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[Capture.the.dr3am]

Probably somebody in the financial aid office getting annoyed by all the emails and trippin’. Hoping CHM admins will come to our rescue! 🙏🏻

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[lanadelgay124]

Probably somebody in the financial aid office getting annoyed by all the emails and trippin’. Hoping CHM admins will come to our rescue! 🙏🏻

You know they just received 100+ emails asking the same question

 

[kwsx1]

Welp. This is absolutely ridiculous

 

[kwsx1]

Lol the financial aid dept here is a joke. I can't deal but will have to

Edit: for those waiting on WL, seems like they've accepted up to their full class size as the email has ~215 students on it.

 

[lanadelgay124]

Lol the financial aid dept here is a joke. I can't deal but will have to

Edit: for those waiting on WL, seems like they've accepted up to their full class size as the email has ~215 students on it.

Is it just me, or is the first year here obscenely expensive for IS? It's almost equivalent to OOS tuition elsewhere.

Edit: I realize there's a summer semester tacked on

 

[kwsx1]

Is it just me, or is the first year here obscenely expensive for IS? It's almost equivalent to OOS tuition elsewhere.

Edit: I realize there's a summer semester tacked on

Yeah 1st and 3rd year run into the summer if I'm not mistaken so we are technically charged with 3 semesters. Oh the joys of medical school

 

[Quil98]

Given that there are reportedly 215 accepted students currently, What is the likelihood of 25+ students withdrawing from MSU for them to start pulling from the waitlist? and how deep will it go if they do cross the threshold is what I can't put together in my head.

 

[viralhiker]

Given that there are reportedly 215 accepted students currently, What is the likelihood of 25+ students withdrawing from MSU for them to start pulling from the waitlist? and how deep will it go if they do cross the threshold is what I can't put together in my head.

You’ve got one person about to withdraw here. Idk how they can advertise themselves being a cheap instate option (which I always thought they were) with a $74k COA. Private school I’m accepted to is nearly the same cost.

 

[Med_For_Life]

You’ve got one person about to withdraw here. Idk how they can advertise themselves being a cheap instate option (which I always thought they were) with a $74k COA. Private school I’m accepted to is nearly the same cost.

What are the tuition rates?

 

[lanadelgay124]

You’ve got one person about to withdraw here. Idk how they can advertise themselves being a cheap instate option (which I always thought they were) with a $74k COA. Private school I’m accepted to is nearly the same cost.

This is where I'm at, especially looking at an OOS public option in a state that grants IS residency after a year. Pretty sure that would end up being the better financial option.

 

[kwsx1]

What are the tuition rates?

Wish I had a choice.

 

[Med_For_Life]

Wish I had a choice.
View attachment 335287

They don't communicate well about the fact that they have two summer semesters - it makes MSU CHM about the same as the other schools in Mich

 

[Lookapteradactyl]

Can someone explain to me where the $74k is shown? Was this something emailed to those of you who have been accepted? Because i havent seen these numbers anywhere and it's making me reconsider waiting on my only IS prospect vs committing to an out of state school with similar costs...

 

[lanadelgay124]

Can someone explain to me where the $74k is shown? Was this something emailed to those of you who have been accepted? Because i havent seen these numbers anywhere and it's making me reconsider waiting on my only IS prospect vs committing to an out of state school with similar costs...

Yes, it was emailed to us (I think just accepted students?) after we were told that our individualized financial aid packets wouldn't be available until late May. I knew going in that there were three semesters to at least one of the years, but wasn't aware that it cost quite that much.

 

[golfnerd]

You’ve got one person about to withdraw here. Idk how they can advertise themselves being a cheap instate option (which I always thought they were) with a $74k COA. Private school I’m accepted to is nearly the same cost.

+1, planning on withdrawing very soon since Wayne gave me some aid

 

[Lookapteradactyl]

Yes, it was emailed to us (I think just accepted students?) after we were told that our individualized financial aid packets wouldn't be available until late May. I knew going in that there were three semesters to at least one of the years, but wasn't aware that it cost quite that much.

Thanks for the reply. Wow, I wish this had been more transparent sooner!!!

 

[zen-yatta5]

This is kind of a rant and topics in this post are scattered... but bear with me


I agree that tuition is expensive and MSU staff aren’t providing a clear picture for us as potential students

However for those like me who don’t really have another option (aside from DO schools and waiting to hear back from 1 other MD program) and are OOS, we have to consider this as an investment. I’m poor and based on my estimation, I will take out about 450k in the end.
the loan amount/ $$$ is bullshhhh but it’s what we got ourselves into :/
“It’s better to grab life by the balls then let life grab you by the balls”

For those with acceptances to other programs that are less expensive, I would def compare the programs side by side.
Consider the cost of living expenses, social support, location, match list, research opportunities, curriculum and overall resources/help that the school provides


Current medical students at MSU I spoke with generally fell into two categories:
1) OOS with MSU being the only MD program they got into
2) IS with mult offers but chose to save money on tuition (I guess every other school in Michigan aside from UM is more expensive)

now about MSU:
It does seem like faculty are supportive at MSU. Small groups/learning societies is a plus if you want to socialize and/or find study buddies. Self study is necessary with this curriculum and some find flipped classrooms annoying. I argue that you have to learn how to study at any institution outside of the lectures and some even find lectures useless. Discussions in the flipped classroom can solidify your knowledge if done appropriately. The faculty claim there are no tests. instead tests are replaced with assessments. Might be BS imo but they are able to track your progress on the just in time website. 25 hrs max of inperson activities isn’t much of a time constraint. Working as a medical assistant in your first year may suck for some but can be rewarding for others. research seems lacking in terms of clinical/translational aspect, may be tough to publish. Based on google search, a few Students from MSU have historically done a Research year between 3rd- 4th year (whether it’s through NIH or outside institution). Match here is mainly into primary care specialities but this isn’t a surprise as it aligns with their mission. I am a firm believer in working hard to attain your goals (meritocracy). If you want to match into ENT, plastics, neurosurg or CT, then put in the work and make sure you are doing research, presenting at national conferences, do away rotations, etc... you know it takes max effort as you are in competition with other students for some coveted residency spots. MSU isn’t going to stop you from attaining your goals. (Although MSU may not help you all that much either. other programs intentionally help students with checking off the boxes). Plenty of volunteer opportunities that can be gratifying. must complete 40 (or 80?) hours of service to graduate. I was placed in Grand Rapids so I’m excited about the city but EL does not seem fun. Coming from SoCal, I have lowered my expectations but I’m still hoping for quality food and fun bars!

in conclusion, work your a** off, find mentors/friends that will support and guide you, remember that you are choosing this difficult path, live life everyday like it’s your last and I promise you’ll be more fulfilled.

thank you for reading this all the way through. If I meet any of y’all in person, I’ll tell you my username and hopefully we can be friends irl

Love,
zen-yatta5

 

[RandomScientist]

I’m a little surprised about some of the reactions to the cost of attendance. Feel free to check my math: As a comparison for in-state students, over the course of 4 years, MSUCHM is about 40k more expensive than Wayne State (the cheapest in state school), but 12k cheaper than UofM. However, Wayne estimates an $1800/month allocation for living expenses, while MSUCHM allocates $2200. That’s about $20k over 4 years, which really brings MSU closer to only $20k more expensive than Wayne if one holds the same living standards. Nobody is going to force you to borrow the full amount if you don’t need it, so if you can get by on $1800 or even $1500 a month, you don’t HAVE to borrow the equivalent of $2200 a month.

I know that $20k (or 40k) is no small amount of money, but in my opinion, it’s worth it to go to a school I really like. GR is awesome, and so is EL. It’s not like MSUCHM is wildly more expensive than the other schools in Michigan, and I’m honestly really surprised people have out of state costs of attendance that are even comparable to in-state COA, unless the cost of living is insanely cheap.

 

[lanadelgay124]

I’m honestly really surprised people have out of state costs of attendance that are even comparable to in-state COA, unless the cost of living is insanely cheap.

I fully agree with most of your post, but did want to give some perspective. For those with OOS acceptances to states that offer IS residency/tuition after one year (e.g., Ohio), the 3-semester M1 at MSU comes out to the same price as OOS tuition for M1 elsewhere (~ $75k). GR is a fantastic place to live (I am sure EL is also, but I'm from the GR area and can vouch for that), but rent is relatively high there for the midwest.

100% agree that the price is worth it for a school you really like, and I agree that MSU is a great option. For all the talk about people matching mostly into primary care, everyone I know who has graduated from here has specialized. Self-selection is a real thing.

 

[lanadelgay124]

in conclusion, work your a** off, find mentors/friends that will support and guide you, remember that you are choosing this difficult path, live life everyday like it’s your last and I promise you’ll be more fulfilled.

thank you for reading this all the way through. If I meet any of y’all in person, I’ll tell you my username and hopefully we can be friends irl

Love,
zen-yatta5

I love this.

I think it's interesting that if we all end up here, we'll be walking amongst each other potentially never knowing each other's SDN usernames

 

[Capture.the.dr3am]

To the people withdrawing: sorry to see you go, but best of luck with all your future endeavors as you keep achieving your dreams! Also, please let us know your campus assignment so us GR waitlist-ers can feel like we have a chance.

 

[golfnerd]

To the people withdrawing: sorry to see you go, but best of luck with all your future endeavors as you keep achieving your dreams! Also, please let us know your campus assignment so us GR waitlist-ers can feel like we have a chance.

I’m gonna get around to withdrawing soon and I’m placed at the GR campus

 

[Blue Lion]

Catching up on this thread, and congrats to those that got off the alternate list! But man, I only just submitted my letter of intent recently, I hope I’m not too late...

Would’ve submitted it earlier but I had a lot of family troubles in March :/

Y'all don't think I submitted too late, right? For the record, I didn't interview until end of February.

Also, I thought alternate list wasn’t supposed to start until April 30th?

 

[Lookapteradactyl]

Catching up on this thread, and congrats to those that got off the alternate list! But man, I only just submitted my letter of intent recently, I hope I’m not too late...

Would’ve submitted it earlier but I had a lot of family troubles in March :/

I thought alternate list wasn’t supposed to start until April 30th?

That's what I thought too....

 

[DemNeurons]

Graduating M4 here, nom-primary care. Happy to answer questions.

it’s funny seeing everyone discuss cost. We bitch and moan about the cost all the time and get the run around that it’s no different than other schools. CHM is the most expensive public medical school in the country. I am graduating with ~260-270k debt taking out their recommended offerings. That’s not horribly different from Elsewhere but it’s still higher.

 

[kwsx1]

Graduating M4 here, nom-primary care. Happy to answer questions.

it’s funny seeing everyone discuss cost. We bitch and moan about the cost all the time and get the run around that it’s no different than other schools. CHM is the most expensive public medical school in the country. I am graduating with ~260-270k debt taking out their recommended offerings. That’s not horribly different from Elsewhere but it’s still higher.

I'm out here just complaining cause I think med school costs are generally obscene and I wish there was at least some aid for everyone everywhere. I love MSU and am very happy to be going here! But I will continue to complain about cost forever

 

[zen-yatta5]

I'm out here just complaining cause I think med school costs are generally obscene and I wish there was at least some aid for everyone everywhere. I love MSU and am very happy to be going here! But I will continue to complain about cost forever

+1!!
My rant earlier about cost applies to any program!

 

[medelsh]

I will be withdrawing my A since I have an A at a school that has sent me my financial aid package already. I am oos and had GR campus placement

 

[Blue Lion]

Man, I really hope they get to read my letter of intent before the next round of alternate list considerations T_T

How has everyone else been feeling?

 

[premed3i]

Man, I really hope they get to read my letter of intent before the next round of alternate list considerations T_T

How has everyone else been feeling?

Pretty bad not gonna lie, based on what accepted students are saying and based on what I heard about waitlist movement in the past, I'm taking this WL as a R unless I get the call. I'm not getting my hopes up

 

[Blue Lion]

Pretty bad not gonna lie, based on what accepted students are saying and based on what I heard about waitlist movement in the past, I'm taking this WL as a R unless I get the call. I'm not getting my hopes up

Don't lose hope! We have three people in the past day alone from just this site who are withdrawing their acceptances. I imagine (and anyone can feel free to correct me), but the whole "215 accepted students" remark is only in regards to what's going on currently, these next nine days (and possibly onward) still leave plenty of room for other people to leave.

Just be sure to get your updates in as soon as possible, and hang tight! We still have a chance

 

[premed3i]

Don't lose hope! We have three people in the past day alone from just this site who are withdrawing their acceptances. I imagine (and anyone can feel free to correct me), but the whole "215 accepted students" remark is only in regards to what's going on currently, these next nine days (and possibly onward) still leave plenty of room for other people to leave.

Just be sure to get your updates in as soon as possible, and hang tight! We still have a chance

You’re right, it’s hard but I’m trying to keep my head up like we all should. Currently on 6 waitlists so one has to work out right haha

 

[Arthur Morgan]

Will be withdrawing my A from here. Picked Lansing as my campus. Hope it goes to one of you!

 

[Blue Lion]

Will be withdrawing my A from here. Picked Lansing as my campus. Hope it goes to one of you!

I will be withdrawing my A since I have an A at a school that has sent me my financial aid package already. I am oos and had GR campus placement

I’m gonna get around to withdrawing soon and I’m placed at the GR campus

+1, planning on withdrawing very soon since Wayne gave me some aid

You’ve got one person about to withdraw here. Idk how they can advertise themselves being a cheap instate option (which I always thought they were) with a $74k COA. Private school I’m accepted to is nearly the same cost.

Just want to say to y'all, as someone on the WL, that I wish you all the best of luck wherever you go, and that you are all going to be such amazing physicians.

 

[lanadelgay124]

Is there anyone else here who is trying to decide between CHM and a school with a more traditional curriculum? My biggest resistance to PTE-ing here is feeling wary about the flipped classroom/PBL/TBL learning method.

 

[Lookapteradactyl]

Is there anyone else here who is trying to decide between CHM and a school with a more traditional curriculum? My biggest resistance to PTE-ing here is feeling wary about the flipped classroom/PBL/TBL learning method.

My friend who started there last year said just expect to have immense self discipline for self study. Idk how accurate this is, but she said it was an adjustment for her.

 

[Sfts_88]

Is there anyone else here who is trying to decide between CHM and a school with a more traditional curriculum? My biggest resistance to PTE-ing here is feeling wary about the flipped classroom/PBL/TBL learning method.

Most of my friends say med school is really about self studying anyways, so I’m personally not too worried. But agreed, it does require a lot of self discipline so just depends on whether you think you need more structure or not!

 

[mskimchiwannabe]

Most of my friends say med school is really about self studying anyways, so I’m personally not too worried. But agreed, it does require a lot of self discipline so just depends on whether you think you need more structure or not!

Welp. I am someone who DEFINITELY needs structure and struggles with self learning. And sadly, I don't have the luxury of picking a school that fits my needs..

But! I am very grateful for my one acceptance and know that this is something I need and want to improve upon!

If any CHM-ers have advice on transitioning to PBL after only thriving on traditional organizational education, pleaaase hmu 🙏🙏

 

[Capture.the.dr3am]

Welp. I am someone who DEFINITELY needs structure and struggles with self learning. And sadly, I don't have the luxury of picking a school that fits my needs..

But! I am very grateful for my one acceptance and know that this is something I need and want to improve upon!

If any CHM-ers have advice on transitioning to PBL after only thriving on traditional organizational education, pleaaase hmu 🙏🙏

Same! Let’s keep each other accountable! Also, I think it helps to physically write out your goals and have that constant reminder of what you are working towards and why. I feel like being in a clinical setting starting in the first year will also be a great reminder and motivator.

 

[DemNeurons]

For what it’s worth, I could never go back to a traditional lecture style curriculum. Flipped classroom, when applied correctly, truly is the best way to learn. It took a year of it prior to getting into intersessions with traditional classroom style and everyone hated it. You realize how inefficient some dude at a podium reading off slides is. You can learn twice the material in half the time on your own using resources from professors that actually want to teach and are good at it vs. the tired and old faculty member who’s done it for 30 years and can’t wait to be done and go home.

Like everyone says though, you have to be diligent on your own. In order to learn , you have to build a solid foundation to build upon. In my opinion, this is the downside of CHM. With the c3 style you start building only part of a complete foundation before building the 1st/2nd floors so it can seem like patchwork and like your missing some things from time to time. Granted you do go back through the years but it’s still on you to make sure you’re covering the bases you need. If you set out a structure - for example an excel spreadsheet of all the boards and beyond topics. You can scratch off videos on your list as you. Basically, you need some way to keep yourself accountable. If you are good at that, there’s no better curriculum that the SDC because it truly offers you the time and flexibility to target your weakness when you need to. Every program will have hoops, BS, and busy work. Yes the SDC has a lot of that...but the freedom is excellent. Anyways - I’m meandering. Happy to follow up if there’s specific questions.

 

[sleepytimes]

Just withdrew my application, good luck to the folks on the WL!

 

[lanadelgay124]

For what it’s worth, I could never go back to a traditional lecture style curriculum. Flipped classroom, when applied correctly, truly is the best way to learn. It took a year of it prior to getting into intersessions with traditional classroom style and everyone hated it. You realize how inefficient some dude at a podium reading off slides is. You can learn twice the material in half the time on your own using resources from professors that actually want to teach and are good at it vs. the tired and old faculty member who’s done it for 30 years and can’t wait to be done and go home.

Like everyone says though, you have to be diligent on your own. In order to learn , you have to build a solid foundation to build upon. In my opinion, this is the downside of CHM. With the c3 style you start building only part of a complete foundation before building the 1st/2nd floors so it can seem like patchwork and like your missing some things from time to time. Granted you do go back through the years but it’s still on you to make sure you’re covering the bases you need. If you set out a structure - for example an excel spreadsheet of all the boards and beyond topics. You can scratch off videos on your list as you. Basically, you need some way to keep yourself accountable. If you are good at that, there’s no better curriculum that the SDC because it truly offers you the time and flexibility to target your weakness when you need to. Every program will have hoops, BS, and busy work. Yes the SDC has a lot of that...but the freedom is excellent. Anyways - I’m meandering. Happy to follow up if there’s specific questions.

I appreciate your taking the time to write this out; it eases quite a few of my concerns with the curriculum. How many hours on average of required attendance time would you say you log every week (e.g., TBL, PBL, simulation labs, clinical time)? Do you feel this leaves ample opportunity for you to self-study as much as is necessary, and participate in research/EC's?

 

[zen-yatta5]

For what it’s worth, I could never go back to a traditional lecture style curriculum. Flipped classroom, when applied correctly, truly is the best way to learn. It took a year of it prior to getting into intersessions with traditional classroom style and everyone hated it. You realize how inefficient some dude at a podium reading off slides is. You can learn twice the material in half the time on your own using resources from professors that actually want to teach and are good at it vs. the tired and old faculty member who’s done it for 30 years and can’t wait to be done and go home.

Like everyone says though, you have to be diligent on your own. In order to learn , you have to build a solid foundation to build upon. In my opinion, this is the downside of CHM. With the c3 style you start building only part of a complete foundation before building the 1st/2nd floors so it can seem like patchwork and like your missing some things from time to time. Granted you do go back through the years but it’s still on you to make sure you’re covering the bases you need. If you set out a structure - for example an excel spreadsheet of all the boards and beyond topics. You can scratch off videos on your list as you. Basically, you need some way to keep yourself accountable. If you are good at that, there’s no better curriculum that the SDC because it truly offers you the time and flexibility to target your weakness when you need to. Every program will have hoops, BS, and busy work. Yes the SDC has a lot of that...but the freedom is excellent. Anyways - I’m meandering. Happy to follow up if there’s specific questions.

thank you for this!

Some other random questions for you

Which intersessions do you recommend? Which one to stay away from?

how early can one get involved in research? Tips on asking professors if we can help with a project?

also shadowing different specialties? Informally asking physicians if we can come to clinic for an hour? does this happen?

any tips for studying our first year? Day 1!

 

[Med_For_Life]

Just got off the WL, but Idk if I will be accepting or not

 

[Keepcalmpremd]

Just got off the WL, but Idk if I will be accepting or not

Congrats!!!! Do what’s best for you. You’ll never go wrong

 

[Med_For_Life]

Congrats!!!! Do what’s best for you. You’ll never go wrong

This is the worst timing ... I'm torn

 

[Poppy Girl]

Just got off the WL, but Idk if I will be accepting or not

Wow! So happy for you!

 

[kwsx1]

This is the worst timing ... I'm torn

Ask for an extension so you can have time to think?? D:

 

[Med_For_Life]

Wow! So happy for you!

Hoping you hear back as well - I've been rooting for you ...

 

[sergethecoincierge]

I very regularly lurk and don't post much, but I just wanted to say I love all the support I'm seeing for each other in the CHM WL gang 🥺 congrats @Med_For_Life and I hope the rest of us hear good news soon too!