2009-2010 Case Western Reserve University Application Thread

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Completely off-topic:

For both programs, when do you buy your stethoscope? I assume you buy Littmann (3M) brand? Do you buy them through the school? Do you have to get a certain model?

The reason I ask is because I shadow in an ER. I am allowed to auscultate and I end up using whatever crappy, nasty pair is left in the ER. Well, using stethoscopes-of-unknown-provenance in an Emergency Department is not terribly appealing to me. Plus, they don't leave the cardiology-grade 'scopes lying around.

Anyways, I thought I might indulge myself and buy a 'scope now. Besides its practicality, it would be a sort of symbolic "up-yours" to those who thought I wouldn't get into med school, plus a personal reward for busting my arse on the MCAT...
 
vc7777 said:
Completely off-topic:

For both programs, when do you buy your stethoscope? I assume you buy Littmann (3M) brand? Do you buy them through the school? Do you have to get a certain model?

The reason I ask is because I shadow in an ER. I am allowed to auscultate and I end up using whatever crappy, nasty pair is left in the ER. Well, using stethoscopes-of-unknown-provenance in an Emergency Department is not terribly appealing to me. Plus, they don't leave the cardiology-grade 'scopes lying around.

Anyways, I thought I might indulge myself and buy a 'scope now. Besides its practicality, it would be a sort of symbolic "up-yours" to those who thought I wouldn't get into med school, plus a personal reward for busting my arse on the MCAT...
Click to expand...

We buy ours through the school sometime during block one at a discount (though I don't know how much). Littmann is fairly popular, though you are given a couple of options and the opportunity to test them out.👍
 
vc7777 said:
Completely off-topic:

For both programs, when do you buy your stethoscope? I assume you buy Littmann (3M) brand? Do you buy them through the school? Do you have to get a certain model?

The reason I ask is because I shadow in an ER. I am allowed to auscultate and I end up using whatever crappy, nasty pair is left in the ER. Well, using stethoscopes-of-unknown-provenance in an Emergency Department is not terribly appealing to me. Plus, they don't leave the cardiology-grade 'scopes lying around.

Anyways, I thought I might indulge myself and buy a 'scope now. Besides its practicality, it would be a sort of symbolic "up-yours" to those who thought I wouldn't get into med school, plus a personal reward for busting my arse on the MCAT...
Click to expand...

When I started this whole process, my sister (who is in her residency now) bought me a stethoscope for Christmas. It's a Littmann brand, but they make a number of different models. She had mentioned to me that this was a very good stethoscope and was widely used but a little less expensive than their top of the line model.

I'm at work right now though, so I can't tell you exactly which model it is, but I'll post it here when I get home.
 
vc7777 said:
Completely off-topic:

For both programs, when do you buy your stethoscope? I assume you buy Littmann (3M) brand? Do you buy them through the school? Do you have to get a certain model?

The reason I ask is because I shadow in an ER. I am allowed to auscultate and I end up using whatever crappy, nasty pair is left in the ER. Well, using stethoscopes-of-unknown-provenance in an Emergency Department is not terribly appealing to me. Plus, they don't leave the cardiology-grade 'scopes lying around.

Anyways, I thought I might indulge myself and buy a 'scope now. Besides its practicality, it would be a sort of symbolic "up-yours" to those who thought I wouldn't get into med school, plus a personal reward for busting my arse on the MCAT...
Click to expand...

vc777 -- check this link out:
http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/Littmann/stethoscope/purchase/buyers-guide/
I bought mine from amazon, as I find the best prices & selection there.
 
I'm here at Case! Interviewing tomorrow! Where are da parties at, playas?! lol
I have all day to relax. Is there anything on campus/around campus I should go see?
 
OMSTR said:
I'm here at Case! Interviewing tomorrow! Where are da parties at, playas?! lol
I have all day to relax. Is there anything on campus/around campus I should go see?
Click to expand...

hey, i'm on my way to case! maybe we'll run to each other!
 
housemd? said:
vc777 -- check this link out:
http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/Littmann/stethoscope/purchase/buyers-guide/
I bought mine from amazon, as I find the best prices & selection there.
Click to expand...

Thanks folks,

I am looking into all of it. And I've been researching this since I took my MCAT in the spring on-and-off, so this isn't an impulse buy....

Well, here's my personal analogy: When I was accepted to a couple of nice engineering programs as a senior in high-school, I bought a very nice calculator (HP RPN Scientific) that I still have and still use (VERY banged up, and very well used/loved). It was way more powerful than I needed then, and it is just right for me now although showing its age. Plus, other engineers respect my calc...it's old-school and like geeky street-cred.

I am hoping to do the same with a Littmann. But I also know some schools want you to use a particular model, so you are all listening to the same sounds.

Here's an older link to a nice page that compared a whole bunch of 'scopes based on acoustic transfer functions (similar to bode plots).

http://www.forusdocs.com/reviews/Acoustic_Stethoscope_Review_page4.htmhttp://www.forusdocs.com/reviews/Acoustic_Stethoscope_Review_page1.htm

The summary was that a one of the Littmanns (Cardio III, which is now not the top-of-the-line) was objectively superior

Some of the Littmanns (all?) have lifetime warranties too.

I figure if I'm gonna shell out some money, I might as well get one that will last me a very long time.
 
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vc7777 said:
Thanks folks,

I am looking into all of it. And I've been researching this since I took my MCAT in the spring on-and-off, so this isn't an impulse buy....

Well, here's my personal analogy: When I was accepted to a couple of nice engineering programs as a senior in high-school, I bought a very nice calculator (HP RPN Scientific) that I still have and still use (VERY banged up, and very well used/loved). It was way more powerful than I needed then, and it is just right for me now although showing its age. Plus, other engineers respect my calc...it's old-school and like geeky street-cred.

I am hoping to do the same with a Littmann. But I also know some schools want you to use a particular model, so you are all listening to the same sounds.

I am trying to find a link I used to have to a nice page that compared a whole bunch of 'scopes based on acoustic transfer functions (similar to bode plots). The summary was that a couple of the Littmanns were objectively superior for their price-points. Some of them (all?) have lifetime warranties too.

I figure if I'm gonna shell out some money, I might as well get one that will last me a very long time.
Click to expand...

Are you EE?

I just got a Littmann from my gf as a graduation present/congrats for getting into med school. It's the Classic II, and it's lightyears better than my old one ($11 on amazon :laugh:).
 
Bryson17 said:
Are you EE?

I just got a Littmann from my gf as a graduation present/congrats for getting into med school. It's the Classic II, and it's lightyears better than my old one ($11 on amazon :laugh:).
Click to expand...

Yeah, my sparky-side is showing again!😀 I devoured the plots on-line, and I guess I used it to back-up qualitative comparisons from docs who say "this one is crisper" or "That one is louder"....and IMHO is explains in one overlay plot the 'tunable diaphragm" feature a heck of a lot better than 3M (the manufacturer) does on their pages!
 
Oh EE. All my EE friends were back in town this weekend for a football game, so I've been reminiscing about it all weekend. I'll have to look around for the stethoscope frequency responses. They sound interesting.
 
Bryson17 said:
Oh EE. All my EE friends were back in town this weekend for a football game, so I've been reminiscing about it all weekend. I'll have to look around for the stethoscope frequency responses. They sound interesting.
Click to expand...


Found it, and edited original post to add link. See above...it is old, but info is still useful...
 
I bought a classic II, but only because it was cheaper.:laugh: Lots of our classmates went for the cardio III, though I still see classic IIs running around in the hospital.
 
Myuu said:
I bought a classic II, but only because it was cheaper.:laugh: Lots of our classmates went for the cardio III, though I still see classic IIs running around in the hospital.
Click to expand...

That's the model my sister got me. I've been using it in my EMT and Hospital work and like it quite well, but don't really know enough to know what I'm missing, either.

Edit: The Classic II S.E. to be specific...I don't even know if there is any other model of the Classic II available, but I figured I'd specifiy...
 
Among the other things you can buy here at supposedly reasonable rates (and are required anyway):

• Reflex hammer (Babinski, not tomahawk--telescoping, rotating head or no is up to you)
MDF535.jpg


• Penlight
• Mini vision chart
• Tuning fork (there's a neuro-vs-everyone-else thing going on for frequencies here, so I'll let you figure that out when you have to)
prestige_tuning_forks.jpg

Note that those are not the same as these: http://www.phys.cwru.edu/ccpi/Tuning_fork/Koenig_tuning_fork_set_of_13.jpg
Or these: http://www.thesciencefair.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/TuningForkResonantSet_1309_1_M.jpg (I just thought they were neat)
 
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Myuu said:
Among the other things you can buy here at supposedly reasonable rates (and are required anyway):

• Reflex hammer (Babinski, not tomahawk--telescoping, rotating head or no is up to you)


• Penlight
• Mini vision chart
• Tuning fork (there's a neuro-vs-everyone-else thing going on for frequencies here, so I'll let you figure that out when you have to)

Note that those are not the same as these: http://www.phys.cwru.edu/ccpi/Tuning_fork/Koenig_tuning_fork_set_of_13.jpg
Or these: http://www.thesciencefair.com/Merchant2/graphics/00000001/TuningForkResonantSet_1309_1_M.jpg (I just thought they were neat)
Click to expand...

Sweet! I love resonators! I worked with micro-scale resonators for years...near and dear to my heart! Judging by the geometries, the numbers must represent the frequency of the forks?

And as a wannnabe flyfisherman I love gadgets in general! I can't wait...

Next you are going to tell me they make Utility-belt/lab coat combos to carry all this stuff all day long like they do for kilts:

http://www.utilikilts.com/

[no, I don't have one, and no I've never worn a kilt...but in case you ever find the need to wear one AND carry tools, now you know!]
 
vc7777 said:
Sweet! I love resonators! I worked with micro-scale resonators for years...near and dear to my heart! Judging by the geometries, the numbers must represent the frequency of the forks?

And as a wannnabe flyfisherman I love gadgets in general! I can't wait...

Next you are going to tell me they make Utility-belt/lab coat combos to carry all this stuff all day long like they do for kilts:

http://www.utilikilts.com/

[no, I don't have one, and no I've never worn a kilt...but in case you ever find the need to wear one AND carry tools, now you know!]
Click to expand...

Hahaha, wow. I was about to say I wanted one. Then I realized they ranged in price from $180-$600.😱

And as a side note, we're beating the Mayo thread by 250 posts. Way to step up, guys!
 
Anybody know anything about Second Look? I'm anxious to visit again!
 
rockaction said:
Anybody know anything about Second Look? I'm anxious to visit again!
Click to expand...

It's a Fri night-Sun morning event in March. You'll have to get your own transportation to Cleveland, but once here, we provide all food, housing and transportation.
 
ugh if i got into case or cclcm (god i hope so!!), i will get so annoyed about the abbrev "UP". up here in michigan that stands for "upper peninsula".. i'm gonna get so confused when someone will ask "are you in the UP?"
 
iceman77_7 said:
It's a Fri night-Sun morning event in March. You'll have to get your own transportation to Cleveland, but once here, we provide all food, housing and transportation.
Click to expand...

I dig. 👍

That will be so much fun!!
 
musafirah said:
ugh if i got into case or cclcm (god i hope so!!), i will get so annoyed about the abbrev "UP". up here in michigan that stands for "upper peninsula".. i'm gonna get so confused when someone will ask "are you in the UP?"
Click to expand...

You won't have to worry about that, because no one uses that here except to differentiate between us and CCLCM.:laugh:👍
 
vc7777 said:
Thanks folks,

I am looking into all of it. And I've been researching this since I took my MCAT in the spring on-and-off, so this isn't an impulse buy....

Well, here's my personal analogy: When I was accepted to a couple of nice engineering programs as a senior in high-school, I bought a very nice calculator (HP RPN Scientific) that I still have and still use (VERY banged up, and very well used/loved). It was way more powerful than I needed then, and it is just right for me now although showing its age. Plus, other engineers respect my calc...it's old-school and like geeky street-cred.

I am hoping to do the same with a Littmann. But I also know some schools want you to use a particular model, so you are all listening to the same sounds.

Here's an older link to a nice page that compared a whole bunch of 'scopes based on acoustic transfer functions (similar to bode plots).

http://www.forusdocs.com/reviews/Acoustic_Stethoscope_Review_page4.htm

The summary was that a one of the Littmanns (Cardio III, which is now not the top-of-the-line) was objectively superior

Some of the Littmanns (all?) have lifetime warranties too.

I figure if I'm gonna shell out some money, I might as well get one that will last me a very long time.
Click to expand...


Lol, bode plots, sure bring up some painful memories! I did like signals better than semiconductors though.... Anyhow, if you read the methods section, they used a Sennheiser headset as the transducer to record the sounds, so there could be an added element of bias in there.

Here's a graph of the Sennheiser HD600's frequency response:

http://graphs.headphone.com/graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID[]=573
Only when the two graphs are combined can the true frequency response of the stethoscope be determined. Somebody good with signals should do that 😀
 
Last edited:
dingyibvs said:
Lol, bode plots, sure bring up some painful memories! I did like signals better than semiconductors though.... Anyhow, if you read the methods section, they used a Sennheiser headset as the transducer to record the sounds, so there could be an added element of bias in there.

Here's a graph of the Sennheiser HD600's frequency response:

http://graphs.headphone.com/graphCom...Type=0&graphID[]=573

Only when the two graphs are combined can the true frequency response of the stethoscope be determined. Somebody good with signals should do that 😀
Click to expand...
Bode plots, Smith charts, Laplace transforms, convolutions...love it!:meanie:

Yes, I am a signals guy too...semiconductors is not my bag...I drove microsensors made by our sensors fabrication group...and 'read' back responses on femto- and atto-farad capacitors (no small feat!)...analog signal processing and circuit designer, vc7777 at your service!

Can't follow the link (probably a fault on my end?) but you have a valid point. I am sure there would be usefulness in a full-blown paper on the subject, but before I say any more, it's not my area of expertise!

I still think this report is a far cry from qualitative comparisons...and besides, since they were all tested with the same setup, the relative comparison is far more important (assuming the system is linear when calibrated). Furthermore, while I am not sure if it plays a role, the human ear has a transfer function as well which is not flat across the frequency band either...Also, the length of the tubing will play a role, which I am sure could gum up the system too!

Hmmm...I smell a research paper for an enterprising pre-med...
 
Most importantly, I think the 'expert' (doctor who has spent years listening through a particular set) would be more concerned with switching to a different 'scope for fear of "distortion" in what they expect to hear, but for a beginner I am not sure it is as relevant?
 
oops, fixed the link.

But you're right, it probably doesn't really matter which one has the flatter response, as long as the physician knows which sound stands for which symptom.
 
vc7777 said:
Completely off-topic:

For both programs, when do you buy your stethoscope? I assume you buy Littmann (3M) brand? Do you buy them through the school? Do you have to get a certain model?

The reason I ask is because I shadow in an ER. I am allowed to auscultate and I end up using whatever crappy, nasty pair is left in the ER. Well, using stethoscopes-of-unknown-provenance in an Emergency Department is not terribly appealing to me. Plus, they don't leave the cardiology-grade 'scopes lying around.

Anyways, I thought I might indulge myself and buy a 'scope now. Besides its practicality, it would be a sort of symbolic "up-yours" to those who thought I wouldn't get into med school, plus a personal reward for busting my arse on the MCAT...
Click to expand...
I got a Littman as a graduation gift, but I don't think it really makes a difference. I still suck at hearing murmurs. Of course, I have some trouble with sound discrimination in general....

Myuu said:
And as a side note, we're beating the Mayo thread by 250 posts. Way to step up, guys!
Click to expand...
Natch. 😎

rockaction said:
Anybody know anything about Second Look? I'm anxious to visit again!
Click to expand...
vc7777 said:
Yes, me too! But I figured it would be announced after the New Year?
Click to expand...
Yes, the details will be sent out later.

iceman77_7 said:
It's a Fri night-Sun morning event in March. You'll have to get your own transportation to Cleveland, but once here, we provide all food, housing and transportation.
Click to expand...
I'm not sure what the deal will be this year, but in the past, CCLCM has given acceptees a couple hundred dollars to help defray travel expenses. For those of you who get accepted by both programs, the second looks are back-to-back, so you can use the CCLCM travel funds for both. 👍

musafirah said:
ugh if i got into case or cclcm (god i hope so!!), i will get so annoyed about the abbrev "UP". up here in michigan that stands for "upper peninsula".. i'm gonna get so confused when someone will ask "are you in the UP?"
Click to expand...
University Program has more syllables than Upper Peninsula does. Epic lose for the Upper Peninsula. :diebanana:

vc7777 said:
Most importantly, I think the 'expert' (doctor who has spent years listening through a particular set) would be more concerned with switching to a different 'scope for fear of "distortion" in what they expect to hear, but for a beginner I am not sure it is as relevant?
Click to expand...
Don't worry, you're going to just smile and nod half the time anyway when they ask you if you hear the murmur. Trust me on this. :meanie:
 
CCLCMer said:
Don't worry, you're going to just smile and nod half the time anyway when they ask you if you hear the murmur. Trust me on this. :meanie:
Click to expand...

LOL! A friend and I were both in the ED late one night and this doc had us use his stethoscope to listen to a patient's lungs, while giving us a long description of what we were listening to...we both were polite and nodded, but agreed later on when he wasn't around that be both didn't hear a dang thing!
 
is iapply still down? i was wondering what time do i have to be at the admissions office for the interview? is it really at 8am? even though an email I got said my interview isn't til 915. i just wanted to make sure. thanks!
 
OMSTR said:
is iapply still down? i was wondering what time do i have to be at the admissions office for the interview? is it really at 8am? even though an email I got said my interview isn't til 915. i just wanted to make sure. thanks!
Click to expand...

CCLCM or UP?

If it is for the UP, see my really long post one page back...

That which you seek shall be found there...
 
If you don't get an interview invite for the college program now, does that mean that you basically don't have a chance anymore? since it is so small a program? :-(
 
vc7777 said:
Bode plots, Smith charts, Laplace transforms, convolutions...love it!:meanie:

Yes, I am a signals guy too...semiconductors is not my bag...I drove microsensors made by our sensors fabrication group...and 'read' back responses on femto- and atto-farad capacitors (no small feat!)...analog signal processing and circuit designer, vc7777 at your service!

Can't follow the link (probably a fault on my end?) but you have a valid point. I am sure there would be usefulness in a full-blown paper on the subject, but before I say any more, it's not my area of expertise!

I still think this report is a far cry from qualitative comparisons...and besides, since they were all tested with the same setup, the relative comparison is far more important (assuming the system is linear when calibrated). Furthermore, while I am not sure if it plays a role, the human ear has a transfer function as well which is not flat across the frequency band either...Also, the length of the tubing will play a role, which I am sure could gum up the system too!

Hmmm...I smell a research paper for an enterprising pre-med...
Click to expand...

dingyibvs said:
Lol, bode plots, sure bring up some painful memories! I did like signals better than semiconductors though.... Anyhow, if you read the methods section, they used a Sennheiser headset as the transducer to record the sounds, so there could be an added element of bias in there.

Here's a graph of the Sennheiser HD600's frequency response:

http://graphs.headphone.com/graphCompare.php?graphType=0&graphID[]=573
Only when the two graphs are combined can the true frequency response of the stethoscope be determined. Somebody good with signals should do that 😀
Click to expand...
Man. We've got three EE's in here. Crazy to think that I graduated without learning how to read a smith chart! :meanie:.

I'm a little confused about the frequency response of the Litmanns. My manual says to press harder to hear higher frequencies when using the diaphragm side. Wouldn't that change the frequency response? I guess they probably just took the measurements with very little force on the diaphragm. Because they came to the conclusion that the stethoscopes were better at low frequency.
 
brooklynblunder said:
what kinda laptop do you guys get ?
Click to expand...
I seem to remember that the UP students have a few different kinds they can choose from. CCLCM students all get the same kind, because the school gives them to us for free. Mine is a Gateway tablet, but they've been giving the underclassmen other computers that aren't tablets. So where I'm going with this is that I have no idea what next year's incoming class will get. But I can tell you that it will be nicer than mine, because the current first years have cameras and biometrics and all kinds of other cool toys, even though theirs aren't tablets. Their laptops are smarter than I am. 😛

vc7777 said:
...and what kind of feeling(s) do you get when you look over the computer? Can you e-mail Canada? 😀
Click to expand...
Nice. :laugh:

Not only can I email Canada, I can even Skype there. :wow:

eyepop said:
If you don't get an interview invite for the college program now, does that mean that you basically don't have a chance anymore? since it is so small a program? :-(
Click to expand...
They're still giving out invites, so don't give up hope yet. :xf:

OMSTR said:
thanks, man! wish me luck!!! 🙂
Click to expand...
Good luck! You'll have a great time.
 
Homoochan said:
When you guys write e-mails to the admissions office, which address do you guys use??

[email protected]? or just send it to Mr. Chrisitian Essman? :scared:
Click to expand...

I don't know which address is best, but if you're worried about sending an email to Christian Essman, don't. He's very nice. Actually, all of the Case staff I met during my visit were nice.
 
iApply was finally up this morning and I found an interview waiting for me!

I will be there December 14😀
 
Can't recall if it's already been discussed here, but does CCLCM send word if an applicant's been passed over for an interview, or only if they're invited? (thanks for the info)
 
Myuu said:
Correct. I am insted learning how to identify a seminoma.
Click to expand...

  • uniform cells
  • abundant clear cytoplasm
  • sharply outlined cell membranes
  • large, central nucleus
  • clumped chromatin
  • lymphocytic infiltrate
 
Showa57 said:
Can't recall if it's already been discussed here, but does CCLCM send word if an applicant's been passed over for an interview, or only if they're invited? (thanks for the info)
Click to expand...
They haven't sent out any rejections yet, if that's what you're asking.

st0w said:
  • uniform cells
  • abundant clear cytoplasm
  • sharply outlined cell membranes
  • large, central nucleus
  • clumped chromatin
  • lymphocytic infiltrate
Click to expand...
I learned today that usually seminomatous germ cell tumors produce hCG, as do nonseminomatous germ cell tumors. HOWEVER, nonseminomatous germ cell tumors also produce alpha-fetoprotein. And that is how you can biochemically tell them apart, which is good to know at my stage since there's usually no path report given on Step 2. 😛
 
I am going to attempt to upload a picture I took today on my way home. For those of you not in Cleveland, you missed the one perfect fall day we have had for this year. Sorry. :meanie:

fallincleveland.jpg


Can you guys see the picture?
 
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