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wstand said:
Do you know whether the final decision will be made without mcat? From its website, mcat score is blind for secondaries and IIs but not sure it won't affect the decision at all. Btw I have my interview scheduled on 9/29 (which was the very first one available to me on the day when I got a II) but has anyone else received IIs and scheduled an interview? I am so worried that this one is my v first one (and currently the only II I received).
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my notes from the webinar: "UCSF WONT USE MCAT SCORE AHHHHHHHH"

i believe i remember dr. wofsy saying mcat will not be looked at any adcom, interviewer or anyone throughout the entire process. someone correct me if i was delirious and hearing things

also, i know someone who got into UCSF with 508 MCAT and 3.3 GPA. they're traditionally a school that look for fit, not stats anyway
 
Does anyone know if the MCAT blind policies some(most?) of the UCs are using also apply to MSTP?
 
splicy said:
my notes from the webinar: "UCSF WONT USE MCAT SCORE AHHHHHHHH"

i believe i remember dr. wofsy saying mcat will not be looked at any adcom, interviewer or anyone throughout the entire process. someone correct me if i was delirious and hearing things

also, i know someone who got into UCSF with 508 MCAT and 3.3 GPA. they're traditionally a school that look for fit, not stats anyway
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I'm really sorry if I made you angry. I already received II but it's still a great news for me whose MCAT score is not so spectacular that UCSF will go MCAT-blind. I was just wondering because the website didn't seem clear about making final decisions (after the interview) for applicants who already took MCAT (I know MCAT score is not required). I wish UCSF admissions will clearly say something about the final decision as well on its website but at this phase, it doesn't really matter that much to me compared to preparing for the virtual interview. So far the only statement on MCAT is:

"For the 2021 Admissions Cycle, the University of California San Francisco School of Medicine will accept applications without an MCAT score due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

All candidates will be screened and interview decisions will be offered without utilization of an MCAT score.

Given the ongoing geographic variation in the impact of the COVID-19 pandemic, as per usual all applications will be reviewed by our admissions decision committee holistically regardless of availability of MCAT scores." Source: Admissions: MD Program | UCSF Medical Education
 
wstand said:
I'm really sorry if I made you angry. I already received II but it's still a great news for me whose MCAT score is not so spectacular that UCSF will go MCAT-blind. I was just wondering because the website didn't seem clear about making final decisions (after the interview) for applicants who already took MCAT (I know MCAT score is not required). I wish UCSF admissions will clearly say something about the final decision as well on its website but at this phase, it doesn't really matter that much to me compared to preparing for the virtual interview. So far the only statement on MCAT is:

"For the 2021 Admissions Cycle, the University of California San Francisco School of Medicine will accept applications without an MCAT score due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

All candidates will be screened and interview decisions will be offered without utilization of an MCAT score.

Given the ongoing geographic variation in the impact of the COVID-19 pandemic, as per usual all applications will be reviewed by our admissions decision committee holistically regardless of availability of MCAT scores." Source: Admissions: MD Program | UCSF Medical Education
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ahh im sorry i didn't mean for it to come off harsh or angry at all. in fact im quite glad you asked because i'd love clarification as well. my MCAT isn't stellar and i'm riding on my ECs. congrats on your interview by the way 🙂

i believe dr. wofsy said even after interviews, MCAT will not be considered. the entire UCSF admissions process will be MCAT-blind this year (from my understanding).

if it's any solace, my friend's UCSF interview was very conversational so don't stress too much about it! they want you to go to UCSF the second they offered you an interview 🙂
 
Cole42 said:
I just went to a virtual interview prep session where the guest speaker was Dean Wofsy from UCSF. He gave a lot of insight into how UCSF conducts their process, so I figured it might be helpful to share with those following this thread in case they weren't able to attend. I was typing while he was talking, so there are a lot of sentence fragments, but I tried to capture what he said as best as I could. If anyone has notes from the end when he talked about attitudes toward the MCAT given COVID, feel free to share as I had to deal with a family situation and couldn't take good notes during that time:

General Comments:
  • Remember there are human beings on the other end of this process - often get different answers to the same question
  • Every school does it differently and individuals have different opinions
  • Don’t get thrown by conflicting advice - you will get conflicting advice
  • People on other end of process are more like us than we think - trying to do right thing, looking for things we would value
  • What would I be thinking if I were in their shoes?
  • What weakness should I address or strength I want to shine through?
  • In the end, medical schools have limited information to judge based on
Schools have 5 things in mind: think about where do I stack up on these 5 things?
  1. Academic Work: You can do the academic work when you get there - not a contest or game of who has best GPA/MCAT - know broad range of grades and MCATs can be great doctors and don’t believe you have to score in 99th percentile on MCAT or 3.8+ GPA but need to know you can do the academic work (shown by undergrad GPA - for those people, MCAT doesn’t matter much; MCAT for those who have lower undergrad GPA; for career changers or those who didn’t do well in undergrad, can prove academics in postbacc program but file has to do that)
  2. Something "Extra": Need to do more than just satisfy the academic work - must have something extra (research, community service, or a talent that has nothing to do with medicine but shows devotion to excellence, etc.) - for many people something extra comes from life experience - can be shown during letters, ECs or personal statement
  3. School Mission: At UCSF, they look for graduates to contribute to society in every area that physicians have an impact - like people for different reasons (if they aren’t going to be a great scientist, don’t need to be judged by that metric and can judge them on narrowing healthcare disparities in California or health policy changing way health care is delivered) - at UCSF, looking for different strengths in different people, no formula for getting in - looking for "Who are the good human beings?"
  4. LORs: So important for letter writers to speak to committee not about the highest grade but what we were like and to some degree that interviews give insight into that too
  5. Diversity: every school interest in diversity in a broad sense - includes racial and ethnic diversity (compelling data that if you want to serve all communities, need to train physicians who will go back and care about them) - diversity includes race, ethnicity, geography, etc. and also sexual orientation, SES, gender, and so on
Interview Offer:
  • Offering an interview is where the decision gets made - the decision doesn’t get made at the end after you interview - the reality is that the hard moment is getting the invitation to get interviewed
  • Tables have turned when you get an interview application (though most applicants and committees aren’t conscious of that) - at that point, you’re being recruited, not judged
  • At UCSF, interview 500 people and by the time go down waiting list, have sent 280 acceptances for 160 spots - over 50% chance of getting in if you got an interview
  • The real hurdle is getting invited for an interview
  • By interview, school has already decided you are good enough - if UCSF interviews you, chances are you will go somewhere great (absent really bad luck)
Mistakes applicants make:
  • Biggest mistake - don’t look at it as if they are on the other side of the process - they don’t identify weaknesses
  • Other applicant mistake - they think they have to stand out in the personal statement - very few people who get into medical school get in because of what they wrote in personal statement (but many tried so hard to stand out that it hurts them)
    • Show you can command the English language, write coherent relevant page (why medicine)
    • If personal statement is wonderful and rest of the file isn’t, you’re not getting in
  • Common interview mistake - deciding before interview what you want to say (need to be thinking on feet and responding to the questions)
Other interview tips:
  • Don’t talk for 10 minutes - make it conversational in classic interview
  • Pretend you’ve just sat down to lunch with someone you don’t know (family friend or something) and they are getting to know you and you’re getting to know them - comfortable, relaxed, conversational interaction where genuinely listening and genuinely interested
  • Over-rehearsed interviews are noticed and not liked (still rehearse but to practice comfort, not what you are going to say - need to be able to think on your feet and respond)
  • Other pitfalls: name-dropping, acting too arrogant/big for yourself (especially at schools where you have a prior connection)
How UCSF eliminates people after interviews:
  • Approach is that the interviewers are not decision makers - they write narrative reports like another letter of recommendation
  • Entirely different committee looks at whole file and makes decision (20 people on the committee look at whole file to make decision)
  • Moved to that 5 years ago because before they were basing it on personality of interviewer - prejudiced process too much based on luck of draw on interviewer (who would advocate most strongly for final decision based on personality)
  • Now 20 people who have not met you integrate information in file and those 20 people vote
  • 3 outcomes - accept/reject/alternate list
  • If just voted, everyone would be accepted after interview because you have 500 interviewed people who were chosen because their file is great and had a positive interview
  • At UCSF, what they do is say to the committee, have to divide up your votes into thirds
    • Which third impresses you the most?
    • Which will be waitlist?
    • Which will we decline?
    • Dean tracks it and over course of the season he tries to force the committee to vote 1/3, 1/3, 1/3 in those 3 categories
    • Usually 40% or more accept and 20-25% reject - it’s close enough and they have enough spots for it to be the way it comes out - will be done that way again this year even though Dean Wofsy isn't running it this year
  • They aren’t deciding who is not good enough - it’s not based on weakness or doing something wrong but rather the intensity of the competition
Screening process for secondary applications:
  • There are 3 ways to use data they have to make decision
    • 1. Can have strict numerical cutoffs
    • 2. Can have a formula (what UCSF used to do) - get points for everyone you can think of like are they in-state, GPA, MCAT, etc. and more than a certain number of points got a secondary automatically
      • UCSF threw out this system because they didn't want to throw out an applicant for getting less research points if their "something extra" was community service - because UCSF judges based on different metrics, this system didn't make sense
    • 3. Now they look at every file (but don't read every word in every application)
      • It would take 20-30 minutes to read every word in app, which isn't feasible
      • They look at every file now but stop looking at it if they decide this person has no chance of making it to the end (acceptance) based on something they read
      • Going through files and giving everyone the benefit of a look until it’s obvious the person has no chance or until it’s obvious there is a chance and they should get a secondary
      • Exclude about 1/3 of people through this screening process and don’t exclude anyone in that process who Dean Wofsy thinks ultimately could make it to an acceptance - secondary screening eliminates about 1/3 of candidates - go from 8,000 applicants to 5,000 secondaries
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i didn't see or hear anything about this interview
 
For the extracurricllar question, is it ok to expand on an activity that we discussed in AMCAS by talking about stuff we didn't talk about in the previous description? I was wondering as I have an EC that aligns well with their mission and was thinking of talking about it more
 
fun10139med said:
II received yesterday!!! Definitely so shocked and happier than ever!!!! Stats: 513 MCAT, 3.9 GPA, ORM
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Did you apply to the MD or dual degree program? Also when did you submit, and are you IS or OS?
 
satdixon said:
Did you apply to the MD or dual degree program? Also when did you submit, and are you IS or OS?
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I applied just to the regular MD program! I am OS. My primary was processed June 11. I received my secondary on Aug 5 and sent it Aug 9
 
babygreenbeans said:
for the institutional action question, do we re-report our IA that we listed on our primary or is this any additional IA/misdemeanor that occurred after primary submission?
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My reading of it was anything NOT reported on the primary. They say " that have not already been reported in the primary AMCAS application ", and the option for n/a says "I acknowledge this policy and have nothing additional to disclose." (The additional makes me think it's anything not reported originally).
If anyone has more official information on this, that would be awesome.
 
babygreenbeans said:
i literally had the same thought process as you. my dilemma is that my four week deadline is literally tomorrow, and I don't want to risk waiting till tomorrow to call them and make sure.
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Completely understandable. Personally, I'm hoping I'm right and that I don't have to call them and say "hey so ACTUALLY I have this thing to declare" :/
 
babygreenbeans said:
do you think submitting on the day of the deadline would be acceptable? It says "no later than four weeks" so I would assume so lol. I don't want to mention a negative thing on my secondary if I don't have to...
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I think if you call and clarify and then submit tomorrow, I think that'd be totally fine
 
I received a secondary from UCSF and totally missed the part about the two-week deadline... It's past two weeks now. Should I still turn it in or should I just withdraw my application?
 
Pheh428 said:
I received a secondary from UCSF and totally missed the part about the two-week deadline... It's past two weeks now. Should I still turn it in or should I just withdraw my application?
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Isn't it 4 weeks for UCSF? I think UCLA is 2 week.s
 
BlueRosesGoldLeaf said:
Isn't it 4 weeks for UCSF? I think UCLA is 2 week.s
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My email says 2 weeks... "Please log in to the status page and complete our secondary application as soon as possible, but no later than two weeks from the date of this invitation."... Am I doomed...?
 
Pheh428 said:
My email says 2 weeks... "Please log in to the status page and complete our secondary application as soon as possible, but no later than two weeks from the date of this invitation."... Am I doomed...?
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how many days after has it been for u?
 
Pheh428 said:
My email says 2 weeks... "Please log in to the status page and complete our secondary application as soon as possible, but no later than two weeks from the date of this invitation."... Am I doomed...?
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Can't hurt to email them and ask! Just drop a "I'm so sorry but with everything going on right now, I missed the deadline - can I still submit?" and they'll either say yes or no ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
rep_the_don said:
My secondary invitation says 2 weeks for UCSF.
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Pheh428 said:
My email says 2 weeks... "Please log in to the status page and complete our secondary application as soon as possible, but no later than two weeks from the date of this invitation."... Am I doomed...?
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Woah, that is so strange. My email says:

"We would like to learn more about you. Please log in to the status page and complete our secondary application as soon as possible, but no later than four weeks from the date of this invitation. We will download your letters of recommendation from the AMCAS Letter Service."


But I already completed it, and just at the two week deadline. I got my secondary 8/5.
 
blinkblink2 said:
Do you all think that that applying PRIME-US increases the likelihood of admission relative to regular MD?

Please answer the question on its own terms, I am amenable to the goals of PRIME-US and a bay area native with ties to the communities it aims to serve.
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They take less people for prime so I’m not sure. I had the same debate when I was applying
 
blinkblink2 said:
Just the response I was looking for, thank you. Now hearing that there is a discrete per-class number of PRIME-US acceptances and that it's on a separate track interview-wise, I feel dissuaded from applying to it. Good point about urban being non-specific. Half the reason I considered it is that I want to answer those additional questions about the PRIME-US program, because my answers are likely to help my application.

Oh well, guess I'll have to just pick one activity of interest and maybe namecheck another or two in passing. It is interesting to me that, despite their review process being so holistic, their secondary questions are so spare.
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Nooooo! Maybe that's too strong a reaction but PRIME is an amazing program and like a community within a community. If it speaks to you AND you have the service record to back up your commitment my inclination would be to go for it. UCSF loves its PRIME students and I don't think I have ever heard of anyone saying they regretted doing PRIME.
 
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