I’ve been lynched pretty much every game for “sounding different”. It was never true before and it’s not true now

 

[Barkley13]

I love that you're obsessed with me

Yes saying something about you twice = obsessed
I just regret that people have let you lay low and lurk all game again

 

[Animal Midwife]

Yeah but why did mutts die?

She was completely outted and nightkilled.

 

[Coopah]

@Navilly you counts don't include extra deaths if MJ is a wolf there will be extra deaths, or if there is an extra kill mechanic for the wolves

 

[Coopah]

She was nightkilled.

Well no ****, but who killed her? How? Was it MJs attempt to get village cred since he's on the short list or was it a different vig?

 

[Animal Midwife]

Well no ****, but who killed her? How? Was it MJs attempt to get village cred since he's on the short list or was it a different vig?

Regardless of who killed her it doesn't change the POE.

 

[Coopah]

Regardless of who killed her it doesn't change the POE.

I'm concerned about leaving an extra kill alive because if we're wrong a few times the wolves can still win

 

[Navilly]

@Navilly you counts don't include extra deaths if MJ is a wolf there will be extra deaths, or if there is an extra kill mechanic for the wolves

As I said, in all caps in that post, everyone needs to not submit anything until MJ is taken care of.

 

[Ms Procrastinator]

Well no ****, but who killed her? How? Was it MJs attempt to get village cred since he's on the short list or was it a different vig?

I don't think it could have been MJ. He said he was delayed kill

 

[Ms Procrastinator]

As I said, in all caps in that post, everyone needs to not submit anything until MJ is taken care of.

What do you mean by this?

 

[Coopah]

As I said, in all caps in that post, everyone needs to not submit anything until MJ is taken care of.

Right but I didn't see calculation to account for his delayed kill if he was a wolf?

 

[Coopah]

I don't think it could have been MJ. He said he was delayed kill

Ok cool I'm still concerned lol

 

[Coopah]

Oh and lynch ziggy

 

[Navilly]

Right but I didn't see calculation to account for his delayed kill if he was a wolf?

But there would be no delayed kills as people are going to not do dumb things and listen to what I am saying there. I don’t get what it mean

 

[Coopah]

As I said, in all caps in that post, everyone needs to not submit anything until MJ is taken care of.

But also I would think you mean just things that could **** things up. Not anything. Because we've had a watcher and a seer. Those sorts of things won't **** things up. Why can't they work?

 

[Coopah]

But there would be no delayed kills as people are going to not do dumb things and listen to what I am saying there. I don’t get what it mean

Ah **** I forgot how that worked. Lol thanks

 

[Navilly]

And MsP, ticker given a little extra oomf, talked about going through any blocks that may have been present that night, but I don’t have any active abilities, so blocking is irrelevant for me.