2017-2018 Seton Hall - Hackensack Meridian

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So I submitted my primary on the 2nd/3rd day but didn’t submit my updates until a week or so later. Anyone know if that hurts chances? Maybe it’s just me being neurotic but I can’t imagine adcoms going back to an app and doing another holistic review on it after getting an update in. I feel like my app isn’t that great anymore since I’ve done so much since I submitted my primary and now all of that might not even be taken into consideration
 
Squeaks said:
All in all the interview day was very impressive! The building is brand new and still being set up, but they are putting in some impressive equipment from the simulation centers to the anatomy lab to the TBL rooms. The dean is a gem and really sells the school and the 3+1 program. Seems like HMH will really take care of their own for residencies, especially if you want to graduate in 3 and go straight to residency.

30% off inaugural class tuition is still on the table (roughly $17,000 off) and no, the class will not be filled with 30% Seton Hall undergrads. In the future, they are looking to implement that later on with their 4+3 program. Both interviews were very casual - variety of doctors (MD and DO), someone had a lawyer, and others. Hopefully will be hearing back in 2-3 weeks!
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Did they mention about what you would do if you decide to use the 4th year and not go straight into one of their residences?
 
Squeaks said:
All in all the interview day was very impressive! The building is brand new and still being set up, but they are putting in some impressive equipment from the simulation centers to the anatomy lab to the TBL rooms. The dean is a gem and really sells the school and the 3+1 program. Seems like HMH will really take care of their own for residencies, especially if you want to graduate in 3 and go straight to residency.

30% off inaugural class tuition is still on the table (roughly $17,000 off) and no, the class will not be filled with 30% Seton Hall undergrads. In the future, they are looking to implement that later on with their 4+3 program. Both interviews were very casual - variety of doctors (MD and DO), someone had a lawyer, and others. Hopefully will be hearing back in 2-3 weeks!
Click to expand...
Thank you for this! Really cleared up a lot.
Congrats on your interview, I hope you get good news!
 
medschoolzombie said:
So I submitted my primary on the 2nd/3rd day but didn’t submit my updates until a week or so later. Anyone know if that hurts chances? Maybe it’s just me being neurotic but I can’t imagine adcoms going back to an app and doing another holistic review on it after getting an update in. I feel like my app isn’t that great anymore since I’ve done so much since I submitted my primary and now all of that might not even be taken into consideration
Click to expand...

I doubt it hurts you too much, I didn't even submit an update and received an II so for all we know they're not taking them into consideration all that much. YMMV but I honestly don't think you should treat it as a bad sign, they were absolutely flooded with apps when it first opened so there is a fair chance they haven't even got to yours yet in which case the timing of the update wouldn't matter.
 
buckoh24 said:
Did they mention about what you would do if you decide to use the 4th year and not go straight into one of their residences?
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Well basically you would just participate in the regular match. Not sure if there would still be advantage for Seton Hall students in matching in the Hackensack network though.
 
Squeaks said:
All in all the interview day was very impressive! The building is brand new and still being set up, but they are putting in some impressive equipment from the simulation centers to the anatomy lab to the TBL rooms. The dean is a gem and really sells the school and the 3+1 program. Seems like HMH will really take care of their own for residencies, especially if you want to graduate in 3 and go straight to residency.

30% off inaugural class tuition is still on the table (roughly $17,000 off) and no, the class will not be filled with 30% Seton Hall undergrads. In the future, they are looking to implement that later on with their 4+3 program. Both interviews were very casual - variety of doctors (MD and DO), someone had a lawyer, and others. Hopefully will be hearing back in 2-3 weeks!
Click to expand...
what are your thoughts about the new medical school campus in Nutley not being close or convenient to the HUMC hospital? looks like it is a 25 minute drive and that the route has a pretty decent amount of traffic. also over an hour with multiple buses using public transportation. any clarification on this?
 
humblethinker said:
what are your thoughts about the new medical school campus in Nutley not being close or convenient to the HUMC hospital? looks like it is a 25 minute drive and that the route has a pretty decent amount of traffic. also over an hour with multiple buses using public transportation. any clarification on this?
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Hey! I grew up in Nutley and currently live in the town over. Nutley is a great place, but there is always a ton of congestion during the rush hours. HUMC Moutainside is relatively close, though. And while I think public transportation would be doable, personal auto would be the way to go.
 
BBenzoQuinone said:
I doubt it hurts you too much, I didn't even submit an update and received an II so for all we know they're not taking them into consideration all that much. YMMV but I honestly don't think you should treat it as a bad sign, they were absolutely flooded with apps when it first opened so there is a fair chance they haven't even got to yours yet in which case the timing of the update wouldn't matter.
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That's true. I guess if a lot of people submitted on the same day that would make more sense
 
Does anyone know how many interview spots they will be giving out/how many have already been given? LM 72, tri-state resident
 
Mistasunshine said:
Well basically you would just participate in the regular match. Not sure if there would still be advantage for Seton Hall students in matching in the Hackensack network though.
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Thanks. Did they say you can match into any field? I know some competitive fields like ortho/derm/ophtho/etc like to see a research year so wasnt sure if the direct tract is for all specialties or just the ones what arent extremely competitive.
 
buckoh24 said:
Thanks. Did they say you can match into any field? I know some competitive fields like ortho/derm/ophtho/etc like to see a research year so wasnt sure if the direct tract is for all specialties or just the ones what arent extremely competitive.
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I'm pretty sure this is what they were saying (correct me if I'm under the wrong impression @Squeaks): For the 3 years then directly to residency, you basically can only choose between the residencies available in the HMH network but you are still competing with all the match applicants. Of course there's more spots for less competitive specialities and vice versa, the slight advantage would be that the programs might be more familiar with us if we've rotated through there/they might be giving us special consideration because of the HMH partnership with Seton Hall. If you don't match directly in the HMH network after three years, you can take the 4th year and then apply for the general match.
 
buckoh24 said:
Thanks. Did they say you can match into any field? I know some competitive fields like ortho/derm/ophtho/etc like to see a research year so wasnt sure if the direct tract is for all specialties or just the ones what arent extremely competitive.
Click to expand...
Mistasunshine said:
I'm pretty sure this is what they were saying (correct me if I'm under the wrong impression @Squeaks): For the 3 years then directly to residency, you basically can only choose between the residencies available in the HMH network but you are still competing with all the match applicants. Of course there's more spots for less competitive specialities and vice versa, the slight advantage would be that the programs might be more familiar with us if we've rotated through there/they might be giving us special consideration because of the HMH partnership with Seton Hall. If you don't match directly in the HMH network after three years, you can take the 4th year and then apply for the general match.
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Yeah, that's what I got from interview day. And if you wanted to go into a field that requires research, that is what the 4th year is for. You can do a year of research, a global health initiative program, get a dual degree, etc. and then apply for the general match. They made it seem like their collaboration with HMH will definitely benefit your chances of matching if you want to stay in the area.
 
Mistasunshine said:
I'm pretty sure this is what they were saying (correct me if I'm under the wrong impression @Squeaks): For the 3 years then directly to residency, you basically can only choose between the residencies available in the HMH network but you are still competing with all the match applicants. Of course there's more spots for less competitive specialities and vice versa, the slight advantage would be that the programs might be more familiar with us if we've rotated through there/they might be giving us special consideration because of the HMH partnership with Seton Hall. If you don't match directly in the HMH network after three years, you can take the 4th year and then apply for the general match.
Click to expand...

In the three year track, is it just the regular match? Is it even realistic to attempt to match in the three year track if you're gunning for ortho/derm/PRS, especially since you are indeed competing against the the rest of the nation?

If it's the regular match, and you don't match the first time around, you're basically screwed. Your chances of matching as a reapplicant go way down.

At least for ortho, you need to do research and away rotations before you submit ERAS. Is there time to do these in a reasonable manner in the three year track? Away rotations are usually done during fourth year at other schools.
 
Did anyone miss the phone call for the II? If so, how long did it take for them to call you back after you left voicemail?
 
Squeaks said:
Yeah, that's what I got from interview day. And if you wanted to go into a field that requires research, that is what the 4th year is for. You can do a year of research, a global health initiative program, get a dual degree, etc. and then apply for the general match. They made it seem like their collaboration with HMH will definitely benefit your chances of matching if you want to stay in the area.
Click to expand...

That answers one of my questions. How will you be able to submit ERAS on time if you're in the middle of a research year? They usually submit ERAS around the middle of fourth year, if I remember correctly. Even if you do participate in the match in the middle of your research year, you'll still be at a disadvantage compared to other applicants that took a full research year between M2/M3 or M3/M4. They'll likely have publications by this time.

EDIT: The other option is to wait until you finish fourth year (the research year in this case) and delay graduation in order to get your app out with the pubs.
 
Fracture said:
In the three year track, is it just the regular match? Is it even realistic to attempt to match in the three year track if you're gunning for ortho/derm/PRS, especially since you indeed are competing against the the rest of the nation?

If it's the regular match, and you don't match the first time around, you're basically screwed. Your chances of matching as a reapplicant go way down.

At least for ortho, you need to do research and away rotations before you submit ERAS. Is there time to do these in a reasonable manner in the three year track? Away rotations are usually done during fourth year at other schools.
Click to expand...
I feel like there would be another 'program/app' that helps with matching in the network. I don't know if residencies have similar IS/OOS biases like med schools do but there would probably be one.

If you don't match the first time, then you take the 4th year and try again. It's kinda like a fail safe the way I see it. You either get to match early or on time with a back up year in place to improve your app.

I don't know how they would do aways. It could be incorporated into the end of 3rd year I guess, but it makes me think that they wouldn't use just ERAS or they would have an obvious preference for their own students.
 
Fracture said:
That answers one of my questions. How will you be able to submit ERAS on time if you're in the middle of a research year? They usually submit ERAS around the middle of fourth year, if I remember correctly. Even if you do participate in the match in the middle of your research year, you'll still be at a disadvantage compared to other applicants that took a full research year between M2/M3 or M3/M4. They'll likely have publications by this time.
Click to expand...
Not 100% sure, but they did say the there is a possibility to move around the curriculum if you need to do research earlier. The three year track is not the regular match, you can only apply for residencies through the HMH network. However, if you want to utilize your 4th year, then you go through the regular match. That's what I understood. Maybe tomorrow's interview group can get more clarification?
 
Fracture said:
That answers one of my questions. How will you be able to submit ERAS on time if you're in the middle of a research year? They usually submit ERAS around the middle of fourth year, if I remember correctly. Even if you do participate in the match in the middle of your research year, you'll still be at a disadvantage compared to other applicants that took a full research year between M2/M3 or M3/M4. They'll likely have publications by this time.

EDIT: The other option is to wait until you finish fourth year (the research year in this case) and delay graduation in order to get your app out with the pubs.
Click to expand...
Usually you submit it by late summer if I'm not mistaken and interviews happen in the fall/next spring so it sounds like any improvements you end up making your last year would have to be added as updates to all the places you applied. It sounds like you'd have to have a solid app before you take a 4th year or be willing to wait an extra year to enter the match. It could also be set up that way to encourage students to match into their own residencies
 
medschoolzombie said:
I feel like there would be another 'program/app' that helps with matching in the network. I don't know if residencies have similar IS/OOS biases like med schools do but there would probably be one.

If you don't match the first time, then you take the 4th year and try again. It's kinda like a fail safe the way I see it. You either get to match early or on time with a back up year in place to improve your app.

I don't know how they would do aways. It could be incorporated into the end of 3rd year I guess, but it makes me think that they wouldn't use just ERAS or they would have an obvious preference for their own students.
Click to expand...

Yeah, hopefully they do have a special kind of match within the network. Hopefully it won't count against you if you don't match the first time around. Yeah, you would probably do it during the "Advanced Clinical Rotations" part of third year. Hopefully there's enough time to fit in 2-3 aways. I say that because schools often have mandatory EM/ICU rotations during that time.
 
Did they mention what kind of students they're aiming to have for their first class at interview day? (stats -gpa/mcat, IS/OOS)
 
Fracture said:
In the three year track, is it just the regular match? Is it even realistic to attempt to match in the three year track if you're gunning for ortho/derm/PRS, especially since you are indeed competing against the the rest of the nation?

If it's the regular match, and you don't match the first time around, you're basically screwed. Your chances of matching as a reapplicant go way down.

At least for ortho, you need to do research and away rotations before you submit ERAS. Is there time to do these in a reasonable manner in the three year track? Away rotations are usually done during fourth year at other schools.
Click to expand...
They said that it's going to be like a "pre-match" where you can only rank programs in the HMH network. Definitely seems more realistic for less competitive specialties. Also, the 1.5 year pre-clinical is going to be a grind where it'll be hard to pursue outside things like research.
 
Squeaks said:
Not 100% sure, but they did say the there is a possibility to move around the curriculum if you need to do research earlier. The three year track is not the regular match, you can only apply for residencies through the HMH network. However, if you want to utilize your 4th year, then you go through the regular match. That's what I understood. Maybe tomorrow's interview group can get more clarification?
Click to expand...

That's good to hear. That way you can make your personal curriculum Duke/Vanderbilt like. Thanks for the clarification.
 
Mistasunshine said:
They said that it's going to be like a "pre-match" where you can only rank programs in the HMH network. Definitely seems more realistic for less competitive specialties. Also, the 1.5 year pre-clinical is going to be a grind where it'll be hard to pursue outside things like research.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it totally seems more realistic for less competitive ones. I'm looking at the curriculum page; isn't it like 1.25 or something? Also, I'm currently in an SMP, so my situation is a bit different from most.
 
medschoolzombie said:
Usually you submit it by late summer if I'm not mistaken and interviews happen in the fall/next spring so it sounds like any improvements you end up making your last year would have to be added as updates to all the places you applied. It sounds like you'd have to have a solid app before you take a 4th year or be willing to wait an extra year to enter the match. It could also be set up that way to encourage students to match into their own residencies
Click to expand...

Yeah, you're right. I remember that interviews for ortho are typically in the fall. What you said makes a lot of sense. Thanks.
 
Fracture said:
Yeah, it totally seems more realistic for less competitive ones. I'm looking at the curriculum page; isn't it like 1.25 or something? Also, I'm currently in an SMP, so my situation is a bit different from most.
Click to expand...
Ya it looks like pre-clinical ends around september.
 
Fracture said:
Yeah, you're right. I remember that interviews for ortho are typically in the fall. What you said makes a lot of sense. Thanks.
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🙂

I wonder what they'll do if you want to apply to optho or the other specialty that has an earlier cycle than the rest?
 
medschoolzombie said:
🙂

I wonder what they'll do if you want to apply to optho or the other specialty that has an earlier cycle than the rest?
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Yeah, uro is the other one. I have no idea how that's going to work out, lol.
 
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It looks like if you want to be the best applicant you can be, you're going to have to take a research year (and pick the four year curriculum), because it will be pretty hard to churn out a solid amount of pubs and balance studying, especially since there's no summer break. Doing research during rotations will probably be a nonstarter unless you're on a chill rotation or something.

That said, it looks like going through the pre-match can't necessarily hurt. It could indeed work out. That's if you don't have an out of area preference. You'll save a year (time and tuition).
 
I'm continuing to speculate here: if you were trying to match ortho in the three year track, your step scores would probably have to be astronomical and/or your sub-i and away letters would have to be "best rotator I've seen in the last 10 years" level. Or you would need someone to go to bat for you by making a phone call.
 
Fracture said:
I'm continuing to speculate here: if you were trying to match ortho in the three year track, your step scores would probably have to be astronomical and/or your sub-i and away letters would have to be "best rotator I've seen in the last 10 years" level. Or you would need someone to go to bat for you by making a phone call.
Click to expand...

From what I gather, the school seems keen on breaking the divide between undergraduate medical education and GME in their network; that is what the three year track is intended to do. The point is that you wouldn't necessarily have to worry about someone going to bat for you because you would have already worked as part of a team with the attendings/other residents in the specialty within the HMH network you plan on going into either as a sub-i or on rotations. They had a list of the specialties that they read off and plan on adding more as time goes on. They are interested in training very good clinicians such that you'll be prepared to function as a resident in three years no matter what.
 
sounds like a lot of moving parts to make this happen in three years...especially for a brand new program
 
itsadisastah said:
From what I gather, the school seems keen on breaking the divide between undergraduate medical education and GME in their network; that is what the three year track is intended to do. The point is that you wouldn't necessarily have to worry about someone going to bat for you because you would have already worked as part of a team with the attendings/other residents in the specialty within the HMH network you plan on going into either as a sub-i or on rotations. They had a list of the specialties that they read off and plan on adding more as time goes on. They are interested in training very good clinicians such that you'll be prepared to function as a resident in three years no matter what.
Click to expand...
As someone who has an eye an a not particularly competitive specialty and would love to stay in northern NJ (OOS, but personal/familial connections in the area), this is pretty much a dream. If only they would give me an II. 😉
 
itsadisastah said:
From what I gather, the school seems keen on breaking the divide between undergraduate medical education and GME in their network; that is what the three year track is intended to do. The point is that you wouldn't necessarily have to worry about someone going to bat for you because you would have already worked as part of a team with the attendings/other residents in the specialty within the HMH network you plan on going into either as a sub-i or on rotations. They had a list of the specialties that they read off and plan on adding more as time goes on. They are interested in training very good clinicians such that you'll be prepared to function as a resident in three years no matter what.
Click to expand...

That's awesome. It's pretty unique too. That coincides greatly with one of my goals: to be an excellent clinician. Hopefully it actually comes to fruition.
 
I tried to call back and left a voicemail? Should I email instead?
 
Sorry if this has been addressed but Im not going through 15 pages.
I understand they will not be in the MSAR with real acceptance stats until next year but once they have a class I imagine they will put their class profile up on their own site. Any ideas on when they'll have decided on acceptances and finalize stats?
 
Detective SnowBucket said:
Sorry if this has been addressed but Im not going through 15 pages.
I understand they will not be in the MSAR with real acceptance stats until next year but once they have a class I imagine they will put their class profile up on their own site. Any ideas on when they'll have decided on acceptances and finalize stats?
Click to expand...

June 7th is the last interview date. July 9th is first day of classes. I am going to say around June 30th, all should be finalized.
 
Fracture said:
It looks like if you want to be the best applicant you can be, you're going to have to take a research year (and pick the four year curriculum), because it will be pretty hard to churn out a solid amount of pubs and balance studying, especially since there's no summer break. Doing research during rotations will probably be a nonstarter unless you're on a chill rotation or something.

That said, it looks like going through the pre-match can't necessarily hurt. It could indeed work out. That's if you don't have an out of area preference. You'll save a year (time and tuition).
Click to expand...

Fracture said:
I'm continuing to speculate here: if you were trying to match ortho in the three year track, your step scores would probably have to be astronomical and/or your sub-i and away letters would have to be "best rotator I've seen in the last 10 years" level. Or you would need someone to go to bat for you by making a phone call.
Click to expand...

Oh wait, there's a 2 week summer break. I guess we'll have to work 15-20 hrs a day then to do enough research for a pub lol. I don't think research during rotations will be that feasible especially if they have shelf exams. If you're trying to match ortho in 3 years, it would be in the same place you rotated in and with the same preceptors you worked with thus you could just get in by reccomendation of one of the orthos that already works there. There would be a hell of a big influence from LORs then in that case.

My question is, when do you even find out about the pre-match? If you have to apply at the end of 3rd year, that means you're on par with everyone else you entered with across the nation. You don't take step 2 until almost May of 3rd year. Maybe they'll fast track it? Or maybe we would apply the end of 2nd year which makes no sense to me but who knows
 
Venusian said:
June 7th is the last interview date. July 9th is first day of classes. I am going to say around June 30th, all should be finalized.
Click to expand...
Wait, you're telling me that there are people who could interview....then start class. Two. Days. Later.
 
Detective SnowBucket said:
Wait, you're telling me that there are people who could interview....then start class. Two. Days. Later.
Click to expand...
Wait, you're telling me that June 7th is. Two. Days. Before. July 9th?

Edit: someone beat me to it. Anyways, bad observational skills Detective SnowBucket. JK.
 
Doing a 4th year isnt a research year. I do not know why you guys keep calling it that. The 4th generally has rotations and sub-I's that students go through. A "research year" is a 5th medical school year where you literally just do research.
 
medschoolzombie said:
Oh wait, there's a 2 week summer break. I guess we'll have to work 15-20 hrs a day then to do enough research for a pub lol. I don't think research during rotations will be that feasible especially if they have shelf exams. If you're trying to match ortho in 3 years, it would be in the same place you rotated in and with the same preceptors you worked with thus you could just get in by reccomendation of one of the orthos that already works there. There would be a hell of a big influence from LORs then in that case.

My question is, when do you even find out about the pre-match? If you have to apply at the end of 3rd year, that means you're on par with everyone else you entered with across the nation. You don't take step 2 until almost May of 3rd year. Maybe they'll fast track it? Or maybe we would apply the end of 2nd year which makes no sense to me but who knows
Click to expand...

Yeah, it would be impossible to publish in two weeks, as far as I know.

Yeah, I 100% don't plan on doing research during rotations. There just isn't enough time, for the most part.

I agree with you about the letters.

Yeah, I'm really not sure how the pre-match process will go. Hopefully they work it out in a way that makes sense.
 
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