2021-2022 NYU (Grossman)

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bmefenx said:
WL after CR in October. Mixed feelings… part of me just wants this to be over lol
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dudeeee i 100% feel you. it's ****ty to even say this b/c i know people would kill for a spot, but it's tough to think about moving forward with another school/planning for the future when i have THEIR waitlist offer hanging over me... like this just throws a wrench in any certainty/sense of control i was hoping to have for the foreseeable future
 
Does NYU actually have graded clinicals, internal rankings, and AOA? I thought they changed recently but apparently not; if this is true then bruh.
 
Anon_help00 said:
Does NYU actually have graded clinicals, internal rankings, and AOA? I thought they changed recently but apparently not; if this is true then bruh.
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You saw that Reddit post too? If Im not mistaken, Dean Rivera said when he asked PDs they said they prefer graded clinicals, so NYU kept them. They also have AOA.
 
Dogruffle01 said:
You saw that Reddit post too? If Im not mistaken, Dean Rivera said when he asked PDs they said they prefer graded clinicals, so NYU kept them. They also have AOA.
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Yep. Welp, I'll be promptly withdrawing then LOL...maybe one of the CR people will get an A then. Still...I could have sworn they had true P/F and no AOA, not sure how this went under the radar wtf. and internal rankings!! what!?!?! ridiculous
 
Anon_help00 said:
Yep. Welp, I'll be promptly withdrawing then LOL...maybe one of the CR people will get an A then. Still...I could have sworn they had true P/F and no AOA, not sure how this went under the radar wtf. and internal rankings!! what!?!?! ridiculous
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I don’t want to propagate false information, I would confirm this with an actual source first. Maybe a current student or another student who was accepted can confirm ?
 
Anon_help00 said:
Yep. Welp, I'll be promptly withdrawing then LOL...maybe one of the CR people will get an A then. Still...I could have sworn they had true P/F and no AOA, not sure how this went under the radar wtf. and internal rankings!! what!?!?! ridiculous
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Anon_help00 said:
I asked two current students and they said they don't know -_-. I mean AOA is already a drag especially at a school with a student body like NYUs, I feel like most peer schools have done away with it already. Graded clinicals is whatever.
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Damn I didn’t realize they even had AOA. AOA alone is more or less dealbreaker for me as I have a reasonably competitive financial package at a school in a city I prefer with no AOA. Will most likely withdraw from the waitlist.
 
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beepbeep197 said:
can someone explain what AOA is, why it sucks, etc?
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AOA is basically an honor society that is chosen from the “top” medical students at a school.

Residency Directors can factor this in to their decision making process.

People don’t like AOA because it often implies a ranking of the medical students. When students are ranked their is more incentive for gunning and fosters a more competitive environment to achieve a higher rank.

It’s similar to the debate of p/f clinicals. If people aren’t graded against one another then they is more incentive to just learn without the added bs of trying to do things for the sake of doing them.

The argument for AOA is that competitive applicants all look the same and there needs to be a way to differentiate them.

People also argue that AOA selection isn’t fair and often times ambiguous.
 
Dogruffle01 said:
AOA is basically an honor society that is chosen from the “top” medical students at a school.

Residency Directors can factor this in to their decision making process.

People don’t like AOA because it often implies a ranking of the medical students. When students are ranked their is more incentive for gunning and fosters a more competitive environment to achieve a higher rank.

It’s similar to the debate of p/f clinicals. If people aren’t graded against one another then they is more incentive to just learn without the added bs of trying to do things for the sake of doing them.

The argument for AOA is that competitive applicants all look the same and there needs to be a way to differentiate them.

People also argue that AOA selection isn’t fair and often times ambiguous.
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okay, thanks for sharing! I'm learning so much from SDN.
I can see why people would not want to go to a school that has AOA. A little confused though, I thought almost all schools had H/HP/P/F clinicals. Is it just a "top School" thing to not have AOA and graded clinicals?
 
beepbeep197 said:
okay, thanks for sharing! I'm learning so much from SDN.
I can see why people would not want to go to a school that has AOA. A little confused though, I thought almost all schools had H/HP/P/F clinicals. Is it just a "top School" thing to not have AOA and graded clinicals?
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Yes, most schools have H/HP/P/F clinicals.

Of the top of my head, Harvard, UCSF, Vandy, Duke have p/f CORE clerkships ( which is what matters).

Penn and Chicago are graded but they give out a lot of honors and high passes.

Yale is technically graded but they are known for having the most chill grading system and almost everyone gets honors ( which is sorts better than p/f in a way)
 
Dogruffle01 said:
Yes, most schools have H/HP/P/F clinicals.

Of the top of my head, Harvard, UCSF, Vandy, Duke have p/f CORE clerkships ( which is what matters).

Penn and Chicago are graded but they give out a lot of honors and high passes.

Yale is technically graded but they are known for having the most chill grading system and almost everyone gets honors ( which is sorts better than p/f in a way)
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hmm okay, thank you again for sharing. You really know your stuff! Given that I'm only in contention for one of the schools on that list...NYU, hit me (if I get off the waitlist) haha
 
Lol this AOA thing might change the waitlist size a bit, I’m prob pulling out. I have a CoA elsewhere anyways. Allegedly the waitlist is “smaller than it has been in prior years,” but that could mean the waitlist could be smaller by like 1 person. Not here for the ambiguity 😌
 
pre1med said:
How many waitlisted this year? Anyone know?
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lofifruits said:
Lol this AOA thing might change the waitlist size a bit, I’m prob pulling out. I have a CoA elsewhere anyways. Allegedly the waitlist is “smaller than it has been in prior years,” but that could mean the waitlist could be smaller by like 1 person. Not here for the ambiguity 😌
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Someone posted here that Dean Rivera mentioned trying to cap the waitlist at 200 at this year when they normally waitlist 250. Plus we'll see whoever's left at that end-of-April zoom call 😬
 
beepbeep197 said:
Someone posted here that Dean Rivera mentioned trying to cap the waitlist at 200 at this year when they normally waitlist 250. Plus we'll see whoever's left at that end-of-April zoom call 😬
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i think the email said it'll be a webinar, so we probably won't be able to see each other. and do you mean 200 people on the waitlist for the remaining spots, or 200 total offers being made throughout the application cycle (for their 92 spots)?
 
sk88 said:
i think the email said it'll be a webinar, so we probably won't be able to see each other. and do you mean 200 people on the waitlist for the remaining spots, or 200 total offers being made throughout the application cycle (for their 92 spots)?
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200 on the waitlist!
 
sk88 said:
jesus christ hahahahaha so it's basically hopeless
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serotonin1 said:
Sounds like a 20-25% chance if no one drops, so who knows!
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yeah, in past years 50-60 people were pulled from the waitlist. I feel like this was a tougher cycle (or maybe just for me haha) so fewer people could be giving up their seats, but who knows. I got the impression that Dean Rivera is pretty transparent about what happens, so I'm sure we'll learn more about what our odds actually look like during the info session he'll host.
 
beepbeep197 said:
yeah, in past years 50-60 people were pulled from the waitlist. I feel like this was a tougher cycle (or maybe just for me haha) so fewer people could be giving up their seats, but who knows. I got the impression that Dean Rivera is pretty transparent about what happens, so I'm sure we'll learn more about what our odds actually look like during the info session he'll host.
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i gotta say, he is the realest admissions dean ever. love that man.
 
vomitcom said:
Current student here. We have graded clinicals and AOA, but no internal ranking.
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The existence of AOA most certainly implies some level of internal ranking, how else can you determine who does/doesn't get AOA if students aren't ranked

Whether those with non - AOA status have their rank reported is a different question
 
vomitcom said:
Current student here. We have graded clinicals and AOA, but no internal ranking.
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Say it ain’t so 😭😭😭😭😭!!

I know this is a stretch, but would you know if clinical grades have a capped amount of honors ( I.e students are put against each other) or if it’s standardized and potentially anyone can get honors.
 
Also for waitlist folks, seems like the “the waitlist is smaller than that of prior years,” line has been in the last few years’ waitlist notification. Not sure what to interpret off that: optimistically, it’s true and our chances of acceptance are higher than previous years, pessimistically, I wonder if they’re saying that to motivate us to stay on the waitlist since they actually pull a decent number from that pool.
 
lofifruits said:
Also for waitlist folks, seems like the “the waitlist is smaller than that of prior years,” line has been in the last few years’ waitlist notification. Not sure what to interpret off that: optimistically, it’s true and our chances of acceptance are higher than previous years, pessimistically, I wonder if they’re saying that to motivate us to stay on the waitlist since they actually pull a decent number from that pool.
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I think someone reported that the waitlist is 200 people this year, rather than 250 in the past per Dean Rivera?? Tryinf to stay optimistic
 
Hey guys, this is somewhat related to the 3-yr program, but what's the general consensus on the strength of NYU residency programs in the competitive specialties like derm, neurosurg, ortho, plastic? Are they considered top-tier?
 
RollcakeSurgery said:
Hey guys, this is somewhat related to the 3-yr program, but what's the general consensus on the strength of NYU residency programs in the competitive specialties like derm, neurosurg, ortho, plastic? Are they considered top-tier?
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I think it is well known for ortho plastic and derm but there is only one spot for each in the 3 year program
 
RollcakeSurgery said:
Hey guys, this is somewhat related to the 3-yr program, but what's the general consensus on the strength of NYU residency programs in the competitive specialties like derm, neurosurg, ortho, plastic? Are they considered top-tier?
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NYU is generally a top 10 residency program in the specialties you listed.
 
For people asking about true P/F, below is from NYU's policy re: AOA. Top quartile in preclinical modules is used in aoa selection, with wiggle room for others to be considered.
In order to inform the AOA selection process, the ORSR additionally asks each module director for an alphabetical list (i.e unranked) of students who performed in the top quarter of the class for that particular module. This information is used along with the student’s performance during the required clinical clerkships to select one third of the class for review by the AOA selection committee. Regardless of their performance during the preclerkship modules, top performing students in the clinical clerkships, as well as students with exceptional extracurricular contributions in the areas of research and/or service, are also considered for AOA and reviewed by the selection committee.

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premed_prebed said:
For people asking about true P/F, below is from NYU's policy re: AOA. Top quartile in preclinical modules is used in aoa selection, with wiggle room for others to be considered.
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Dude I love NYU in every other aspect... The grading is just killing me. Like I get that the PD directors said they prefer grading, and the deans said they don't want to affect students, but every other school in NYUs tier is moving towards more lax grading and taking out AOA and match list are unaffected.
 
Current student - wanted to answer some questions that have been raised.

The number of people accepted to 3 YR seems to be flexible depending on the specialty, as I've known people who entered programs that technically already had all spots full.

Regarding internal rankings and grading: I don't believe there is a cap on honors, as some rotations will have like 60% of students honoring the rotation - but it does depend on the clerkship director, there are a few that like to be particular about the number of honors they give out. I can't say for sure whether there are internal rankings, but I can confirm that they give you an "adjective" in your dean's letter (I.e. outstanding, excellent candidate, etc) that I would believe likely corresponds to some kind of quartile ranking? Unless they just do it based off your CV, which is also possible.
 
Congrats to all upcoming NYU Grossman grads and their impressive match list.
This NYU 2022 match list demonstrates increased strength for NYUs matches and is the last match by NYU students who matriculated without knowledge of free tuition. This class was arriving on campus when it was announced (Aug 2018).

Since then, admission to NYU Grossman got even more challenging with even greater success matriculating students that previously would likely have attended a different T5.
 
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RollcakeSurgery said:
Hey guys, this is somewhat related to the 3-yr program, but what's the general consensus on the strength of NYU residency programs in the competitive specialties like derm, neurosurg, ortho, plastic? Are they considered top-tier?
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Off the top of my head, NYU according to Doximity has about seven T10 residencies. You use Doximity for more current stats, for some past aggregation (2019) here you go- Doximity Residency Navigator 2018 - 2019 - Tea with MD
 
Dogruffle01 said:
It’s similar to the debate of p/f clinicals. If people aren’t graded against one another then they is more incentive to just learn without the added bs of trying to do things for the sake of doing them.
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It is my understanding that their graded clinicals are not capped at how many honors can be given. At least this reduces competition within that rotation.
 
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