Cornell vs Pitt

[shirahyuki]

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Hi! I recently got taken off of the waitlist for Cornell and received my financial aid information last Friday. I was all set to go to Pitt, but now I'm conflicted over which school to go to. My family is in NYC and I've lived in NYC almost my entire life. I love the city, but I feel like I should live somewhere else for a while. However, I feel like I would ultimately want to work in NYC - would going to Pitt instead of Cornell close any doors for me?

Also, can anyone talk about the teaching styles at the two schools? Are the faculty approachable? How are the lectures? Do the professors talk about what is relevant or do they go off on tangents about their research? Can others give me their general impression of the schools?

I heard that Cornell is very hands-off and you basically have to teach the material to yourself - can anyone speak to that and is it like that at Pitt too?

Thanks!

 

[bollywoodlover]

I think I've heard something similar about Cornell. I'd choose Pitt. UPMC seems great and will certainly not close any doors especially if you want to choose a residency in the Northeast.

The biggest thing I looked for in schools is attendance that is optional for lectures (so you can study the way that is best for you), time allotted to study for STEP, cheaper tuition, and a collaborative student body. True P/F grading would be great if either school has that, but isn't imperative. A lot of P/F schools internally rank anyways and still have AOA.

 

[shirahyuki]

Thanks for your reply! =)

For tuition, Pitt is cheaper than Cornell by $10k for me. I really loved the school during my interview day - everyone was so friendly and laid-back. Cornell's interview day was pretty bad - I believe my two faculty interviews were both stress interviews and they were awful. =\

The main thing that's holding me back from choosing Pitt is NYC. My mom really wants me to remain here and I have a very strong support system in the city. I've also lived in NYC for so long that I'm scared that I won't be able to get used to a small city like Pittsburgh.

 

[imnamerican]

However, I feel like I would ultimately want to work in NYC - would going to Pitt instead of Cornell close any doors for me?

I wouldn't say going to Pitt would close doors, but doing your rotations at NY-Presby/Memorial Sloan-Kettering and having letters from Cornell faculty would probably help significantly in your bid to come back to NYC at either Cornell or Columbia.

What does financial aid look like for you?

 

[shirahyuki]

I wouldn't say going to Pitt would close doors, but doing your rotations at NY-Presby/Memorial Sloan-Kettering and having letters from Cornell faculty would probably help significantly in your bid to come back to NYC at either Cornell or Columbia.

What does financial aid look like for you?

Cornell will $10k more expensive than Pitt, so it's not that big of a concern for me.

 

[Ismet]

I don't know anything about Cornell, but I sure do know about Pitt! 🙂

would going to Pitt instead of Cornell close any doors for me?

Absolutely not. Pitt is a well-known name in the medical world, and choosing Pitt over Cornell will definitely not close any doors. If you really want to match back in NYC, that is definitely doable out of Pitt. Many students match to NYC residencies every year.

Also, can anyone talk about the teaching styles at the two schools?

The breakdown of lecture/PBL/lab varies greatly between classes, but the biggest chunk of time is spent in lecture. PBL is usually case-based, and I have found it beneficial for some classes (anatomy, micro, neuro) and not that beneficial for others (biochem) but it really depends on your learning style.

Are the faculty approachable?

Absolutely. The majority of lecturers are quick to respond if you have a question, or you can always ask the course director via the course blog (which everyone can see). If you want to shadow, that's just a quick email away, pretty much anyone you ask will let you shadow them.

[QUOTEHow are the lectures?[/QUOTE]
It depends on the course. Anatomy is amazing (most people say Dr. Schumann is the best professor at Pitt Med), microbio and neuro had good lecturers, and psychiatry was probably my favorite class, and I looked forward to going to those lectures every day. Lectures are mostly Powerpoint-based, and the presentation + the audio is recorded. Very few professors give chalk talks, in which case the audio will be recorded but not the chalkboard. You get a syllabus with all the class notes at the beginning of each course, and I annotate those notes with stuff said/shown in lecture.

Do the professors talk about what is relevant or do they go off on tangents about their research?

The latter is rare, but it does happen (I'm assuming it can happen everywhere...not everyone can be a great teacher). The vast majority of lecturers have presentations that are easy to follow along with in the syllabus. There will be the occasional professor who has a lot of supplemental information in his lecture that is not testable, but that's definitely not the norm. We often got heads up from MS2's about professors not to miss and professors to just podcast at 2x speed (and all MS1's get two MS2 "advisors" so there's always someone you can ask.)

I heard that Cornell is very hands-off and you basically have to teach the material to yourself - can anyone speak to that and is it like that at Pitt too?

Pitt is definitely not hands-off. One of the things that made me choose Pitt was that it feels like family. I know that sounds cliche, but the faculty and administration are seriously invested in the students and their well-being. The facilitators for PBL volunteer to do it, so that really shows how eager the faculty are to teach us. The lecturers always welcome questions during and after class, and many tell us not to hesitate to email them if we're interested in shadowing or doing research in their department. If you ever feel like you're struggling with academics or life in general, doors are always open for help, they'll set you up with tutors, study planning, etc. The dean of the medical school even has lunch with a group of med students once a month to hear from us directly what they can be doing better as a school and as administration. I just feel very welcome here.

The main thing that's holding me back from choosing Pitt is NYC. My mom really wants me to remain here and I have a very strong support system in the city. I've also lived in NYC for so long that I'm scared that I won't be able to get used to a small city like Pittsburgh.

I know there is a huge difference between NYC and Pittsburgh, but Pgh is wonderful! 😍


I hope that helped. Let me know if you have any other questions.

 

[shirahyuki]

Thank you for all of the information, Ismet! =) Is there anything that you don't like about Pitt? I feel like I've been hearing quite a bit of negative stuff about Cornell but only positives from the Pitt side when searching the forums. =P

 

[Ismet]

Thank you for all of the information, Ismet! =) Is there anything that you don't like about Pitt? I feel like I've been hearing quite a bit of negative stuff about Cornell but only positives from the Pitt side when searching the forums. =P

It's honestly hard to think of really negative things to say about Pitt, but I can come up with a couple...

The main thing I don't like is that the building is quite outdated. Most of the schools I interviewed at were either relatively new and shiny and modern, or at least had been renovated at some point. And really the only downside of this is that the lecture halls are kinda cramped (auditorium seating with small pull up desks, instead of the long-table lecture hall style that I saw in a lot of newer schools). But after anatomy, attendance largely drops off and usually only ~1/3 of the class is in attendance, so it's easy to have some space during lectures. The anatomy lab is not the most technologically advanced, and I know a lot of people complained about the lack of windows (floors 1-3 of the building are underground) but personally I didn't mind and it's not like the lab was overly smelly. There's actually a museum in the back of the lab with labeled preserved specimens and a ton of models that we used to supplement the cadaver learning, so I think this lab provided a lot more than some of the fancy new labs I've seen.

Another thing is that a few times this year, there were things that were sprung on us without much warning, like finding out about our advisory dean lunches the day before or not getting the guidelines for a project until a week before (2nd semester MS1 has a kind of "intro to research" class, and we had to do a critical appraisal of a research article and present it in small group, but no one knew what the appraisal entailed until a week before the first groups had to go). It's just an annoyance, especially for those of us who like schedules and like knowing what's coming up. BUT this brings up a positive point of Pitt, in that we are constantly giving feedback to administration on how things are going, and they definitely listen and do something about it. Classes are constantly being tweaked (our biochem class got an overhaul after feedback from the class of 2015, so the change happens relatively quickly). People brought this up when we had a lunch with the dean, and he told us that is definitely something that will be improved. So hopefully it won't be as much of a negative for your class! 🙂

 

[brahms11]

Hi! I recently got taken off of the waitlist for Cornell and received my financial aid information last Friday.

Congrats!

However, I feel like I would ultimately want to work in NYC - would going to Pitt instead of Cornell close any doors for me?

Close doors? No, not really. You could probably match into a NYC residency at Pitt.

That said, Cornell would make matching in NY SO, SO MUCH easier. > 1/3 of our grads stay in the city, usually at Cornell, Memorial/Sloan Kettering, Columbia, Bellevue, Hospital for Special Surgery, and Sinai (as well as Montefiore/other hospitals). (The match list is online, PM if you can't find it.) PDs at these institutions are very familiar with our grads and view them favorably as a "known quantity." Plus, it's super easy to do lots of electives at these institutions w/o travel expenses.

Also, can anyone talk about the teaching styles at the two schools? Are the faculty approachable? How are the lectures? Do the professors talk about what is relevant or do they go off on tangents about their research? Can others give me their general impression of the schools?

Faculty at Cornell are totally approachable. They have met with me outside of normal school hours, check their emails all weekends (especially before tests), and take a genuine interest in the students' well-being.

Lectures are generally good, with occasional bad ones (same at any school with multiple lecturers per week). This is especially true for the main lecturers in physiology, pharmacology, and most of my small group/PBL leaders.

Lectures focus on testable material. When a prof addresses their research, they put it at the end and let us know (because they're not allowed to test that information!) All lectures are video-recorded, but the majority of the class enjoys going even this late in the second term of M1!

Being done by 1 PM all of M1 & most of M2 is a huge, huge benefit. You'll have lots of time to explore NYC/hang out with family/get involved in research/extracurriculars at your discretion.

I heard that Cornell is very hands-off and you basically have to teach the material to yourself

Don't confound "hands-off" with team learning and mixed modalities. No school will be a hand-holder, as that won't help you get through boards and the wards. Cornell does an excellent job of presenting salient facts/concepts in lecture, hammering them in along with clinical reasoning & presentation skills in PBL, and enriching your knowledge/research skills in journal club/epidemiology write-ups/etc. The idea is to make you self-sufficient acquirers of information and good team members. As I mentioned before, the faculty will bend over backwards to make sure you are caught up and offer help if you are struggling. They really want you to succeed.

For tuition, Pitt is cheaper than Cornell by $10k for me. I really loved the school during my interview day - everyone was so friendly and laid-back. Cornell's interview day was pretty bad - I believe my two faculty interviews were both stress interviews and they were awful. =\

I didn't love my interview day here (or in undergrad, for that matter) but am really glad I came. Since you missed revisit, definitely call Lori and ask to stay with a current M1/visit again. Several students have done this after coming off of the waitlist.

The main thing that's holding me back from choosing Pitt is NYC. My mom really wants me to remain here and I have a very strong support system in the city. I've also lived in NYC for so long that I'm scared that I won't be able to get used to a small city like Pittsburgh.

Support systems are great for med school, especially when things can get overwhelming. It is also easy to get used to things like 24/7 pharmacies and 24/7 public transit 🙂.

Good luck with your decision!