2013-2014 Stony Brook University Application Thread

BU Medical Sciences
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For those of you not able to go to second look this Friday, have you emailed back saying you can't make it?
 
tewpac said:
For those of you not able to go to second look this Friday, have you emailed back saying you can't make it?
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Yes, and I asked them to email me any important information I might miss. They were very helpful 🙂
 
boomboompow said:
Yes, and I asked them to email me any important information I might miss. They were very helpful 🙂
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surely said:
I emailed them earlier today - Haven't received a reply yet, but it's Saturday, so...
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Alright cool, yeah I was hoping I could make it but can't because of work. I'm thinking people here will also fill us in on anything important when they get back 🙂
 
Just got back from Second Look. You should email Mary Allen if you want an estimate of your financial aid package, including any need based institutional aid. The official award won't be available until June or July. Also, Stony Brook is transitioning to 1.5 year curriculum. Let me know if you guys have any other questions.
 
Just got back from second look. Overall I had a good time. It was a lot of sitting in an auditorium but they gave a good overview of everything at Stony Brook and things to look forward to. In regards to financial aid packages, they said you could email the woman in charge of financial aid to get an estimate of what your need based awards would be, assuming you submitted all the financial aid info they asked for. PM me for specifics if you couldn't attend and wanted more info about what happened/was said!
 
Steven1991 said:
So it has almost been 2 months since i interviewed and still no news. Anyone else wait this long?
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Why don't you send email? They will respond and tell you your status. You should have been rejected by now. You are probably on some sort of waiting list. Try to determine where you are on the list. Try to improve your standing.
 
At Second Look, was there any mention/discussion of the expected amount of mandatory class for the new 1.5 year curriculum starting in 2014?
 
nontradnyc said:
At Second Look, was there any mention/discussion of the expected amount of mandatory class for the new 1.5 year curriculum starting in 2014?
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I wasn't at second look, but if you follow this link, there are examples of how a week of classes would be spent.
http://medicine.stonybrookmedicine.edu/LEARNcurr/decisions

Looks like for Lectures (self or In class) in the mornings (9-11am), you have the option of watching classes on your own or attending class.

What did they say about this at the Second Look?
 
Has anyone heard anything from SB lately? Interviewed in early February and have not heard anything yet......
 
The wait list e-mail says that the wait list movement won't start until late May-early June. I will be going out of country from May 22nd to June 26th. Does it mean I shouldn't even bother sending a letter of updates since I won't get to respond to phone calls/e-mails promptly?
 
Lya said:
The wait list e-mail says that the wait list movement won't start until late May-early June. I will be going out of country from May 22nd to June 26th. Does it mean I shouldn't even bother sending a letter of updates since I won't get to respond to phone calls/e-mails promptly?
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Why would being out of country prevent phone calls or email? You have cell phone? You have wifi?
 
Just placed on the regular waitlist yesterday. Interviewed in February. Anyone know approximately how many people are waitlisted?
 
Hey Guys,
Accepted via email today at noon. No call. Interviewed mid-March.
OOS, URM, 30+, 3.5.
Will probably attend unless something comes up quickly in late May.
Best of luck to everyone waiting or wait listed.
 
Just withdrew my acceptance today, hope it goes to one of you excellent people still waiting.

Thanks for the help early on in this process with Stony Brook's secondary/waiting/advice. Really appreciated it!
 
wannabeMD19 said:
I wasn't at second look, but if you follow this link, there are examples of how a week of classes would be spent.
http://medicine.stonybrookmedicine.edu/LEARNcurr/decisions

Looks like for Lectures (self or In class) in the mornings (9-11am), you have the option of watching classes on your own or attending class.

What did they say about this at the Second Look?
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I second this question! I also wanna clarify - do we actually have three day weekends to look forward to?! lol I'm only asking because that planned curriculum in the PDF never mentions Fridays and I couldn't attend second look to get this question answered... Anyone..?

nontradnyc said:
At Second Look, was there any mention/discussion of the expected amount of mandatory class for the new 1.5 year curriculum starting in 2014?
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I think somewhere in the curriculum PDF it says classes are not mandatory and the aim of the curriculum is to encourage student based learning rather than solely didactic instruction... Something like that.
 
Got my financial aid offer earlier this week (need-based grant, nice), but I just emailed them to announce my decision to withdraw. Good luck to everyone on the waitlist!
 
surely said:
Got my financial aid offer earlier this week (need-based grant, nice), but I just emailed them to announce my decision to withdraw. Good luck to everyone on the waitlist!
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Was this an official offer or an estimate? I thought they wouldn't be released for another month.
 
hplssrmantcxox said:
I second this question! I also wanna clarify - do we actually have three day weekends to look forward to?! lol I'm only asking because that planned curriculum in the PDF never mentions Fridays and I couldn't attend second look to get this question answered... Anyone..?


I think somewhere in the curriculum PDF it says classes are not mandatory and the aim of the curriculum is to encourage student based learning rather than solely didactic instruction... Something like that.
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Are we looking at the same image? From what I'm seeing, there's 3 hours of mandatory class time Monday-Thursday and 4 hours on Friday. And on some weeks, there is 5 hours mandatory every day.
 
midnight0il said:
Was this an official offer or an estimate? I thought they wouldn't be released for another month.
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That's what I thought too! It was a rather informal email offering me $XX,XXX in need based grants, but it didn't say anything else after that. No information about loans or anything. And I hadn't previously requested any financial aid information, either, since I pretty much knew I was headed elsewhere (despite my positive feelings about SB). Am I the only one who got the financial aid info already?
 
gunnershow said:
Are we looking at the same image? From what I'm seeing, there's 3 hours of mandatory class time Monday-Thursday and 4 hours on Friday. And on some weeks, there is 5 hours mandatory every day.
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I would assume that labs, like anatomy, would be mandatory. And there seems to be a focus on small group study which is also mandatory (could be case studies and whatnot - wouldn't want to do that on a computer/miss that).
 
wannabeMD19 said:
I would assume that labs, like anatomy, would be mandatory. And there seems to be a focus on small group study which is also mandatory (could be case studies and whatnot - wouldn't want to do that on a computer/miss that).
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Regardless, this is considerably more mandatory class time than most lecture-based schools. And it's distributed across every day of the week.
 
gunnershow said:
Regardless, this is considerably more mandatory class time than most lecture-based schools. And it's distributed across every day of the week.
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Especially since I was under the impression that most of the students at Stony Brook commute from various distances, this has to be a huge downside to the school. You would think they would be more understanding of this and make more lectures optional/consolidate them so that the mandatory stuff falls out on fewer days, that way people don't have to drive in for a just a few hours every day....
 
cyberchicken001 said:
Especially since I was under the impression that most of the students at Stony Brook commute from various distances, this has to be a huge downside to the school. You would think they would be more understanding of this and make more lectures optional/consolidate them so that the mandatory stuff falls out on fewer days, that way people don't have to drive in for a just a few hours every day....
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Agreed. *Lectures* are optional, but they claim that over 50% of the curriculum is "active learning" (aka PBL), so it makes that moot. In addition, 50-60% of your grade will be determined by "soft" factors (peer assessments, essays, etc), so I take it there won't be much flexibility with regards to attendance.

Though I do wonder if there will be supplemental online lectures, because I imagine 8 hours of weekly lecture isn't sufficient to cover the breadth of preclinical information in only 1.5 years. It's stated that "Faculty and administration will facilitate provision of high quality e-lectures", but also that "Faculty may use or adapt existing institutional or other high quality/ up to date resources to create an organized, detailed and logical syllabus". I'm hoping "e-lectures" just means recorded lectures (not additional lectures) and that the latter statement means that they'll clearly define external resources for us to self-study instead.
 
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gunnershow said:
Agreed. *Lectures* are optional, but they claim that over 50% of the curriculum is "active learning" (aka PBL), so it makes that moot. In addition, 50-60% of your grade will be determined by "soft" factors (peer assessments, essays, etc), so I take it there won't be much flexibility with regards to attendance.

Though I do wonder if there will be supplemental online lectures, because I imagine 8 hours of weekly lecture isn't sufficient to cover the breadth of preclinical information in only 1.5 years. It's stated that "Faculty and administration will facilitate provision of high quality e-lectures", but also that "Faculty may use or adapt existing institutional or other high quality/ up to date resources to create an organized, detailed and logical syllabus". I'm hoping "e-lectures" just means recorded lectures (not additional lectures) and that the latter statement means that they'll clearly define external resources for us to self-study instead.
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In some ways it seems annoying to have all that scheduled time. But most of the schools I interviewed at had a set up like that (perhaps there was more free time at schools where you alternated in your group who went to anatomy lab)… In the end you alone determine how well you do in medical school and on the STEP exams. The curriculum is just a vehicle, you are the driver. You'll get there in the end regardless.
 
wannabeMD19 said:
In some ways it seems annoying to have all that scheduled time. But most of the schools I interviewed at had a set up like that (perhaps there was more free time at schools where you alternated in your group who went to anatomy lab)… In the end you alone determine how well you do in medical school and on the STEP exams. The curriculum is just a vehicle, you are the driver. You'll get there in the end regardless.
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I agree with you. Success is a function of how hard and how efficiently you can work. Which is why I think the curriculum should reflect that. From what I've read, PBL is a low-yield, inefficient method of learning that doesn't comport well with self-motivated people who could be doing multiple passthroughs of material or active recall (flashcards). I mean, we're not reinventing the wheel here -- basic science + path (and the boards in particular) come down to how much you can memorize. Of course I'll put in the same amount of work and cover the same material, just in a shorter amount of time (fewer hours in the day due to commute+groupwork and fewer days in total because of the shortened 1.5 year curriculum). Being mired in an essay or presentation every week or two just doesn't sound too appealing to me. I'd like to be treated like an adult and given the independence to approach the material in a way that works best for me, that's all. Like you said, it shouldn't matter how you get there.

For what it's worth, many of the schools I interviewed with (particularly Baylor and Vandy) realized this and fashioned their curriculum accordingly, and it's reflected in their board scores. But don't take this as me whining, it's just an idea that I think is worth considering.
 
gunnershow said:
I agree with you. Success is a function of how hard and how efficiently you can work. Which is why I think the curriculum should reflect that. From what I've read, PBL is a low-yield, inefficient method of learning that doesn't comport well with self-motivated people who could be doing multiple passthroughs of material or active recall (flashcards). I mean, we're not reinventing the wheel here -- basic science + path (and the boards in particular) come down to how much you can memorize. Of course I'll put in the same amount of work and cover the same material, just in a shorter amount of time (fewer hours in the day due to commute+groupwork and fewer days in total because of the shortened 1.5 year curriculum). Being mired in an essay or presentation every week or two just doesn't sound too appealing to me. I'd like to be treated like an adult and given the independence to approach the material in a way that works best for me, that's all. Like you said, it shouldn't matter how you get there.

For what it's worth, many of the schools I interviewed with (particularly Baylor and Vandy) realized this and fashioned their curriculum accordingly, and it's reflected in their board scores. But don't take this as me whining, it's just an idea that I think is worth considering.
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I've always been more of a self-motivated, self-learner and your thoughts are pretty much spot on with what I was thinking when I first heard about PBL. But, on the other hand, I feel like the success of PBLs come down to the faculty/tutor and how much the students in your group are gonna buy in to the process. This can mean the difference between unproductive sessions and worthwhile ones.

Though as expected I've heard mixed opinions on it so I'll just have to see for myself, either way I'll adapt and make it work.
 
gunnershow said:
Are we looking at the same image? From what I'm seeing, there's 3 hours of mandatory class time Monday-Thursday and 4 hours on Friday. And on some weeks, there is 5 hours mandatory every day.
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My bad.. I paid attention to the poorly formatted PDF that cut off Fridays -___- fml lol
 
it came down to stony and another school for me, and i decided to withdraw. hope it goes to one of you. good luck! 🙂
 
Will be withdrawing here. Hope it goes to one of you guys on the waitlist! good luck guys!
 
Withdrew my acceptance today, good luck to all!

Edit: just realized I was the third straight person to post a withdrawal from stony. Don't make anything of it lol -Withdrew for personal reasons but I really thought it was an awesome school!
 
gunnershow said:
Curious as to why you guys decided to withdraw
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For me, it was because my wife goes to school in manhattan so stony brook would be way too far for one of us. If it were closer to nyc I would have had a really hard time turning it down.

And it looks like at least 3 of us are turning it down for the same school lol.
 
gunnershow said:
Curious as to why you guys decided to withdraw
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For me, I withdrew because I have decided to attend a top 20. There was no way I could've turned that offer down. But SB is a great school thou!
 
Withdrew just now! Echoing the other posters, I withdrew only because I was offered more money at a NYC school and my SO works in Manhattan. Otherwise, I loved SB and it's definitely experiencing a lot of growth!
 
So is the whole PBL and "Self-directed learning" philosophy basically a way of saving the schools money on getting profs to lecture with the alleged excuse of it being more engaging to students?
 
Azimuthal431 said:
So is the whole PBL and "Self-directed learning" philosophy basically a way of saving the schools money on getting profs to lecture with the alleged excuse of it being more engaging to students?
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They still have lectures every day… and PBL is lead by tutors that are often professors.
 
Azimuthal431 said:
So is the whole PBL and "Self-directed learning" philosophy basically a way of saving the schools money on getting profs to lecture with the alleged excuse of it being more engaging to students?
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Absolutely not. This change was mainly driven by the students who voted with their feet by not showing up to lecture. In the past it was quite common to find a prof lecturing to < 10 second year students. Needless to say the lecturers didn't appreciate this very poor turnout. It was also the students who said they preferred the small group setting instead of a large lecture.

Also I don't really understand why people are complaining about mandatory small group sessions when in return the preclinical years are being truncated from 2 to 1.5 years. Sounds like a fair trade-off to me.
 
Hi everyone. I am leaning towards Stony Brook but my only concern is the curriculum change.
It seems like it's A LOT different from the previous one. 50% of the grade not from exams seems a lot. Peer assessment, oral/written exams, essays, problem solving exercise etc.
And shortening the preclinical from 2 years to 1.5 years sounds a little scary to me.
Anyone on the same boat as me? I guess people are pretty much decided at this point. I'd appreciate if you guys can give me any thoughts on this.
Thanks 🙂
 
There is a general trend in today's medical schools to reform the curriculum in one way or other. You should go to the web site of the other schools and see what they are doing. You will be surprised at what you will find out!!!
 
commserver said:
There is a general trend in today's medical schools to reform the curriculum in one way or other. You should go to the web site of the other schools and see what they are doing. You will be surprised at what you will find out!!!
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Yeah, the other school I am considering changed their curriculum couple years ago. The people who went through the change did not like it but they got through. Bunch of presentations and essays in addition to the basic science seems like a lot, plus doing that in 1.5 years. But the faculties and staff seemed really helpful and I loved the atmosphere at the school. I guess it will be fine 🙂
 
Azimuthal431 said:
So is the whole PBL and "Self-directed learning" philosophy basically a way of saving the schools money on getting profs to lecture with the alleged excuse of it being more engaging to students?
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No, it's a way for them to justify their own salaries. Think about how 95% of the medical school curriculum, in this day and age, could be learned from previously recorded lectures and online textbooks. So you see why they have to change up the curriculum to assert their relevance, to make it seem as if this is the more 'enlightened' way to learn, much better than the 'brutish' lecture+annotating+memorization approach. Of course, they'll neglect to mention that this is pretty much the only approach for most medical school courses (i.e. anatomy, pharma, micro, etc). If you look at the professors who designed this curriculum, a lot of them are PHDs in "education" and are trying to fix things that aren't broken -- Stony Brook recently had its highest Step 1 average. Why change what students themselves say works best for them?
 
gunnershow said:
Voted with their feet? You realize the students were just watching the recordings at home so they could be more efficient in their studying, correct? If a lecture is somehow supposed to be "better" in real life than over a recording, shouldn't the onus be on the professor to format the class in such a way that would entice people to come? Instead, you suggest that we ingratiate ourselves to the egos of professors (whose salaries *we* pay), show up to their classes, and deal with their daily struggles with technology, even though it would be better for us to study at home at a pace that works for us.

Truncated preclinical years would be awesome if we could graduate a half year early and pay half tuition for the 4th year. Instead, it just seems like we have to learn the same information in a shorter amount of time, while at the same time juggling highly inefficient and low-yield mandatory group classes for most of the day, Monday through Friday.
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gunnershow said:
No, it's a way for them to justify their own salaries. Think about how 95% of the medical school curriculum, in this day and age, could be learned from previously recorded lectures and online textbooks. So you see why they have to change up the curriculum to assert their relevance, to make it seem as if this is the more 'enlightened' way to learn, much better than the 'brutish' lecture+annotating+memorization approach. Of course, they'll neglect to mention that this is pretty much the only approach for most medical school courses (i.e. anatomy, pharma, micro, etc). If you look at the professors who designed this curriculum, a lot of them are PHDs in "education" and are trying to fix things that aren't broken -- Stony Brook recently had its highest Step 1 average. Why change what students themselves say works best for them?
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1. I'm assuming you're a current student. This is certainly not the place to voice your displeasure with the curriculum changes.
2. as the person who brought video recording lectures to the school i'm flattered that you think they've had that much of an impact. it doesn't come as a shock that videotaped lectures have made in-person lectures obsolete and hence the change. whether this is the optimal way to do things is yet to be determined but it is certainly in line with the national trend (both PBL and truncated preclinical curriculum) and a step in the right direction
3. it seems that the vast majority of posters here don't see the real value of having 1.5 year preclinical curriculum. starting fourth year earlier is fantastic and a huge advantage. in the old system you started fourth year in july and basically had 2 months before your ERAS was due. Every additional month during fourth year is an opportunity to strengthen your application whether it's doing aways, taking step 2 or doing subIs and electives at your home institution. Any change that adds more clinical elective time should be welcomed with open arms. unfortunately premeds in the application process tend to ignore the clinical education portion of the curriculum because they don't understand the intricacies of it and have no exposure to clinical students during their visits yet this is where the starkest differences between schools lies. a couple hours a day of PBL during the first two years for a couple more months of clinical elective time is a trade you should be happy to make. also keep in mind it's not like there wasn't any PBL/small group stuff in the old curriculum.
 
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