Mt Sinai vs. UNC-Chapel Hill Out-of-State

[Picata]

Hi guys,

First time poster, so forgive me if I'm unaware of customs or the correct placement of this thread.

I was wondering what people would recommend between UNC Chapel Hill out of state, and Mt Sinai. I'm gonna pursue a couple of waitlists and still have to hear back from a couple of really good schools, but otherwise I would drop my deposit on one of these two.

A little about me:
-I'm from CT, went to school in NYC, and have lived there since graduating last year, so my friends, girlfriend, and family support network are in the NY area. Leaving NYC would be hard, but met some wonderful people at UNC with whom I think I would become fast friends.
-I am extremely interested in infectious disease and global health, and am definitely interested in rotating internationally while in school. I feel like UNC has the edge on research for HIV, but Sinai does amazing things with influenza. I'm not sure, but I think UNC has more international connections. But Sinai's immigrant patients seemed more likely to have interesting infections.
-I am more attracted to Sinai's urban, diverse patient populations.
-I like the idea of a relaxed curriculum. Sinai is pass fail both years, whereas I think UNC is only first year. I like Sinai's "exams in your underwear".
-But on the other hand, I would like to get a dual-degree MPH, which both schools offer, but UNC offers through an unbelievably good public health school. -Also, if I can qualify for in-state residency after the first year or two, UNC will be significantly cheaper in the long run.
-As for my general happiness when interviewing, I loved both, and loved the faculty and students I met at both.
-I'm unclear on who has a more competitive match list. I'm likely to do internal medicine, and both seemed to match well.

Let me know what you think. Thanks!

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[jbz24]

My perspective as a student at Sinai:
- Location is a huge factor in the decision making. You already said that you have a huge support system in NYC, and I think it's very important as a medical student. Also, where do you want to end up in the future? If you want to come back to NY, you're much better off at Sinai than UNC. Partially because the NY schools seem to take each other for residency, but also because you have the best shot for residency at your home institution.

- Cost will be in favor of UNC if you get in-state tuition.

- Take this with a grain of salt because I don't know how UNC is with ID, but I feel that if you're sure you want to do ID, you should stay in NYC. All of the NY schools will see very diverse pathology when it comes to ID that you simply won't see in other places. Sinai is affiliated with Elmhurst, which is the most diverse zip code in the country, so you will see lots of rare ID cases. Also, you will see end stage HIV cases in any of the NY schools, which is becoming rarer to see at other institutions. There's also some pretty strong HIV/ID researchers at Sinai (i.e. Paul Klotman, who founded HIVAN), although the chair of ID at Sinai is leaving this year to become the chair of medicine at Duke.

- In terms of global health, Sinai isn't as strong as other places, although I'm not sure how UNC is either. There are definitely opportunities to rotate internationally though, and they even have some funded medical and surgical trips the first two years during breaks.

In the end though, you'll do well at whichever place you choose. Both places are well-regarded. Congrats on your acceptances!

 

[Picata]

Thanks! is Garcia-Sastre the one who you were talking about who is leaving?

 

[jbz24]

Interestingly, Mary Klotman (who is Paul Klotman's wife who I mentioned in my previous post), who is the current chair of ID, will be leaving (or might have left already at this point).

 

[traderjoe]

Some pretty big cultural differences between these two. I grew up in NC and went to college in New Jersey. Accepted at UNC, so I may be a classmate of yours.
Chapel Hill is an amazing community. With 8 universities within 30 miles, the Research Triangle Park, and large, successful health care communities, it is a very dynamic and relatively diverse place...for the South. Jesse Helms wanted to put a fence around Chapel Hill to keep all the progressive thinkers locked up. But it is a small town atmosphere...so very different than NY.
I can't speak to specifics on ID/HIV, but the NIH funding at Chapel Hill is huge and the learning environment (my brother did undergrad and med school, and I have 27 relatives who went to UNC) is very collaborative and relaxed. Its a great place to live, but if you want to end up in the NE, staying at Sinai might make sense.
I am fairly certain you will get in-state residency after a year. Most OOSers do.
Best of luck.

 

[Picata]

Thanks! you both make great points, which is why this is so hard a decision! i look forward to more opinions.

 

[justinbaily]

I wasn't aware that UNC was so cheap. If you can get IS residency in NC, then the last three years of medical school at UNC will cost you less than a single year at Mount Sinai. UNC also more of a lay-person reputation outside of NYC if that matters to you at all. I would assume that they have the same reputation in the medical community. They are both incredible schools and you are fortunate to have such a difficult choice to make. Why not wait until you've gone to their second looks?

 

[Picata]

Thanks! I too am very happy with the choices. I unfortunately won't be able to attend second looks because I am leaving for India next Friday, and won't return until late June, so I have to resort to other means. Unlucky timing, the UNC second look is the day after I leave!

But yeah, price is a big actor. Out of state UNC tuition is the same as Sinai (~35K), but if i could get in-state by my second year it would be ~13K a year after that. In terms of cost-of-living, NYC is of course high, but actually Sinai has 550$ month subsidized housing, so the differences would be mainly in prices for food, entertainment, etc. On the other hand, I would probably need to somehow procure a car if I went to NC, unless I planned to spend all my time in tiny Chapel Hill. So many factors!

 

[mdeast]

Go to Sinai....so you can potentially be my classmate. Is that not reason enough?!?!

I think all things considered, both are great schools. One is an urban environment and more of the traditional Northeast US, big city research medical center vibe. UNC-Chapel Hill is more suburban environment, better weather, cheaper cost. I'd say Sinai Medical Center definitely sees more interesting cases and patient populations, and it's an overall better hospital than UNC...but I think that matters less as a med student than it does as a resident.

If you could see yourself equally happy about both places socially and academically, then I'd chose UNC and save the money.

 

[jbz24]

Thanks! I too am very happy with the choices. I unfortunately won't be able to attend second looks because I am leaving for India next Friday, and won't return until late June, so I have to resort to other means. Unlucky timing, the UNC second look is the day after I leave!

But yeah, price is a big actor. Out of state UNC tuition is the same as Sinai (~35K), but if i could get in-state by my second year it would be ~13K a year after that. In terms of cost-of-living, NYC is of course high, but actually Sinai has 550$ month subsidized housing, so the differences would be mainly in prices for food, entertainment, etc. On the other hand, I would probably need to somehow procure a car if I went to NC, unless I planned to spend all my time in tiny Chapel Hill. So many factors!

Do you have a preference as to where you want to end up after medical school?

 

[MrCheetah]

Do you have a preference as to where you want to end up after medical school?

If the costs were equal I'd say, without a doubt, go for Mt Sinai, but they're definitely not... I don't know man... Is it worth it to you to pay 66k (more like 120k after interest) more to attend Mt Sinai over UNC?

Thats the only thing you need to consider.

 

[jbz24]

What will the price of tuition alone be for each school over 4 years?

Why are you quoting me?

 

[MrCheetah]

Why are you quoting me?

Haha. Beats me.

 

[jbz24]

If the costs were equal I'd say, without a doubt, go for Mt Sinai, but they're definitely not... I don't know man... Is it worth it to you to pay 66k (more like 120k after interest) more to attend Mt Sinai over UNC?

Thats the only thing you need to consider.

I think money is important to consider but shouldn't be the only thing. If the OP said that he wants to return to NY after graduation, then it might be worth it to go to Sinai over UNC in spite of the money issue. He also said he has a big support system in NY, and it's important to be at a place that will make you happy. If the OP was only concerned about money then he probably would not have posted this here

 

[Picata]

Hi guys,

Thanks for all the responses!

While not absolutely committed, I do think I will want to come back to the northeast for residency or ID fellowship and beyond. The match list for internal med for mount sinai is overwhelmingly nyc and northeast based, while the match list for UNC is more diffuse, but with some incredibly good centers (UChicago, Barnes-Jewish St. Louis, Hopkins, Duke, Vanderbilt, and of course UNC). That being said, they did match a couple of people to Mass General in Boston, and ironically Mt Sinai itself. I think that the non-northeast match list of UNC is probably somewhat self-selecting, as students are probably mostly NC-based and don't have as much of a preference for the northeast. Considering how diffuse the med centers are, and how amazing they are, I'm pretty confident if I did well I could match at places in NYC or Boston.

What I am concerned with maybe more than domestic regional contacts is international contacts. This is where I feel like UNC really excels through its public health school, which has faculty working in over 50 countries. The counterargument, of course, is that Mount Sinai makes up for this by being in the city, which is an unbelievable resource of contacts for pretty much anything you get interested in. Not to mention that Sinai has some cool international-working faculty itself. However, I think if I did an MD/MPH at UNC, I could maintain 5-year relationships with UNC global health faculty, whereas if I went to Sinai and decided to get my MPH at another school with a larger public health program, I would only have 1-year relationships with anyone I worked with. I could always choose to do my MD/MPH all at Sinai, but it's a young program, and I heard from my friend whose a current student that its not that great. But he's pretty cynical.

Do you guys have any comments on these factors, especially if you're a current student at either of these schools?

 

[jbz24]

Your friend is right, Sinai's MPH program is not all that great, at least compared to UNC. Students who do their MPH at Sinai generally do so within the four years, and those who take a year off to do it usually do it at another institution. As for coming back to NY for residency, Sinai does very well matching into northeast programs. There is definitely self-selection bias at UNC matching into northeast programs, but it's not entirely self-selected. Many programs select from programs close by because they know them the best and faculty at institutions all know each other. I believe UNC matches well into places like Duke for this reason. However, UNC students will find it more difficult to match at NY programs than Sinai students. Also keep in mind that each school takes 25-40% of their own for residency, so you have the best odds staying at your home institution. Just something to keep in mind if you do want to come back to NY. If future location is not a factor, then to be honest your decision should be based on current location (NYC is a much better location) vs. cost (UNC will be cheaper), as both are ranked roughly the same.

 

[traderjoe]

U-N-C! With an MPH from UNC, you'll have an MD from the top public medical school in the country and an MPH from a top 2/3 program. You can get a residency you want and bring a more diverse network to the NE should you choose that route.

 

[BubbaChuck3]

U-N-C! With an MPH from UNC, you'll have an MD from the top public medical school in the country and an MPH from a top 2/3 program. You can get a residency you want and bring a more diverse network to the NE should you choose that route.

I'd choose UNC for similar reasons that traderjoe expressed. But a correction UNC is not the top public medical school in the country. It does make the top 5 though but don't forget about UCSF,UWashington,UMICH, and UCLA. I may be missing one or two. Either way I think UNC would be a much better choice especially if you are considering a MPH.

 

[Picata]

Thanks everyone, you've been remarkably helpful!

Can any current students (or anyone else that knows) describe the preclinical curriculum at each school?

I know Sinai is pass/fail, but is it also unranked?

I think I remember them saying that UNC is pass/fail for only first year. Is it ranked for that first year?

Also, I don't know if they release this info to current students, but anyone have an idea of average board scores?

Thanks!

 

[jbz24]

Sinai is P/F unranked first two years, H/HP/P/F third year.