Does anyone know how long 2nd look will run for? I'm looking at leaving from the Greyhound bus station at 4:30 pm (else I'd need accomodation).
2011-2012 SUNY Upstate Application Thread
- Thread starter Sammich117
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It's from 9 to 2pm
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i got rejected from upstate after interview with very high numbers. watevs though, isnt this school being eliminated and losing accreditation anyways?
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erhhhh no.
But sorry you didn't get in. I'm sure you'll get in somewhere else though, with your high numbers. Good luck!
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Bitter much?
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nah not bitter, because they say the school is going to get shut down anyways
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Dont be sorry, I got into UCSD
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Care to define who "they" are? Because all counts I've read regarding this school's probationary status clearly indicate the unlikelihood of the school losing accreditation.
I'm sorry you didn't get in, but it's pretty rude to come onto a forum where people are excited to have gotten into this school only to talk poorly about it because you didn't get in.
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Clearly he wouldn't have fit in anyway.
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well then congrats on getting in
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you're right about that. i definitely would not fit in at upstate.
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u mad?
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First of all stop hatin u know u mad bitter in a corner somewhere. I know I know, I would be mad 2.
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First of all stop hatin u know u mad bitter in a corner somewhere. I know I know, I would be mad 2.
Si, im hatin and im mad bitter in a corner bc of my ucsd acceptance =) have a good weekend
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The mature thing to do would be to admit you were wrong to come onto the forum only to bash the school. Instead, you continue to attempt to speak down to a group of people who were accepted to a school from which you were rejected. Not to mention the people who are here looking for support as they hope to get that acceptance that you too were hoping for at one point.
I sincerely hope that you learn a bit of humility.
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call them? they did say you can call to check your status if you have not heard back after 4weeks when i interviewed...
I guess I probably should. I will call maybe Thursday/Friday. Give them another week I suppose.
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Accreditation group finds erratic learning environment at Upstate medical school
Published: Tuesday, March 06, 2012
By James T. Mulder / The Post-Standard
"...LCME says in a 192-page report that explains why it put the medical school on probation...The report shows the committee found the school out of compliance with 15 accreditation standards."
"Objectives of the medical school are not consistently used to guide curriculum.
"School's objectives are not consistently stated in outcomes-based terms that allow assessment of
student progress.
"Some clinical courses in medical specialties do not consistently apply the same criteria to all
students.
"No process to ensure the school's objectives are made known to students, residents and faculty.
"Comparable education experiences and assessment across all instruction sites do not exist in
some courses.
"Students in some courses do not get final grades on a timely basis.
"No system to ensure formal feedback to students in some courses.
"No effective authority for the overall design, management and evaluation of a coherent and
coordinated curriculum.
"Dean does not have authority to modify curriculum.
"No faculty committee effectively monitoring course content to ensure educational objectives are
met.
"Different clinical requirements at regional campuses and inadequate oversight of the rural training
program.
"Different numbers of credit hours required for graduation at the Syracuse and Binghamton
campuses.
"Little evidence student feedback is used to improve the educational program.
"School has a lower than national average student awareness of mistreatment policies and an above
average percentage of students reporting mistreatment.
"More than 100 fourth-year students shared answers on online quizzes or were aware of such
activity."
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/03/accreditation_group_finds_erra.html
Published: Tuesday, March 06, 2012
By James T. Mulder / The Post-Standard
"...LCME says in a 192-page report that explains why it put the medical school on probation...The report shows the committee found the school out of compliance with 15 accreditation standards."
"Objectives of the medical school are not consistently used to guide curriculum.
"School's objectives are not consistently stated in outcomes-based terms that allow assessment of
student progress.
"Some clinical courses in medical specialties do not consistently apply the same criteria to all
students.
"No process to ensure the school's objectives are made known to students, residents and faculty.
"Comparable education experiences and assessment across all instruction sites do not exist in
some courses.
"Students in some courses do not get final grades on a timely basis.
"No system to ensure formal feedback to students in some courses.
"No effective authority for the overall design, management and evaluation of a coherent and
coordinated curriculum.
"Dean does not have authority to modify curriculum.
"No faculty committee effectively monitoring course content to ensure educational objectives are
met.
"Different clinical requirements at regional campuses and inadequate oversight of the rural training
program.
"Different numbers of credit hours required for graduation at the Syracuse and Binghamton
campuses.
"Little evidence student feedback is used to improve the educational program.
"School has a lower than national average student awareness of mistreatment policies and an above
average percentage of students reporting mistreatment.
"More than 100 fourth-year students shared answers on online quizzes or were aware of such
activity."
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/03/accreditation_group_finds_erra.html
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I'll try to address all of these briefly.
"...LCME says in a 192-page report that explains why it put the medical school on probation...The report shows the committee found the school out of compliance with 15 accreditation standards."
"Objectives of the medical school are not consistently used to guide curriculum.
--I don't know what this means--
"School's objectives are not consistently stated in outcomes-based terms that allow assessment of
student progress.
--I think this explains the previous statement; I guess our school objectives are unclear. I'll accept that as truth.--
"Some clinical courses in medical specialties do not consistently apply the same criteria to all
students.
--I don't know what they are referring to specifically, but judging based on these forums that is pretty common...--
"No process to ensure the school's objectives are made known to students, residents and faculty.
--Again, this explains my confusion. I always thought the school's objective was to produce decent allopathic physicians.--
"Comparable education experiences and assessment across all instruction sites do not exist in
some courses.
--There are technically different course requirements at the two clinical sites. This is not new. It is slightly curious, but it has been that way for decades.--
"Students in some courses do not get final grades on a timely basis.
--Yeah, that's annoying. Problem is that it is usually private primary care docs who put evals on the back burner because they are so busy. I agree though that they could put more pressure on them.--
"No system to ensure formal feedback to students in some courses.
--I don't know what kind of system they mean. We get narratives in all clinical courses, not usually in basic science courses. I'm not sure that is unusual.--
"No effective authority for the overall design, management and evaluation of a coherent and
coordinated curriculum.
--This was the meat of the issue. Such a committee existed, however according to the governance structure it did not have enough power over individual departments to dictate coordination. Some departments were rather stubborn, to put it nicely. This was one of my biggest gripes with the school, and I'm glad the LCME noted it, as now the chairs have been chastened. Now things can change.
"Dean does not have authority to modify curriculum.
--Technically he did, though he chose not to exercise those rights. He delegated them to committees which unfortunately made poor decisions, and he stood by them. It was the wrong move.--
"No faculty committee effectively monitoring course content to ensure educational objectives are
met.
--This goes back to the former governance structure which allowed chairs the right to manage their courses. It was kind of a confederacy, and we all know how those work out. The LCME wants a Federal style strong central governance, and I couldn't agree more. The school is forming such a committee.--
"Different clinical requirements at regional campuses and inadequate oversight of the rural training
program.
--This was addressed earlier.--
"Different numbers of credit hours required for graduation at the Syracuse and Binghamton
campuses.
--Whatever. Credit hours are a joke anyway.--
"Little evidence student feedback is used to improve the educational program.
--I have personally given feedback and watched it be incorporated into changes. Most departments actively seek out feedback, and most make changes when we ask them. So this is pretty much untrue.--
"School has a lower than national average student awareness of mistreatment policies and an above
average percentage of students reporting mistreatment.
--If so many are reporting it, they are probably aware of it. I know of only a couple instances of mistreatment, and in both cases action was taken swiftly. In any case, we are all taught about mistreatment multiple times in required courses as well as 3rd year orientation. So this makes no sense.--
"More than 100 fourth-year students shared answers on online quizzes or were aware of such
activity."
--Yeah, that happened. Something like 20-30 students cheated, and basically everyone else knew about it. This has been discussed elsewhere on SDN, but basically there was a ridiculous 4th year class that got way too difficult and interfered with away rotations and when the students complained to the administration they were told there is nothing we can do. The class protested and refused to help the admissions office interview applicants, to no avail. The course director basically told them to try harder. So some people started collaborating in these online quizzes based on esoteric basic science journal articles. Some were still failing. This whole controversy exposed the very governance issues that the LCME commented on a well as made the graduating class extremely disgruntled in advance of filling out the LCME student survey.
Overall, as I've said before, I don't think these issues call into question whether or not Upstate does a good job producing good medical graduates. As such, there is no reason for the LCME to actually want to revoke the accreditation of the school. If probation is what it took to smack some sense into certain parts of the administration, then I applaud it. The LCME will accomplish its goal, which is to bring schools into line with its standards. And Upstate will be better for it.
"...LCME says in a 192-page report that explains why it put the medical school on probation...The report shows the committee found the school out of compliance with 15 accreditation standards."
"Objectives of the medical school are not consistently used to guide curriculum.
--I don't know what this means--
"School's objectives are not consistently stated in outcomes-based terms that allow assessment of
student progress.
--I think this explains the previous statement; I guess our school objectives are unclear. I'll accept that as truth.--
"Some clinical courses in medical specialties do not consistently apply the same criteria to all
students.
--I don't know what they are referring to specifically, but judging based on these forums that is pretty common...--
"No process to ensure the school's objectives are made known to students, residents and faculty.
--Again, this explains my confusion. I always thought the school's objective was to produce decent allopathic physicians.--
"Comparable education experiences and assessment across all instruction sites do not exist in
some courses.
--There are technically different course requirements at the two clinical sites. This is not new. It is slightly curious, but it has been that way for decades.--
"Students in some courses do not get final grades on a timely basis.
--Yeah, that's annoying. Problem is that it is usually private primary care docs who put evals on the back burner because they are so busy. I agree though that they could put more pressure on them.--
"No system to ensure formal feedback to students in some courses.
--I don't know what kind of system they mean. We get narratives in all clinical courses, not usually in basic science courses. I'm not sure that is unusual.--
"No effective authority for the overall design, management and evaluation of a coherent and
coordinated curriculum.
--This was the meat of the issue. Such a committee existed, however according to the governance structure it did not have enough power over individual departments to dictate coordination. Some departments were rather stubborn, to put it nicely. This was one of my biggest gripes with the school, and I'm glad the LCME noted it, as now the chairs have been chastened. Now things can change.
"Dean does not have authority to modify curriculum.
--Technically he did, though he chose not to exercise those rights. He delegated them to committees which unfortunately made poor decisions, and he stood by them. It was the wrong move.--
"No faculty committee effectively monitoring course content to ensure educational objectives are
met.
--This goes back to the former governance structure which allowed chairs the right to manage their courses. It was kind of a confederacy, and we all know how those work out. The LCME wants a Federal style strong central governance, and I couldn't agree more. The school is forming such a committee.--
"Different clinical requirements at regional campuses and inadequate oversight of the rural training
program.
--This was addressed earlier.--
"Different numbers of credit hours required for graduation at the Syracuse and Binghamton
campuses.
--Whatever. Credit hours are a joke anyway.--
"Little evidence student feedback is used to improve the educational program.
--I have personally given feedback and watched it be incorporated into changes. Most departments actively seek out feedback, and most make changes when we ask them. So this is pretty much untrue.--
"School has a lower than national average student awareness of mistreatment policies and an above
average percentage of students reporting mistreatment.
--If so many are reporting it, they are probably aware of it. I know of only a couple instances of mistreatment, and in both cases action was taken swiftly. In any case, we are all taught about mistreatment multiple times in required courses as well as 3rd year orientation. So this makes no sense.--
"More than 100 fourth-year students shared answers on online quizzes or were aware of such
activity."
--Yeah, that happened. Something like 20-30 students cheated, and basically everyone else knew about it. This has been discussed elsewhere on SDN, but basically there was a ridiculous 4th year class that got way too difficult and interfered with away rotations and when the students complained to the administration they were told there is nothing we can do. The class protested and refused to help the admissions office interview applicants, to no avail. The course director basically told them to try harder. So some people started collaborating in these online quizzes based on esoteric basic science journal articles. Some were still failing. This whole controversy exposed the very governance issues that the LCME commented on a well as made the graduating class extremely disgruntled in advance of filling out the LCME student survey.
Overall, as I've said before, I don't think these issues call into question whether or not Upstate does a good job producing good medical graduates. As such, there is no reason for the LCME to actually want to revoke the accreditation of the school. If probation is what it took to smack some sense into certain parts of the administration, then I applaud it. The LCME will accomplish its goal, which is to bring schools into line with its standards. And Upstate will be better for it.
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+1. Thanks a ton BigRedder. You did a phenomenal job addressing all issues in an unbiased way.
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I'm also a current med student at Upstate and I agree with Big Redder's analysis (thank you for doing that).
The LCME initially dinged Upstate for 18 deficiencies, none of which are relevant towards the overall quality of education at Upstate, or the way residency programs view the students that graduate from here. We do well on national measures (i.e. the USMLE exams), and our students do very well in the match for residency. The amount of interesting and inspiring extracurricular activites are students partake in is mind-boggling - it makes you proud to rub shoulders with them every day.
Nonetheless, the administration, faculty, staff and students have responded aggressively to changing and improving things based on the LCME citations.The majority of the citations have already been addressed, while others are in the process of being addressed. Upstate will only benefit from this and emerge stronger. The school was not perfect before the LCME came, and it wont be perfect once we've satisfied the LCME requirements, but the attitude of everyone I've met here is always to work towards a better tomorrow in all aspects that affect the medical students (education, opportunities, treatment, preparation, etc...). I would encourage anyone to come be a part of an environment like that.
I have a working knowledge of the specifics. If any prospective applicants are concerned or have questions that they haven't received answers to otherwise, feel free to e-mail me ([email protected]) and we can discuss.
Good luck to all the applicants!
Sam
The LCME initially dinged Upstate for 18 deficiencies, none of which are relevant towards the overall quality of education at Upstate, or the way residency programs view the students that graduate from here. We do well on national measures (i.e. the USMLE exams), and our students do very well in the match for residency. The amount of interesting and inspiring extracurricular activites are students partake in is mind-boggling - it makes you proud to rub shoulders with them every day.
Nonetheless, the administration, faculty, staff and students have responded aggressively to changing and improving things based on the LCME citations.The majority of the citations have already been addressed, while others are in the process of being addressed. Upstate will only benefit from this and emerge stronger. The school was not perfect before the LCME came, and it wont be perfect once we've satisfied the LCME requirements, but the attitude of everyone I've met here is always to work towards a better tomorrow in all aspects that affect the medical students (education, opportunities, treatment, preparation, etc...). I would encourage anyone to come be a part of an environment like that.
I have a working knowledge of the specifics. If any prospective applicants are concerned or have questions that they haven't received answers to otherwise, feel free to e-mail me ([email protected]) and we can discuss.
Good luck to all the applicants!
Sam
I agree with archer57. I wish it taught me that. I've stopped counting because the wait is driving me crazy!
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Question, when do they release financial aid packages?
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For entering students, Financial Aid Eligibility letters are released by late April.
http://www.upstate.edu/currentstudents/financial_resources/finaid/faqs.php
That's still good. Based on last year a lot of folks got in off the HP. Also during interview they said HP is the good waitlist to be on.
Nothing on my end still. I am not sure if this is a good or bad sign.
Nothing on my end still. I am not sure if this is a good or bad sign.
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Does anyone know anyone who interviewed on or after march 7th who actually got accepted? it has been almost 2 weeks. I am extremely anxious!
Anyone have any suggestions for housing. I looked at Geneva Tower, the new apartments/dorms upstate is opening this fall. But for a two bedroom it is quite expensive almost 1000 dollars. That is way to much for me, are a lot of people looking to live there. I want to be around other first years, anyone have any other suggestions?
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That $1000 includes a lot. As I understand, they will be furnished and include utilities, Internet, and maybe cable? With all that it becomes about the same as Jefferson, which I am sure is already full. There is a building at like Comstock and E Genesee called the Roosevelt, it's a little older but has pretty big apartments, mainly 2 bedrooms I think.
If you want something cheaper you could live in the Westcott area which is like a 20-30 minute walk. There are a lot of houses converted to apartments and it has more of a neighborhood feel, but there are also a lot of SU students. There are a couple cool restaurants over there, plus the Westcott theatre which gets lots of random bands if you're into that. Some of my friends bike from there without a problem.
Another option is living farther out in like Liverpool and driving in every day. Parking can be like $80 a month in the garage, but the other lots are cheaper.
And there is always Clark, which is very much like a dorm, but that can be kind of fun if you are used to it already, plus you are right next to the CAB, and you can get to school almost entirely covered by roofs.
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There're a few suggestions on our facebook group:
- orangehousing.com
- geneva/clarks towers
- madison or jefferson towers (cheaper than geneva/clarks but not furnished)
- Clarendon Heights (a couple of miles further out)
- craigslist
I say don't worry about being surrounded by other first years. Most likely you'll be seeing your classmates most of the days. Perhaps after first semester or first year, you can find some people you really click with and go rent a house together off campus, that's the cheapest way.
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Many people matched into 2 programs, so the total number will not add up to the total number of students
15 Anethesiology
1 Child Neurology
2 Dermatology
1 Diagnostic Radiology
16 Emergency Medicine
8 Family Medicine
9 General Surgery
23 Internal Medicine
6 Medicine-Preliminary
2 Medicine-Primary
1 Med-prelim/Anesthesiology
1 Med-prelim/neurology
1 Neuro surgery
3 neurology
6 OBGYN
4 Opthalmology
2 Ortho surgery
1 Otolaryngology
3 Pathology
2 Medicine-Pediatrics
20 Pediatrics
2 Phys Med & Rehab
8 Psychiatry
2 Rad Oncology
8 Rad Diagnostic
3 Surgery Prelim
1 Surg-prelim/anesthesiology
12 Transitional
Full pdf file is posted on our facebook group
http://www.facebook.com/groups/161373027297306/
About 15 people were matched to Upstate (which I want to be doing in the future) so I'm kinda happy with that.
15 Anethesiology
1 Child Neurology
2 Dermatology
1 Diagnostic Radiology
16 Emergency Medicine
8 Family Medicine
9 General Surgery
23 Internal Medicine
6 Medicine-Preliminary
2 Medicine-Primary
1 Med-prelim/Anesthesiology
1 Med-prelim/neurology
1 Neuro surgery
3 neurology
6 OBGYN
4 Opthalmology
2 Ortho surgery
1 Otolaryngology
3 Pathology
2 Medicine-Pediatrics
20 Pediatrics
2 Phys Med & Rehab
8 Psychiatry
2 Rad Oncology
8 Rad Diagnostic
3 Surgery Prelim
1 Surg-prelim/anesthesiology
12 Transitional
Full pdf file is posted on our facebook group
http://www.facebook.com/groups/161373027297306/
About 15 people were matched to Upstate (which I want to be doing in the future) so I'm kinda happy with that.
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for you guys
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Hey all....withdrawing my acceptance, hope on of you hp's get good news soon!
No it is not complete yet, it will open on august 1st. I took the tour of it a couple of months ago when they were giving tours. The rooms are SMALL, for a two bedroom the rooms were very tiny. For a one bedrrom it was not as bad, because you had the living room all to your self. The 4 bedrooms, were a little bigger then the 2 bedrooms, but they still were not that big. The weird thing is a 4 bedroom is 900 (per person), 2 bedroom 925 (per person), and a 1 bedroom 1000. So the prices are not that big of a difference which is really weird, also have to pay around 50 dollars a month for parking. So it will cost around 1000 for a two bedroom per person, after parking. Its also right next to the other two housing buildings, which are half the price for a two bedroom.
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