2013-2014 Washington University in St. Louis Application Thread

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pyrrion89 said:
Encouraging stuff... but I think the more relevant statistic is what percentage of the waitlisted students are ultimately taken off. I was pretty disappointed when my interviewer told me at the end of my interview that outright acceptances are quite hard to pull off at this stage.
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When did you interview?
 
What month is it acceptable to send LOI after waitlists? Just curious
 
1Sail0r said:
What month is it acceptable to send LOI after waitlists? Just curious
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Has anyone been already wait listed by WashU?

As for your question, I'm just a fellow applicant, so take this with a grain of salt, but I don't think there is anything wrong about telling the school you love it right after it broke your heart 😛
Seriously though, I don't think it's wrong to send a LOI right after you're wait listed, especially if a school announces its wait lists as late in the cycle as WashU does. What exactly is the point of waiting in this case? Waiting for other people to get off the wait list before you?
 
Amygdarya said:
Has anyone been already wait listed by WashU?

As for your question, I'm just a fellow applicant, so take this with a grain of salt, but I don't think there is anything wrong about telling the school you love it right after it broke your heart 😛
Seriously though, I don't think it's wrong to send a LOI right after you're wait listed, especially if a school announces its wait lists as late in the cycle as WashU does. What exactly is the point of waiting in this case? Waiting for other people to get off the wait list before you?
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I don't have any inside knowledge with admissions but I don't think a genuine LOI would hurt you. In the past the office has always accepted and filed updates, I just can not speak to what they do with them

Edit: I'm glad to see the WashU love!
 
Are we supposed to receive a confirmation email after scheduling our interview?
 
chi11 said:
Are we supposed to receive a confirmation email after scheduling our interview?
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It should come in a few days after scheduling.


NewYorker9 said:
I don't have any inside knowledge with admissions but I don't think a genuine LOI would hurt you. In the past the office has always accepted and filed updates, I just can not speak to what they do with them

Edit: I'm glad to see the WashU love!
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Woooo go bears. Yeah wewstl! But actually St. Louis is an awesome place with a ton of neighborhoods to explore and its really cheap to live here.
 
Just got an II and scheduled for Mar. 5th. Flight was cheap so I guess I don't mind too much interviewing for a WL spot.
 
I sent an update (post-interview) regarding a paper that was recently published. I still haven't received an email from them confirming that they received my update.

Has anyone else sent an update post-interview?
 
Odessa09 said:
I sent an update (post-interview) regarding a paper that was recently published. I still haven't received an email from them confirming that they received my update.

Has anyone else sent an update post-interview?
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I sent one post-interview. I sent the e-mail at night and got an e-mail confirmation (manual, not automated) the next morning, but this was in mid-December. Maybe they're busy right now with tomorrow's acceptances? I would give them until early next week (unless it's been two weeks or something).
 
mynameistoolong said:
I sent one post-interview. I sent the e-mail at night and got an e-mail confirmation (manual, not automated) the next morning, but this was in mid-December. Maybe they're busy right now with tomorrow's acceptances? I would give them until early next week (unless it's been two weeks or something).
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I sent it mid-late January. Would it be reasonable to call them? I just don't want to seem desperate haha
 
Nothing here. Midwestern applicant, interviewed in mid Dec.
 
so if we don't hear back today, we're either rejected or waitlisted? :scared:
 
Odessa09 said:
I sent it mid-late January. Would it be reasonable to call them? I just don't want to seem desperate haha
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I sent an update 2/4 and they responded the same day to say they got it. This was post-interview as well.
 
wuzman said:
so if we don't hear back today, we're either rejected or waitlisted? :scared:
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I think there's another Acceptance Friday in two weeks and Rejection Friday is four weeks from now. But this is just a speculation according to past trends.
 
Odessa09 said:
I sent an update (post-interview) regarding a paper that was recently published. I still haven't received an email from them confirming that they received my update.

Has anyone else sent an update post-interview?
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Where did you send it? I want to send an update as well
 
happyfeet1292 said:
Nothing here 🙁
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Same, nothing here either 😕

Interviewed back in November... pretty sure I've been wait-listed. Had a great interview though

Edit: International student for reference.
 
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I am a Midwestern student, interviewed in November too, just for reference :/
 
:luck:Best of luck to everyone still waiting. WashU is such a great school.
 
ranson said:
Does anyone know why WashU has a 4 tier grading system (Honors, HP, P, F) + internal rankings (so even if everyone gets Honors, you will still be ranked) in year 2 as opposed to Pass/Fail? Also, why do they act like it's pass/fail in year 1 when they keep internal rankings (top 25%, top 50%, etc.), kinda defeats the purpose of pass/fail. That was one thing I didn't like; MS1's seemed very stressed out when I was there.
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Let me clear up some confusion as to how rankings at WashU work. Rankings are top third, middle third, bottom third, not top 25%, top 50%, etc. Rankings are based on the grade that appears on your transcript, i.e. H, HP, P, F, not the 93% on you got on your exam and so forth. If everyone got honors, you will be ranked equivalent to everyone else. Year 1 is pass/fail and therefore it is pass/fail and meets the purposes of pass/fail. The M1s are not very stressed. There are plenty of other schools that are more stressful (e.g. schools with a compressed preclinical curriculum, schools with grades and internal ranking during first year). When you and the 99% of your class pass all year 1 courses, then you are ranked all the same at that point. Year 1 P/F is weighted 10% of your overall rank, year 2 is 30%, year 3 is 60%. Year 2 is H/HP/P/F. Year 3 and 4 are also H/HP/P/F.

You asked why WashU has a 4 tier grading system as opposed to pass/fail during year 2. The big reason is inertia and status quo bias. The real question is, why hasn't WashU followed the vast majority of its peer institutions in switching from multi-tier to pass/fail? WashU is just behind the curve. If this is truly the one thing you did not like about WashU, and you get accepted, be sure to raise a stink about it. Believe it or not, almost no students bring this up during their interview nor do they put it on their 'why'd you turn us down' survey. Administrators don't read SDN and are often not in tune with the national trends. It's in your power if you dare.
 
chronicidal said:
Let me clear up some confusion as to how rankings at WashU work. Rankings are top third, middle third, bottom third, not top 25%, top 50%, etc. Rankings are based on the grade that appears on your transcript, i.e. H, HP, P, F, not the 93% on you got on your exam and so forth. If everyone got honors, you will be ranked equivalent to everyone else. Year 1 is pass/fail and therefore it is pass/fail and meets the purposes of pass/fail. The M1s are not very stressed. There are plenty of other schools that are more stressful (e.g. schools with a compressed preclinical curriculum, schools with grades and internal ranking during first year). When you and the 99% of your class pass all year 1 courses, then you are ranked all the same at that point. Year 1 P/F is weighted 10% of your overall rank, year 2 is 30%, year 3 is 60%. Year 2 is H/HP/P/F. Year 3 and 4 are also H/HP/P/F.

You asked why WashU has a 4 tier grading system as opposed to pass/fail during year 2. The big reason is inertia and status quo bias. The real question is, why hasn't WashU followed the vast majority of its peer institutions in switching from multi-tier to pass/fail? WashU is just behind the curve. If this is truly the one thing you did not like about WashU, and you get accepted, be sure to raise a stink about it. Believe it or not, almost no students bring this up during their interview nor do they put it on their 'why'd you turn us down' survey. Administrators don't read SDN and are often not in tune with the national trends. It's in your power if you dare.
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I'm fortunate enough to be in at washu and a few other places and the big reason im on the fence is that washu is not p/f during all of preclinical and most other top schools are.
 
termitechips said:
I'm fortunate enough to be in at washu and a few other places and the big reason im on the fence is that washu is not p/f during all of preclinical and most other top schools are.
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I'm also debating WashU because of this. I absolutely loved the school and the student environment during interview day, but I am concerned about the ranking and the H/HP/P/F and how stressful it'll make things in second year. Also, if most students there, having gotten in with such competitive scores/marks, are hardcore gunners…

Haha add to that, I'm Canadian, and unless I am able to (by some miracle) get a merit scholarship, this school will be very hard to afford (they don't offer fin aid to internationals). Sigh. Otherwise I really loved this place!
 
interviewed in jan, haven't heard anything..
i love you washu, please accept me!! :hello:
 
chronicidal said:
Let me clear up some confusion as to how rankings at WashU work. Rankings are top third, middle third, bottom third, not top 25%, top 50%, etc. Rankings are based on the grade that appears on your transcript, i.e. H, HP, P, F, not the 93% on you got on your exam and so forth. If everyone got honors, you will be ranked equivalent to everyone else. Year 1 is pass/fail and therefore it is pass/fail and meets the purposes of pass/fail. The M1s are not very stressed. There are plenty of other schools that are more stressful (e.g. schools with a compressed preclinical curriculum, schools with grades and internal ranking during first year). When you and the 99% of your class pass all year 1 courses, then you are ranked all the same at that point. Year 1 P/F is weighted 10% of your overall rank, year 2 is 30%, year 3 is 60%. Year 2 is H/HP/P/F. Year 3 and 4 are also H/HP/P/F.

You asked why WashU has a 4 tier grading system as opposed to pass/fail during year 2. The big reason is inertia and status quo bias. The real question is, why hasn't WashU followed the vast majority of its peer institutions in switching from multi-tier to pass/fail? WashU is just behind the curve. If this is truly the one thing you did not like about WashU, and you get accepted, be sure to raise a stink about it. Believe it or not, almost no students bring this up during their interview nor do they put it on their 'why'd you turn us down' survey. Administrators don't read SDN and are often not in tune with the national trends. It's in your power if you dare.
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I'm surprised that your administration is not in tune with national trends considering all the publications in the literature regarding Pass/Fail grading, some institutions which have had them since the 90s. Heck, some schools are creative with grading and ranks, like Yale or Stanford when it comes to grades and rank. It's a true shame bc Barnes-Jewish and St. Louis Children's are stellar rotations to rotate at, which you guys get to rotate and get LORs as MS-3s, and the research opportunities available for students at WashU are just astounding, and a fully elective MS-4 year -- which is definitely not the case at most schools. For example, correct me if I'm wrong, but in Radiology, Mallinckrodt is #1, when it comes to research funding and a top tier radiology program, when most would think such a program would be only on the East/West Coast.

It might also be helpful for applicants to know how long you guys get after classes are over to study for USMLE Step 1? Also whether your preclinical curriculum is organ system based vs. traditional basic science subjects.

But I do know people (who researched these things more than your average premed) who turned down WashU bc of their grading system during their MS-2, which would then compute into your overall rank. Obviously, grading during the MS-3 years is necessary (although there are some institutions that do P/F grading during MS-3 year such as Stanford, but this DEFINITELY is not the norm).
 
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For all of you comparing this year to previous years, don't. WashU has a new Dean of Admissions this year (starting in January) and has already changed the process. WashU previously didn't interview past mid February, but she has extended interviews through March. It's also safe to say that acceptances may not work on the exact same schedule as well. Just roll with it!
 
DermViser said:
I'm surprised that your administration is not in tune with national trends considering all the publications in the literature regarding Pass/Fail grading, some institutions which have had them since the 90s. Heck, some schools are creative with grading and ranks, like Yale or Stanford when it comes to grades and rank. It's a true shame bc Barnes-Jewish and St. Louis Children's are stellar rotations to rotate at, which you guys get to rotate and get LORs as MS-3s, and the research opportunities available for students at WashU are just astounding, and a fully elective MS-4 year -- which is definitely not the case at most schools. For example, correct me if I'm wrong, but in Radiology, Mallinckrodt is #1, when it comes to research funding and a top tier radiology program, when most would think such a program would be only on the East/West Coast.

It might also be helpful for applicants to know how long you guys get after classes are over to study for USMLE Step 1? Also whether your preclinical curriculum is organ system based vs. traditional basic science subjects.

But I do know people (who researched these things more than your average premed) who turned down WashU bc of their grading system during their MS-2, which would then compute into your overall rank. Obviously, grading during the MS-3 years is necessary (although there are some institutions that do P/F grading during MS-3 year such as Stanford, but this DEFINITELY is not the norm).
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All good points.

We get 4 weeks after classes to study for Step 1. It varies year to year about +/- five days.

The curriculum first year is traditional basic science subjects and second year is organ based (but often multiple organ systems at once, like cardio + pulmonary + renal; or endocrine + GI + derm; or neuro + psych; or infectious diseases + rheumatology + pediatrics).
 
chronicidal said:
All good points.

We get 4 weeks after classes to study for Step 1. It varies year to year about +/- five days.

The curriculum first year is traditional basic science subjects and second year is organ based (but often multiple organ systems at once, like cardio + pulmonary + renal; or endocrine + GI + derm; or neuro + psych; or infectious diseases + rheumatology + pediatrics).
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Wow, that's really different, as there are schools that arrange their preclinical curriculum much more "cleanly" than WashU, such as Baylor and USC-Keck. Their preclinical curriculums have caused their average board scores to shoot thru the roof, as their faculty tend to purposefully teach to the boards as well. They also get more "time" to study after classes are over to put all the info. altogether.

I think WashU tends to be more conservative to changing (which takes more logistical work on their part) to more student-"friendly" measures with regards to preclinical curriculum, teaching to Step 1, "time" to study after classes are over, etc. bc they know that when it comes to residency interviews, coming from WashU means a lot. They know already their "milkshake brings all the boys to the yard" due to being a research powerhouse, so they don't have to change.

With that said, if a student at WashU is in the top 1/3 (maybe even 2/3) of the class (bc WashU already selects for such an elite top notch group to begin with), one would definitely get a lot more interviews to great places vs. the same ranked applicant at a local state school. This is reflected in WashU's match lists, where even in Internal Medicine, students are going to top places: https://residency.wustl.edu/Residencies/WUSMMatch/Pages/Home.aspx
 
DermViser said:
Wow, that's really different, as there are schools that arrange their preclinical curriculum much more "cleanly" than WashU, such as Baylor and USC-Keck. Their preclinical curriculums have caused their average board scores to shoot thru the roof, as their faculty tend to purposefully teach to the boards as well. They also get more "time" to study after classes are over to put all the info. altogether.

I think WashU tends to be more conservative to changing (which takes more logistical work on their part) to more student-"friendly" measures with regards to preclinical curriculum, teaching to Step 1, "time" to study after classes are over, etc. bc they know that when it comes to residency interviews, coming from WashU means a lot. They know already their "milkshake brings all the boys to the yard" due to being a research powerhouse, so they don't have to change.

With that said, if a student at WashU is in the top 1/3 (maybe even 2/3) of the class (bc WashU already selects for such an elite top notch group to begin with), one would definitely get a lot more interviews to great places vs. the same ranked applicant at a local state school. This is reflected in WashU's match lists, where even in Internal Medicine, students are going to top places: https://residency.wustl.edu/Residencies/WUSMMatch/Pages/Home.aspx
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Dang... Those are phenomenal matches!! Thanks for sharing 🙂
 
I'm a 3rd year at Wash U and just want to say that the reason they don't change the 2nd year here to P/F isn't because of inertia or resistance to change, but because students don't want to. Every year (or at least most years) they poll the class on a lot of different issues, including the grading of second year. And every year the majority of the class who have done the graded 2nd year (including ours), votes to keep it that way. The majority of us don't find it that much more stressful (especially since 1/2 the class gets an honors in almost every class anyway) and it helps keep you motivated to study hard during the year, which allows Wash U to do very well on Step 1 (most recent class got a 241 average), despite having less time than most to study after classes end.

Simply put, Wash U has grades because the current system is working just fine and their philosophy is "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." To be honest, the people most stressed by the 2nd year grades at Wash U are the 1st years; those that have been through it know that it's just fine.
 
Any last minute pre-interview advice from anyone?! Perhaps any specific questions they really like or background info I may need to brush up on? Set up of the interview?

Thanks for any advice!! 🙂
 
natg101 said:
Any last minute pre-interview advice from anyone?! Perhaps any specific questions they really like or background info I may need to brush up on? Set up of the interview?

Thanks for any advice!! 🙂
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It's a one-on-one interview that you'll have either in the morning or afternoon. It's super chill and conversational and really just the adcom trying to get to know you more personally (so basically she just asked about like my family, my college life, activities, etc) and there weren't any tough questions or ethical questions asked. Lunch is great - it's in the Queeny Tower restaurant that lets you get a great view of the surrounding St. Louis area and you eat with either a physician or a student (who aren't part of the adcom). Overall, one of the most relaxed interview days I've had! Good luck! 🙂
 
SYL30 said:
It's a one-on-one interview that you'll have either in the morning or afternoon. It's super chill and conversational and really just the adcom trying to get to know you more personally (so basically she just asked about like my family, my college life, activities, etc) and there weren't any tough questions or ethical questions asked. Lunch is great - it's in the Queeny Tower restaurant that lets you get a great view of the surrounding St. Louis area and you eat with either a physician or a student (who aren't part of the adcom). Overall, one of the most relaxed interview days I've had! Good luck! 🙂
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Not necessarily. I had a very intense 90 minute grilling by a faculty member who went over my application with a fine tooth comb and who posed several hypothetical medical ethics questions.
 
Can any current students speak about living in St. Louis? I would really appreciate it! 🙂
 
natg101 said:
Any last minute pre-interview advice from anyone?! Perhaps any specific questions they really like or background info I may need to brush up on? Set up of the interview?

Thanks for any advice!! 🙂
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The day was probably the least structured of any interview day I had - but this is also likely because I had a mid-afternoon interview, which is unusual and gave me more free time. You have time to drop in on lectures and current students come by to get coffee from admissions and talk to you. My interview itself was super relaxed - a few probing questions, but what good interview doesn't have deeper questions asked? It IS the type of interview day where it seems your impressions throughout the day matter - to the person presenting in financial aid to sitting around, though your tour guides don't affect admissions at all. Lunch is great and you have a fantastic view of Forest Park! Good luck!
 
MDub1 said:
I'm a 3rd year at Wash U and just want to say that the reason they don't change the 2nd year here to P/F isn't because of inertia or resistance to change, but because students don't want to. Every year (or at least most years) they poll the class on a lot of different issues, including the grading of second year. And every year the majority of the class who have done the graded 2nd year (including ours), votes to keep it that way.
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There is some truth to what you say. There's only been one time that the administration has polled any class on preclinical grading in at least 7 years. The rest were student-initiated surveys. Here are the results of that poll that were shared with the entire school. 50.0% of the 3rd years opposed a change, 50.6% of the 4th years opposed a change, 56.1% of the research students (MSTs and extra research years) opposed a change. Barely a majority, I reckon.

How would you describe your opinion of a change in second-year grading to Pass/Fail?
 

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Hipocrates said:
Not necessarily. I had a very intense 90 minute grilling by a faculty member who went over my application with a fine tooth comb and who posed several hypothetical medical ethics questions.
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Yikes I'm sorry to hear that...I guess it just depends on the interviewer then? I don't know, from other people I've talked to who've interviewed at Wash U, they had a similar experience to what I had so it seems maybe your interview experience was a bit different than the norm...? Well, regardless, I hope it went well for you!
 
It seemed like there weren't any decisions last Friday. Possible decisions this Friday?
 
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