2016-2017 Texas A&M Health Science Center Application Thread

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I would beg to differ. Helping prospective students make a decisions that WILL effect the rest of their life is anything but a molehill. As stated previously, OP asked for honest feedback to help make an informed decision. All students receive the same presentation during orientation week where we are told that we were selected because we were in the top of our class, but in med school 50% will be in the upper half and 50% in the lower half of the class. Students tend to think this doesn't pertain to them, until they are placed in a class with 199 of the brightest students in the nation. I'm happy to be chastised for preparing students for the possibility of being in the lower half, and forewarning them that they won't get the help they need in such an event bc the school just doesn't have the resources for them. I wish someone would have been more honest on SDN about A&M when I turned down my offers to UTHSCSA, McGovern, UTMB, and Tech (Lubbock), as well as some OOS schools. The core faculty is dedicated, sure, but as @tennischamp822 mentioned, you only deal with them during first semester when classes are comparatively easier than they are in the subsequent blocks. Report back when you get to the ID block, and you have to teach yourself 40 lectures worth of material for an exam bc all the prof did was read off the slides. Dr. Hairrell is great, but she's one person. Good luck getting an appointment with her after first block, when things pick up. To my understanding, as explained by members in your class, the website was created out of necessity. M1 is a busy year, and it's highly unlikely that they had so much time on their hands that they wanted to spend time creating a website that's updated weekly for ****s and giggles.

I hate that it sounds like I'm bashing this school, but this is an open forum and all too often comments are disproportionately positive which doesn't allow a student to make an accurate assessment of whether this is the right school for them. Maybe you'd prefer shorter blocks of tests like at UTSW, or want to stay in one place for 4 yrs like at McGovern, or maybe you just loathed histology in undergrad and don't want to dedicate an entire block to it and would rather it be covered when pertinent in the different organ blocks like at many of the other medical schools in TX. I think honesty is the best policy. M-zeroes have worked their asses off to get to this point and I just want to see them happy with their selection.

Oh, and btw, our class also only received three days to prepare for a remediation exam. I felt bad for those trying to study to pass a block in three days that they were unable to maintain a passing average in after four weeks. Just things to consider.

Good luck with match day!!!

Most of my making a mountain out of a molehill was directed back to the original post regarding the student handbook and people freaking out about that. I think that there was a lot of focus on negatives that I wanted to offer my honest opinion on them. Choosing what med school to go to is extremely important, and I'm not trying to diminish that. But I also wanted to offer my perspective because things do change with suggestions and time. From my experiences I have felt nothing but support and assistance, its not spoon feed to you but if you seek it you will find it. Dr. Hairrel is not the only one in academic support, and I would venture to guess that because the M2s will be on rotation when we start ID that their schedules will be at least a little more open than they were during previous years. I cant speak to that with any certainty, its just a guess.

Is the website easier to read than ecampus for a concise summary of information? Sure. Do I or a majority of my fellow classmates need it in order to complete all of our assignments? Absolutely not. There some very little things that I sometimes find frustrating, for example the way that our OSCE was organized and communicated was frustrating, but I don't think that is enough of a reason to say the school has administrative issues.

We also just had a really quick turn around our last foundations exam Wednesday with remediation the following Monday. To some this might be a disadvantage but others might prefer this since the material is still very fresh and they dont also have the remediation to worry about while learning the next block material. You bring up a ton of really good points about things to consider when choosing school, but thats also all information pretty clearly given to students when they interview. It's hard to make broad generalizations on what school is best for someone as that depends on very personal factors. I would never assume this school is the right fit for everyone, but it absolutely is for me. When you guys are making your decisions consider the curriculum, consider the publicly available data (step score, match lists, ect), but also consider where you think you will thrive most as an individual. If you think a school/location/curriculum will be detrimental to you happiness then trust that.
 
Question for the current medical students in this thread- Do you think these issues are serious enough to where if you had the chance, you would have gone elsewhere for medical school, or is it just another thing to deal with?

I might be in a position to choose between UTHSCSA and A&M and have been pretty torn between the two.

Also, thanks for coming in here and helping us out. I think it’s important to hear both the positives and the negatives, and up until now I hadn’t heard a single negative thing about this school.
 
Question for the current medical students in this thread- Do you think these issues are serious enough to where if you had the chance, you would have gone elsewhere for medical school, or is it just another thing to deal with?

I might be in a position to choose between UTHSCSA and A&M and have been pretty torn between the two.

Also, thanks for coming in here and helping us out. I think it’s important to hear both the positives and the negatives, and up until now I hadn’t heard a single negative thing about this school.

Up till now, I've heard plenty of small grievances about the curriculum from classmates, but as many have said, we were going through a transition and that's to be expected. On here, I have seen a student from the class of 2018 and one from the class of 2020, NEITHER of which went through the trying debut years of our new curriculum, complaining about things with which other classes (and even their classmates) have had no issue. If people fail, we all construct giant documents reminiscent of first aid to help them succeed. We appoint tutors who do >2 SDs above the average to help them succeed. Chris and Angie (Academic support) have their doors open at any time, and travel campus to campus, to help them succeed. Hell, we would amass tubberwares full of food so they didn't have to cook and could dedicate themselves to study, all to help them succeed. Do not let these naysayers deter you from an excellent academic experience, though it will be excellent regardless of if you go here or somewhere else. You are in professional school, these institutions receive LCME accreditatio: quite simply, you cannot pick wrong. All interviews are prettied up, but A&M is not some shady, cut throat school as depicted (apparently just recently, strange how dissenters are coming out of the woodworks, must have just bombed a test).

And I'm sure these "fellow students" of mine must think I'm a suck up for defending our great school. Not at all, just a die hard Aggie who loves where he's learning medicine, and is embarrassed to see his colleagues so bitter about their great fortune to be doing the same. Plenty will take their seat if they want to leave.
 
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Question for the current medical students in this thread- Do you think these issues are serious enough to where if you had the chance, you would have gone elsewhere for medical school, or is it just another thing to deal with?

I might be in a position to choose between UTHSCSA and A&M and have been pretty torn between the two.

Also, thanks for coming in here and helping us out. I think it’s important to hear both the positives and the negatives, and up until now I hadn’t heard a single negative thing about this school.


I was curious about your question and decided to ask my sister, (She is currently in medical school at Texas A&M), and she said that based on her experiences with the program if she could have a do-over in selecting medical schools she would definitely have chosen her previous UT San Antonio pre-match over her A&M pre-match in the final rankings... She does very well academically in medical school, but she definitely feels that it has been more based upon her personal studying and learning of the material rather than from the instructor's teaching methods.
 
This simply is not true. None of it. Medical school is the colosseum of competition, there will be no one to help you here unless they are a close friend or are doing well enough to the point that they don't need to study (I have yet to see this). Saying only 1 person had to repeat is far from the truth. Several students from the class of 2019 that I know of had to repeat and a few were dismissed or withdrew. I can see how it would be difficult to notice who doesn't progress in a class of 200 unless you got inside information like I did, but let's not be misleading. If @thatonegirly is honest, she can attest to the inaccuracy of this statement. Not to knock those that had to repeat, bc they certainly lacked the support they needed to do well.

I personally headed up the tutoring program in the class of 2019, and oversaw the students that were struggling. I came up with the method. Do not tell me it doesn't exist, because there are still groups going on at every campus to this day. Every single one who asked for help received it, and was eventually promoted to the second year. If they withdrew, or were dismissed, it's because they did not seek the help readily offered to them, or because academics weren't the problem.

To those applying: the doctor who does not seek help from their colleagues when they sorely need it is the one who fails. This is a team sport, we are in this together. Regardless of where you end up learning medicine, remember that you are not alone in this, but that it is not on others for your success. You are responsible for reaching out and ensuring you have what you need to succeed.
 
I was curious about your question and decided to ask my sister, (She is currently in medical school at Texas A&M), and she said that based on her experiences with the program if she could have a do-over in selecting medical schools she would definitely have chosen her previous UT San Antonio pre-match over her A&M pre-match in the final rankings... She does very well academically in medical school, but she definitely feels that it has been more based upon her personal studying and learning of the material rather than from the instructor's teaching methods.

My thoughts exactly.
 
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Up till now, I've heard plenty of small grievances about the curriculum from classmates, but as many have said, we were going through a transition and that's to be expected. On here, I have seen a student from the class of 2018 and one from the class of 2020, NEITHER of which went through the trying debut years of our new curriculum, complaining about things with which other classes (and even their classmates) have had no issue. If people fail, we all construct giant documents reminiscent of first aid to help them succeed. We appoint tutors who do >2 SDs above the average to help them succeed. Chris and Angie (Academic support) have their doors open at any time, and travel campus to campus, to help them succeed. Hell, we would amass tubberwares full of food so they didn't have to cook and could dedicate themselves to study, all to help them succeed. Do not let these naysayers deter you from an excellent academic experience, though it will be excellent regardless of if you go here or somewhere else. You are in professional school, these institutions receive LCME accreditatio: quite simply, you cannot pick wrong. All interviews are prettied up, but A&M is not some shady, cut throat school as depicted (apparently just recently, strange how dissenters are coming out of the woodworks, must have just bombed a test).

And I'm sure these "fellow students" of mine must think I'm a suck up for defending our great school. Not at all, just a die hard Aggie who loves where he's learning medicine, and is embarrassed to see his colleagues so bitter about their great fortune to be doing the same. Plenty will take their seat if they want to leave.

If your tutors are generally >2SDs over the average, that means you have less than 5% of the class who can tutor. ~12.5% of the Class of 2018 either repeated the year or was dismissed just FYI.

You must be kidding if you think that a bad test is causing me to speak up or if you think that I am going to leave after I've already spent so much time/money in this pursuit.

Edit: Not trying to bash the school, but some of the facts should be available to people before they make their decisions.
 
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If you struggle at A&M what makes you think you wouldn't struggle elsewhere..?

Not sure if this is a serious question or not, but you are aware that, in theory, all medical schools should be teaching the same thing, right? It just boils down to who teaches it the best and/or can provide the resources to compensate for any deficits in teaching. I just wish A&M had better resources for the students and instructors that are as involved as the core faculty. Nowhere did I say I struggled, but because I had friends at other medical schools I was able to use the resources they were provided (namely UTSW and Tech).
 
Not sure if this is a serious question or not, but you are aware that, in theory, all medical schools should be teaching the same thing, right? It just boils down to who teaches it the best and/or can provide the resources to compensate for any deficits in teaching. I just wish A&M had better resources for the students and instructors that are as involved as the core faculty. Nowhere did I say I struggled, but because I had friends at other medical schools I was able to use the resources they were provided (namely UTSW and Tech).
See the thing is, in your scenario, n=1. Some are kicked out of the program not for "deficits in teaching", but the fault of the student solely. So we mustn't lump all of them into one category and blame the school. even in undergraduate education, people leave for lots of reasons. I think the policy of the school is to ensure a line is drawn on how much one can screw up. If you think about it, each school tries to get students that they are sure will never get to that point (hence the screening of our previous academic record and accomplishments), so it makes sense that they have a standard of who they do not want in their program. Our goal (nor matter where we end up) is to do the best we can and succeed. Now is not the time to be worried about failure.
 
Not sure if this is a serious question or not, but you are aware that, in theory, all medical schools should be teaching the same thing, right? It just boils down to who teaches it the best and/or can provide the resources to compensate for any deficits in teaching. I just wish A&M had better resources for the students and instructors that are as involved as the core faculty. Nowhere did I say I struggled, but because I had friends at other medical schools I was able to use the resources they were provided (namely UTSW and Tech).

In theory, everyone studies for Step using the same set of booklets- Pathoma, first aid, etc. but there are wide disparities in scores, you know. There are a lot of video lectures and resources students can access to improve their performance. Some of them cost money. But when you're $150K in debt, $400 to make AOA in physiology because some videos seems like a deal.
 
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I truly commend @tennischamp822 and @SallyT for taking the time to share their insight as actual medical students at A&M. I can definitely tell you that I wouldn't disregard what they are saying. I find it interesting that some applicants feel comfortable speaking on this issue when they have absolutely no experience or perspective in which to formulate a valid opinion. Medical school is nothing like anything you've ever experienced, you can't compare it to your undergraduate program, nor can you think that because you did well on your MCAT or have multiple acceptances that you will thrive in medical school. I would say this is one of those instances where it'd be in your best interest to save your 2 cents and take into consideration what those who actually attend the school have to say.

I don't think that many of you are aware that the student ambassadors that do the tours and panels during interview day are trained and told to only promote the positive aspects of the school. I should know, I'm one of them. I will say that I wish there were more people providing honest feedback back when I was making my decision. I interviewed at 9 TX schools, and looking back many of the students that I kept in touch with throughout interview season chose different schools. A good majority of them are happier with their decision than I can say I am. Which is unfortunate, but then again I based my decision only on what was projected to me (only the positives).

I've done well thus far, but I've also been one to be able to teach myself material so I don't rely too much on the professors. I do know that many students aren't able to do this, but then again, they shouldn't have to because we're not paying to teach ourselves. I do agree that this school lacks resources, which makes sense because they are not a big research school. I honestly didn't know this school offered tutors. Maybe because they don't, that or it's a well-kept secret. I'll have to look into that tomorrow to confirm.

I saw a comment that referred to AOA, which I found a bit humorous. You have to maintain honors throughout your preclinical years to even be nominated for AOA, then I believe only 5 students or so are ultimately selected. The kicker is that you have to have above a 90% to honor and then be in the top 15% for that block. Honors for one of our blocks last year was like a 95 or 96 average in the course. So, I'd recommend worrying about just trying to pass. I know most of you feel exceptional because you go to a decent school, but there are students that graduated at the top of their class from the same schools as you and better ones that don't honor, or even come close for that matter.
 
I love all these people coming out of the crevices to throw shade at their own school: posters with under 5 posts who now decide they want to help the applicant by dissing a school that many who are on this forum were overjoyed to be accepted to. Where were you to help throughout this whole cycle when others have been helping them, who have made them love this schools community feel?

Donny, I too am an ambassador. I talk to applicants every week, here and on campus. But the difference here is that I give them good tangible reasons to be excited about this place, whereas one of your two posts is to air your buyers remorse.

TLDR: Fellow aggie docs, stop killing the buzz because of your inability to find the readily offered resources, and your personal unhappiness with your choice.
 
I truly commend @tennischamp822 and @SallyT for taking the time to share their insight as actual medical students at A&M. I can definitely tell you that I wouldn't disregard what they are saying. I find it interesting that some applicants feel comfortable speaking on this issue when they have absolutely no experience or perspective in which to formulate a valid opinion. Medical school is nothing like anything you've ever experienced, you can't compare it to your undergraduate program, nor can you think that because you did well on your MCAT or have multiple acceptances that you will thrive in medical school. I would say this is one of those instances where it'd be in your best interest to save your 2 cents and take into consideration what those who actually attend the school have to say.

I don't think that many of you are aware that the student ambassadors that do the tours and panels during interview day are trained and told to only promote the positive aspects of the school. I should know, I'm one of them. I will say that I wish there were more people providing honest feedback back when I was making my decision. I interviewed at 9 TX schools, and looking back many of the students that I kept in touch with throughout interview season chose different schools. A good majority of them are happier with their decision than I can say I am. Which is unfortunate, but then again I based my decision only on what was projected to me (only the positives).

I've done well thus far, but I've also been one to be able to teach myself material so I don't rely too much on the professors. I do know that many students aren't able to do this, but then again, they shouldn't have to because we're not paying to teach ourselves. I do agree that this school lacks resources, which makes sense because they are not a big research school. I honestly didn't know this school offered tutors. Maybe because they don't, that or it's a well-kept secret. I'll have to look into that tomorrow to confirm.

I saw a comment that referred to AOA, which I found a bit humorous. You have to maintain honors throughout your preclinical years to even be nominated for AOA, then I believe only 5 students or so are ultimately selected. The kicker is that you have to have above a 90% to honor and then be in the top 15% for that block. Honors for one of our blocks last year was like a 95 or 96 average in the course. So, I'd recommend worrying about just trying to pass. I know most of you feel exceptional because you go to a decent school, but there are students that graduated at the top of their class from the same schools as you and better ones that don't honor, or even come close for that matter.
I'm not going to go back and forth, but my comment about undergraduate education was meant to get across the understanding that, at every level, the teachers are not always at fault. I didn't say that medical school was easy (I highly doubt that in fact). I'm just saying we cannot solely blame the institution for the dismissal or repeating for some students, as we do not know every single situation. If the school lacks resources, that is fine, but I don't think that is the reason for every single person's dismissal or need to repeat. I do appreciate the insight, and I am learning from all of you, but I think we should take this with a grain of salt. Those are my last two cents on this matter, and I appreciate your respecting that.
 
Also a current M2 (class of 2019) - not here to argue with anybody, but I would love to answer any questions and dispel any concerns any of you have. I'm glad you all are discussing these issues, as they are very important to your future and they should absolutely be addressed! To answer some of the above concerns:

- some of the posters above mentioned a handful of individuals being dismissed/had to repeat the year and that this may be attributed to the schools lack of efficiency. However, our class has consistently been shown we have scored higher in most (every?) block in school thus far, after this new, integrated curriculum. I only mention this to conclude that IF the school is lacking in efficiency, while the majority of class is excelling, the school cannot be blamed for performing sub-optimally for those 15 students who didn't perform well, while 185 students did. If this is the case, and the school was sufficient for 185 students, this is something to be considered. The school can't teach well for 185 students, and not well for 15, and then be blamed for inadequacy. Do some people struggle here (and EVERY school)? Of course. However, when the class' course average has never even been CLOSE to failing (in any block), I can assure you that the school is far from inefficient. I know the other current students posting above aren't trying to sound bashful, I just wanted this point addressed as something to be considered.

-I didn't understand a previous poster's comment of "feeling the need to teach themselves." For example, while organic chemistry, calculus, and courses such as these in undergrad are seemingly "foreign languages" at the time, it's obviously very dependent on how your professor explains the material, as the information itself is the challenge. In medical school, very few times will you be confused by what was presented in lecture. The material itself is usually not difficult to understand, rather, it's the sheer volume of material presented to you. Because of this, the professors will present their information to us, and then it's up to us, the students, to go home and commit hours on hours to memorizing, applying, and understanding the concepts. The real challenge is just remembering it all and applying it. As this is the case, I'm not sure if any good or bad professor necessarily affected my grade significantly, bc I still have to go home and read the lecture over and over just as in any medical school curriculum. Even if the professor was great, I still have to go home and look over the lecture time and time again, hopefully that makes sense? In summary, you wont be "teaching" yourself, but you will be memorizing and applying by yourself, regardless of how great (or rarely, not so great) the professor was.

-I'm not sure that A&M's handbook is much different than other med schools. Repeating the school year after failing 3 courses in the first year (which essentially means you failed 3 out of 7 of the core science blocks in the year) is nothing to be concerned about. Repeating the school year after failing almost half of the curriculum is reasonable, and not a common occurrence at all.

-As for only have a few days to prepare for a remediation exam, this largely varies. You usually have several weeks, but a few courses only gives a few days, depending on the block. However, the handbook's language is a bit vague. For example, every remediation date for each block is given at the beginning of the year. IF you are in danger of failing (again, not many people), going into the last exam of the course, it makes sense to begin preparing for the remediation exam that will either be the following week, or several weeks from them. This pertains to VERY few people, as the majority already know they passed, and few of the remaining people actually do end up failing. Nevertheless, as Nysor mentioned above, our class collectively prepares study sheets, food, tutoring, you name it for anybody that needs extra help, motivation, support, etc if they are in this situation and needing to remediate. Hopefully, the students needing extra help seek out the PLENTIFUL resources A&M offers beforehand in order to avoid this, such as these:

-Speaking for my class (2019), as Nysor mentioned above: We have absolutely had tutors available for our help. I have NEVER had an issue reaching out to a single faculty member at A&M. Tutoring sessions (from both faculty and other current students) is a regular occurrence. The statement that mentioned "good luck getting an appointment" with faculty advisors/counselors for help is beyond me. They offer appointments every single day, and if you can't meet with them that day, they will even give you their personal numbers to reach them.

-for the comment of "Do you want to go to a school that will dismiss you if you fail Step 1 twice (which happens at A&M)? There are many other MD/DO schools which will give you 3 tries at passing." The likelihood of failing Step 1 once is VERY rare, and failing twice is EXTREMELY rare (at any medical school). I'm not currently aware of any current A&M students in this situation? Regardless, I don't think you want to compare a school based on the comparison of maximum Step 1 attempts. I know you're not insinuating this, but again just to provide clarity.

-The above posters are correct in their statement that interview days are full of positivity and presenting themselves in the best light. I know people at every single medical school in the state (as many of you do), and EVERY one of them has their complaints about different issues (yes, even in our states/countries best schools). Developing and implementing a new curriculum is extremely challenging, as you can all imagine, and presents many different issues. In the last few years alone, multiple TX schools have been on probation, schools have had to cancel certain blocks because of problems, had students repeat, etc. I assure you that NO school is perfect. Do schools teach differently, more efficiently, etc? Of course. Am I going to crush step because of a great/terribly taught lecture during my first week of medical school? Absolutely not, as you can't remember every tiny detail from over a year ago, whether you were taught by the best professor in the world or not. Just like other medical schools, use the resources, courses, etc - step is largely dependent on you, the individual.

-school is what you make of it. You WILL receive plenty of support here at A&M (and probably at any TX school), and the school will absolutely help you succeed. You all are going to be excellent doctors, regardless of which school you choose and how you were taught the information.

-PLEASE ask here/message me any questions any of you may have, I am more than happy to answer them, along with my other classmates. I am very happy to be here, and I hope you don't let other's opinions (or mine) persuade you one way or the other, this is YOUR decision, you will do great anywhere. Remember that one good (or bad) experience that we all mention may not be YOUR experience. Again, I do not want to argue with anybody, and I'm glad you all are asking these types of questions before making such an important decision! Good luck everybody!
 
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-I'm not sure that A&M's handbook is much different than other med schools. Repeating the school year after failing 3 courses in the first year (which essentially means you failed 3 out of 7 of the core science blocks in the year) is nothing to be concerned about. Repeating the school year after failing almost half of the curriculum is reasonable, and not a common occurrence at all.

I wasn't planning on responding, but this is a misinformed statement. I know a former A&M student who failed 2 classes during second year and was dismissed. She had already remediated 1 of those 2 classes, so the whole process came as a shock to her. She told me that A&M doesn't have a high dismissal rate because the admins will encourage you to withdraw before you get dismissed. A fail and a successful remediation is still considered a fail at A&M for dismissal purposes.

There aren't many schools where students have the potential to get dismissed for marginally passing classes (70-73%) or will definitely be dismissed for failing Step 1 & Step 2CK more than once. A ~12.5% dismissal/withdrawal rate is also really high and is directly related to how the school is being run right now.
 
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I have spoken to five other M3s about this subject, and a huge issue we all faced was dealing with the really low quality teaching at this school.

Here are a few key issues:

1. A lot of professors skip relevant information that appears in First Aid / U World. At many other schools, they make it a point to cover all of the facts in at least one of these two sources, but that was not the case here. Without this information being covered, we were at a huge disadvantage when studying for Step 1 even after making high grades on class exams.

2. Simple concepts being complicated

3. Tons of contradictory information in the PowerPoints (clinical guidelines, drugs etc) - these contradictions would show up on exams, and we would comically have to guess which professor wrote the question in order to answer the question correctly

4. A lot of professors would emphasize the following information: clinical guidelines, specialty specific research, facts from Robbins or obscure theories that they found interesting. This kind of information rarely shows up outside of class exams.

Note: You can still do really well on Step 1 coming from A&M. An M3 I talked to scored well (between a 250-265 for the sake of anonymity), but he did many hours of Firecracker + USMLE RX questions + UWorld questions every day after he realized early on that A&M faculty weren't planning on covering a lot of the relevant information (as mentioned above).

Edit: I just downloaded a few lectures, and can send them to anybody who messages me. These professors are still teaching according to the Class of 2019 calendar.
 
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I wasn't planning on responding, but this is a misinformed statement. I know a former A&M student who failed 2 classes during second year and was dismissed. She had already remediated 1 of those 2 classes, so the whole process came as a shock to her. She told me that A&M doesn't have a high dismissal rate because the admins will encourage you to withdraw before you get dismissed. A fail and a successful remediation is still considered a fail at A&M for dismissal purposes.

There aren't many schools where students have the potential to get dismissed for marginally passing classes (70-73%) or will definitely be dismissed for failing Step 1 & Step 2CK more than once. A ~12.5% dismissal/withdrawal rate is also really high and is directly related to how the school is being run right now.

That's tough to hear, but I was quoting the handbook rules you posted previously, which stated failing 3 courses in 1st year, and 2 courses in 2nd year may result in having to repeat the year and/or dismissal. I also know of students who have failed twice and were NOT dismissed, so maybe it varies on a person-to-person basis. As for a successful remediation, I know that this results in a "P/F" on the transcript, and thus it is considered one of the fails as you said. But is this not reasonable? To fail 3 out of 7 courses in 1st year, or failing 2 of 5 core science blocks necessitating repeating the year (since most are NOT dismissed)? I'm not sure how reasonable it is to be allowed to fail over 50% of the curriculum. So I guess I'm having a hard time defending having to repeat the year for these reasons, or having to take step THREE times as "harsh." I can only speak for class of 2019, but we did not have "tons of contradictory info" in lectures nor on exams, but I'm sorry to hear that your class did. I have yet to believe any exam thus far has been unfair, and I think that shows as our class average for every single exam thus far has been good to VERY good. It's unfortunate that some of you haven't seemed to have the best experience, and that some have struggled, but again when the majority of the class is excelling, I'm not sure it's fair to point all the blame at the school for any (unfortunate) struggles. Regardless, I wish you all the best, and I'm glad you're here to share your honest thoughts with applicants, but keep in mind these above points before painting such a negative picture of your own school. (if you don't mean to, this is how it seems to come off, and I apologize for the misinterpretation).
 
That's tough to hear, but I was quoting the handbook rules you posted previously, which stated failing 3 courses in 1st year, and 2 courses in 2nd year may result in having to repeat the year and/or dismissal. I also know of students who have failed twice and were NOT dismissed, so maybe it varies on a person-to-person basis. As for a successful remediation, I know that this results in a "P/F" on the transcript, and thus it is considered one of the fails as you said. But is this not reasonable? To fail 3 out of 7 courses in 1st year, or failing 2 of 5 core science blocks necessitating repeating the year (since most are NOT dismissed)? I'm not sure how reasonable it is to be allowed to fail over 50% of the curriculum. So I guess I'm having a hard time defending having to repeat the year for these reasons, or having to take step THREE times as "harsh." I can only speak for class of 2019, but we did not have "tons of contradictory info" in lectures nor on exams, but I'm sorry to hear that your class did. I have yet to believe any exam thus far has been unfair, and I think that shows as our class average for every single exam thus far has been good to VERY good. It's unfortunate that some of you haven't seemed to have the best experience, and that some have struggled, but again when the majority of the class is excelling, I'm not sure it's fair to point all the blame at the school for any (unfortunate) struggles. Regardless, I wish you all the best, and I'm glad you're here to share your honest thoughts with applicants, but keep in mind these above points before painting such a negative picture of your own school. (if you don't mean to, this is how it seems to come off, and I apologize for the misinterpretation).

Let's agree to disagree. My main point is that a potential matriculant should check the policies and procedures at each school they are accepted to before they commit to a school. If you compare A&M to UTSA, you can see that A&M is more stringent in literally every single policy (penalization of marginal passes, probation policies, course failure policies, step retakes etc). My friend would have had a much better chance at becoming a doctor if she had chosen to go to UTSA, where there is zero possibility of dismissal after two course failures in a preclinical year.

There are definitely some positive points about A&M (affordable tuition, nice classmates, great clinical site locations and other things mentioned on this thread)

Personally, I like A&M, but I honestly care more that potential matriculants have the information to make the best possible choice for them considering they have worked really hard to get to this stage. IMO, A&M can very easily change its policies to make them more similar to other US MD schools and also find ways to improve its lecture quality.

Thank you osteo141 for sharing your thoughts and not personally attacking me. Best of luck to everyone making their choices!
 
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Hello current Texas A&M students! I just wanted to get your honest input on the issues presented above. I've been accepted to schools that I would have ranked higher than A&M, not because A&M is any less, I just saw myself fitting in better elsewhere. However, A&M gave me a full ride, and I wanted to know if the grievances presented above would merit a free medical education. Thanks so much y'all! I really value your input.
 
Hello current Texas A&M students! I just wanted to get your honest input on the issues presented above. I've been accepted to schools that I would have ranked higher than A&M, not because A&M is any less, I just saw myself fitting in better elsewhere. However, A&M gave me a full ride, and I wanted to know if the grievances presented above would merit a free medical education. Thanks so much y'all! I really value your input.

Not a current A&M student, but free ride or just tuition? TX school tuition is so cheap -- I'm not sure 80k is really worth turning down a school that you would prefer or is higher ranked, considering your future physician income.
 
Hello current Texas A&M students! I just wanted to get your honest input on the issues presented above. I've been accepted to schools that I would have ranked higher than A&M, not because A&M is any less, I just saw myself fitting in better elsewhere. However, A&M gave me a full ride, and I wanted to know if the grievances presented above would merit a free medical education. Thanks so much y'all! I really value your input.

+1 trying to make this decision


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Not a current A&M student, but free ride or just tuition? TX school tuition is so cheap -- I'm not sure 80k is really worth turning down a school that you would prefer or is higher ranked, considering your future physician income.

Thank you Skittsie13! It's actually a full ride. I also weigh the wisdom of the choice to not be in any debt at all, even major surplus at the end of my medical education. 120,000 plus accruing interest would not be immediately paid after medical school, considering the starting salaries of residents.

However, I also want to be knowledgeable of the education I will be getting, and how successful I can be in getting a good residency. And ultimately, if I will be making a good investment if I forego having a good financial start after medical school. 🙂
 
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Hello current Texas A&M students! I just wanted to get your honest input on the issues presented above. I've been accepted to schools that I would have ranked higher than A&M, not because A&M is any less, I just saw myself fitting in better elsewhere. However, A&M gave me a full ride, and I wanted to know if the grievances presented above would merit a free medical education. Thanks so much y'all! I really value your input.

As with anything, you get what you pay for. I was in your shoes not too long ago, and followed the money. Big mistake. As others have said, you shouldn't sell your future (physician) self and salary short because you are worried about what you'll have to pay back later. Paying out of pocket to attend a higher ranking school is nominal in the long run. In short, this is the reason why: It is easier for a school that knows it is not as highly ranked to offer scholarships, as it has less value to offer. You essentially add value to the school by accepting their scholarship offer because the thought is that you will increase the average step score and pedigree of medical student which will subsequently make their school more desirable. Here's the trade-off, if, and that's a big IF, you do score well on step 1 (which may be tough given that the education/lecturers/curriculum/program/resources are subpar at this school in comparison to a higher ranked school), you will still be a less competitive applicant for residency because of the school that you attended if it is a lower ranking school. Step score is one of the highest determinants in selection factors for residency, but the medical school you attended is a close runner-up. It's just like your application to medical school. Consider this, someone who went to Baylor (undergrad) and had a 3.6 will be held in higher regard than someone who went to UTD with a 4.0. This is just the reality of it.

I have received several messages asking which school I would have chosen if given the chance again. This is a very personal choice to make. My best advice, given what I know now is that the biggest thing to consider is where you will be in 4 years as a result of your decision. I know it may be difficult right now because all of the schools have put their best foot forward in attempting to appeal to your decision, but this should be given the least amount of weight. Instead you should research:
-How the curriculum is structured
-What resources will the school offer to prepare you for STEP and what is their history on STEP scores
-How is this school ranked and where do these students match
-Do students voice complaints about this school?
-Is there a high turnover in faculty or administration?
-What is the student to faculty ratio?
-Will I get the help I need?
-Do I want to be in a small town or a large and diverse city?
-How far away will I be from my support system?

All of this, among endless other factors. Just hoping to offer more solid direction in things to consider when making your decision. Feel free to pm me if you have questions you don't feel comfortable posting. Best of luck!
 
Thank you Skittsie13! It's actually a full ride. I also weigh the wisdom of the choice to not be in any debt at all, even major surplus at the end of my medical education. 120,000 plus accruing interest would not be immediately paid after medical school, considering the starting salaries of residents.

However, I also want to be knowledgeable of the education I will be getting, and how successful I can be in getting a good residency. And ultimately, if I will be making a good investment if I forego having a good financial start after medical school. 🙂

Yeah a full ride is different. That's amazing -- congrats! It's definitely a decision you'll have to weigh carefully.
 
One of my priorities for medical school is to stay close to my family and significant other. I absolutely love AM and the 1/3 program where I can come back to Dallas. Do you know if people who prematches/get accepted early have a good chance of getting into Dallas? Thanks for all the info you have given!

To answer this earlier question, they don't send out the campus ranking form until after match day, so as far as I'm aware, there's no preference given to those who pre match. Dallas and Houston are definitely the most sought-after campuses (at least for my year), so don't let that make or break your decision. We do get a chance to switch campuses during winter of M1, so you may get the one you wanted later if you don't get your first pick. Not sure what algorithm they use to assign campuses, but from what I've gathered, the more thought you put into your essays as to why you ranked the campuses the way you did, the better. They also seem to give more consideration to personal reasons (spouses, family, etc) as opposed to just saying you want to be at X hospital. My understanding is that you can do away rotations if you are wanting an experience not offered at your campus, but they are fairly comparable. The biggest difference between campuses is the AIM program for the BCS track, but I don't really know what that entails. Just make sure you put thought into the order of all your rankings when the time comes- I got my first choice, but plenty of people got their second or third picks (esp if they ranked Houston high).
 
To answer this earlier question, they don't send out the campus ranking form until after match day, so as far as I'm aware, there's no preference given to those who pre match. Dallas and Houston are definitely the most sought-after campuses (at least for my year), so don't let that make or break your decision. We do get a chance to switch campuses during winter of M1, so you may get the one you wanted later if you don't get your first pick. Not sure what algorithm they use to assign campuses, but from what I've gathered, the more thought you put into your essays as to why you ranked the campuses the way you did, the better. They also seem to give more consideration to personal reasons (spouses, family, etc) as opposed to just saying you want to be at X hospital. My understanding is that you can do away rotations if you are wanting an experience not offered at your campus, but they are fairly comparable. The biggest difference between campuses is the AIM program for the BCS track, but I don't really know what that entails. Just make sure you put thought into the order of all your rankings when the time comes- I got my first choice, but plenty of people got their second or third picks (esp if they ranked Houston high).

I think this was more so the case when the tracks were introduced. I wrote about family and my significant other and ended up with my third choice. No one knows for certain what goes into the selection process. I can say that the committee found that students were being "coached" to write personal reasons for their designations. If everyone all of a sudden has a spouse and/or family in the two most sought after tracks, they become obligated to assign for reasons beyond personal. It's not worth getting your file flagged, seriously. Just be honest. There is no "algorithm," so I wouldn't treat the process as such. Every track has its benefits. For example, it is known that BCS track students do a bit better on STEP because they are more interactive in applied knowledge through the AIM program, they also take STEP a little later than everyone else.
 
Ah, good to know about the STEP scores. Sorry if I was not clear, but I wasn't suggesting the OP fabricate or exaggerate reasons for wanting a certain campus- I had just spoken with classmates who thought they were only supposed to write about reasons directly related to medical school and wished they had spent more time thinking about what they wrote. You really can't go wrong with any of the tracks.
 
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I think this was more so the case when the tracks were introduced. I wrote about family and my significant other and ended up with my third choice. No one knows for certain what goes into the selection process. I can say that the committee found that students were being "coached" to write personal reasons for their designations. If everyone all of a sudden has a spouse and/or family in the two most sought after tracks, they become obligated to assign for reasons beyond personal. It's not worth getting your file flagged, seriously. Just be honest. There is no "algorithm," so I wouldn't treat the process as such. Every track has its benefits. For example, it is known that BCS track students do a bit better on STEP because they are more interactive in applied knowledge through the AIM program, they also take STEP a little later than everyone else.

Donnie, I'm not sure which class you're in at TAMCOM, but I am currently an M2 in the AIM program. We are taking STEP first (end of Feb/early March).
 
Here's the trade-off, if, and that's a big IF, you do score well on step 1 (which may be tough given that the education/lecturers/curriculum/program/resources are subpar at this school in comparison to a higher ranked school), you will still be a less competitive applicant for residency because of the school that you attended if it is a lower ranking school.

I appreciate you trying to add something to this discussion, but this is utter bull. If?? The STEP average for TAMCOM was above average this last year, and we had people scoring in the 270s. Education is subpar at this school? Where do you get off, and do you have the data to back these claims up? TAMCOM, like every school in TX, is LCME accredited: they have passed rigorous review to show that they provide a quality education. Additionally, several M4s this year matched to competitive residencies in varied fields. I don't know what issue you have with this school, but you are far too concerned with image and numbers. If that's all applicants are looking for, they may be sorely disappointed in their eventual choices: name brand does not make a successful education (Not to mention TAMCOM students are notorious for impressing during their away rotations).
 
At the beginning of my M2 year, we were told that the Class of 2017 scored above average (230+) on Step 1.

I later went to an A&M Step 1 presentation, and I found out that they had decided to exclude everybody who had delayed the exam from this average score (maybe around 30 students). If you actually include these students, the A&M Step 1 average for Class of 2017 dropped to below average (average score went down to the high 220s).

There were also 2-3 students who failed Step 1, and their scores were also not included in this average (either their initial score or their score on the retake)

I haven't been to any Step 1 presentations this year, so I don't know what is going on with Class of 2018 averages.
 
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I agree that attending a higher ranked school has it's advantages when applying to residency, but among the Texas schools... besides maybe Baylor and UTSW, do you really think a residency program director is going to be blown away that a student attended UT-H over Texas Tech, Dell, A&M, UTHSCSA, etc (or vice versa) assuming the students had identical resumes/class ranking/step scores, or vice versa? This can't be a serious claim. Because so many here are all about statistics and proof, then it is known that UTH (3rd highest "ranked" school in Texas) is #56, while A&M is #76. You honestly think a program director thinks THAT highly of one Texas school over another (again, maybe excluding UTSW and Baylor) when most are probably within 20 spots or so?? To demonstrate how insignificant this is, and to prove such a theory wrong, I highly advise any applicant to look at A&M's match list this year, where I believe 10 matched to derm, 8 to ortho, 2 to plastic surgery, etc all over the country. Besides attending one of the top ranked schools in the country, ranking may be helpful, but not nearly as much as people assume. More helpful, I believe, would be to compare schools based on resources, support, etc. At least among the Texas schools, where you end up will be almost completely dependent on how you do in class and on step, and not nearly as important on where you attended medical school. I hope everyone considers this before spending a very large amount of money to attend a school ranked 20 spots (or less) different, in comparison to other Texas schools. But hey, whichever school you feel the best fit, then I hope you end up there anyways 🙂

Hey @fresnomike, I agree with your post as it corroborates much of what I said. My comparisons did include Baylor. The 20 spots claim isn't really pertinent here because we're discussing residency within the context of Texas, as these are Texas medical schools. If we factor in OOS residencies and medical schools we are opening pandora's box. Tbh, I do believe it would make a difference because you must consider recognition. You can mention UTSW, Baylor, UTH, UTHSCSA outside of Texas and other professionals in medicine will have heard of these medical schools based on their research and innovations in medicine. I know I'll be crucified for saying this but, I've lost count of the number of times I get a response along the lines of, "I didn't know A&M had a medical school," when outside of Texas. So yes, brand is important. Dr. Ogden even spoke of his mission to increase marketability of A&M students for this reason in the 2015 Annual Report, but he has now stepped down so I'm not sure of the direction for future classes. I mentioned ranking as important, but it wasn't the first thing on the list I provided and that was a list of considerations for applicants to determine their "fit" at a school, it wasn't residency application specific. Rank is closer than one might imagine in terms of what's important on a residency application. It's actually in the top 10 according to a research article on this criteria that was published by doctors at UMN. It's also misleading to assume that future students will match similarly to this year's match or last year's match list, especially when considering that the trend academically has been a decline in exam score averages. The class of 2019 has lower exam averages than 2018, and 2020 has been lower than both. This can be confirmed by anyone in academic support services (they produce these reports internally). I'm sure the students are equally brilliant; however, this would indicate an obvious discourse somewhere. It's hard to say exactly where, but possibilities posed included disorganization, resources, etc. Which are things we both mentioned to consider for incoming students.
 
i feel like a very intense discussion is happening right now which I will read in a sec but.... i just got an Interview Invite today!!! So excited especially since I've been done for so long and thought I wasn't gonna be getting more invites
 
i feel like a very intense discussion is happening right now which I will read in a sec but.... i just got an Interview Invite today!!! So excited especially since I've been done for so long and thought I wasn't gonna be getting more invites

Congrats!! It must be a great feeling, I'm sure. Which campus did they invite you to, Temple or Bryan/College Station?
 
Hello current Texas A&M students! I just wanted to get your honest input on the issues presented above. I've been accepted to schools that I would have ranked higher than A&M, not because A&M is any less, I just saw myself fitting in better elsewhere. However, A&M gave me a full ride, and I wanted to know if the grievances presented above would merit a free medical education. Thanks so much y'all! I really value your input.
Lots of factors
what specialty do you plan on pursuing? (affects income 😀)
Do you want to do academic medicine or teach in the future?
Do you have any other sources of aid (parents, uncles, etc.) that could help alleviate some of the costs? maybe for a lower interest rate
Do you plan to be in private practice? (again also affects income)
Do you have a spouse or significant other that is okay with the debt?

IMO i would choose the higher ranked school or the one that you feel most comfortable at. BUT if your planning on doing FM or something less competitive, I would choose A&M
 
i feel like a very intense discussion is happening right now which I will read in a sec but.... i just got an Interview Invite today!!! So excited especially since I've been done for so long and thought I wasn't gonna be getting more invites
I would recommend not reading these posts so you have a better "perception" of A&M while interviewing. Read this after your interview 😀
 
Lots of factors
what specialty do you plan on pursuing? (affects income 😀)
Do you want to do academic medicine or teach in the future?
Do you have any other sources of aid (parents, uncles, etc.) that could help alleviate some of the costs? maybe for a lower interest rate
Do you plan to be in private practice? (again also affects income)
Do you have a spouse or significant other that is okay with the debt?

IMO i would choose the higher ranked school or the one that you feel most comfortable at. BUT if your planning on doing FM or something less competitive, I would choose A&M

Do you think that school name is important for a career in academic medicine?


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So I posted this in the San Antonio thread and hope it will help out people following this thread:

I have four friends who are current MS1s at A&M and two who are at San Antonio. We are all super close and I recently got to hang out with them and ask them about their respective schools. They all love their schools and believe they all have the resources to reach their goals. The one common theme they all agreed on is you're going to get out of your education what you put into it. Go where you feel you will belong most. In Texas, you will gain a great education and obtain a great residency as long as you work hard and take advantage of all the resources given to you.
 
Does anyone know if A&M will accept update letters after you have interviewed?
 
Does anyone know if A&M will accept update letters after you have interviewed?

Yes, they will accept them, but it typically carries more weight after match. If it is a letter of intent, I have heard of some anecdotal success, but can't confirm as I have no personal experience there.

All my friends going into academic medicine say it is. In TX, UTSW and Baylor seem to be the top choice for research

Not attempting to start another argument, but I have worked in academic medicine and have heard otherwise: residency and fellowship mean much more than medical school.
 
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Thank you all so very much for your constructive input! It has been very helpful and I highly valued hearing everyone's point of view. I will keep it all in mind when ranking my schools. Thank you SDN community and Happy Holidays!
 
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