Ten - Game Thread

[apoptosis09]

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Okay here goes

 

[samac]

Samac why u make 13 pages

hello i samac have you met me

 

[WildZoo]

apop is a brave soul

 

[samac]

apop is a brave soul

for wading through it or for the screaming if she comes to the wrong conclusion?

 

[apoptosis09]

You’re village reading me?
Wat
When have you ever done that

Poke at kiz in like the first page

So you think the reads are NAI?
What would you like them to do to AI

Discussion of toby, semi-protective

Wasp/kcalb dynamic is very interesting

Attn to wasp

I think it is fair to question anyone hard village reading me but so far I think that’s only been kc.
What do you think about that in context of we’ve never played together?

pointing out kcalb early village reads

Unyeet Clem
Yeet beans

Early yeet on clem; later see this sustained for several days. Seems genuine

That group of 3 felt like a grab bag and after the performative vig comment I just didn’t like it.
I may feel better now?
I may want to move to genny?
I’m not sure

Poke at a wolf

I like this post. Not a reason wolfy Toby to make make this post.

Protecc on toby

….. YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN AM
YEET WASP

Yeet on wasp

Don’t like their nothing burger posts and feels like they have coasted in their few posts

I think this was on wasp

Don’t **** me santy

Unyeet wasp
Yeet kitz

Wolf -> wolf jump. Either very villagey or Ms. Frizzle level bussing

If it’s genny and wasp I will be insufferable

You still have a chance!

I also feel weird village reading an 8 person wagon but I’m village reading the wagon for now

Woofs were in this wagon

That’s the big thing. Looking at the wagon you, beans, and KC were early and good votes. Santy started the momentum, I followed, moon is village and Toby reads independently as village. It feels nice

Tr on toby

WALL POST

I hated this. This felt like confused wolf.

It’s my pocket get out.

Guess this doesn’t matter anymore

I don’t remember why this stood out to me when it did but I did not like it

Beans pure

This feels like a “why you interested in my partner” post

Good post

ITS MY POCKET

GOOD BEANS

Hate this post so much and it’s scummy

I don’t like this either

Frustration with questioning could give Dubz some village points. She likes to be friendly when wolf.

I don’t remember why I wanted this

I didn’t like this post. At the same time saying it’s not out of his wolf range but also saying null.

I like this post. It’s a push on kitz that feels pure

Not great for SAR tbh

I don’t like this, cause what Santy did doesn’t out the village PR.

This feels like wolfy protect packmate

Good post. Like post.

Good work

So this is prime bussing opportunity

I quoted for his legacy. I liked it.

This could be guilt of bussing as kitz returned to wolf chat.

This was a lot but gleaned a tr on toby and wr on wasp. Tracks with above and doesn’t fit my bussing theory

Nah nah nah I want answers

Keeping toby in the convo

I use too much meta to build bloccs.
I’m not allowing myself.
I got a pretty good blocc now though.
With Santy, beans, fruit, and KD.
And Toby is close behind

Toby tr again

Santy
Fruit
Beans
KC
Toby

Spurs

Then the rest is a mess tbh. Leaves me with an 8 person Poe with one post less
Are we village reading Rae? And why?

Kcab is the only read here still alive. One was wolf

yeet wasp

Wasp yeet

…..
Santy that pulled me into kitz at the last minute? That Santy?


Imma use the back half of this post to say Oh by the way I feel like you all need to know we got every question right, including bonus questions, in the MCU trivia.
And then got to the wager and had to list some movies in order of highest international box office.
We got 2 mixed up in the middle and lost at the last question
Rip my husband is still heartbroken

I just pulled all of kitz direct mentions/reads

Fruit village

Fruit village, me village, zenge village
Moon wolf

Spurs village

Fruit village

Me village

Discussion with me about me being village.
I shoulda been up her butt around here but hindsight is 20/20 and I was trying to not meta read her lol

Mention of Clem, but I think important to note not a read.

Moon wolf

Moon

Santy asks for a Clem wagon and she yeets Santy.
You right ain’t great for Clem.
I think the village folks seem like pure village tbh. It can be easier for a nooblet wolf in an open set up to play give the village reads than find their own push

Wolf push on moon

Unyeet wasp
Yeet Clem

Move onto clem

I thought genny felt wrong when she hit the thread last cycle but I wanted high posting genny today so dropped it.

Some sus of genny waning

I guess when I get information from flips it’s usually like “if genny flips wolves these people are where I’d go next or these are the people that should be cleared from the push” and I feel like SAR has more information related to that then genny. Genny has not fulfilled her high posting processes.

Tossing up genny and sar

Thank youuu
Am i a good person to sheep? Prolly not
Has Wasp done anything to move herself out of being my vote? No

Wasp again

Yeah sure
Unyeet Clem
Yeet wasp

“
[

Talk to me about QQ a little more

Well 1. She's delightful, really fun person
2. She's pretty dangerous as Scum and gets locked the **** in

So she’s more disengaged than you’d expect as scum?

Yeah exactly

]
this interaction collectively. Puts was in a pretty protective spot of qq which doesn’t fit the bussing we’ve seen, but samac seems to determine this means we are paired

I dunno if I’ve seen you do it but I know you and you could.
Nooblet wolf gone,
Comes back to wolf chat and is like why you do this to me?
You feel big feels
Yes
Dubz could do that
You’re a softie
It’s not like it’s Mel or stagg

Points out bussing

unyeet Clem
Yeet genny

unyeet genny
Yeet clem

Yeet genny

You don’t think genny could be paired with wasp?

Strong swing at genny

I pulled all of the wasps mentions of folks
I think it clears KC even though I wasn’t suspicious of them. You don’t chose to make a post with 2 reads and they’re both pack mates.
Doesn’t look great for Clem tbh. Noncommittal after saying she wants to look into him more

Working out what this means for kc given known bussing

I agree. Like I said I feel pretty good right now. Wasp was solidly in my Poe consistently. We’ve gotten 2 wolves in 2 days. I like this threadstate rn.
I am concerned there may be a deep wolf hiding around but I don’t feel like I need to feed into that paranoia now

Deepwold mention when we still had/have (if counting myself) some non-deep options

That’s not deep wolfing tho, just semantic wise. He didn’t shove kitz into the ground.
But I did like the post and still have it book marked actually

Then samantics of deepwolfing

unyeet genny
Yeet clem

Bus is just a bus. You vote a packmate.
A deep wolf runs that bus over their packmate. Drives that ship - ergo death mommy Dubz getting a stagg wagon started.

Same above. Semantic push seemed odd

Okay this one isn’t great.

How’s the psychosis.
I’m a psychiatrist. Need help?

Push on toby

Here’s the question, Toby got wolfing over on AM twice. You think they wouldn’t interact with their partner?

Again waning the tr on toby now that he’s getting zenge’d

What about your progression on wisp from thinking TWTBW to voting there. Can you walk me through that?

Wasp mention

So you weren’t wolf reading wasp at all?

“

I’ll be honest I don’t know that I have a strong genny read.
I changed to Clem.
I still feel Clem has equity and he is not doing a lot today to absolve that

Genny up again

genny busses. Don’t let site meta hold you on that one.

“

My issue is with your D3 continued willingness to try and make genny happen

Bringing this up bc zenge points out the sustained genny push by toby even as it was making him more sus. Not related to samac I just found it while reading

This here is what I’m not vibing with

Same above

unyeet toby

Genny controversially pulls off of toby to avoid hammer

It would be the combo of genny doing it with wasp I think.

Out of context made me LOL. But mention of genny v wasp interactions

I don’t know if beans would deepwolf. I don’t know enough about her wolf game. She was an early vote on kitz but did she push wasp or Toby? I don’t remember her doing so

Once again though, intellectual exercise. I don’t think it’s beans or Dubz

Discussion of deepwolfs that would technically implicate herself if she was incldued in the analysis

I will never!
I’ll bus if I gotta. I don’t throw based on no bus meta, he’ll I voted Dy when I subbed in for you because I felt boxed in. But the moment I had a solid reason to move to someone else I jumped off that wagon so fast.

Point out

I guess I’m just worried about getting into f3 and then being the misyeet bait. I can’t stand that life. I ****ed it up in death mommy because I was so scared to be the one having to defend myself and PSV was in my Poe I through the vote down and lost us the game.

I feel town locked here and feel like I have done the things that should scream im town and i should be NKable but zenge dropping me to neutral, i think cause that spreadsheet, and you saying this in your probably last cycle worries me for a repeat of that world and it scares me.

So I’m just hoping it ends with Clem.

End of the clem v genny discussion. Now seems uninterested in genny in favor of me


All this to say I think the overall process feels towny and wold have to be an early deepwolf. Doesn’t really fit my pack strategy theory but is possible if samac really wanted to pull a win for champs practice.
The interactions around genny though are making me lean more to genny assuming samac is town.

 

[samac]

Oh it's also a little bit more than 13 pages you have to click see older.... I just checked.....

 

[apoptosis09]

apop is a brave soul

That took me an hour 😭

 

[apoptosis09]

Oh it's also a little bit more than 13 pages you have to click see older.... I just checked.....

Ngl I trimmed off early D1 fluff and most of when I jumped in

 

[apoptosis09]

Who else is still playing? Fruits and dubz?

 

[samac]

Poke at kiz in like the first page

Discussion of toby, semi-protective

Attn to wasp

pointing out kcalb early village reads

Early yeet on clem; later see this sustained for several days. Seems genuine

Poke at a wolf

Protecc on toby

Yeet on wasp

I think this was on wasp

Wolf -> wolf jump. Either very villagey or Ms. Frizzle level bussing

You still have a chance!

Woofs were in this wagon

Tr on toby

This was a lot but gleaned a tr on toby and wr on wasp. Tracks with above and doesn’t fit my bussing theory

Keeping toby in the convo

Toby tr again

Kcab is the only read here still alive. One was wolf

Wasp yeet



Wolf push on moon

Move onto clem

Some sus of genny waning

Tossing up genny and sar

Wasp again

“
[







]
this interaction collectively. Puts was in a pretty protective spot of qq which doesn’t fit the bussing we’ve seen, but samac seems to determine this means we are paired

Points out bussing







Strong swing at genny

Working out what this means for kc given known bussing

Deepwold mention when we still had/have (if counting myself) some non-deep options

Then samantics of deepwolfing



Same above. Semantic push seemed odd

Push on toby

Again waning the tr on toby now that he’s getting zenge’d

Wasp mention

“

Genny up again

“

Bringing this up bc zenge points out the sustained genny push by toby even as it was making him more sus. Not related to samac I just found it while reading

Same above

Genny controversially pulls off of toby to avoid hammer

Out of context made me LOL. But mention of genny v wasp interactions

Discussion of deepwolfs that would technically implicate herself if she was incldued in the analysis

Point out

End of the clem v genny discussion. Now seems uninterested in genny in favor of me


All this to say I think the overall process feels towny and wold have to be an early deepwolf. Doesn’t really fit my pack strategy theory but is possible if samac really wanted to pull a win for champs practice.
The interactions around genny though are making me lean more to genny assuming samac is town.

I was excited to see if you'd try and push me into the POE with the ISO. But you didn't. That makes this feel much less agenda-y then I thought you would.
Ugh.

ya know what i got from reading this? Toby is a bad bunny with deep pockets 😡

 

[samac]

Who else is still playing? Fruits and dubz?

yep

 

[apoptosis09]

I was excited to see if you'd try and push me into the POE with the ISO. But you didn't. That makes this feel much less agenda-y then I thought you would.
Ugh.

Sorry I'm not tastier 💔

 

[samac]

I don't know what to do. I don't know that I"m going to have time to sit and think about it this afternoon, I gotta go out of town this evening. 🙁
@WildZoo figure it out. Let me sheep you pls.

 

[fruitsalad]

props and respect to apops for putting in the effort into isoing everyone

 

[fruitsalad]

I don't know what to do. I don't know that I"m going to have time to sit and think about it this afternoon, I gotta go out of town this evening. 🙁
@WildZoo figure it out. Let me sheep you pls.

samacs pls the fruitfoil still holds!

 

[samac]

samacs pls the fruitfoil still holds!

That it's KC?

 

[fruitsalad]

That it's KC?

WZ could be wolfing!

although i’m prioritizing kcalbs over WZ

 

[samac]

WZ could be wolfing!

although i’m prioritizing kcalbs over WZ

I really don't think so

 

[fruitsalad]

I really don't think so

well the only one i’m really really village reading is beans

and maybe genny

 

[fruitsalad]

beans is pure

purest beans 🫘🫘

 

[WildZoo]

At this point my leans are

Town: Kitzuna who seems pretty active but also isn't slamming down on the Is Town or Is Scum

Scum: Kcalb is doing the opposite which is kind of pinging my radar, as potentially performative

The Avocado where we play via a combination of Discord Rooms for Faction Chats and Disqus comment sections for Game Days. It's glorious. The Roleplays and rivalries over the years have been intense.

I ask myself this every day lol jk

Okay so here is where I remind myself that this post exists

And usually I would be like "wtf there's no way a wolf makes their packmates their only two reads"

But hey I don't know Wasp, and maybe this is how she likes to do things. This pack didn't exactly shy away from talking about each other, though direct interactions are interestingly a bit more sparse. Up to this point on d1 none of the known pack had said anything about QQ, despite the fact that she'd popped in. I just find that a bit odd that none of them had mentioned her - makes me lean more village on that slot.

Toby in particular made a point of talking about Wasp despite saying he was going to look into the top "consensus" scum, which Wasp was not at the time as far as I can tell (just had the one vote from samac on the board and she hadn't given a reason yet).

So like on balance I think this pack was more likely to talk about each other than to leave each other out of the conversation. I can't see them all just forgetting QQ existed up to this point.

 

[WildZoo]

WZ could be wolfing!

although i’m prioritizing kcalbs over WZ

Fruit. You really need to stop this. There is a very real chance that I end up in f3 if it goes there because I'm perceived as the least clear of the blocc and you're going to get me misyoten and lose us the game if that happens. There has not been a single good argument for why I make sense as a part of this pack except "Well maybe WZ is deepwolfing!" which is negated by the fact that I moved off of kitz and Wasp. If I was voting them for the cred I would have gotten the damn cred. And Toby made an effort to try to start a wagon on me d1 when I was pretty absent, at a point when kitz was already getting some side-eyes. I was the FIRST person he really pushed. Santy tried to drum up sus on me later on d1 and when he asked if others agreed that I wasn't acting right in the interactions about SAR, toby was one of the FIRST to be like "yeah that's pretty sus." We had a whole back and forth about it the next day cycle. Go read that again and tell me that's a wolf/wolf interaction with the knowledge that Santy and SAR were both village.

 

[apoptosis09]

“Low posting” dubz is 10 pages smh

Although 6 of those are after i joined
So maybe I’m the problem

 

[WildZoo]

Day 1 Yeet Tally
Clem (3) - moon 17, Spurs 69, Kcalb 33
Santy (2) - samac 42, Clem 7
moon (1) - fruit 25
fruit () -
Kcalb () -
Zenge () -

6/17
yeet close in ~5.5 hours

I'll probably just take the consensus 3-5 top sus and dig deeper and see who I prefer when I have time

Kcalb was my initial ping so I'll include them too

This is just funny because toby goes on to talk about Kcalb, beans, and me. None of whom were on the board or top sus at the time lol

Day 1 Yeet Tally
Clem (3) - moon 17, Spurs 73, Kcalb 34
Santy (2) - samac 62, Clem 7
moon (2) - fruit 25, beans 28
fruit (1) - genny 15
Kcalb () -
Zenge () -
beans (1) - Dubz 20

9/17
yeet close in ~3.5 hours

On second read of Kcalb I actually think they are just pure towny, the post that pinged me before was below,

I thought it was giving over explanation and panic and struggling to commit to an opinion, which it is, and it does ping me, but only when taken out of context. When looking at their posts altogether they seem to be quite consistently trying to solve and showcasing true townie paranoia. Their opinions and tone is quite sporadic that I don't see coming from a wolf, particularly as they said this is their first english mafia game, they might choose to be more reserved. But they're jumping in and calling out names which is grabbing attention that I don't see a wolf wanting to have

Been over this one. Makes you wonder why toby felt the need to village read kcalb.

Did a dive of Wildzoo since they were there, not really a single hint of solving in their posts yet


opening post dont like - I feel it comes more from wolf than town, a wolf isnt afraid to be nk'd


and there's like 3 posts talking about sheeping that I tried to multi quote but it didnt work

but so far their presence just seems like they are spectating and chiming in with things that people shouldn't expect a wolf to say. I havent seen anything towny yet

Wildzoo

@Animal Midwife

And this to me is just toby going for what he may have perceived as low hanging fruit

Looked at Beans

They seem okay so far, my only thing is they haven't given any reasons for any town reads despite having 6 of them, which does make me think they don't want to commit to any town leans :
(soft village: samac, spurs, kcalb, zenge, rae, fruit )

There was also a comment that despite being sus of wasp, voting them wouldn't be nice and I don't know why
@beans2020 is there context to that

okay lets see what this wasp is buzzing about then

Who is the other player from The Avocado here?

I don't see much from Wasp so far, they say they come from discord rooms so I'm assuming if they play on discord it's usually a lot more fast paced, and I haven't seen that kind of playstyle yet

Not much on wasp, this isn't really important, just reiterating that toby seemed to make a point to talk about packmates

ok its mrsqueequeeg

Only comment on QQ was to say she was the other player from the avocado, no commentary on her posts

Day 1 Yeet Tally
Clem (2) - Spurs 85, Kcalb 34
Santy (1) - Clem 13
moon (3) - fruit 28, beans 30, kitz 22
fruit (1) - genny 20
Kcalb () -
Zenge () -
beans (1) - Dubz 33
Dubz (1) - toberto 25
Wasp (1) - samac 75
SAR (2) - Santy 49, moon 27

12/17
@moonstermash is in the lead!
yeet close in ~2 hours

I find opinions like these sus especially d1

^ This was directed at kitz

Im down for a Kitz wagon yes yes

Unyeet Clem
Yeet kitzuna

🍿

This wasn't that long after the toby comment. Still struggling with two wolves ganging up on the same packmate like this...I think beans was really the only other one pushing her at the time though it's possible Santy had mentioned her already and I didn't see it in this reread because I have the dead villagers on ignore. In any case, kcalb was the first vote there.

Day 1 Yeet Tally
Clem (1) - Spurs 92
Santy (3) - Clem 13, SAR 21, rae 30
moon (2) - fruit 28, kitz 22
fruit (1) - genny 20
Kcalb () -
Zenge () -
beans (1) - Dubz 56
Dubz (1) - toberto 27
Wasp (1) - samac 75
SAR (2) - Santy 49, moon 35
kitz (2) - Kcalb 38, beans 38

13/17
@Santygrass is in the lead!
yeet close in ~1 hour

Dead villagers will now be unignored so I can read the last hour of d1 with full context...😮‍💨

 

[WildZoo]

“Low posting” dubz is 10 pages smh

Although 6 of those are after i joined
So maybe I’m the problem

Endgame is the problem. I can't help myself. Also I bet most of my first ~ 2 pages are nonsense and then being pissy at Santy lol

 

[fruitsalad]

Fruit. You really need to stop this. There is a very real chance that I end up in f3 if it goes there because I'm perceived as the least clear of the blocc and you're going to get me misyoten and lose us the game if that happens. There has not been a single good argument for why I make sense as a part of this pack except "Well maybe WZ is deepwolfing!" which is negated by the fact that I moved off of kitz and Wasp. If I was voting them for the cred I would have gotten the damn cred. And Toby made an effort to try to start a wagon on me d1 when I was pretty absent, at a point when kitz was already getting some side-eyes. I was the FIRST person he really pushed. Santy tried to drum up sus on me later on d1 and when he asked if others agreed that I wasn't acting right in the interactions about SAR, toby was one of the FIRST to be like "yeah that's pretty sus." We had a whole back and forth about it the next day cycle. Go read that again and tell me that's a wolf/wolf interaction with the knowledge that Santy and SAR were both village.

WZ pls, i'll be dead at that point

We need to consider that something is going really really wrong if apop is also village. And I said I'm prioritizing kcalbs over you, if for some reason i'm alive and kcalbs flips village, then something IS going very wrong

like

that can't be ignored. it's deepwolfing territory and no i'm not referring to past games or any precedents but the likelihood of who would deepwolf and why, because the situation at this point is abnormal and unprecedented

i'll be forced to reconsider genny as well

samacs has the same suspicion equity as you, because samacs DID bus her packmate before and ended up fooling me in the process, so i would need to consider that as well. sure, that can be explained away as samacs subbing into a bad spot like how death mommy is a nonstandard game

but if apop is village

nothing about THIS game is standard

 

[WildZoo]

WZ pls, i'll be dead at that point

EXACTLY

You will be dead and have flipped village and the other villager in f3 with me (let's be real, it probably would be samac which is horrible) will be all paranoid about me because you couldn't see reason.

We need to consider that something is going really really wrong if apop is also village. And I said I'm prioritizing kcalbs over you, if for some reason i'm alive and kcalbs flips village, then something IS going very wrong

like

that can't be ignored. it's deepwolfing territory and no i'm not referring to past games or any precedents but the likelihood of who would deepwolf and why, because the situation at this point is abnormal and unprecedented

i'll be forced to reconsider genny as well

samacs has the same suspicion equity as you, because samacs DID bus her packmate before and ended up fooling me in the process, so i would need to consider that as well. sure, that can be explained away as samacs subbing into a bad spot like how death mommy is a nonstandard game

but if apop is village

nothing about THIS game is standard

And I'm saying that you keep saying I am a deepwolfing possibility but what deepwolf in their right mind throws away the cred they would have gotten by hopping off their packmate's vote at the last minute when they're going over anyway.

This isn't about meta.

 

[apoptosis09]

Hmm lemme look at SAR

I am generally good at finding village!Clem too (and mistaking wolf!Clem for village!Clem but shhhhh I might have learned from last game) but on my quick skimming of his posts he's not really said anything game related so that makes it...harder

First read is clem, mid-late D1. Sustained later on

In my reading SAR posts I also came across some other posts and will also dump rae and Zenge in my pile of people I'd resist voting for today

rae's post about samac squinting at her just felt very genuine given her recent experiences (sorry I didn't quote it, my bad)
Zenge is Zengeing so far.

I think my pile of resistance is at Spurs, SAR, Zenge, rae for game content reasons. Possibly genny. And also mrsqueequeg (do we have a nickname here yet?), Toby, Wasp, Kcalb for courtesy reasons

Watch the wolves all be in that group! That would be funny!

2/3 known wolves in village read, although for courtesy reasons

I guess I have left myself with beans, Clem, moon, Santy, fruit, kitz

Putting kitz in sus D1; not really very dubzy but possible sans meta

Hrm. This post is. Hrm.

this was a response to Moon sussing kitz and tr toby

Could you remind me why kitz, or link me to the post where you explained if you already did?

Bringing kitz into discussion again d1

Dang it now I have to go find kitz's reads list

Hey @SARdoghandler, do ya got a read on your wolf pup?

“

Hello

Can you explain your Wasp vote?

Bringing wasp vote into consideration. Very similar to the handling of a wolf above

I just would appreciate it if you would get off my ass and let me breathe and figure out what I want to do. I am fine with moving to Clem if needed, it just feels kind of meh so I am seeing if there are other alternatives since you're insistent that beans is village. I am looking at kitz.

Kitz again

Well, my d1 reads are trash anyway

unyeet Clem yeet kitz

yeet onto kitz earlyish

I don't pussyfoot around my packmates so I don't actually think what I did around kitz is at all in line with my wolf meta. Nor is it actually that hard to tell the difference between busy Dubz and wolf Dubz. Y'all literally saw the same Dubz early last game and said the same stuff lol

A bit prickly, seems like village dubz

If Santy is a wolf here he is the most dick wolf to ever wolf since there is no way the kitz vote happens without him bringing her up as an option, very last minute, when he easily could have kept asking people to vote for Clem or continued with SAR

Protecc on santy after scuffling with him earlier. town points.

I don't really understand why you're wasting your posts on this since you said yourself you're not pursuing it today, but the people voting for Santy still didn't react quickly, most of them stayed on his vote, I think SAR is the only one who moved and she just unvoted. It was others. If he had said everyone vote Clem, then moon and myself and probably others who ended up on kitz would likely have done so in the same rapid fashion.

Prickling toward spurs

I actually don't think this means anything tbh. Wolves end up stacking their votes all the time. Sometimes they aren't aware of the tally, especially if it's been a while since the other wolf voted, sometimes it's strategic for exactly the reason that people don't expect it to be a thing.

This is a bit contrary to statements dubz has made in other games

That's okay, I'll do it

Yeet Wasp

Another yeet on a wolf

Oh that post was more directed at Spurs. I don't expect you to know me well enough to look beyond the surface level of my being dumb d1. I haven't done anything that is clearing lol

Interesting point out

Well I'm between Wasp/Clem/SAR

Have wasp on wolf reads again

No, that's just from reading the thread. The soul read is dead.

The way she treated kitz this game was pretty similar to how she treated kitz when they were wolfing together previously. And there were a couple of her posts that I responded to earlier that made me raise an eyebrow about her approach to me.

I do still have to go back and reread the exchange with Santy and there's some stuff that gives me pause that I've already mentioned, but I won't be shielding her today.

Admittedly it's very hard for me to vote for her so I'll likely end up on Clem, or I might stay on Wasp (though I'm mostly here for the tie).

Sussing SAR is admittedly a little out of character for dubz

I don't think it's inherently wrong to see it that way but that wasn't why I didn't want to give a strong opinion. I'm just not someone that gives strong opinions when I don't feel informed on the topic at hand. I would have been happy to comment otherwise. I commented on what I felt I could, which was that generally I don't associate retaliatory votes with SAR's wolf play.

It also just didn't feel that important to me in real time, I think I said this somewhere else, eventually it became a big deal but when their whole back and forth started I was just like...not even paying that much attention to it. Sadly can't remember what I was more focused on at the time but I'm sure it was something that seemed more interesting to my brain in that moment

I don’t remember why I pulled this but the tone feels village!dubz

@samac

Town:
Santy
beans
fruit

All due to the kitz yeet, I don't feel like I need to type a bunch more on these

Wolf:
Clem - combination of I just can't get a handle on his actual thoughts this game and kitz's reaction to him being on the board
Wasp - I can't remember lol I may have just been sheeping you
SAR - I'm still struggling here on my solo read of her vs some pretty pairing stuff between her and kitz

Wolfing wasp again. Others are lowish fruit.

How many times do I need to do the same exercise?

Clem, SAR, Wasp, genny. QQ I don't have points for either way.

“

Oh yeah there was the thing of Wasp having kitz as her only village read
True that does seem...odd for packmates. Though it's also overall an odd read. Hrm.

Mention of two wolves

unyeet Wasp yeet Clem

Bounce off of a wolf after pushing them for a while. This doesn’t feel like a bus to me

Wasp is the apoptosis of this game

Still want to know what this means

If people don't start getting through their heads that disengaged Dubz is never, ever wolf!Dubz I just don't even know what to say. You can look at any wolf game from me in the last decade and not find a single one where I was absent most of d1, didn't seem like I had a handle on what was going on, or otherwise was coasting. I will ruin my life to stay in control of the thread when I'm wolfing lol

People who are new I get it, whatever. But people who have played with me, especially who have played with me when I was wolfing? Do better.

Defending herself again with meta in a game we’re specifically told to try to avoid meta, but the defensive tone kinda feels like town dubz

Clem - the way kitz reacted to him being on the board was very "hey what is my partner doing there". Also he's reading me wrong, so. Otherwise there's not a lot to say here, d1 he barely did anything game related, which could be town but is also very easy to do as a wolf and would be of course very different from how he played his last wolf game so maybe intended to throw people off. Today he's picked things up a bit but mostly to list town reads that are not all that exciting or anything. I'm mostly leaning on kitz's posts here and a lot of null from Clem himself.

genny - seems kind of bitey in places but I am having a hard time with trying to remember whether that is more v!genny or w!genny tone. Please advise for those who do have a feeling on this? Otherwise I'll try to refresh my memory later. In a non-meta sense this post really bothers me - I know later genny said she was reading kitz village because of the US women's hockey comment, which was obviously not serious, but having her in this initial post just feels odd.

SAR - Still struggling here, on reread my solo read is still that this is v!SAR for reasons already mentioned (her reaction to Santy's vote is the big one) plus some tonal things, but it's hard to ignore the partnering stuff with kitz. The specific callout of her as neutral on kitz's reads list sticks in my craw, and of course there's the defense of kitz from SAR that reads very similar (though less intense) to the last time they wolfed together. I'm not sure which thing I should prioritize right now, but I would rather look elsewhere first and circle back to her. Because I'm weak.

Wasp - I see Santy's points but I can't in good conscious move her out of neutrals. Wild to have kitz as her only village read. TWTBW or was that how it was meant to look?? I don't know. I simply don't know.

samac - I need to ruminate on my uneasy feelings about samac more. There are some early interactions with her/kitz that I need to look at in the context of samac's entire posting during that timeframe to make sure I'm not confbiasing because in limited game context they strike me as unnatural, but that could also just be coming from kitz's side. I am curious if her initial push on beans had something to do with a roundabout defense of kitz but need to look at that in context as well, and I don't think that beans was voting for kitz yet at that point so I'm probably overthinking. The move to Wasp was odd, I was expecting her to come back and reveal it was some kind of reaction test just because it was so weird for her to decide to vote for a visitor without explanation, but then it was just kind of a boring read? There are a couple moments that I mentioned before that I microread as v!samac though so I'm tabling all that for night cycle spiraling when I can maybe spend more time looking at overall context.

QQ - neutral, sorry, I just don't have a lot in my brain here and I forgot I should have left her unignored when I was going back through d1. Will update later.

rae - very much a tone read but I just feel like this is the village rae I have seen in recent games and I can try to articulate that further at some future time, though I think I previously mentioned the post that triggered that feeling for me (it was a response to samac)

Spurs - I can't say I'm seeing anything different from his village game here, and he's hitting all his standard v!Spurs pushes (which is kind of funny). His hop on and off of kitz would just be...odd for a packmate imo. Also this doesn't feel like a response he would make to a packmate's reads list.

Zenge - I mean I guess there's some chance we're living in some bizzaro new world of wolf!Zenge behavior but that seems unlikely to me at this stage. I think he and Santy were just having their usual tiff.

Kcalb - overall has felt towny to me, though they stopped saying nice things about me so I've exited the pocket probably. This interaction with kitz feels pretty good.

Toby - approach to the kitz yeet felt very towny, interactions we've had have felt reasonable and like they're trying to actually solve/not pushing an agenda. I probably need to look more closely here because I otherwise have kind of been rolling with everyone else being like "oh yeah feels towny" and need to make sure I'm not missing something.

beans - obviously. I don't think she calls out kitz's initial reads list the way she did if they were packmates. Less strong than I was on it prior because I see she didn't vote for kitz until way later, but it's still pretty good.

fruit - I should probably find a non-meta reason for a fruit read but uhhhh I'm lazy so someone else can handle that. We'll stick with the #neverbusser read for now.

Santy - Only a wolf if he decided to be a dick for no reason, I am choosing not to live in that universe. Also I only ever get yelled at by villagers lol

Tl/dr lands with wasp in neutral and toby in town, after pushing wasp for a while

This is the closest thing Wasp gave to a reads list recently

Pointing out wasp reads

A full reassess when someone in the POE flipped wolf and someone not in the POE flipped village? From my perspective I'm not even surprised that SAR flipped village. What's got you so jumpy?

Pointed at zenge

Is Toby compatible with Clem?

Asking for clem compatibility w/ toby, bringing attention to the 3rd wolf up for yeet

Hey! I asked question! Could it be Toby and Clem??

Same above

Squinty squonty

This was at spurs yeeting toby

Who do you think is Clemmy Clem's partner?

Again pushing for a clem partner when he hadn’t flipped yet

You're not the only one anymore. samac and fruit have picked up the mantle. You know I'll sheep you (and I think the arguments are good even if I'm not doing the work myself). This doesn't die with you.

It doesn't have to be unanimous, and there are two wolves left. You gotta let people do their own thing and come to things in their own way, especially if you think they're village. Everyone deserves to have game autonomy, even if they've been wrong before. Working together doesn't mean one person strongarming everyone else. Even if you're right.

And as someone who generally doesn't like being told what to do in these games, I think it would be better for thread health if you let people breathe. We have the rest of the day and we're halfway to hammer already. Toby isn't going to slip away without anyone noticing.

Push against zenge again. This feels towny and doesn’t fit the bussing universe

This was one of Toby's D1 posts. He was also on my ass for the SAR/Santy thing and only let it go VERY BEGRUDGINGLY when it became clear I wasn't going to lie down and die over it and no one else was interested. Wasp shaded me multiple times.

Wolves were obsessed with me, probably because nobody told them that even a low posting Dubz isn't an easy yeet.

So y'all can get my name out of your POEs.

Another defensive meta post

Deepwolfing in champs doesn't count against your site meta hmmyes

Then followed by this which is interesting

@Kcalb I'd really prefer if you spent time on figuring out if apop or genny is a better option since there is just not really a universe where we're voting into the lock today. It's locked for a reason so for me it would be helpful if you put the solving effort into those two instead since it might help me evaluate the sincerity of your solving. Given you're the other option on the table.

Not to tell you how to play the game, just recognizing that for me and probably others it would be useful to get your perspective on them and less useful to rehash the reasons why the consensus town people are consensus town at this stage.

Bringing up genny again but doesn’t actually seem interested in the yeet

But here I am reading d1 again and just not being able to stomach toby and kcalb sussing kitz at the same time for the same posts if they were packmates TT_TT

Admittedly town dubz is a softy and I lowkey believe this.

Overall the kitz push started a little too early and the clem and wasp pushes held steady.
Imo the tone is town and the process could certainly be village. Not my top choice for deepwolf

 

[apoptosis09]

Endgame is the problem. I can't help myself. Also I bet most of my first ~ 2 pages are nonsense and then being pissy at Santy lol

Ngl my village read on you is 50% due to spatting with spurs, zenge, and santy all separately lol

 

[WildZoo]

Ngl my village read on you is 50% due to spatting with spurs, zenge, and santy all separately lol

I don't think I intended to be prickly at Zenge but Spurs and Santy know what they did 😛

 

[apoptosis09]

Also irrelevant meta read that wolf dubs wold be going for my head much harder

 

[WildZoo]

Defending herself again with meta in a game we’re specifically told to try to avoid meta

No one said I had to avoid meta!

 

[fruitsalad]

EXACTLY

You will be dead and have flipped village and the other villager in f3 with me (let's be real, it probably would be samac which is horrible) will be all paranoid about me because you couldn't see reason.[/spoiler]

WZ pls, i'd like to imagine the surviving villager at that point would reevaluate everything and make a reasonable conclusion regardless of my tinfoils/paranoia

And I'm saying that you keep saying I am a deepwolfing possibility but what deepwolf in their right mind throws away the cred they would have gotten by hopping off their packmate's vote at the last minute when they're going over anyway.

This isn't about meta.

it's not a standard game at that point

like we're seriously entertaining the possibility of genny being wolf which sounds crazy to me but then we rationalized it saying toby might be deepwolfing out of panic and things went really badly

so when wolves are in a really bad state, they won't be thinking rationally

i don't know what toby was doing or what waspy was doing

so reasonably, i think apop is a hit, if i'm also wrong, then kcalbs is immediately POE'd because the reasons to village read her are weakest vs everyone else, including you, because the way you're putting up the fight does in fact have village undertones that i see

 

[fruitsalad]

rip SDN slaughtered the quotes

 

[fruitsalad]

EXACTLY

You will be dead and have flipped village and the other villager in f3 with me (let's be real, it probably would be samac which is horrible) will be all paranoid about me because you couldn't see reason.

WZ pls, i'd like to imagine the surviving villager at that point would reevaluate everything and make a reasonable conclusion regardless of my tinfoils/paranoia

And I'm saying that you keep saying I am a deepwolfing possibility but what deepwolf in their right mind throws away the cred they would have gotten by hopping off their packmate's vote at the last minute when they're going over anyway.

This isn't about meta.

it's not a standard game at that point

like we're seriously entertaining the possibility of genny being wolf which sounds crazy to me but then we rationalized it saying toby might be deepwolfing out of panic and things went really badly

so when wolves are in a really bad state, they won't be thinking rationally

i don't know what toby was doing or what waspy was doing

so reasonably, i think apop is a hit, if i'm also wrong, then kcalbs is immediately POE'd because the reasons to village read her are weakest vs everyone else, including you, because the way you're putting up the fight does in fact have village undertones that i see

 

[fruitsalad]

ok now it's fixed!

 

[WildZoo]

2/3 known wolves in village read, although for courtesy reasons

Nooooo those are not village reads! My village reads are the people I said I wasn't voting for for game-related reasons. The others I had no read on (I said this later) and just wasn't going to vote for because courtesy. It's not my fault the plot armor people keep being wolves lately!!!

Putting kitz in sus D1; not really very dubzy but possible sans meta

And to be clear that list was just the remaining players that were vote options after I took out the courtesy folks and the people who I actually was village reading.

This is a bit contrary to statements dubz has made in other games

it is??

Bounce off of a wolf after pushing them for a while. This doesn’t feel like a bus to me

Still want to know what this means

These were after Santy said he was shielding Wasp. His main argument was that no one was coming to her defense and she was TWTBW. So it made me think of when everyone was wolf reading you and you ended up flipping village.

Of course that all ended up being wrong and Wasp was in fact just wolfy enough to be wolf...

Again pushing for a clem partner when he hadn’t flipped yet

In context I was asking Spurs this because he was so sure on Clem and I wanted to see where his head was at for the remaining wolf/was still trying to decide how to sort him

Another defensive meta post

That post wasn't meta! That was a not-meta-based defense.

Admittedly town dubz is a softy and I lowkey believe this.

town!dubz is simultaneously soft and prickly hehe

 

[WildZoo]

it's not a standard game at that point

like we're seriously entertaining the possibility of genny being wolf which sounds crazy to me but then we rationalized it saying toby might be deepwolfing out of panic and things went really badly

so when wolves are in a really bad state, they won't be thinking rationally

i don't know what toby was doing or what waspy was doing

so reasonably, i think apop is a hit, if i'm also wrong, then kcalbs is immediately POE'd because the reasons to village read her are weakest vs everyone else, including you, because the way you're putting up the fight does in fact have village undertones that i see

I mean I'm talking about d1. A wolf in my position, regardless of any meta, does not break a tie towards their packmate and then "Whoopsie nevermind" and throw away that cred at the last minute when it would not save their packmate from death. It makes zero sense to do that.

 

[beans2020]

Got out of class finally
I'm going to peek at genny and kc now, probably focusing on their interactions with the wolves.

 

[beans2020]

FWIW the defensiveness we are seeing from dubz is very village!Dubz

 

[fruitsalad]

FWIW the defensiveness we are seeing from dubz is very village!Dubz

i'm going to sheep beans and say i agree

 

[Animal Midwife]

Day 5 Yeet Tally
kcal () -
apop (2) - fruit 30, genny 25

2/7
yeet close in ~4.5 hours

 

[beans2020]

Genny: so genny's posts alone (not taking into account what Toby said about her specifically) aren't necessarily clearing. She village read kitz and wasp and then dropped wasp from village to wolf reads so fast. Also no stated opinion on Toby until Toby kept voting for her.

I'd also argue that the way wasp handled genny was not unpairing. All wasp did was hop on genny to "break the tie" (or create a tie? I can't remember what the gimmick was now). I could see wasp doing that to a packmate if she didn't think genny was likely to go over.

 

[apoptosis09]

Last but not least

 

[beans2020]

Then we come to genny and toby. And that's where I start to squint. Toby's iso looking at only posts where he mentioned genny/talked about her was like over a page. Which is a crazy amount to talk about one player. That makes me think he was going for her as an easy target.

 

[samac]

WZ pls, i'll be dead at that point

We need to consider that something is going really really wrong if apop is also village. And I said I'm prioritizing kcalbs over you, if for some reason i'm alive and kcalbs flips village, then something IS going very wrong

like

that can't be ignored. it's deepwolfing territory and no i'm not referring to past games or any precedents but the likelihood of who would deepwolf and why, because the situation at this point is abnormal and unprecedented

i'll be forced to reconsider genny as well

samacs has the same suspicion equity as you, because samacs DID bus her packmate before and ended up fooling me in the process, so i would need to consider that as well. sure, that can be explained away as samacs subbing into a bad spot like how death mommy is a nonstandard game

but if apop is village

nothing about THIS game is standard

Sir I subbed into a losing pack. I was just trying to make sure you all have a fun solving game.

I wouldn’t vote my packmate day 1, move to my other packmate, throw my vote on my packmate again day 2, and then stay off my packmates wagon on d3.
I’m not a deep wolf, I won’t deep wolf and I sure as **** wouldn’t **** up that meta going into champs. That would be flat out dumb.

 

[beans2020]

Last but not least

I just spent way too long staring at this

 

[samac]

EXACTLY

You will be dead and have flipped village and the other villager in f3 with me (let's be real, it probably would be samac which is horrible) will be all paranoid about me because you couldn't see reason.


And I'm saying that you keep saying I am a deepwolfing possibility but what deepwolf in their right mind throws away the cred they would have gotten by hopping off their packmate's vote at the last minute when they're going over anyway.

This isn't about meta.

No I die
I more clear than fruits
Fruit more likely to deepwolf than me
Take him to endgame pls if we’re wrong wolfie.
Not me.
I too clear.
Yes.

 

[fruitsalad]

Last but not least

ok rip apop hypnotized me 💫💫

 

[beans2020]

I guess my conclusion on genny right now is re-evaluate her if apop flips village...which seems to be everyone's conslusion. She's more towny than apop. TBD how she compares to kc. Less towny than the town lock folks.