England - Game Thread

[Animal Midwife]

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I meant me leaving the north, sorry if that wasn’t clear. There was write up about a party in my honor and it included some things that made me question of a certain character was in the game and I googled where their home is and turns out its northern England.

Are you sure it would be North the PM group versus just North RNG'd? I haven't actually ever played a group PMing game where the group title had anything about what roles people had.

 

[mkg323]

I don't really like that you're following Cray's statement of "she's not acting normal." She literally says that about Shorty every game when nothing has changed. Nothing has struck me as particularly off about Shorty this game. Why do you think she's not acting like her village meta?

Why is Finn a village lean? I haven't felt much about them in either direction yet.

Zenge's DocE posts sounded a lot more like going against DocE than supporting Shorty, at least in my perspective. And I agree with him on a lot of the points he made against DocE.

FTFY
also not sure about the finn village lean. I just haven't seen enough from her yet in terms of wolf hunting to move her out of neutrals. I did really enjoy reading about her WW logic about sharing reads though.

I'm not going to put my vote on Zenge today. Although I feel like his posts have been pingy, I'm starting to think I was letting some of the last game's sus roll over into this one. I feel a lot less strongly about him wolfing this game than I did last game. He hasn't come after me at all as opposed to the last game when he got really heated any time I put any kind of pressure on him. There has been a little bit of fluff but not really the hedginess I remember.

He's a great villager when he's a villager and I want more of a reason to yeet him if I'm going to do that. Last game I would have gladly flipped him D1 but this time I'm a lot less confident it wouldn't be a misyeet. And that would be a horrible misyeet if it is, and a great asset to wolves.

Would much rather see a DocE flip.

So then do you think that Z could be trying to pocket shorty by going after DocE? or heck, maybe both of them are wolves?

Sunny's recent posts are bothering me a bit, because she seems reluctant to share/expand on her thoughts. Not sure if normal D1 Sunny though.

The other part is that I'm not really seeing the zenge vote. Nothing he's said has struck me as wolf!zenge yet. The only thing I've noticed is he's been quieter compared to normal, but I think that's NAI because he was pretty active last game as a wolf. I didn't really see his posts as defending shorty, and he has provided reads on others when asked.

I'd love to see her spreadsheets as well, she makes really great ones. That being said, with only like half the roster having posted regularly since the start I'm not ready to say that her posting a couple of thoughts instead of a spreadsheet is AI.

I still wanna know who took Sar’s teapot.

Gotta be the Mad Hatter that took it, he had a tea party to get to

 

[samac]

Are you sure it would be North the PM group versus just North RNG'd? I haven't actually ever played a group PMing game where the group title had anything about what roles people had.

I was moved to London after getting PM. My original starting location was the north. I think although our roles are overall likely rng that the locations are not.

 

[Animal Midwife]

I was moved to London after getting PM. My original starting location was the north. I think although our roles are overall likely rng that the locations are not.

Alright. Guess I'll see how things play out once we start getting flips.

 

[DocEspana]

I'm starting to wish I had kept ghosting......

So far the game has consisted of a butt hurt argument about the value of villager-listing, a butt hurt argument about whether two people can read English, my own butt hurt comments about "lynch" "yeet" "yeti" "oust" "unlive" etc, and .... a handful of relatively newer-ish players actually trying to play (kudos to you guys).

I agree with you on that. But technically it was unalive. It's the hip and with it way to say murder. My gen Z patients say it unironically

 

[Aprilthearab]

So then do you think that Z could be trying to pocket shorty by going after DocE? or heck, maybe both of them are wolves?

Not really. I'm not going to call anyone wolfy just for voicing their opinion against DocE for reasons I agree with. I don't think it has anything to do with Shorty and everything to do with DocE. I could be wrong. I think Shorty is village, and my wolf lean on Zenge is slowly dissipating.

 

[Cyndia]

These posts^

There was also a post by DubZ that was referring to Shorty/DocE but I misinterpreted as referring to Cray. (it was this post)

I wasn’t postulating that she was faking a restriction, I meant just questioning if she was choosing to only use doctor who images by choice, or if her restriction stipulated that.

 

[sunshinefl]

I don't really like that you're following Cray's statement of "she's not acting normal." She literally says that about Shorty every game when nothing has changed. Nothing has struck me as particularly off about Shorty this game. Why do you think she's not acting like her village meta?

I’m definitely not “following cray” and I’m annoyed at that statement. I independently feel that she is not contributing like her normal self, but also acknowledged that it could be due to the attack from Doc E. So I said I had to wait and see about her.

Why is Finnick a village lean? I haven't felt much about them in either direction yet.

I felt his arguments about good village play with AM were sincere, even though I agreed with 1 main point and not the other. So I feel I’m probably not just being falsely persuaded to village lean based on general WW philosophy alone.

Zenge's DocE posts sounded a lot more like going against DocE than supporting Shorty, at least in my perspective. And I agree with him on a lot of the points he made against DocE.

Well I don’t feel Doc E as a strong wolf candidate. And stand by my statement that for all of his strong, best new villager in a century accolades, he has largely just hopped in to write a jokey post on theme of the game except when defending his IRL finance shorty.

Why do you have a village lean on Enigma?

She overall seems engaged, and has good analysis that I agree with majority of the time.

Sunny's recent posts are bothering me a bit, because she seems reluctant to share/expand on her thoughts. Not sure if normal D1 Sunny though.

How is this weird for me? I’m the meta crusader of not pushing people for premature reads, especially early and with 100 people playing, and have said so across multiple games.

The other part is that I'm not really seeing the zenge vote. Nothing he's said has struck me as wolf!zenge yet. The only thing I've noticed is he's been quieter compared to normal, but I think that's NAI because he was pretty active last game as a wolf. I didn't really see his posts as defending shorty, and he has provided reads on others when asked.

I’ve already explained this 10 times. And yeah he gave reads on like 2 people when pushed which is easy enough for a wolf to do which is again why pushing people for premature reads isn’t great wolf hunting strategy.

Are you reading them w/w?

No, as I have said I am wolf lean on zenge and neutral in shorty. I’m just not village reading her yet. Again as I have said twice now, I think their connection in the game as far as him defending her is d/t their IRL relationship, not game relationship.

I wanted to circle back to this part about Sunny.

Usually when she’s playing as a villager, if she’s asked for her reads, she’s always eager and ready to post a screen shot of her Excel spread sheet, complete with reasons for her reads.

When asked for her reads this game she gave us this: With no deductions or reasoning. Definitely not what we usually see from Village!Sunny. That’s off to me.

LOL wrong again! When I have reads I share them on my own. As above, I have been against pushing people for premature reads for months across multiple games. My spreadsheet this game only has names imported so far. My few reads are on my phone notepad app. Since the game started I’ve had post-match depression that is demotivating, and have packed and moved out of where I was staying for the last rotation, then driven back home across the state stopping at my dad’s for several hours on the way, and then am in the process of unpacking/unloading at home.

lynch sunshinefl

because I really think the DocE and Zenge votes are crap, and Sunshinefl is pushing too hard on Zenge.

I’m giving a vote with an explanation. Not sure how that’s “pushing too hard”. And even if it is, then so is your vote with an explanation for me.

 

[Animal Midwife]

She overall seems engaged, and has good analysis that i

Could you finish this thought?

 

[sunshinefl]

Could you finish this thought?

Not sure why it got cut off. I’m on my phone and things get deleted when you press enter or any number of thing. I already fixed it before I saw your post.

“She overall seems engaged, and has good analysis that I agree with majority of the time.”

 

[Animal Midwife]

Not sure why it got cut off. I’m on my phone and things get deleted when you press enter or any number of thing. I already fixed it before I saw your post.

“She overall seems engaged, and has good analysis that I agree with majority of the time.”

What analysis specifically are you agreeing with?

 

[Aprilthearab]

I felt his arguments about good village play with AM were sincere, even though I agreed with 1 main point and not the other. So I feel I’m probably not just being falsely persuaded to village lean based on general WW philosophy alone.

I'm not quite understanding. Anyone can state their village policies in any game regardless of their affiliation. It doesn't really reflect their gameplay and interactions in this specific game, just what they think of as their own universal rules. You say that you disagree with one of their points and so it's not bias that's making you village read them - so is there anything else contributing to their read besides that they talk about what is good village play?

 

[sunshinefl]

I'm not quite understanding. Anyone can state their village policies in any game regardless of their affiliation. It doesn't really reflect their gameplay and interactions in this specific game, just what they think of as their own universal rules. You say that you disagree with one of their points and so it's not bias that's making you village read them - so is there anything else contributing to their read besides that they talk about what is good village play?

I don’t think someone would argue passionately for good villager play while not being a villager.

 

[sunshinefl]

What analysis specifically are you agreeing with?

I didn’t write it down.

 

[Cyndia]

Yeah, after having wolfed with Cyndia in Bioshock, that’s been on my mind too. It’s very similar, but I’m not sure if that’s just how she plays or if it’s more indicative of wolfing for her.

@alleycat03 what are your thoughts on Cyndia, having just wolfed with her.

Was Bioshock the only game we’ve played together? Others can confirm but my level of activity is pretty NAI. Mainly bc I can only check in during the evening or briefly during lunch because I’m not allowed to have my phone on me during work.

 

[Animal Midwife]

I didn’t write it down.

You don't know even the jist of what you like from what she's said?

 

[WildZoo]

Are you sure it would be North the PM group versus just North RNG'd? I haven't actually ever played a group PMing game where the group title had anything about what roles people had.

Hannibal did, technically

 

[sunshinefl]

What analysis specifically are you agreeing with?

These.

I know I'm more pro-mechanics talk and that other people don't like it as much, but I don't think it's that odd of a hypothesis to bring up - unless there's a way that royals can pretend vote, we'll know at the end of the day who did or didn't participate. We can't know the ultimate implications of all of it yet, but that's one of the very few things we do know at this point

This is a fair point

since i didn't play or follow bioshock i'll take your word for it, but i really don't think we've gone that far down a rabbit hole yet, it was a pretty direct assumption from a clearly officially stated mechanic

hows this for tin foil rabbit hole though: maybe royals can still place votes, but it doesn't count in the actual final tally, so it allows them to blend in and then it'll be a mystery as to whose votes didn't count in the end

okay okay I'll leave this alone now

I will note that my gut feeling on shorty is that she seems to have adopted some AM style strategies that I don't remember her using much previously (more questions/pushback than original contributions). Also that off-topic talk about teapots felt a bit like parts of cartoons when she was wolf (but is more likely just early game NAI chatter)

I'm not ready to oust her, but it did stand out to me as different.

still getting a feel for his playstyle. Didn't really follow his reasoning for wanting to be PM. I don't know that I'd go as hard as he is on shorty, but as mentioned i do kinda see where he's coming from. It's clear that theres royalty shenanigans involved in the votes for him/SAR, but i'm not sure if it's based on who ran or who voted. And while i do like overall mechanics talk (looks like my tinfoil was right after all) I do think I should be more careful about speculating too publicly into who the exact royals are, since some of them are likely village affiliated and outing them could bring them harm


Since I didn't play bioshock i might have just missed a step in natural evolution from noob to more experienced player. I do think that some of her non-questioning posts this game have served more to stop conversation than to advance it, I didn't get that feel in goats. And I still feel like there's an AM influence in the types of questions she asks, but that's not necessarily wolfy, just evolving.

pretty neutral for now, maybe very slight village (but with a strong personality and possible additional motives at play)

I'm still trying to wrap my head around how the class modifiers should impact my reads, if it all.

Because roles and abilities and classes all are going to impact the way people play. so someone might seem weird to me because they're a wolf, or they could be a villager with a class modifier that I don't understand that is influencing their decision making/ strategy. there may be within-class trends that look like wolfpack trends, etc. It seems like there's several layers of complexity to this game, so it's gonna be more complicated than wolf vs. not wolf. I think a focus on wolves is obviously the best starting point, I just want to be nuanced with my reads when possible

In the games i've played so far, yeeting silent people early tends to end up catching people who just had IRL stuff that got in the way, rather than wolves. The one situation where I think it is better to pick the silent person is if there's a close vote, and you have good reason to believe that the other person is village - better to lose a non-participating villager than an active one. I do think that early votes for silent folk can help pressure them into participating sometimes though

I think in some ways I'm just having fun overthinking things, but it frustrates me a little when we're handed interesting details about the game and then everyone says to ignore them until later (I find mechanics super interesting in a way other people hate haha, but its part of what makes the game fun for me). As mentioned before I'm not planning to publicly speculate too much on exact class modifiers for individuals (for example, I don't know if there's certain classes that would make people targets for wolves/3Ps in the way PRs often are), but I also don't want to put someone in my wolf bin for reasons that could be explained by other details of their role and accidentally get them yeeted

I'm guessing you didn't go back and read deadchat because I was screaming to yeet AM the entire time lol. I just couldn't do anything about it cause I was a lil bit dead, so I'm salty

It's very salty caution. I don't have a strong read on her either way yet, but a huge part of the problem in goats was everyone blindly accepting AM as village, thinking that they could read her well, so I'd rather err on the side of caution and be wrong than be a part of that. I'll take note that you clearly want me to read her as village though.

I also have some philosophical differences with AM's playstyle, so even when she's village I don't tend to feel great about her. I don't really see how me not giving you a village read on AM is out of sync with my "past reading experiences" - If anything, I'm pretty consistently hedgey and that regularly gets me in trouble, I would be more surprised if I took a great stance on her this early

there were some kind of royalty shenanigans involved, as by my count the final vote was
SAR - 9
DocE - 7
MsP - 3
samac - 3
Capri - 1

I'm curious to see how it pans out, but i don't think we have enough info to dig into exactly how it happened

 

[Zenge142]

Was Bioshock the only game we’ve played together? Others can confirm but my level of activity is pretty NAI. Mainly bc I can only check in during the evening or briefly during lunch because I’m not allowed to have my phone on me during work.

Yeah, that’s been our only game together. You were very good at flying under the radar and doing just enough to look village. Some of your posts I actually had to do a double take in that game. So I’m definitely going to be cautious when reading you, but I can definitely appreciate being busy IRL and it being NAI.

 

[WildZoo]

I don’t think someone would argue passionately for good villager play while not being a villager.

I have definitely seen wolves do this many many times, especially if it supports their ability to continue playing the way they want to play by being able to say "well this is how I village too". It's NAI.

 

[Animal Midwife]

These.

Mmm. I'm don't really think any of these are things she couldn't post as any alignment given it's mostly tinfoils, gameplay philosophies, and salt jokes. The only read I see is a maybe slight village lean on DocE.

 

[WildZoo]

@supershorty I have to read back over april's posts today to see how I feel, I was wanting to back away from her a bit based on initial impulse, but I want to make sure it's not just because I was agreeing with some of the things she was saying

 

[sunshinefl]

Mmm. I'm don't really think any of these are things she couldn't post as any alignment given it's mostly tinfoils, gameplay philosophies, and salt jokes. The only read I see is a maybe slight village lean on DocE.

I know your definition of game solving isn’t the same which is maybe why you can’t see the analysis I’m referring to.

 

[Barkley13]

I know your definition of game solving isn’t the same which is maybe why you can’t see the analysis I’m referring to.

Okay well I don’t see how those posts make her village either

 

[sunshinefl]

Okay well I don’t see how those posts make her village either

Well then don’t village read her?

 

[Stagg737]

Little behind, but should be caught up this afternoon and actually contributing

MFW I’m never trusted again because of ggoats:

Spoiler

Welcome to the family!

 

[WildZoo]

Little behind, but should be caught up this afternoon and actually contributing



Welcome to the family!

Oh hai staggikarp

 

[vetmedhead]

Edit, forgot this one. This is my 5th game. That’s not a mechanic I’ve heard of, seems like an easy way for wolves to get extra kills if they just have to guess village for vast majority of people?

This conversation is off-topic at this point, but the extra kill isn't based on guessing a player is a villager, it's usually guessing something more specific to their role. For example many moons ago in the Dogs game I could get extra kills if I could guess what AKC group a player's role was in (and was aided greatly by @PippyPony casually asking about what breeds people were on thread because of excitement about the game theme lol)

Are you sure it would be North the PM group versus just North RNG'd? I haven't actually ever played a group PMing game where the group title had anything about what roles people had.

I also have reason to believe that player locations are relevant to their role

These.

So you agree with... basically every post she's made so far in the game?

I really dislike your sudden ignoring of veteran players being rude to newer players on thread, which as I recall is something you hate and have always been riled up by. Having a hard time seeing you support DocE at all given that.
A lot of your reasoning shared today is also really off the wall and you've avoided lots of questions about your play/reads until you could come on and give really vague answers (like your response to my question about your last second mayor vote switch, which was completely ignored until someone asked it again later, and your reads responses today).

Vote sunny

 

[Stagg737]

Oust Shorty

Yeet Stagg

Didn't post at all yesterday. Pressure vote.

I'm not a fan of this. If this was a real pressure vote why wouldn't you tag me? Even more concerning since you tagged a player about a separate, more benign question shortly afterwards.

Also had an instance or two of probing for where to throw possible shade (early interaction with TME and someone else, Visc maybe?).

 

[vetmedhead]

Visc, Finnick, cray, and Enigma are village leans for me.

Why is Finnick a village lean? I haven't felt much about them in either direction yet.

Psst just as a friendly reminder Finn would prefer to be called Finn in this game. She very recently lost an extremely beloved pet by the same name as her username and it's a sad reminder for her

 

[Stagg737]

Oh hai staggikarp

 

[Stagg737]

Wait, this is the England game...

 

[vetmedhead]

I don't really understand the zenge votes, I think he's contributing a lot to gameplay and more than just "but muh gurlfrend" like I've seen mentioned as a reason against him. He's certainly had thoughts on more than just her

@genny I saw you were the first vote on him, has his play today changed your thoughts at all?

 

[vetmedhead]

Also FWIW I'm reading the entire DocE/shorty/zenge thing as village all around, albeit extremely distracting

 

[Animal Midwife]

Oust Shorty



I'm not a fan of this. If this was a real pressure vote why wouldn't you tag me? Even more concerning since you tagged a player about a separate, more benign question shortly afterwards.

Also had an instance or two of probing for where to throw possible shade (early interaction with TME and someone else, Visc maybe?).

Where did the bolded occur?

 

[samac]

Little behind, but should be caught up this afternoon and actually contributing



Welcome to the family!

I wasn’t even some big heavy busser that game I just apparently lied well lol

 

[Barkley13]

Unyeet alissa
yeet sunshine

 

[Barkley13]

I assumed these were indicative of you wolf reading Alissa.

I’m not currently wolf reading her. It was just a place to start

 

[Aprilthearab]

Psst just as a friendly reminder Finn would prefer to be called Finn in this game. She very recently lost an extremely beloved pet by the same name as her username and it's a sad reminder for her

I'm sorry Finn, I wasn't aware. 🙁 My apologies and condolences.

 

[sunshinefl]

This conversation is off-topic at this point, but the extra kill isn't based on guessing a player is a villager, it's usually guessing something more specific to their role. For example many moons ago in the Dogs game I could get extra kills if I could guess what AKC group a player's role was in (and was aided greatly by @PippyPony casually asking about what breeds people were on thread because of excitement about the game theme lol)


I also have reason to believe that player locations are relevant to their role

So you agree with... basically every post she's made so far in the game?

Nope. Just the ones I quoted.

I really dislike your sudden ignoring of veteran players being rude to newer players on thread, which as I recall is something you hate and have always been riled up by. Having a hard time seeing you support DocE at all given that.

I HAVE LITERALLY ALREADY ADDRESSED THIS. And I hate vet deference. As far as I can see, I didn’t follow him onto a shorty vote so why are you accuse me of going against my own values?

A lot of your reasoning shared today is also really off the wall and you've avoided lots of questions about your play/reads until you could come on and give really vague answers (like your response to my question about your last second mayor vote switch, which was completely ignored until someone asked it again later, and your reads responses today).

Wtf? I EXPLAINED IT AT THE TIME AS WELL AS RESPONDING TO YOUR SPECIFIC INQUIRY AS SOON AS I SAW IT. unless we start designating times to all be on together talking synchronized, I don’t think you have a right to falsely accuse me of ignoring your question (for which the answer was given at the time). I didn’t want SAR to be the prime minister. I wanted Ms P. I waited until then AND tried to call attention to it but no one was moving. And I preferred Doc E over SAR. Oh and before you accuse me of “supporting” him again, that was A: before the whole shorty thing and B: a vote against SAR, not for him.

Psst just as a friendly reminder Finn would prefer to be called Finn in this game. She very recently lost an extremely beloved pet by the same name as her username and it's a sad reminder for her

Well I remembered the sentiment but couldn’t find the preference and asked the mod and she told me the opposite so now I don’t know what to call that player.

Also FWIW I'm reading the entire DocE/shorty/zenge thing as village all around, albeit extremely distracting

Okay so is this you “supporting” Doc E as you accuse me of? For simply saying I think he’s aggressive, but not necessarily a wolf?

 

[mkg323]

I will hopefully be back before yeet close, but for now I'll

YEET DOCE

Okay off to another run. Wife wants me living that healthy life

In what will come as a pleasant change of pace, I'll keep stuff short

Cray: always plays crazy. Her name is apros pos. Or however that's spelled. I know that historically she does tend to support my votes a lot and that makes me rather blind to her being a wolf. With all of that said, I don't think she is being wolfy. I think I have a good argument and she tends to trust me at baseline (as much as one can) and is supporting an argument. The fact that she has a post restriction and I spell out my thoughts at length and repeatedly helps. I'd say give her a pass until she has time to talk.

Zenge: there is honestly a catch 22 where if I know I'm innocent and I know if my argument is sound (it is but people try to misrepresent it as alternatingly more and less than it is), then anyone critiquing it too harshly is going to draw my ire. I think their take on me is baffling and perhaps a rookie wolf overplaying their hand but I also am not going to switch just because "it's convenient" or because of that. It feels too retaliatory and I want to take time to actually reread what they've posted and see if I really feel it. Wife is gonna make that hard. Will do it as I can whenever the wife isn't looking.

shorty: I still believe in my prior point that this is the person who it would hurt the least to lose from the limited sample of day zero and 1. Not moving from it yet.

everyone else: I'm the inventor of the spreadsheet on people. Everyone is in there but it does me and the village at a whole no good for me to speak about my suspicions this early because it really is just a jumble of noise mixed with signal this early and I don't need to let wolves be able to strategize in a way that weaponizes me or dissuades me.

this is the only post I've found that isnt just about Shorty, but its still limited to those involved in the dumpster fire of a discussion yesterday. There are 28 people in this game, reads should not be limited to those who have directly opposed you/have sheeped you.

 

[sunshinefl]

It’s a little much but I don’t know if that makes him a wolf. Like I said, he’s being very aggressive towards her.

tbh it doesn’t sound nice so I wasn’t going to comment, but even though I was sometimes cringing, shorty frequently fights with me, and is a disciple of AM, and I philosophically disagree with both of their play styles. So I think you are wrong to say that’s out of character for me not to rush to white knight her like Z did.

@vetmedhead since you missed it the first time

 

[alissa14]

It was this one

Just before this you posted your reasoning, which was saying you could get behind the logic Cray was using for voting for DocE, but overall I didn’t think the logic made any sense. She was acknowledging he was sketchy and didn’t trust him and then voting to give him more power. So your jumping on the vote too pinged me a little bit.

This is a fair point but I thought cray's logic seemed reasonable

 

[alissa14]

Does anyone have any specific questions for me? I'm pretty caught up on thread but I haven't deep dived anyone specifically. I am trying to not become so engrossed because it makes playing less fun and I'm just trying to have fun.

To answer AM's question: I haven't seen anything from TME that has flagged me as wolfy and I've mostly agreed with her content

 

[alissa14]

Unyeet capri
Yeet MsP

Will you stay on this if she makes an appearance and contributes more?

 

[finnickthedog]

Does anyone have any specific questions for me?

Is there a reason I missed for you asking this? It seems odd.

 

[Animal Midwife]

Will you stay on this if she makes an appearance and contributes more?

Depends on how quality said contributions are.

 

[Stagg737]

Where did the bolded occur?

I'm on page 16 and may have patients coming in shortly. Give me a minute to try and find it, but may take a while. Iirc, it was near the top of a page between pg 5-10.

 

[alissa14]

Is there a reason I missed for you asking this? It seems odd.

Huh? I just don't feel like putting a huge wall post with deep analysis of every player and quotes and yadda yadda because that takes me hours to do. So my point being, while I am available and active on thread, my post was to ask if anyone wanted furtherexplanation as to what I've posted so far

 

[Stagg737]

Where did the bolded occur?

Here ya go:

This exchange is pinging me a little bit, feels weird to start making mechanics-type hypotheses so early on. There were very few votes even placed yet.

Hedgy with weird justfication, imo. Put her on my radar early. The "pressure vote" without a tag or any further follow-up pushed her out of neutral though.