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College program is an MD/MS program where you spend your 5th year as a masters student. University program is a normal MD program.
2009-2010 Case Western Reserve University Application Thread
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College program is an MD/MS program where you spend your 5th year as a masters student. University program is a normal MD program.
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Not exactly. The College Program confers an "M.D. with Special Qualifications in Biomedical Research" not a separate MS. It's more than just a fifth year - the curriculum is different, and College Program students don't take the same classes as Univeristy Program students. Research is integrated throughout the CP curriculum, whereas in the UP we have a research requirement, but we do it during a block in years 3-4. The two programs are very different.
The College Program is taught at the Cleveland Clinic (Lerner College of Medicine), the UP is at Case. Although admissions goes through the same secondary app, the two programs are, for the most part, functionally separate.
http://casemed.case.edu/admissions/programs/cp_curriculum.cfm
Edit: I'm sure CCLCMer can chime in here and give more specifics on the College Program and CCLCM. We saw and met with the CCLCM class during orientation and in writing our oath, but from what I've heard, for the most part, that's the last time we'll really be academically involved with each other.
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Ahh, nope. The MD/MS programs are options for UP students - and they're offered at no additional cost to MD students. 👍
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For the UP LOR requirement, would a lab coordinator for a science class that I TA'd count? She was also part of teaching for the lab and she is also an advisor for the non-honors portion of the major (but she's not my advisor).
when were you complete?
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33 here, so I dunno...
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See, what they do at this stage is assign a numerical value to every letter of your name, then they add them all up and divide your AMCAS number by that. If the result is a prime number, you get an interview. If not, you go to the back of the pile.
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Can you find out the numerical values, so we can know if we are getting an interview? That would be great, thanks!
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Christian and Dr. Mehta made me promise not to tell... And I don't want to get on their bad side. :-X
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I think I'm riding on some weird ECs, lol. I'm one of those "used to be wannabe i-bankers" that grew a conscience, lol. I was really worried going into the app process because though I have a really good amount of research... none of it is anything close to bio, chem, or medicine. It's all econ research. Maybe they found that interesting?
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I'm pretty sure Myuu said it before, but Case loves the bent arrows!
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Meaning those who have changed direction towards medicine? Sorry if I'm acting a little thick, lol
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hahah.. No worries. Bent arrows meaning those who have a very atypical path to medical school. The non-"cookie cutter bio major, finished in four years, applied straight to med school" type. Not that we don't have many of those too (they don't hold it against you). But they really like the people who've done different things.
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Thanks for the clarification!
...love the analogy, gonna start using that one and always conclude with "with due props to st0w" lol
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HAHAHAHA... Don't credit me, I'd never heard it before someone at Case said it. I guess it's a Case-ism. *shrug*
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Any more information on this (website links, articles, things you've heard, etc.). My stats are fairly average, but I've worked a year as an aviation engineer and then 2 as a medical device engineer which gives me all kinds of fun stuff to talk about. My path to medicine has been very unorthadox...
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Well, here's our general demographic stats... http://casemed.case.edu/admissions/docs/The Entering Class of 2009 for website.pps
And this gives you a good amount of information on this history of bent arrows at Case: http://casemed.case.edu/communications/bulletin/vol10-no2-2004/face.html
And this: http://www.google.com/search?q=site:casemed.case.edu+bent+arrow
Unorthodox is good. Not just at Case, but at a ton of places. Definitely talk it up on the interview trail!
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Has to be UP. CCLCM starts sending invites and interviewing people later than the UP.
Nope, your holdup is that you applied to CCLCM. Not only do we start interviewing later than the UP, but your app has to be reviewed by both admissions offices before either one will offer you an invite. They have to do it that way so they can coordinate your interviews if both programs decide to invite you. So everyone who applied to both programs will get invites later than people who just applied to the UP. On the bright side, getting two invites in one day is pretty sweet, and you only have to pay for travel expenses once. 👍
It can be MD/MS, but it doesn't have to be.
They're less different than you realize. The UP class that entered with my class was the first group to go completely through the new WR2 curriculum, which has been adopting several features from our program. We have always had a portal, evals, portfolios, etc. Now you guys have your own portal, you have to write portfolio essays too (though none of my UP friends is quite sure what the med school plans to do with them!), and even the UP research block is new in the past few years.
That's really only true for the first two years. After that, we're all mixed together for research and rotations. Students from all three programs (including MSTP too) can rotate at any of the four Cleveland hospitals (UH, VA, Metro, CCF). I'm not sure if there are research options at Metro or the VA, but you can definitely do your research block at UH or CCF (as can we). To be honest, I can only think of a few differences between UP and CCLCM after year 2:
1) grading system-on rotations UP students get grades (we're still P/F) and are required to take shelfs (optional for us). You guys can get AOA, which we can't since we have no grades. (For you premeds, AOA is the medical school honor society.)
2) amount of research-you do one 4-month block of research while we do three of them.
3) amount of time spent on preclinical curriculum-you get out a block ahead of us at the end of second year.
4) clinical year didactics-we have different Friday afternoon classes. You won't have to take research classes on Fridays like we do, but you'll have to take something else called IQ plus. I don't know much about it except that some people didn't seem to like it very much.
People doing rotations can range anywhere from MS2's from the UP, up to MS5's from CCLCM. The out-of-synch schedules make for a delightfully confusing mix of medical student statuses on the wards.
Yeah, that's going to be it for the next couple of years, but then you'll be together again like I explained before.
Having the first two years completely separate is also fairly new. We used to have FCM together. (FCM is the Case class for humanities/social sciences in medicine. We all have to take it.) But my class and the two classes above us complained enough about having to go over to Case that they scrapped that, and now we do FCM separately. It's too bad in some ways, because the interaction part was good, and the topics covered are important. But the implementation wasn't always the greatest. (You haven't started FCM yet, but unless it's gotten wildly better organized over the past two years, you will see what I mean.)
They're options for CCLCM students too. I'm getting an MS. The main difference is that more of our med school coursework counts toward the MS. So for mine, which is part of CRSP (clinical trials track), I only have to take three extra classes. Everything else I can do by dual-enrolling some of my med school classes to get credit for grad school. And of course the thesis year is required here anyway, so that will count toward my MS too.
You should call the office and ask. Any time you're not sure about something like this that can delay your app if you choose wrong, save yourself the trouble and call the office. That's what they're there for.
I think it's a Case-ism too. 🙂
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Very good point, I wasn't thinking about that. My focus is admittedly a bit myopic at this point, since that's what I'm steeped in right now.
Actually we have. They've integrated FCM even into block one, and we're already doing patient interviewing and looking at social contexts of disease and patient care outside the traditional classes. Unless you mean something different relating to FCM.
Thanks for clarifying all the details! I'm glad to know more about the CCLCM specifics.
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I feel like I found one of my people! Alvarez13...I've got 10 years in med device engineering with a brief stint in military vehicle electronics (instead of 'avionics', we called it 'vetronics')....what did you / do you do? I'm applying to Case and CCLCM in particular...as you probably know, their med device research is second to none...check out my stats if you wanna see 'unorthodox'...this arrow is likely to shoot you in right the foot, it's so bent...
-vc7777
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It generally depends on your situation, but they are already somewhat behind. So far,though, it's been pretty quick.👍
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I submitted Saturday the 25th, and I was marked complete on Monday the 27th. I guess that means less than one business day.
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What do you mean "situation," like MCAT/GPA situation?
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Nah, more like piece/paper gathering.
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Same here I submitted on the 20th and was complete on 21st and got the interview on 27th, so they seem to be gunnin through these apps.
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You are awesome. Thanks for the info.
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That's some great info. Do you have a rough idea of when the CCLCM applications are viewed and the decisions made?
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Random question, I am an international applicant who applied extremely late last year (mid-september to october) and I worked extremely hard on some essays that I feel didn't get any consideration due to lateness. I'm wondering whether it's looked upon negatively to submit extremely similar essays? My research is the same so I'm not sure how else I can word that one....
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Of course. It feels like third year is a long way off right now, and first year is still new and exciting for you. A couple of weeks ago, I ran into a few of your classmates on their way to class on the first day of school. They were all nervous and excited. It was cute, and it also made me smile because I felt the exact same way on my first day. 🙂
You're already taking the Tuesday morning FCM class? In the summer? Or is this something to do with your new public health block that they're just calling FCM?
Things might have changed since I was a first year, but ours started in the fall and met for two hours on Tuesday mornings. This was school-wide. We went over to Case every few weeks, and in between, we had our own FCM sessions at CCF. They would have lectures on things like patient safety, art in medicine, medical errors, I don't remember what else.
Likewise. One thing about CCLCM (and Case in general) is that things never stay the same. 🙂
It shouldn't take more than a few days once all of your materials are received. If you know they have all of your LORs, secondary, etc. and you still aren't marked complete within a week, call them. When I applied, they had all of my stuff, but they hadn't downloaded my LORs yet. They did it right after I called, and then I was complete.
The first adcomm meeting is on October 15, and interviews probably start about two weeks earlier. I'm guessing Sept. 28 will be the first interview day, but don't hold me to that! So that means the first invites will go out in another month or so.
This next part of the explanation about when people will hear back is kind of confusing, so bear with me (and ask questions if any of it doesn't make sense).
A lot of med schools are rolling, meaning they accept students every few weeks all interview season long. The UP does this. There are also some schools that are nonrolling, like Penn, where they only accept people on one date in the spring (usually in March). CCLCM used to be rolling, but we went to semi-rolling admissions last year. Semi-rolling is kind of a hybrid between rolling and nonrolling. It means that instead of accepting people all year long, there are only three dates during interview season when acceptances will be given out. These acceptances get decided at special adcomm meetings called subcommittee meetings.
So, the early bird people who get reviewed on Oct. 15 won't hear anything for a while after that until the adcomm has their first subcommittee meeting. There are three subcommittee meetings, and the first one is in December. (I think it's on the 15th.) During the subcommittee meeting, the adcomm re-reviews all of the students who have interviewed up to that point, and the students who will be offered an acceptance are chosen. So if you interview at CCLCM in the fall, the earliest you can be accepted is in late December. It will be a nice Christmas present. 🙂
Those of you who interview after December shouldn't worry. The reason why the adcomm has three subcommittee meetings is to make sure that everyone has a chance to interview for an open seat. Usually about 9-11 students will be offered an acceptance after each subcommittee meeting, so that works out to filling approximately 1/3 of the class. Once all three meetings are over and all seats given out (around the end of February), then no more acceptances will be given until people start dropping their seats.
The reason why we have this whole weird semi-rolling thing is because we can't overaccept like most med schools do. In other words, medical schools know from previous years that if they have, say, 100 seats, they can accept maybe 150 students because 50 of them will withdraw and go somewhere else. But since CCLCM has so few seats, we can't take the risk of overaccepting. So only a very few acceptances will go out before the spring, maybe 10 or so in December and another 10 in late January.
I guess it depends on whether your essays were a negative part of your app last year and what new info you have to add this year. Hopefully you know what else you needed to do to improve your app besides applying earlier. Like if they told you to get more clinical experience and you did a bunch of shadowing, you should make sure to highlight that in your app this year. But if it was something like you had to retake the MCAT to raise your score, then you probably don't need to change your essays that much.4goneconclusion said:
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I guess this is just one more reason to want to go to Case! lol
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A lot of the public health stuff has been presented with a focus on FCM (disparities, socio-cultural competence, health policy, etc), but it's not specifically FCM.
We aren't doing the Tuesday morning classes yet, but we've been having evening workshops with standardized patients every week with an associated medium-sized group lecture on patient interviewing which is under the FCM umbrella. We're also having (right this very minute) a discussion of the Tuesday seminars.
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just got the interview!
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complete 7/21, stats 3.7,36 (in case you want to know)
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Congrats! I have similar stats, but I wasn't complete until 7/27. This makes me wish I had submitted earlier, so maybe I could be fortunate like you and have an interview.
Does any one know what Case's interview schedule is like? I know I am looking ahead too early, but I am just curious.
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did u apply to both the college and university programs?
congrats on the interview invites, everyone!
quick question, i just logged into iapply and I noticed under the additional documents section there is a new document called visitors guide. I opened it up and it talks about general interview day information. I have not gotten an email about an interview invite nor does it say anything under the UP correspondences section. Does this mean I got an interview? Does everyone have this additional document on their status page? Am I reading into this too much? lol
i know, i need to calm down 🙂
quick question, i just logged into iapply and I noticed under the additional documents section there is a new document called visitors guide. I opened it up and it talks about general interview day information. I have not gotten an email about an interview invite nor does it say anything under the UP correspondences section. Does this mean I got an interview? Does everyone have this additional document on their status page? Am I reading into this too much? lol
i know, i need to calm down 🙂
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just the university program, their interview season from what I see on the scheduling chart is sep14-feb26
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thanks a lot for the info! Hopefully I will see that link on my status page sometime soon
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Yeah, I had that as well today. I'm going to try not to read into it.
I have this document as well, but I'm not even complete (waiting on one more LOR). so I don't think it means anything. sorry 🙁
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The first prompt is called an autobiographical essay, but then it asks to describe a challenge.
Did you guys describe yourselves at all in the essay and your motivations to become a doctor, or just stick to writing about adversity you faced?
Did you guys describe yourselves at all in the essay and your motivations to become a doctor, or just stick to writing about adversity you faced?
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